We need a geoengineering forum..."Chemtrail" properly geoengineering, threads do not belong instan

Paul Portney, Dean of the Eller College of Management and Professor of Economics organized his talk around six questions: 1. Why is this such a difficult problem? 2. Why should the U.S. be part of the solution? 3. What is being done now? 4. What more could and should be done? 5. How can we accomplish this? 6. Will I get to the game by tip-off time?

This is one of the leading geoengineering scientists. He has been a primary person involved with the development of Geoengineering Research & Development programs.

Google Tech Talks : January, 7 2008

www.youtube.com...

Speaker: Ken Caldeira

Ken Caldeira is a scientist at the Carnegie Institution Department of Global Ecology and a Professor (by courtesy) at the Stanford University Department of Environmental and Earth System Sciences. Previously, he worked for 12 years in the Energy and Environment Directorate at the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory (Department of Energy). His research interests include the numerical simulation of Earth's climate, carbon, and biogeochemistry; ocean acidification; climate emergency response systems; evaluating approaches to supplying environmentally-friendly energy services; ocean carbon sequestration; long-term evolution of climate and geochemical cycles; and marine biogeochemical cycles. Caldeira has a B.A. in Philosophy from Rutgers College and an M.S. and Ph.D. in Atmospheric Sciences from New York University.

Roger Angel, Regents' Professor of Astronomy gave two issues for his talk. One he called taking our foot off the accelerator - how we should cut back on our use of fossil fuel and the importance of not adding to the problem of global warming. Second was: can we design some brakes in case we need them which entails global engineering to cool the planet. November 21, 2006

A panel of Carnegie Mellon researchers discuss global climate change and how we all can be contributors to the solution. Moderated by alumna Dr. Marilyn Bracken (MM'57), President and General Manager of Bracken Associates LLC. Panelists include Steinbrenner Institiute for Environmental Education & Research (SEER) faculty Dr. Lester Lave, Co-Director Carnegie Mellon Electrical Industry Center; Dr. M. Granger Morgan, Director of the Climate Decision Making Center and Edward Rubin, Professor in Engineering and Public Policy and Mechanical Engineering

BARIUM RELEASE SYSTEM
United States Patent 3751913
www.freepatentsonline.com...

ORIGIN OF THE DISCLOSURE

The invention described herein was made in the performance of work under a NASA contract and is subject to the provisions of section 305 of the National Aeronautics and Space Act of 1958, Public Law 85-568 (72 Stat. 435; 42 USC 2457).

This invention relates generally to a chemical release system and relates in particular to a system for releasing barium in the vapor phase so that it can be ionized by solar radiation and also be excited to emit resonance radiation in the visible range. The ionized luminous cloud of barium then becomes a visible indication of magnetic and electric characteristics in space and allows determination of these properties over relatively large areas of space at a given time compared to rocket borne or orbiting instruments. For example, a geomagnetic field line could be illuminated by the present invention from pole-to-pole.

Presently, barium release systems are used to create ion clouds in the upper atmosphere for the study of geophysical properties of the atmosphere. These known systems utilize a solid chemical system using a thermite mixture of barium and copper oxide as the heat-producing reaction and an excess of barium to be vaporized. This system is launched by a suitable rocket and, at a predetermined time, the ingredients are ignited and released from a canister through a burst diaphragm and nozzle. The resulting barium cloud gives a brilliant color that can be observed and studied from earth to give indications of wind currents and the like. This known system of barium release has proved effective but is inherently of low efficiency in producing barium vapor yielding, in practice, only from 2 to 4 percent of the total chemical weight when actually up to 48 percent is available. In addition, the barium-copper oxide mixture is a fire hazard when mixing and pressing into the canister and must be done under inert atmospheric conditions which proves time-consuming and costly in operation. Also, little, if any, ionization takes place in this known system due to the initial heat generating reaction.

It is therefore an object of the present invention to provide a new and novel barium release system for atmospheric and space studies.

Another object of the present invention is a system for releasing barium in the vapor phase so that it can be ionized by solar radiation and excited to emit resonance radiation in the visible range.

