Israeli Settler Terrorists Are At It Again

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


its very hard to argue with ignorance but ill try.

If you did some research you would know that there were always jews in israel from 1200 BCE to the turk and british mandate. However the number of jews was much lower and after WW2 there was a large immigration.

Point being jews were always there, so your argument is pointless either way you look at it.

Here is a link:
en.wikipedia.org...

Some historical facts:

"Crusader rule (1099 – 13th century) During the Crusades, both Muslims and Jews in Palestine were indiscriminately massacred or sold into slavery. The murder of Jews began during the Crusaders' travels across Europe and continued in the Holy Land.

" There was a massacre of Jews in Palestine during Muhammad Ali of Egypt's occupation in 1834. In 1844, Jews constituted the largest population group in Jerusalem and by 1890 an absolute majority in the city. By 1890, Palestine was populated mainly by Muslim and Christian Arabs, as well as Jews, Greeks, Druze, Bedouins and other minorities."

"In 1870, an agricultural school, the Mikveh Israel was founded near Jaffa by the Alliance Israelite Universelle. The first modern Jewish settlement in Palestine, Petah Tikva, was founded in 1878, followed by Rishon LeZion (1882).

reply to post by CountDrac

its very hard to argue with ignorance but ill try.

Its also very hard to argue with someone who fails to see how irrational it is in letting europeanized jews move into a land they have never lived in, at the cost of the arabs living there for generations
You have been ignoring this point with regard to the Palestine situation... a point which Ive been repeating throughout this thread.
None of the "facts" and "history lessons" you have been spewing out here, even comes close to addressing it.

Of course, thats to be expected from someone who said "the only mistake Israel ever did is not to kick them out completely once they conquered the rest of what we call today Gaza and the west bank…"

Hardly any surprise there, Count.


Also, on a sidenote... I never denied that there were jews living in that land.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


Stay on point.
You said jews moved into the land, i just showed you historical facts that they never left and were there much before the Arab farmers you call today palestinians.

Please stop repeating you baseless propaganda and enlighten us with historical facts and links to these facts just as I did.

You basing your entire argument on nothing but your own opinion which contradicts historical evidence. And you are sounding more irrational each post you write.

This is not in the conspiracy theory thread, so unless you can offer something mature and logical don’t bother writing anymore.

reply to post by CountDrac

Stay on point.
You said jews moved into the land, i just showed you historical facts that they never left and were there much before the Arab farmers you call today palestinians.

Jews moved on to the land. Yes.
There were also Jews, living alongside Arabs before Israel was established. I never denied this in any of my posts.

Now, if you are saying "they never left"... then why the need to establish an exclusive state called "Israel", just to make room for European Jews after WW2? What was wrong with having middle eastern jews live alongside Arabs and European jews live alongside Europeans?

Hopefully, you will stay on point and address this. Thank you.

Please stop repeating you baseless propaganda and enlighten us with historical facts and links to these facts just as I did.

You seem to have a hard time differentiating between propaganda and fact.

Fact #1: The majority of the jews living in that state called Israel are Ashkenazi jews of European descent. (Please bear this in mind while addressing my previous point.)

Fact #2: The jews suffered in Germany at the hands of Germans, not at the hands of palestinians.

Fact #3 : The Palestinian Arabs had NOTHING to do with jewish suffering during WW2... so there is no reason to have them make a homeland for jews on the land they have been living on for generations prior.

Now, do you deny any of these facts? Or do you classify the above facts that you disagree with as "baseless propaganda".

You basing your entire argument on nothing but your own opinion which contradicts historical evidence. And you are sounding more irrational each post you write.

Im sure any rabid pro-israel poster would think the same way as you do. But, it really does nothing to change the basic reality that Europeanized jews have no business on Arab land.

This is not in the conspiracy theory thread, so unless you can offer something mature and logical don’t bother writing anymore.

No conspiracy here. Just a few simple truths that burns like sunlight.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


You ask why let European Jews immigrate back?

Because there was already a country of Jews in the past, the same Jews who built what you call today Jerusalem until the Romans came and kicked the majority of them out.

All this immigration both of middle eastern and Ashkenazi Jews are the descendents and families of Jews that were kicked out by Romans, Muslims empires or Europeans in the crusades.

On the other hand, never in history was there a Palestinians country or a land for Palestinians in that territory.

P: S- your fact one is wrong and the other two are unrelated to the subject. You are just jumping from one irrational statement to the next without any correlation or relevance to our discussion.

Have a nice day, you have just been served…

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


And honestly who cares how ,why and what is fair (even though it is).

Enough people around the world thought the Jews should get their old country back and the UN declared a new state of Israel for the jews, which now happens to be one of the strongest military powers in the world.

Deal with it…

its very hard to argue with ignorance but ill try.

Ignorance to me would be declaring ALL Jews have a right to that land when ancestral right truly has nothing to do with religion...

