Hawaiian Senator said Obama not releasing long-form BC to hide identity or citizenship of his father

Originally posted by balon0
This whole birthplace issue is ridiculous. Shouldn't this be something debated on and brought to attention
B E F O R E he ran for president?????

Yes, it was by Phil Berg, and people like the ones posting on this thread said it was ridiculous. Phil Berg is a Democrat by the way and a Hillary supporter. A number of Hillary supporters were behind this as well, as they wanted her elected, but it fizzled out after Obama got elected. Jerone Corsi wrote an entire book about Obama and his mother. It's called Obamanation. It was in the bookstores by the end of June 08. I know, because I bought one in the Phoenix airport.

Originally posted by mickdundee23
They are obviously hiding something. Why spend $millions to hide it. Just release and I and millions of others will eat crow.

There is a problem with your theory. Most wont succomb to defeat. No matter what is shown, it wont be enough.
It will be released.
It will be called a fake.
It will be called a lie.
Wait and watch.

Everyone here that does not hold a huge flag supporting Obama has the brains to know Obama is at least hiding his identity.

The simple FACT that this fraud of a President spent millions to keep anyone from getting hands on his real info should prove, WITHOUT A SHADOW OF A DOUBT THAT HE IS UTTERLY LYING TO ALL YOU AND WAS NOT BORN IN THIS COUNTRY!!!!!!

ANYONE WHO DENYS OBAMA IS NOT A FRAUD needs to have their head examined or deported from this great land for ignorance.

When most Black Americans I talk to don't trust him as far as they can throw him, you know somethings up. One is my Doctor!!!

reply to post by dereks

WOW!
Derek, you here have just used three "anti-birther" tactics filosophia layed out in his post here

You used tactics 4, 3 and 2 and then 4 again as follows
Tactic 4. Call the birther a racist person

Originally posted by dereks
Well for one it would not stop the racist birthers as it is not about any bit of paper Obama shows, it is that a black man is the legal POUS

Tactic 3. Suggest that even if he did release the long form, birthers won't accept it.

Originally posted by dereks
Birthers would just claim it was forged anyway

Tactic 2. Obama didn't release his long form, but he doesn't need to.

Originally posted by dereks
Why should he? No previous POTUS had to show theirs,

Tactic 4. Call the birther a racist person

Originally posted by dereks
but when the first black POTUS gets legally elected the racist birthers start demanding he show all his personal records

Originally posted by Miraj
reply to post by rebeldog

 

One parent has to be citizen.

Or they have to be born on US territory.

Obama's mother was a citizen, so was his father (although not a naturalized citizen.), and he was born in our country.

Where did you get that information? Are you assuming that he got a Green Card (residency) when he married Stanley Ann? She was underage at the time of their marriage. Obama Sr was a British subject by the British Nationality Act of 1948

British Nationality Act, 1948 Part I British Nationality 1.—(1) Every person who under this Act is a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies or who under any enactment for the time being in force in any country mentioned in subsection (3) of this section is a citizen of that country shall by virtue of that citizenship have the status of a British subject. 2) Any person having the status aforesaid may be known either as a British subject or as a Commonwealth citizen; and accordingly in this Act and in any other enactment or instrument whatever, whether passed or made before or after the commencement of this Act, the expression "British subject" and the expression "Commonwealth citizen" shall have the same meaning.

As far as we know, Obama Sr was not naturalized in the US and never gave up his British citizenship.

Part II Citizenship of the United Kingdom and Colonies. Citizenship by birth or descent 4. Subject to the provisions of this section, every person born within the United Kingdom and Colonies after the commencement of this Act shall be a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies by birth:

www.uniset.ca...

So, if by some chance, Barry was actually born in Kenya, he would be automatically a British subject. His mother being underage could not confer citizenship. He was reportedly 6 when Stanley Ann married Lolo and took him to Indonesia. So, any jurisdiction the US would have is non-functional.
This is why it was so important to show whether he was born in Kenya or Hawaii.

One has to wonder why Barry was interested in this kind of legislation when he became Prez

But in his speech last night, Obama clearly made H-1B and Green Card access to graduates of U.S. universities is a priority and part of his competitiveness theme. He will have little trouble assembling bipartisan support for an H-1B reform bill.

blogs.computerworld.com...

Oh yes, Stanley Ann and Obama Sr separated in about 1963. It typically takes about 18 months these days to pursue a legal residency in the US. It is very difficult to do when you are separating. Obama Sr then married another American named Nidesand in 1967. It is clear that Obama Sr can not have had legal residency or citizenship by the time Barry was born. He was still on Visa during the time he was in the US.