Another object of the present invention is a novel chemical mixture for releasing a good yield of free atoms and barium ions.

A further object of the present invention is a binary liquid hypergolic chemical release system in which barium is formed as a vapor at the time of release.

The foregoing and other objects are attained in one aspect of the present invention by providing a liquid fuel, in which barium salts are dissolved, and a high energy oxidizer which spontaneously ignites the fuel on contact. The barium release is accomplished by impinging fuel and oxidizer jets in an open-ended combuation chamber which expels the reaction product gases or plasma and which includes the desired barium neutral atoms (Ba° ) and barium ions (Ba + ) as individual species.

A more complete appreciation of the invention and many of the attendant advantages thereof will be readily apparent as the same becomes better understood by reference to the following detailed description when considered in connection with the accompanying drawings wherein:

FIG. 1 is a schematic representation of the fuel and oxidizer tanks connected to an open-ended combustion chamber in a launch rocket for release of barium according to the present invention; and

FIG. 2 is a plot of triangular coordinates which defines the barium nitrate- barium chloride-hydrazine mixtures of the present invention.

Aluminum soap demisting agent in jet fuel

www.patentstorm.us...

oai.dtic.mil...

Accession Number : ADD003645

Title : Aluminum Soap Demisting Agent in Jet Fuel.

Descriptive Note : Patent,

Corporate Author : DEPARTMENT OF THE NAVY WASHINGTON D C

Personal Author(s) : Adicoff,Arnold

Report Date : 30 NOV 1976

Pagination or Media Count : 2

Abstract : Compositions of matter comprising a mixture of a jet fuel and an aluminum di-acid soap of a saturated carboxylic acid having from 8 to 20 carbon atoms are disclosed. The compositions of matter are useful as fuels for jet aircraft. (Author)

Descriptors : *Patents, *Aluminum soaps, *Fuel additives, *Jet engine fuels, Saturated hydrocarbons, Carboxylic acids, Chemical composition, Mixtures

Subject Categories : FUELS

Distribution Statement : APPROVED FOR PUBLIC RELEASE

The Science of "Air Pharmacology" or "Chemtrails"
By: "Jim Phelps"
Copyright 2005

www.californiaskywatch.com...

This page is written by the person that invented the DOE's biggest project on re-mediation for the ozone hole. Jim Phelps invented the DOE's "Global Shield" Weather Control Projects in the mid-1980s to compensate for man's damage to the ozone layer leading to global warming. Jim Phelps spotted the predominate mechanisms for global warming and found ways to lessen the damage using commercial aircraft to make cloud systems to cool the Earth.

Jim Phelps invented the concepts of "Global Systems Engineering" to do studies that allowed Human activities to more harmonize with the natural order of the Earth, rather than conflict. Phelps discovered the way UV-b radiation damaged the ocean's cloud systems and invented the large scale methods using commercial jet planes that attempt to restore some of this cloud based cooling effect and lessen the rate for Global Warming. The inventions came from direct experience at the Oak Ridge National Lab and working the Q-cleared world of DOE's nuclear weapons complex.

This piece is about the origin of the Ozone Hole and the methods in use and being designed to attempt to fix what man's pollution has done to our weather and environment. Chemtrails are, in essence, the manmade massive global white clouds that are the harbinger for Christ's message. If you have ever wondered about chemtrails; What they are, How they work, Who designed them, or Who is responsible then it is all right here in these pages for all to see. Here one can read the science behind chemtrails, the real mechanisms for global warming, and the common sense reasons for what is happening.

Everyone has always suspected HAARP and Chemtrail methods were related, and they are, one is preventative method and the other after the fact corrections for GW. The top goal for HAARP is to dump the concentrations of Methane type gases in the upper atmosphere similar to how high sun spot activity causes losses of gases into space from the atmosphere. I specified and named the atmospheric RF heating system to modify the methane concentrations in the upper atmosphere, to remediate this critical problem in global warming.

