I'd like to be converted. Can you help answer my questions?

Please don’t rip my head off for this post because I am close to believing you but have been close to believing many things and I want to offer myself as a student raising his hand to the teachers. There is a lot of proof supporting different sides. Well maybe not proof but very convincing arguments. I thought that her, after reading many posts, that I might get solid opinions on my questions from people sincerely trying to help.


My problem is I don’t know what to believe and I don’t think it’s necessarily fair to be persecuted based on the society that tries to confuse its members at every turn especially when I’m trying as hard as I can to make a decision. I don’t want to run out of time before I feel like I can make the right choice.


Here it goes.


The members of the different options are trying to find true proof of what ever we believe so we can save the rest of our family (other humans) that don’t get what we are saying yet right? So they don’t get hurt right? (Seems to be what everyone on earth is ultimately trying to do or choose which one to go with). My problem is that all the books, from all the various religions, and stories that tend to speak about our past history and what the truth really is since we would have no proof in future times. Discoveries that modern man has found either translate, or back up their claims convincingly depending on how we look at it right?


It seems as if the truth was hidden and we have been trying to get it back for a long time with many options to choose from (I hate options when its based on something that happened before my grandparents’ great grand parents were born).I would think that if something really important happened that would explain all of the questions we would have happened back then, it wouldn’t be left up to interpretation and there would only be a record of what happened right? Something that big would be just as huge as if the USA set off a nuclear bomb (not hiding it and on purpose to save us from aliens lets just say) and a bunch of people recorded it in a book that told of our wondrous human victory over the invading aliens. It would be kind of hard to take that any other way other then a false alarm when we blew ourselves up (and here is the book that makes sure we don’t make the same mistake for those who survived). If it wasn’t god involved which books would you believe? The ones that made us out to be great or the ones that made us out to be at fault?


I’ve heard that anyone will believe anything you say as long as it’s a compliment and what bigger compliment is there when those that were slaves actually were so full of strength that they could stand up against its oppressor and defeat them, freeing themselves from their captors. If a book told of its people doing great things like that then it would be easy to believe it and everything inside would also be true as well right? Our government and that of others are aware that if the people of its nation turned on them, it wouldn’t be a pretty picture. The power would change hands right? Over our history in all the different books, they normally tell stories of its people rising above its oppression by the help of a higher power. If not a higher power like god himself, it was a prophet sent or told to go forth in his name right?


These style stories or events date back as far as we have recovered drawings, documents, and the books that groups cherish today.


This is where you might get mad at me. Please understand that if you are sure of what you believe then this shouldn’t be a stab. It should be seen as a child asking an innocent question looking for a caring answer because they honestly don’t know and really would like to find out from those who have more of a grasp on the topics.


Is it possible that way back in time, those that had power and wanted to keep it, which actually lived during a great uprising just gave up but not without a fight? (Let’s just use Jesus as an example but the same question could be asked of the rest as well.). The guy Pontius Pilate (or whatever the spelling is or who ever really was in power at the time), that saw his power over his people falling apart, actually believed what he did BEFORE declaring a new religion for his land. Whether a true conversion to a new faith wasn’t a result of seeing the light but a result which left him feeling backed up against a wall?


I try to put myself in his shoes. I see my family ruling as direct lines to the gods, directly in ownership of some sort of superhuman knowledge. Our people doing whatever we want, when ever we want, because the gods had my back. I see myself believing in this full force and I see how I would feel if I were being forced to renounce that belief with no other option because a large population was at my door about to flip out.


I say all religions because there are similar stories to those in power being pushed up against a wall by a new belief or uprising in so many of them that changed everything for the better for its chosen people. My fear is that all the books that are based on today’s religions were directly written by these so called "converted believers" or just human hands from that particular time period. I see myself looking into to the future, trying to plan what ever I could think of to bring my family back into power eventually, because I was no match for the uprising at the time.


The bible in particular, speaks of an antichrist, and we are to believe that the words are from those that knew the truth because they were there, or from gods mouth directly right? Back then if before Christ revolutionized religion, there was a book or many books that spoke of an end time with a prophet that spoke lies then the people might have had a harder time believing what Christ said. He was still killed even though some believed he was god, and it just didn’t happen quickly enough for his mark not to make a difference especially since he rose from the dead in the book right?