In addition, Stanley Ann was preggie with Barry before she married Obama Sr. There is no DNA to even prove that Obama Sr is the daddy.

Originally posted by rebeldog
reply to post by filosophia

 

EXACTLY!!!!! it is not about birthplace.. that doesn't matter...

NATURAL BORN CITIZEN... which is the difference in presidential eligibilty verses congressional..

BOTH PARENTS HAVE TO BE US CITIZENS!!!!

so many stupid people don't get that, or they are disinfo..

If you would be so kind as to show us "stupid people" where EXACTLY it says that both parents have to be citizens in the Constitution please?

FOR THOSE WHO HATE OBAMA: This is how people felt when the last President gained office via FRAUD in Florida. By all accounts, GORE won the election. A republican judge had the deciding vote and Bush "won" the election because of her decision. He robbed Gore the Presidency.

Okay. That happened. We got over it. Most people know that election was bought and stolen.

We moved on. It's time for you to do the same. Obama is the President. For whatever reason this Hellstorm has ignited, the fact that he is President must be accepted. He is the President. Just as Bush was when he stole the election against Gore. Move on. Accept it. Do you really think Obama would be in office if the BANKERS (BANKSTERS) did not want him to be in office? Have you noticed a real change in US policy? No? Get off your kick. Accept that he is President. Accept that he is sitting in a seat that is CONTROLLED by other forces (TPTB).

Get over it. Just like folks did when G.W. stole the election. Now you know how it feels. Now you know that it doesn't matter WHO is in the seat. The seat Itself has been bought and paid-for by the wealthy elite. There is an agenda beyond the seat, no matter who sits on that false throne.

reply to post by GhostLancer
Bush haters didn't really get over it until his term ended.
Just saying...

Can I ask the birthers a couple questions?

1) I've been googling, but besides a blog and a couple sites like ATS referencing the blog, I can't find any reputable souces saying that Obama is paying anyone to "Seal" his records.

2) Secondly, everyone's records are sealed by default. So what do you all mean by "Seal"

3) I see that Obama HAS spent millions paying lawfirms to defend cases where he has been sued for various reasons concerning his election, but none of the cases that I have looked up would have been settled with him showing his birth certificate. (that was really more of a statement than a question i guess).

4) as for his background, is it that hard to believe he's American? Is he not fat enough, is it because of his middle name? I mean.. I had an investigation for my security clearance and it only took 4 months. Very few people (only the few people I talked to) remembered me from school. I never had a driver's license before a few months ago so no driving record. And I was born in a small town in Illinois and it was a pain in the butt getting just a copy of my short form. If I ran.. and you couldn't readily get all sorts of info on me from a google search, would you question my citizenship?

5) and Lastly...if he doesn't want to show his birth certificate for some reason, lets say he enjoys having the right to privacy that every other american has, do you think we should force him to give up this right to privacy? Would you think so if it meant that you too would also lose your right for privacy towards your personal records?

Originally posted by GhostLancer
FOR THOSE WHO HATE OBAMA: This is how people felt when the last President gained office via FRAUD in Florida. By all accounts, GORE won the election. A republican judge had the deciding vote and Bush "won" the election because of her decision. He robbed Gore the Presidency.

Okay. That happened. We got over it. Most people know that election was bought and stolen.

We moved on. It's time for you to do the same. Obama is the President. For whatever reason this Hellstorm has ignited, the fact that he is President must be accepted. He is the President. Just as Bush was when he stole the election against Gore. Move on. Accept it. Do you really think Obama would be in office if the BANKERS (BANKSTERS) did not want him to be in office? Have you noticed a real change in US policy? No? Get off your kick. Accept that he is President. Accept that he is sitting in a seat that is CONTROLLED by other forces (TPTB).

Get over it. Just like folks did when G.W. stole the election. Now you know how it feels. Now you know that it doesn't matter WHO is in the seat. The seat Itself has been bought and paid-for by the wealthy elite. There is an agenda beyond the seat, no matter who sits on that false throne.

Well, if we were going to take this to its logical conclusion, it would not have mattered even if Gore had been accepted as POTUS by the court. I am certain the PATRIOT ACT would still have passed. What would Gore have done when Sept 11 happened? The PATRIOT ACT was drafted in the Clinton term, so we know that the NWO had it planned all along.

Originally posted by Santh
Can I ask the birthers a couple questions?

1) I've been googling, but besides a blog and a couple sites like ATS referencing the blog, I can't find any reputable souces saying that Obama is paying anyone to "Seal" his records.

2) Secondly, everyone's records are sealed by default. So what do you all mean by "Seal"

3) I see that Obama HAS spent millions paying lawfirms to defend cases where he has been sued for various reasons concerning his election, but none of the cases that I have looked up would have been settled with him showing his birth certificate. (that was really more of a statement than a question i guess).

