Its happend before, so why not now?

Originally posted by FreeSpeaker
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You too.

I have no idea what this behaviour is all about. The debunkers have pretty well made me discard cloud seeding but why the often change of weather in my woods when this occures? Purely coincidence maybe? Probably?

I wish I knew.

On a side note, I'm very happy the debate here has gotten alot more civil today.

Its not that contrails change the weather, its that weather changes the contrails. The weather was already changing, and the increased prominence of contrails are evidence of that.

If a weather system is approaching and the upper air humidity is increasings, its entirely logical to expect bigger and longer lasting contrails. Its actually illogical that the chemmies expect that contrails should always look the same, regardless of the weather

Originally posted by firepilot
If a weather system is approaching and the upper air humidity is increasings, its entirely logical to expect bigger and longer lasting contrails. Its actually illogical that the chemmies expect that contrails should always look the same, regardless of the weather

Doesn't that mean chemtrails would also take on different appearances in different atmospheric conditions?

Originally posted by Uncinus
reply to post by FreeSpeaker

 

Well, I can't really speculate much more without seeing photos.

Understandable. I will endeavor to get some pictures in the future.

Another possibility is that you were just seeing overflights crossing above you, and you confused this with some local flights. Perspective can play tricks on you sometimes. Of course I was not there, so really can't tell. I think there are a bunch of international flight that go over that region though.

You're forgetting I watch these planes arrive from the south and then return south. I am not mistaken and have seen it happen many many times. The pattern and behaviour is always the same.

One other problem I have is if the weather, and lake effects etc, and its changes affect contrail formation how is it possible that they can always arrive and leave without leaving a trail? If conditions are that random it doesn't seem possible that they could always be just right for them to arrive and leave with no marks.

Originally posted by firepilot
Its not that contrails change the weather, its that weather changes the contrails. The weather was already changing, and the increased prominence of contrails are evidence of that.

Indeed, in fact you can use contrails to predict the weather. Which might be useful for the fishermen.

cf.synergylearning.org...

By taking advantage of this information in the sky, without any equipment, students can predict the weather. If the contrails are short (and there are few or no clouds in the sky) there is little moisture in the sky at high levels and chances are the next twelve to twenty-four hours will be clear.

If the contrails are long (and maybe clouds are already in the sky) the moisture content of the upper level of the sky is high and more clouds or even a storm is on the way.

The weather prediction is more dramatic when the sky is clear and the contrails are long. Then you can say on a clear day that tomorrow will be cloudy. Some days you can see a short trail in the morning and long trail in the afternoon; that tells you that moisture is moving in and you know it before the clouds come!

Originally posted by FreeSpeaker
You're forgetting I watch these planes arrive from the south and then return south. I am not mistaken and have seen it happen many many times. The pattern and behaviour is always the same.

One other problem I have is if the weather, and lake effects etc, and its changes affect contrail formation how is it possible that they can always arrive and leave without leaving a trail? If conditions are that random it doesn't seem possible that they could always be just right for them to arrive and leave with no marks.

Okay, well next time get photos

It's possible they are coming from a nearby airport to practice high altitude maneuvers - so they are climbing most of the way there, and descending most of the way back. That's pure speculation though, without photos.

Originally posted by Uncinus
Okay, well next time get photos

You mean so you can just look at it and say "contrails!" with your chemical-analyzing eyeballs again?


What would you be comparing it to, again, to contrast with what chemtrails look like?

Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

Originally posted by Uncinus
reply to post by FreeSpeaker

 

Well, I can't really speculate much more without seeing photos.

Understandable. I will endeavor to get some pictures in the future.

Another possibility is that you were just seeing overflights crossing above you, and you confused this with some local flights. Perspective can play tricks on you sometimes. Of course I was not there, so really can't tell. I think there are a bunch of international flight that go over that region though.

You're forgetting I watch these planes arrive from the south and then return south. I am not mistaken and have seen it happen many many times. The pattern and behaviour is always the same.

So what type of aircraft was this?

Oh, this is just another thread with vaguely defined and constantly shifting parameters fro what entails a 'chemtrail'.

Here's a test, substitute the word jesus for chemtrail and you will have fun with this thread, true believers.

Originally posted by firepilot

So what type of aircraft was this?

I truly have no idea. Never been big into aircraft. All I can say is its not a commercial jet. Too me it looks around the size of the waterbombers we have or the type of large planes that land on water. Thats the best I can tell you.

Originally posted by bsbray11

Originally posted by Uncinus
Okay, well next time get photos

You mean so you can just look at it and say "contrails!" with your chemical-analyzing eyeballs again?

What would you be comparing it to, again, to contrast with what chemtrails look like?

edit on 12-6-2011 by bsbray11 because: (no reason given)

I would be able to tell if it looked like a contrail, possibly something about the altitude, the plane type, and the weather conditions, and perhaps what type of maneuver was being performed.