Would it make sense that the back in the day TPTB would try to make sure that their descendants wouldn’t make the same mistake since they used to be gods before this guy Jesus came along? They didn’t give two craps about what the religion was but just that they continued to live in the lap of luxury right? The future religions seemed to be going into a one god ideology. What was the only way to punish these people from what they did to that family of power?


I would insist on my new beliefs, and I would insist that I prove it by being part of writing the book to tell its story of how the people found the truth. I would also get my close friends to do the same as a show of good faith to the people that I cared and we had the peoples best interest at heart so they wouldn’t take our family an hang us from a tree. (Saying, “look at us we agree with you and will prove it by putting it in writing”.


Sure the majority of the books speak of greater good and god being so amazing but there also seems to be a few things scattered inside, which if future people were to follow as religious law, would set the stage for a fraud. I’m talking about the fine print kind of thing, that if they had such a book back then, the things might of went in the favor of a multi god world because they were warned about the day when Jesus would arrive. (If it painted him as evil then the people wouldn’t listen to him at all or at least give the TPTB at the time the chance to put up a stronger case proving their side of the story as the actual truth instead. Plausible deniability and benefit of the doubt).


Things like the antichrist makes it so no matter what happens, if someone comes along that is actually a real prophet from god, we will kill them out of fear and won’t believe a word they say because we were warned by a book from someone who might have had revenge on their mind. If we see one person leading people in a time of worldly disasters, speaking of revolution and the world finally coming together as one, immediately they would be the antichrist right? It makes it seem like the bible was written as retaliation of what happened to royal family so long ago in order for us to kill the one who might actually be able to help..



We won’t know the difference between the messiah and the evil one because it’s supposed to be that way, as the book says. Someone will be leading the world with talks of peace during a time of disaster right? (The masses are said to believe what the antichrist is preaching). Jesus is supposed to come after the antichrist, and defeat him in a glorious battle, because he wasn’t leading the people out of a disaster, but rather he was the cause (and we were just stupid and followed him because we were scared right)? After that the world will be saved by God or at least for those that follow the new savior?


It just seems fishy that a book written by humans (didn’t fall out of the sky written in gold or something crazy), predicts for the world to begin going nuts with chaos all over the place, even in space, and someone standing up to it, successfully leading the people in the right direction (*or we ALL will believe that he is). All of a sudden god decides after all this time that he will come back and save us from the antichrist.


This to me seems spooky similar to many other tactics that our government uses other places as well.


I’m trying to look at it as if I was looking from above when it all was happening in the first place. If I was the one in power before Jesus "took it away from me" I think its not hard to believe that I would devise plan to eventually try and get my family back into power in secret. They had big brain thinkers back then so I don’t think it’s too far of a stretch to think that they would try. People living today could be directly descended from them just going along with the plan because if it works their family will become royalty over the whole world.


Okay so what I’m really trying to ask after my annoying long winded post (I’m sorry about that) is this:


There are many people that believe that our own government is behind some of the disasters that are very similar to the ones foretold in the bible, and even the same is happening in other countries. Is it possible that our governments are just going along with the plan set into motion way back in time? Are they setting us up to believe that the disasters happening all over, that are stirring up end of the world talks, just to flush out the most powerful leader living today that could easily take on the "antichrist" role? Setting us up to believe that even though this person makes perfect sense and is seeming to be the best thing that could of happened to us, that our lords return is not too far away? Setting us up to believe that he has alternate motives behind his talks of world peace to actually enslave us all, only to stage the lords return to fight and destroy him coming to the rescue of the whole world?