4) as for his background, is it that hard to believe he's American? Is he not fat enough, is it because of his middle name? I mean.. I had an investigation for my security clearance and it only took 4 months. Very few people (only the few people I talked to) remembered me from school. I never had a driver's license before a few months ago so no driving record. And I was born in a small town in Illinois and it was a pain in the butt getting just a copy of my short form. If I ran.. and you couldn't readily get all sorts of info on me from a google search, would you question my citizenship?

5) and Lastly...if he doesn't want to show his birth certificate for some reason, lets say he enjoys having the right to privacy that every other american has, do you think we should force him to give up this right to privacy? Would you think so if it meant that you too would also lose your right for privacy towards your personal records?

edit on 26-4-2011 by Santh because: (no reason given)

He "paid" back Elena Kagan for acting on his behalf in the lawsuits by giving her a nomination as a Supreme. What kind of paypack did you have in mind?

Which records did you have in mind? There's his BC, and his school records. Here is an article about the BC records from WND(I know anti-birthers hate this but then they can disprove the particular statement if they like)

WND has learned that Hawaii's Gov. Linda Lingle has placed the candidate's birth certificate under seal and instructed the state's Department of Health to make sure no one in the press obtains access to the original document under any circumstances.
The governor's office officially declined a request made in writing by WND in Hawaii to obtain a copy of the hospital-generated original birth certificate of Barack Obama.
Those listed as entitled to obtain a copy of an original birth certificate include the person born, or "registrant" according to the legal description from the governor's office, the spouse or parent of the registrant, a descendant of the registrant, a person having a common ancestor with the registrant, a legal guardian of the registrant, or a person or agency acting on behalf of the registrant.

WND was told the official reason for denial of access to Obama's birth certificate would be authority granted pursuant to Section 338-18 of the Hawaii Revised Statutes, a provision the anonymous source claimed was designed to prevent identity theft.

But don't you find it inexplicable that the gov of Hi would seal the BC of a Presidential candidate whose eligibility is in question?


Read more: Obama's birth certificate sealed by Hawaii governor www.wnd.com...

So there's that! This is why Obama would have to request it himself, or someone requesting it on his behalf.

Then there's the Freedom of Information Act of 1974 which you can read up on here en.wikipedia.org...(United_States)

You may remember some confusion about this issue:

2001 Executive Order limiting the FOIA Executive Order 13233, drafted by Alberto R. Gonzales and issued by President George W. Bush on November 1, 2001, shortly after the September 11, 2001 attacks, restricted access to the records of former Presidents. This order was revoked on January 21, 2009, as part of President Barack Obama's Executive Order 13489.[17] Public access to presidential records was restored to the original extent of five years (12 for some records) outlined in the Presidential Records Act.[18]

So Bush Jr made signed an EO limiting access to Presidential records and Barry signed an EO reversing it. We may assume it was for purposes of getting dirt on the former Prez, but then he would also open himself up to this too. Most likely he will just reverse it back to Bush's original order just before he leaves office.

Oh yes, and lastly, Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi guaranteed Barry's eligibility to be POTUS. This page has her siggy on the nomination document for the DNC. It was up to the DNC to thoroughly vet their candidate, which means they are supposed to know if their nominated candidate is eligible. Nancy verified his eligibilty so if we find out that he really was not natural born, then she is implicated in the cover up, you see because they are supposed to check his BC. See how that goes?
www.wnd.com...

reply to post by SerenityGained


You were there between 1966 and 1969? (I think those are the correct dates). Obama was in Indonesia between the ages of 5 to 9 or thereabouts.

Originally posted by Byteman
reply to post by syrinx high priest

 

And again, since you glossed over it.

He gave it up when he became Indonesian, IF he had it in the first place.

It would seem you've glossed over doing any research.

In order to give up your US Citizenship - you MUST write the State Dept and request revocation. Do you have any proof this was done? IF he had Indonesian citizenship, that did NOT automatically revoke or invalidate his US citizenship (feel free to check the State Dept web site for details).

Additionally, please show us where in the Constitution is says that anyone holding dual citizenship (US obviously being one of them) is ineligible to be President.