It could, of course, possibly be a secret government sprayer.

Originally posted by incrediblelousminds
Oh, this is just another thread with vaguely defined and constantly shifting parameters fro what entails a 'chemtrail'.

Here's a test, substitute the word jesus for chemtrail and you will have fun with this thread, true believers.

Nice contribution. Go have fun with yourself if you don't like the thread because nobody likes to waste time reading garbage.

Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

Originally posted by firepilot

So what type of aircraft was this?

I truly have no idea. Never been big into aircraft. All I can say is its not a commercial jet. Too me it looks around the size of the waterbombers we have or the type of large planes that land on water. Thats the best I can tell you.

Then how do you know its the same planes? I have seen your claim many times though from people, who insist they see the same planes going West over head, then going East, and they think it is the same exact plane, even though there will be constant traffic of planes going opposite directions.

Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

Originally posted by incrediblelousminds
Oh, this is just another thread with vaguely defined and constantly shifting parameters fro what entails a 'chemtrail'.

Here's a test, substitute the word jesus for chemtrail and you will have fun with this thread, true believers.

Nice contribution. Go have fun with yourself if you don't like the thread because nobody likes to waste time reading garbage.

Actually the original point is valid. There are lots of comparisons between religion, and fervor in the faith based chemtrail belief. Its not far fetched at all to make a religious comparison of the two.

Originally posted by Uncinus
I would be able to tell if it looked like a contrail

And of course if it was any white trail in the sky behind a plane, you would say it's only a contrail.


For most planes I'm sure they are, but it's the going from "most" to "all" that creates problems for me, when as far as we know they could look the exact same.

Originally posted by firepilot

Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

Originally posted by incrediblelousminds
Oh, this is just another thread with vaguely defined and constantly shifting parameters fro what entails a 'chemtrail'.

Here's a test, substitute the word jesus for chemtrail and you will have fun with this thread, true believers.

Nice contribution. Go have fun with yourself if you don't like the thread because nobody likes to waste time reading garbage.

Actually the original point is valid. There are lots of comparisons between religion, and fervor in the faith based chemtrail belief. Its not far fetched at all to make a religious comparison of the two.

If you want a religious debtate my I suggest another forum. Conspiracys in religion maybe.

Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

Originally posted by firepilot

So what type of aircraft was this?

I truly have no idea. Never been big into aircraft. All I can say is its not a commercial jet. Too me it looks around the size of the waterbombers we have or the type of large planes that land on water. Thats the best I can tell you.

Hmm, how much detail could you actually see? It does not sound like it was that high.

Anything like this?

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/5d105ddc0666.jpg[/atsimg]

Originally posted by firepilot

Then how do you know its the same planes? I have seen your claim many times though from people, who insist they see the same planes going West over head, then going East, and they think it is the same exact plane, even though there will be constant traffic of planes going opposite directions.

I have said it again and again. Do you debunkers just discard any information that you don't agree with? I have watched two planes do this for years now. I spend alot of time at the cottage and know what the planes at the local airports look like. I have even flown on some of them. I don't know names but I do know the general shape and size of most of the planes up there.

Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

Originally posted by firepilot

Then how do you know its the same planes? I have seen your claim many times though from people, who insist they see the same planes going West over head, then going East, and they think it is the same exact plane, even though there will be constant traffic of planes going opposite directions.

I have said it again and again. Do you debunkers just discard any information that you don't agree with? I have watched two planes do this for years now. I spend alot of time at the cottage and know what the planes at the local airports look like. I have even flown on some of them. I don't know names but I do know the general shape and size of most of the planes up there.

No, I just have a skeptical view and want to understand what someone is trying to express, and if it takes pointed questions, then that what it takes. Maybe try photographing them or coming up with some tangible data. Knowing what type of aircraft would be a big help though

People who believe in chemtrails, have a long history of knowing little to nothing about aviation. I have yet to see a chemtrailer who can actually talk with some degree of aviation knowledge.

Originally posted by bsbray11

Originally posted by firepilot
If a weather system is approaching and the upper air humidity is increasings, its entirely logical to expect bigger and longer lasting contrails. Its actually illogical that the chemmies expect that contrails should always look the same, regardless of the weather

Doesn't that mean chemtrails would also take on different appearances in different atmospheric conditions?

Correctomundo!

When conditions are not right for them they look completely different from when conditions are right for them - they become transparent!

Originally posted by FreeSpeaker
Most really be something damaging in those reports.

I would really hate if terrorists got their hands on the reports from those programs, it would detail exactly how biological agents can spread, and provide a wealth of information that would allow them to hurt many people.

Use some critical thinking.