This is out there I know but it would make sense given all the claims to alien contact within governments all over kept secret. If in fact we are not alone in this universe (which I’m not sure of), wouldn’t it be kind of easy to fake a lord returning out of the sky given their technology said to be in their abilities? If our government is making it seem as if aliens are a crazy idea, and we would be so stupid to believe they exist? Someone coming out of the sky and killing someone using the bible to name him the antichrist would make us think it was stupid to believe the being from the sky was alien. The one who saved us from the antichrist would be the real savior and leader of what ever was left becoming god on earth right? If even a slim chance that some of the reports are correct and all governments have linked somehow together with ancient aliens hiding it every time they slip up and we would say nah no way (not always having to really work that hard to hide it). (Far out I know but if that’s what they wanted us to think; they did a pretty good job doing just that).


The creatures in movies today look real to me but they are all cgi or props so the videos that people “capture the truth” could be from one of the talented movie producers that do it for entertainment already. It would be kind of hard to believe a mother ship if we already saw one in independence day, war of the worlds, etc……. (But we always win in those don’t we?)(So don’t worry because even if they do come we would win right?)(Is that so we are surprised when they come, because we never thought they had a chance so we never did anything about it?)


If this has any truth to it then it seems that we might have been duped by those in power way back in time and their descendants are about to reclaim their thrown by faking the need for our lord to return and replacing our lord with an alien buddy who has such high tech weapons that the so called "antichrist" wouldn’t even have a chance. We would easily see alien technology as godlike an easily conclude that indeed our lord has returned to save us from someone preaching peace during a time of world crisis that in no way our governments could have had anything to do with right?


Could someone make me feel better and tell me why there is no chance that this is possible and we aren’t going to sit back and watch someone who could easily be the only true power wielding, truth speaking, prophet that god has sent in such a long time be killed for no reason. If someone realized the truth we all have been searching for our books might force him to keep it to himself so the people don’t kill him as the antichrist. This person would have accomplished the impossible. If they would of gotten the world to sit up, take notice and finally got the people to do the right thing, how are we to know he is actually evil? Instead of acting like they couldn’t make a difference they are going to speak up and let themselves die by the lords hand and we are going to just let it happen! They would be leading the world into peace and might actually have been successful until we let him be martyred by our "lord" that we wouldn’t even recognize if they walked next to us on the street.


Look I don’t know what exactly to believe but I’m searching feverishly to figure it out. The only way I know how is to take all the information and put it together to weigh it out. I would hate to have fallen for a plot that was set up 1000s of year ago by people going to the bathroom in a hole and with a total of maybe 0 books to read at the time. I would feel so foolish and stubborn. I would hate for an amazing person to be murdered just so that we would name the one who killed our "antichrist" god! After that, who ever God says is okay we would just go along with . It seems that even when god returns the WORLD will be ruled by ONE being as long as he is here, or if he appoints someone worthy to take his place then we would have a world GOVERNMENT leader in control anyway. It will be Pontius Pilate thing all over again. To make things worse our only hope before we fell hook line and sinker was killed in our honor. I hate perspectives. There are so many to choose from. How am I supposed to believe the right one with so many seeming right? Faith? Seems like a very convenient opportunity to be tricked!


I know that some will beat me up in here because of my spelling and grammar. (I know I am horrible with those) but I sure do hope that some of you will help shed some light on this for anyone else who might have thought about these things. It would be nice to focus on my points instead of diverting away from the damn topic. I’m sick of being confused! And I don’t want to find out after its too late or not at all because no one thought to ask some crazy questions that would make them look stupid. Society told us that certain things were just stupid to think about. Who are they and why the hell is society such a holder of the truth when they weren’t born back then just like me? What gives them the right? A book?


Thank you and I posted this here because after reading many forums about religion there seems to be many people really knowledgeable on these subjects and I thought you guys could have great insight. I also posted another thread that paints a picture of why I think it could of taken so long for a plan like that to come into fruition. (in the search bar type in - “stuck in a dream? Are you sure?”) if you want to read it. Please be nice because the other side of nice isn’t very becoming and will only push those honestly seeking the truth away from you out of fear of your hate words. It would be counter productive. The other post has a repost later in the thread that makes it easier to read. I tried to edit it but was too late so someone reposted with a better format for me and I’m going to finish where they left off. You guys are great and I’m so happy to have found a place where I can talk about things that make people look at me like I belong locked up by “society”.