For that matter, show me where the SCOTUS has specifically decided what "natural born" really means since it certainly was NEVER defined in the Constitution.

reply to post by Sinnthia

Originally posted by Sinnthia

If you lose the one you got when you were born, you need to get a new one. When you get a new one, you get the one the state CURRENTLY issues. What Obama showed is what the state CURRENTLY issues. You birthers all need to take your argument over to Hawaii and tell the state they are lying because that is all you have left. –pg 2

Hawaii no longer issues full copies of the registration in a move to conform to federal guidelines and come inline with other states, such as mine, that NO LONGER ISSUE FULL COPIES OF THE REGISTRATION EITHER. No, they do not destroy them because they are not sitting around to be destroyed. There is a file. If you want what is in it, you can only get a copy. That is simple reality. If you request a copy today, you get the version they give you that is recognized by all 50 states as proof of birthplace. You can whine and cry all you guys like but until you tell Hawaii they are full of crap and the constitution needn't recognize them, you will just be whining and crying. – pg 2

What makes you think he has the one that was issued to his parents all those years ago? There is a reason he had to get a current copy and I can only assume it was the same as mine. Mom did not hold onto stuff like she should have. So unless you can prove he still has posession of the original one he was issued, you are just speculating on your own beliefs. – pg 4

Ummmm...no. None of that is correct. There is a registration on file and even Obama cannot relase it. All he can do is ask for a copy. Perhaps you can explain this strange practice it sounds like you just made up? The fact that you birthers do not even know what you are talking about when it comes to birth certificates is kind of the dead giveaway that you really do not care about it. – pg 6

OK, let's say he "releases" this imaginary document you think is hidden in a safe. You will just accept that then? – pg 6

Coming from a state that issues short forms only myself kind of tipped my hand here. EIther I can never be president just because NY state decided to screw me or the very base birther claim fails from the get go. – pg 6

Now, let's take your purposeful misrepresentation of the facts out of this and let's see what the Hawaii Dept. of Health has to say about releasing vital records...

§338-13 Certified copies. (a) Subject to the requirements of sections 338-16, 338-17, and 338-18, the department of health shall, upon request, furnish to any applicant a certified copy of ANY CERTIFICATE, OR THE CONTENTS OF ANY CERTIFICATE, OR ANY PART THEREOF. (b) Copies of the contents of any certificate on file in the department, certified by the department shall be considered for all purposes the same as the original, subject to the requirements of sections 338-16, 338-17, and 338-18.
(c) Copies may be made by photography, dry copy reproduction, typing, computer printout or other process approved by the director of health. [L 1949, c 327, §17; RL 1955, §57-16; am L Sp 1959 2d, c 1, §19; HRS §338-13; am L 1978, c 49, §1]

www.capitol.hawaii.gov...

reply to post by JohhnyBGood

Do you suppose that would be good enough for even the lowest grade security clearance?

Of course it is. That and a picture ID are all that is required for proof of citizenship and identification.

A passport, (current or expired) satisfies both requirements, but the way, and the COLB is good enough for a passport.

Deny Ignorance; think before you type.

reply to post by Becoming

I for one believe that there is a long form and that he was born in Hawaii. I just think that the reason he won't sign a release of information and show it to us all is that it possibly has a religion box on it and it has been filled in by the dreaded word "muslim".

There is no space on the mythical long form for religion. Please refer to this article for an explanation of what the long form would look like it were released. Note that this article describes a hypothetical reconstruction and makes no pretense of being the actual form. The form has no space for religions affiliation.

Originally posted by Byteman


The real issue is the citizenship of his father.

If it doesn't show both his parents are US citizens, then he is not natural born, and he is not qualified to be president. Since we all know his father was Kenyan and a British subject at the time of Obama's birth, Obama was also a Brit at birth, and not qualified to be president.

No it's not. If you are natural born it means you were born as a citizen, and you or nobody on your behalf took no action (naturalization) to become a citizen.

The short term certificate is actually called a 'Certification of Birth'. He has shown this and, as another ATS member correctly pointed out, that is the only certificate that Hawai will issue; ie. they don't re-issue the long-form certificates.

Think this should be laid to rest, there are more important things going on in the world and no matter how hard we push on this, i doubt Obama will stand down or withdraw his candidacy.

Thundersmurf...
Peace™

Originally posted by jibeho
Just for those who claim that HI only issues the "standard short form" like Obama's forgery. Here is a person who obtained a copy of their "long form" in March of 2011

nobarack08.wordpress.com...

If I'm not mistaken - here are two versions of the same document that you're referring to. Both of these were presented on the same web site - just 4 days apart. If you look carefully (I encourage you to import into a viewer and increase the magnification as much as needed), you'll notice not so subtle differences between the date stamps. From the same exact BC???

Old: www.thepostemail.com...
New: www.thepostemail.com...

Originally posted by userid1
you'll notice not so subtle differences between the date stamps. From the same exact BC???

Old: www.thepostemail.com...
New: www.thepostemail.com...

Yes, there is certainly a difference! funny that.