Yes, the Jews who had ancestors from that area you may say have some rights, as would the Arabs from the same area..

reply to post by CountDrac

P: S- your fact one is wrong and the other two are unrelated to the subject. You are just jumping from one irrational statement to the next without any correlation or relevance to our discussion.

Every single "fact" that you have spewed on here is irrelevant to the discussion... Of course, you may feel free to pat yourself on the back..

Every single poster you have engaged with here know that you've frame all your arguments based on your personal opinions/biases.... not to mention resorting to personal insults and diverting/dodging the issue.

Also, it was really nice of you to finally get around to addressing the question of Europeanized jews moving to Arab land... even if it was as laughably pathetic as saying " there was already a country of Jews in the past".
I dont blame you, thats really the only answer you have... nevermind how far it is from objectivity and common sense.

Now... if only more Israeli/pro-Israeli politicians used this kind of childishly simple "logic" while defending Israels legitimacy on TV.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


Really? You have yet to prove me wrong.
Meanwhile you couldn’t provide one link or historical fact to your statements.
In your last post you couldn’t even argue one of my points so you decided to completely disregard them without addressing my facts or the links I provided.


First you said the Jews had no right to take Palestinian lands, and I proved historically that Jews were their first and had there own country much before the Muslims.

Then you resorted to make a stupid argument about the lands Israel conquered after winning three wars against several Muslim countries that attacked them first.

When you could defend that absurd premise you resorted to saying the European Jews had no right to come back. Completely forgetting about the Middle Eastern Jews (who by the way were always more then 60% of the population in Israel). And disregarding the fact that these European Jews where kicked out of Israel over hundreds of years.

You made three stupid arguments based on nothing, and you were proven wrong in each.

At the end of the day you can post as much as you want on ATS but nothing you do will change the fact that my side (the Jews) have the country, the power and the upper hand.

Enjoy your day

reply to post by CountDrac

You made three stupid arguments based on nothing, and you were proven wrong in each.

Actually their arguments were all based on fact..

You arguments are mere opinions and twisting of the facts..

Seems to be your SOP..

reply to post by CountDrac

In your last post you couldn’t even argue one of my points so you decided to completely disregard them without addressing my facts or the links I provided.

That was because your "points" were irrelevant to what I was discussing. I thought I made that pretty clear to you in that post,.

First you said the Jews had no right to take Palestinian lands, and I proved historically that Jews were their first and had there own country much before the Muslims.

Not quite. Ive clearly stated that the jews who suffered in WW2 under Germany had no right to take over Arab lands if they got screwed in Germany.
I also recall mentioning to another poster that I fully back the European jews right to build a homeland in Germany. But, you seemed to have conveniently missed it.

As for your "historically proving" that Jews were their first and had there own country much before the Muslims...
a) Nobody disagrees that the jews were there first
b) Its pretty much the single most retarded argument to let everyone of Jewish origin back into Israel.

Im saying its retarded, because if everyone of Jewish origin were to be allowed back into Israel, then it would open the doors for millions of Pashtun tribesmen (also of Israelite origin) moving back to Israel.
In case you didn't know, the Pashtun tribesmen of Afghanistan and Pakistan are also of Israelite origin ...they call themselves Bani Israel, simply meaning "children of Israel", regardless of religion.

Now, before you start denying this, its a well supported theory accepted even by a former Israeli president. Look him up.

en.wikipedia.org...

So that said, are you still open to the idea of the Pashtuns, who are also descendants of Israelite tribes, moving back to Israel.. the land of their ancestors? I'd like to know.

When you could defend that absurd premise you resorted to saying the European Jews had no right to come back. Completely forgetting about the Middle Eastern Jews (who by the way were always more then 60% of the population in Israel). And disregarding the fact that these European Jews where kicked out of Israel over hundreds of years.

European jews have no business in Arab land. Period. You seem to overlook the fact that the 3 wars were provoked by Israel being established there. And its not like these Arab armies would have attacked a jewish state established in Europe.
Middle eastern jews comprising 60% of the population of Israel? Where you getting that figure from?

You made three stupid arguments based on nothing, and you were proven wrong in each.

Proven wrong in each?? Haha...as usual, declaring your own victories. Why am I not surprised.

reply to post by CountDrac

At the end of the day you can post as much as you want on ATS but nothing you do will change the fact that my side (the Jews) have the country, the power and the upper hand.

Yes.
Finally you say something that I can agree with. Your side, the jews, have the country, the power and the upper hand.

Just like the Nazis... who also had the country, the power and the upperhand a little over 60 years ago.

And if history teaches us anything, its that no empire/kingdom/regime lasts forever.
What makes you think this modern day state of Israel is an exception to this rule?

reply to post by CountDrac


So are you saying that there were 1.5 million Jews living in Israel before the outbreak of WWII? Which is complete bogus. No one denies that there were Jews living in Palestine before that but not in the numbers that constituted a majority in a geographical area- as there were Jews living in Germany, Poland, Russia and Yugoslavia.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n

What makes you think this modern day state of Israel is an exception to this rule?