Wow Brianegan. Take a deep deep breath and relax. We're not going anywhere, for a while anyway. We're not going to find what we are looking for all wrapped up in a nut shell. I'm going out soon so I only skimmed your thoughtful post. There were a number of things that could make more thoughtful posts. Divide it up. Your passion is clear. There are many folk here who will drool at a chance to discuss a number of the topics you raise.

I know that what you see is THE BIG PICTURE. You seek to encompass it all. You are running around in your mind trying to put the jigsaw puzzle together. My recommendation? If you ask too many things at once from to many sources at once and if you have a fair degree of empathy, which I guess you do, you are very likely to overwhelm your circuits. So, Brianegan, take a deep deep breath and relax.

so this is a "whats the true religion" thread?

I didn't see anything in there about being converted aside from the title...

reply to post by Brianegan


Simple and easy.


Hi, and good for you that you seek the Truth.

There is only one "Religion" that:
The Savior or main prophet or character center of any religion, died and arose! Only one.... Jesus died and raised himself from the grave. No other religious leader makes or has ever made that claim and had any proof. I think not one has ever made that Claim. Many people saw Jesus after he had risen. There is Proof.

Now for the simple part

Start reading a Bible with the expectation of finding the real Truth. If you earnestly seek, you will find the answers. You have to earnestly seek the answers though.

Now for the easy part:

Oh no....it's not going to be a EASY. Once you have found the Truth(Jesus is who he says he is and he really is the Savior of the World) you will have many detractors who don't want you to find Truth. Humans and spirit entities alike. want to keep us in the dark about having a way off of this rock. Time is short though and you must start soon. Again, time is short. I hope you find the Truth soon. Best Wishes

reply to post by Akragon


really?

All I want is to be able to stop worrying all the time and those that have more information on these topics could help to accomplish that. If there is an answer to all these points that I missed i really want to know.

These questions are directly the cause of why I can not chose between what is the right one and what is the wrong one.

Ive been an alter boy. Half of my family is jewish so I listended to many rabbis speak. Ive had a few friends from different walks of life who were kind enough to tell me stories from their religion as well.

I have a lot of info but not enough to figure anything out. I figured since I only have limited info from each religion that maybe more insights from different ones might actually give help on these questions holding me back and not take 3 lifetimes to do it.

Thank you very much from my heart for reading my post. I just want to be told the truth and not make a bad choice in the end you know. I dont think thats wrong to ask for.

Are you saying that it was false advertising or something because this is my second thread ive started and all i've really gotten back really was criticism, so im starting to get put off here. Im not a liar and proud of that because thats all I really have. Please dont try to take that away from me.

reply to post by TerryMcGuire


Good point. I have always been in a rush. If this doesnt help maybe I will try that.

Great post, it was a very nice read.
Unfortunately I'm an atheist so I cannot answer your questions concerning your beliefs. However when you talked about how aliens might come down to earth and present themselves as aliens it made me think of a great qoute by Arthur C. Clarke :

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
Arthur C. Clarke

Originally posted by Brianegan
reply to post by Akragon

 

really?

All I want is to be able to stop worrying all the time and those that have more information on these topics could help to accomplish that. If there is an answer to all these points that I missed i really want to know.

These questions are directly the cause of why I can not chose between what is the right one and what is the wrong one.

Ive been an alter boy. Half of my family is jewish so I listended to many rabbis speak. Ive had a few friends from different walks of life who were kind enough to tell me stories from their religion as well.

I have a lot of info but not enough to figure anything out. I figured since I only have limited info from each religion that maybe more insights from different ones might actually give help on these questions holding me back and not take 3 lifetimes to do it.

Thank you very much from my heart for reading my post. I just want to be told the truth and not make a bad choice in the end you know. I dont think thats wrong to ask for.

Are you saying that it was false advertising or something because this is my second thread ive started and all i've really gotten back really was criticism, so im starting to get put off here. Im not a liar and proud of that because thats all I really have. Please dont try to take that away from me.

no no im not saying that at all... Its good you're looking for the truth...