I found this effect way back in the middle 1980's while looking at the Star Wars LASER effects on the atmosphere, the mechanism of the ozone hole, and the mechanism for smog generation. Observations around Oak Ridge due to its high emissions of HF were showing unusual effects on temperatures and with close inspection of the processes I became the first to define the HF global warming equation and the unusual recycle boundary conditions. The HF being lighter than air was a sure sign of problems in the upper atmosphere, but one that took UV synergism for the injection.

The discovery of this process lead directly to the issues of designing chemtrail methods to pull the HF out of the skies, since it was the easiest to get to with combination chemistry with metals and via absorption into water molecules. Generation 1 and Generation 2 chemtrail techniques are all my invention to stop the formation of the IR blanket gases.

HAARP was my idea to deal with the IR gases already high in skies by heating them in such a way as to set up a wave propagation to push some of these gases into space. High-energy ejection from the Sun also will cast off light gases from Earth into space in the upper atmosphere and HAARP is intended to mimic this effect and more. It was a retroactive approach to lessen the problems. HAARP could also be potentially used to test making more
ozone to replace what was being killed from the Cl atoms and cut GW effects. This is why fluoride emissions need to be carefully regulated and the effect made public.


V. PERSISTENT CLOUD MAKING FOR GLOBAL WARMING SHIELDING
The discovery of the HF problems leading to imminent disasters due to strategic metals industries and coal power HF releases together with the oil industries hydrocarbon emissions was all covered up. Since I discovered the effect, I was far ahead to the pack on possible solutions.

I was the first person to suggest two possible ways to control the HF problems, one via using metals to complex with the HF and weight it down from the skies and the other using the HF affinity toward water and raining it from the skies. In those days, I called these methods "air pharmacology," but the more recent most popularly used term has become "chemtrails." So basically, I was the person that invented chemtrails.

skunk works is the nice name for the other hoax section. These days if ATS believes in something I usually believe in the opposite.

The problem is quite simple: some people just don't understand the difference between geo-engineering and "chemtrails." Geo-engineering is the theoretical capacity to artificially alter the Earth's climate on demand. "Chemtrails" are condensation trails that form at high altitude. Unable to comprehend their formation, some people have proposed vague conspiracy theories to account for them. Geo-engineering can and should be discussed in the "Science and Technology" and "Fragile Earth" forums. "Chemtrails" properly belong in the "Skunk Works" or "Grey Area" as there is no evidence to support any of the conspiracy claims.

reply to post by DJW001

"Chemtrails" properly belong in the "Skunk Works" or "Grey Area" as there is no evidence to support any of the conspiracy claims.

Despite countless proven cases of Governments spraying harmful chemicals on unsuspecting civilians..
I get it mate, you're in denial..

reply to post by MathiasAndrew

The Science of "Air Pharmacology" or "Chemtrails"
By: "Jim Phelps"
Copyright 2005

Here is another example of "Jim Phelp's" research:

The deadly plan to kill JFK evolved at the Oak Ridge Y-12 plant and took on the shape of a hate crime as Oak Ridge declared JFK a communist [person not supporting religion], a bootlegger, an adulterer, anti-Israel, drugged up on pain medicines, and worse. When JFK took on the elimination of Israel acquiring nuclear weapons it became a full-fledged religious hate crime. Israel's David Ben-Gurion declared that JFK was going to be the end of Israel. JFK appears to have come across some of the hidden elements in the Jewish religion that if exposed would change everything. From the very beginning of the Manhattan Project, it has been a highly Jewish dominated research and management aimed at Hitler. And with anything Jewish, there is a huge support for Israel over even that of your own country. It is the "state within a state" issues that affect all areas where Jewish nationalism effect conflicts for control of Govt.'s. Oak Ridge used this against JFK.

Oak Ridge and the Assassination of JFK

reply to post by backinblack

Despite countless proven cases of Governments spraying harmful chemicals on unsuspecting civilians..
I get it mate, you're in denial..