I can answer that for him; delusional belief that they are the chosen people.

Just like Hitlers übermensch. Delusional to the max.

Originally posted by Zamini
reply to post by sk0rpi0n

 

What makes you think this modern day state of Israel is an exception to this rule?

I can answer that for him; delusional belief that they are the chosen people.

Just like Hitlers übermensch. Delusional to the max.

You know,
the only times I see people use the “chosen people” argument, is by members who are either racists, anti-Semites, plain Nazis, or combination of all three. Take your pick.
At least, there are members of ATS who openly admited to being one.

FYI, the “chosen people” thingy was not a prize given to the Jewish people, but a load and a duty.
A duty to spread a new social ethics based on the ten commandments.

So next time you quote Goebbels, at least know what you are talking about.

reply to post by gravitational

You know,
the only times I see people use the “chosen people” argument, is by members who are either racists, anti-Semites, plain Nazis, or combination of all three.

WHAT? So what you are saying is that the policies of the Israeli regime are NOT organized to fit religious perspectives? So lets see, I'm a Nazi racist anti-semite according to you...huh...

Take your pick.

Oh Oh Oh. I get to pick? By the way, you use the same smear tactics as those do on televisions. These things do not get past me, what is so hard to understand about that?

At least, there are members of ATS who openly admited to being one.

Why not call me it instead of implying it...? Oh yeh I know because your post would be removed. Can't have that, so you use underhand tactics. Again you intellectually handicapped fool; these things do not get past me.

FYI, the “chosen people” thingy was not a prize given to the Jewish people, but a load and a duty.

You are delusional. Nothing was given to a single people.

A duty to spread a new social ethics based on the ten commandments.

Yeh so much for your social ethics, unless the way you treat Palestinians is the same as you want to treat everyone else.

So next time you quote Goebbels, at least know what you are talking about.

You do know that calling people something they are not is going to bite you in the rear end HARD one day right? So much for those ethics.

Get over yourself. You are not chosen as a people because a book says so. That's a disgusting and racist to the max. It gives you the superiority complex which has given you the idea that you have to spread new social ethics.

You readers notice another one of his tactics? Making me out to be anti-JEW while I am pointing out to the Israeli regimes doings, ie. Zionism. It's another one they frequently use over a broad scope of media. Oh well, keep playing your game, you have about 7 more years(generous here) before the people start putting their feet down. That includes China(I know how scared you bunch are of China)

reply to post by Zamini


If you want to compare the Jewish state to WW2 Germany and Nazis then maybe I can accept that when it comes to military power, technological and economical supremacy etc.

But if you are trying to compare Nazis to Israelis on the moral and ethical level, I think you will have a better chance comparing the Palestinians extremists and Hamas who send suicide bombers to kill woman and children.

Better yet compare the Muslims surrounding countries like Iran, Egypt, Libya and Syria with their Muslim governments and dictatorships who treat their people very similar to how the Nazis treated the Jews. Rape, humiliation, murder and everything else that their governments are doing to their civilians especially now with the uprisings.

reply to post by CountDrac

But if you are trying to compare Nazis to Israelis on the moral and ethical level, I think you will have a better chance comparing the Palestinians extremists and Hamas who send suicide bombers to kill woman and children.

The Israeli government can be perfectly compared to Nazis because of their Nazi-like attitude towards treating the Palestinians, a weaker people already living in segregation and under the boots of the Israeli government.

And on the other hand, the palestinian "extremists", can only be compared to jews who took part in the armed ghetto uprisings during WW2 to resist a superior force. They, like the Palestinian extremists, were also armed and figured that sometimes violence needs to be used to get a message across.

en.wikipedia.org...

en.wikipedia.org...

In conclusion, if Palestinian armed resistance against the Israeli government is "islamic terrorism", then the Jewish armed resistance against the Nazis must also be labelled as "jewish terrorism".

To label armed jewish resisters as "heroes" and the Palestinian resisters as "terrorists" is a double standard.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


FYI: In the ghetto uprisings the Jews didn’t kill German woman and children. They killed Nazi soldiers, big difference.

Give me a break!
Funny you didn't answer the main part about the muslim countries and how they treat their own citizens.
You are a racist and probably muslim so its pointless to even argue with you.

The palestinians deserve everything they get, and honestly they are better off under israeli control rather then their own muslim governments and religious regimes.

Why else do you think all the other Muslim countries are controlled by dictatorships and religious law. Why should the Israelis treat the Palestinians different then kadafi to the Libyans, or Asad the Syrians, or the Iranian regime to its people.

The Arabs in the Middle East are primitive people and need to be dealt with in a primitive manner.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


The Palestinian extremists target civilians because they are animals. But what else do you expect from Muslim people who kill their own citizens like dogs and treat them like animals. Look what’s happening in the Middle East and how these regimes and treating their own civilians now in the uprisings.

Better yet, look what Hamas did to the PLO members after they took over Gaza. They beat them to death with sticks and Threw them off buildings.

Enough Said...