Proven cases of governments performing unethical experiments properly belong in "General Conspiracies" or "Breaking Alternative News."
I get it mate, you're a troll.

reply to post by DJW001


Some people just don't understand the connections between geoengineering, military aerial obscuration and solar radiation management (SRM).

reply to post by DJW001


www.123helpme.com...

Abstract: Across the United States for the past half a century, the Department of Defense and the U.S. Army have been releasing biological agents over the very population they are supposed to protect. Although few Americans know it, open-air biological testing of stimulants such as aspergillus fumigatus, zinc cadmium sulfide, bacillus subtilis, and serratia marcescens has been taking place over populated areas since at least 1949. Between 1949 and 1969, the military admits to having conducted 239 open-air tests over populated areas in the United States. Testing has taken place in the San Francisco Bay area, New York City, and Washington, D.C., as well as in areas such as Hampton Roads, Virginia and Panama City, Florida. These open-air tests occur without the knowledge, or the consent, of both the general population and public officials and in fact, constitute a silent but potentially deadly form of terrorism against an uninformed and unsuspecting public. At least in instances of international or radical terrorism, the general population of the United States can feel secure in the fact that there are organizations designed to bring terrorists to justice; who, however, is going to defend citizens of the U.S. from the actions of the Department of Defense?

Beginning in the early 1980's the Department of Defense began to shift their focus away from biological agents to viral agents and genetic engineering. By 1983, for example, the Department of Defense already sponsored at least fourteen programs which studied recombinant DNA and the National Institute of Health had already granted several institutions permission to begin open-air testing of organisms which contained recombined DNA. There are two main reasons why recombined organisms are desirable to the Biological Warfare Program: First, viruses can be designed which previously had not been able to exist outside of their natural hosts. And secondly, these viruses will cause illnesses which will not only be difficult to treat, but will be extremely difficult to even diagnose. Although military institutions have the means to subvert them, international laws such as the Geneva Protocol of 1925 and the 1972 Biological Weapons Convention, exist in order to offer people protection from excessive or immoral use of biological warfare. As recently developed technologies, DNA and viral testing are not specifically addressed within the context of these older laws. Because technology advances so rapidly and both national legislation and international protocols tend to occur only after atrocities occur, it is very likely that humans come into contact with potentially deadly agents at the hands of the U.S. military.

reply to post by MathiasAndrew

Some people just don't understand the connections between geoengineering, military aerial obscuration and solar radiation management (SRM).

You're right: I understand that SRM is a branch of geo-engineering but I don't see the connection with chaff or "chemtrails." Perhaps if you actually did something to establish that connection you would be providing an important service to the world.

Chapter 1: The Need for Change (Research Involving Human Participants V1)
www.onlineethics.org...

not all research participants are protected by the federal oversight system; a number of federal departments and agencies that sponsor primarily nonbiomedical research or modest amounts of research have failed to implement fully the federal protections available; the federal protections do not always include specific provisions for those individuals who are especially vulnerable; the federal protections are difficult to enforce and improve effectively across the government, in part, because no single authority or office oversees research protections across all agencies and departments

involuntary human experiments
www.bibliotecapleyades.net...

1. "From the end of world War II well in to the 1970s, the Atomic Energy Commission, the Defense Department, the military services, the CIA and other agencies used prisoners, drug addicts, mental patients, college students, soldiers, even bar patrons, in a vast range of government-run experiments to test the effects of everything from radiation, '___' and nerve gas to intense electric shocks and prolonged ‘sensory deprivation.’ Some of the human guinea pigs knew what they were getting into; many others did not even know they were being experimented on.

During the last 50 years, hundreds of thousands of military personnel have been involved in human experimentation and other intentional exposures conducted by the Department of Defense (DOD), often without a servicemember's knowledge or consent.... The U.S. General Accounting Office issued a report on September 28, 1994, which stated that between 1940 and 1974, DOD and other national security agencies studied hundreds of thousands of human subjects in tests and experiments involving hazardous substances. GAO stated that some tests and experiments were conducted in secret."

The Versailles Leader-Statesman
Volume 115, Number 44 Thursday, October 26, 2000
Fort Wood tests raise concerns
www.gulfwarvets.com...

These facts also are found in "Biological Testing Involving Human Subjects by the Department of Defense, 1977, Hearings Before the Subcommittee on Health and Scientific Research of the Committee on Human Resources, United States Senate, 95th Congress, First Session on the Examination of Serious Deficiencies in the Defense Department's Efforts to Protect the Human Subjects, of Drug Research, March 8 and May 23, 1977."

In Edward M. Kennedy's opening statement, Kennedy said, "the Army had conducted a number of simulated biological warfare tests in the public domain and without the knowledge or consent of the people exposed to these tests. They also acknowledged that, while the simulants used in the tests were believed to be safe at that time, it is known that at least some of them are not safe and were not safe then."

Protection of Human Subjects in Biomedical Research
www.fda.gov...

LIMITED EXCEPTIONS TO THE INFORMED CONSENT REQUIREMENTS
Having discussed the system for human subject protection, it is important to recognize that there are limited circumstances when informed consent is not obtained from a human subject or his or her representative. There are three "exceptions" to FDA's informed consent requirements. These exceptions are: 1) for a physician to preserve the life of an individual patient; 2) for the conduct of a narrow class of research in emergency settings; and 3) for use by the Department of Defense (DoD) of specific investigational products in combat exigencies.

The FD&C Act specifically requires that investigators inform subjects receiving drugs under an IND that the drugs (and biologics) are investigational and "obtain the consent of such human beings or their representatives, except where they deem it not feasible, or in their professional judgement, contrary to the best interests of such human beings" (Section 505 and 520). The Medical Device Amendments of 1976 provided that the sponsor of clinical investigations must "assure that informed consent will be obtained from each human subject (or his representative). . . except where subject to such conditions as the Secretary may prescribe, the investigator conducting or supervising the proposed clinical testing of the device determines in writing that there exists a life-threatening situation involving the human subject. . . which necessitates the use of such device and it is not feasible to obtain informed consent from the subject and there is not sufficient time to obtain informed consent from the subject and there is not sufficient time to obtain such consent from his representative" (Section 520(g)(3)(D)). The three exceptions to the informed consent requirements that FDA has promulgated into regulation meet the standards described in those two statutory sections.

Federal Protection for Human Research Subjects:
An Analysis of the Common Rule
and Its Interactions with FDA Regulations
and the HIPAA Privacy Rule
www.fas.org...

Scope of the Common Rule
The protections and restrictions afforded by the Common Rule do not apply to
all research. Questions have been raised regarding which research should be
governed by the Common Rule, and the effect that the rule has on some specific
types of research.
Non-Federally Funded Research and Federally Funded Research
Outside the Scope of the Common Rule. The Common Rule governs only
research funded by agencies that have adopted 45 CFR 46, Subpart A. This
limitation may be important, as it has been reported that industry, rather than the
federal government, provides an estimated seventy percent of the funding for clinical
drug trials conducted in the United States.
22
Other federal regulations that may apply
to human subjects research are also limited in their application. FDA requirements
only extend protections to clinical trials that support applications to market a medical
product, or other areas over which FDA has jurisdiction, regardless of funding
source. The HIPPA Privacy Rule’s protections only regulate the flow of personally
identifiable information, and extend only to non-background research conducted by
covered entities, such as hospitals or medical clearing houses. Because of these
limitations, some clinical research (for example, a doctor’s non-federally funded
study to compare methods of plastic surgery)
23
falls outside the scope of HHS, FDA,
and HIPAA regulations, and therefore is not subject to federal informed consent and
IRB review requirements.
24
Information is not generally collected about human
subjects studies that fall outside the scope of federal regulations, so the precise
number of these studies is not known; however, a few sensational cases have been
reported in the media.
25
Companies and other organizations may voluntarily choose to apply the
Common Rule and/or other Subparts of 45 CFR 46 to their research projects.
However research projects in which compliance is voluntary are not subject to
oversight or disciplinary action by the HHS.

CHRONOLOGY OF CONGRESSIONAL HEARINGS RELATED TO RADIATION AND HUMAN RESEARCH

www.gwu.edu...

reply to post by backinblack

Despite countless proven cases of Governments spraying harmful chemicals on unsuspecting civilians..
I get it mate, you're in denial..

"They" are neither countless nor presently occurring.

No one should post as "fact" their presuppositions or personal fears, and expect hem to be accepted.
Show us a scientific study. Show us an analysis that says this is happening NOW.


You cannot, you last resort is fearmongering.

jw

Originally posted by MathiasAndrew
reply to post by DJW001

 

Some people just don't understand the connections between geoengineering, military aerial obscuration and solar radiation management (SRM).

Mat, the only credible propositions for any of these are benign and intended to address a perceived threat to all humanity.

Your own insecurities and inability to understand lead to fear of the unknown. How sad. You have yet to either formulate a single coherent hypothesis or to show how proposed SRM is harmful and on-going.

You need help.

deny ignorance
jw

Originally posted by MathiasAndrew
reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul

 

As I have said before, when you put all the evidence together then there is no doubt that these projects are happening on a large scale basis for studies and testing.
You must be joking if you want to keep suggesting that they're not.

Mat, this is getting pathetic.

Let's take your basic assumptions, and look at reality:

"Chemtrails are cooling the climate"
There is no definitive, objective evidence that the Earth has cooled as a result of the application of stratospheric SO2 aerosols. NOT ONE!
Dozens of studies have considered the feasibility of this approach to SRM/mitigation, but none has been shown to be effective.

Show us ONE, or you can persist in a delusion.

"Chemtrails" are to reduce the world's population."
After nearly 20 years of "chemtrail" propaganda, the Earth's population has increased by more than 1,000,000,000 people!
The methods you've described can NEVER achieve the stated goals of the "de-industrialists" like Holdren and Ehrlich.

Show us how this result is measured, observed and chronicled or persist in your pathetic delusions.

Mat, why are you so afraid? There are many who have studied ordinary contrails and found plenty to criticize! Why make things up, when there are plenty of present-day problems that affect us NOW, instead of some make-believe plot against people in general?

deny ignorance
jw

reply to post by DJW001


That's a ridiculous statement to make. Don't call troll when the only trollishness is coming from your direction.

You've come into this otherwise civil thread with a pre-formed opinion and aren't willing to do anything but imply that we lack understanding in these matters. It's a learning experience for all of us, and it's quite clear that you either don't see the connections, or are deliberately ignoring them for whatever reason.

Your thinly-disguised insults are offensive; your apparent inability to engage in lateral thinking is laughable - your apparent lack of capacity to logically connect overtly/ covertly related data sets and events is startling - particularly for a long-time member of a conspiracy website.

How Sad

One of the faithful has broken the rules, and exposed your charade:

Originally posted by MathiasAndrew
This really is becoming ridiculous. Obviously any of the debunkers who have said geoengineering has nothing to do with chemtrails is not aware of any of the real facts and actual arguments behind the "chemmies" positions.

Who would've guessed?

jw

Originally posted by filosophia
skunk works is the nice name for the other hoax section. These days if ATS believes in something I usually believe in the opposite.

Welcome to the discussion. Star.

Do you believe in current secret geoengineering efforts such as injecting aerosol particulates into the stratosphere which is discussed in the numerous papers presented here?

Do you have any research you would care to present?

I star all opinions as long as they are not trolling in my thread.

I'm not sure who "ATS" is as a person, but there seems to be a very strong spit of opinion over this topic. I know Nef on ATS live has a very definite opinion that there are not current geoengineering projects, don't remember the rest of the opinions expressed but I think they covered a range.

Originally posted by DJW001
reply to post by backinblack

 

Despite countless proven cases of Governments spraying harmful chemicals on unsuspecting civilians..
I get it mate, you're in denial..

Proven cases of governments performing unethical experiments properly belong in "General Conspiracies" or "Breaking Alternative News."
I get it mate, you're a troll.

I'd be offended if I didn't know you are only here for one biased purpose..