Unfortunatly you won't find much in your bibles.......Lots of great stories...and some good moral value but you won't find the truth of religion in that book.

IF you want my advice on the matter, no religion is the truth above any other... They all have certian truths...

The only truth you'll find in the bible is the teachings of Christ. And even those are not all his words...

The truth lies within, spirituality is the only true way... And it has nothing to do with religion...weird as it might sound.

reply to post by dakota1s2


Thank you.

It sounded like you actually care. Thats nice to see.

I have actually read and been part of bible studies at church and other places as well but I could never ask these questions there. Plus I was put there buy my parents and forced so the intention I need to read it with might of not been like you said. A non-believer is what I would look like ya know. Its not what you want to look like in those places. I try to have an open heart to these options but I cant read the bible thinking it a fact before I find out why when then are other choices to give a fair chance to. I think its only right to listen to everyone first before I make decision and claim a book from 1000's of years ago is my proof. For all we know it could of been written by a childrens author from back then to keep them in line and after a while people started to actually believe in it with no one around to set them straight. I dont know.....what if the feeling that you felt when you were saved was not what you thought it was. Im really not trying to insult anyone so im so sorry about how this sounds but i cant just not ask because im affraid.

I'm going to be honest with you. Even though I know I should I never read books. I get such a headache and has made me hate reading all together. I know im wrong but I know I probably wont pick up the bible and read it for myself. So if you want to help tell me why you are sure.

The proof that you speak of. What is that?

As far as coming back from the dead, I wasnt saying all the stories were exactly the same, but that they had many similarities in their events and teachings.

reply to post by Brianegan


I think it's important to note that if Christianity was a conspiracy, the bible would contain mass amounts of contradictions.. considering that it was written by many many different people from all walks of life. Some were farmers, some were even Kings. Yet throughout, it's a singular account of a God's love for His creation. God creates man with free will, man sins, God sacrifices His Son for man so that if we accept Him as our Saviour we will be saved from the penalty of sin. You can break it down any way you want, but it's really as simple as that. It's love. You can accept it or you can pass, because you have free will.

Regarding the antichrist.. Before he appears on the scene, Christians will be removed from this earth. God knows what is coming and He doesn't want His people to go through it. Jesus will snatch His church up into Heaven with Him, as it says in the bible. The world will be confused and try to figure out what's going on (which is kinda silly since the bible told us a long while back...) and out of that confusion the antichrist appears and the world accepts him because he will seem like the only guy with answers. Unfortunately for the people, however, the antichrist wants to do nothing more than deceive them. There will be many who figure out the truth and accept Jesus as their Saviour during this time, but for the most part the world will serve the antichrist and accept his mark on their hand or forehead to prove their allegiance. Anyone who does not will be put to death. Sound like peace a great guy? He goes on to proclaim himself to be god and to reign terror upon the earth. 7 years after he's established/strengthened peace, Jesus will return triumphantly and set the world straight.

Maybe you know all this already, maybe you don't, but these events are being set up right now. All you hear about these days is globalism, a world government, interfaith, wars, and Israel. The bible said that Israel will become the focus of the world in the end times, and it has. You can't turn on the news without hearing a status update from Israel. And there have been many prophecies fulfilled already that had to happen before any of that could come to pass. This link provides a very in-depth look at different things that have occured, that are prophecied in the bible. All of these lead up to the rapture, and rise of the antichrist. There are so many that it's just unreasonable to list here, but it's staggering. And there is so much more than that going on in the news that I can't even get into cause I'll be here all day. Christians are watching the headlines and seeing scripture fulfilled before our eyes, and yet the world is oblivious. They argue that it is self-fulfilling prophecies, but come on.. The headlines practically quote scripture, and there is all too much to be a coincidence. God told us these things would come to pass, and they are.

So where do you take it from here? Nobody can make that decision for you. Either you recognize your sins and accept Jesus as your personal Lord and Saviour, and enjoy freedom from the burden of this world and all it's curses, or you pass and live a life with your head in the sand. But it really is a line in the sand, and you need to know where you stand.

reply to post by dakota1s2

Many people saw Jesus after he had risen. There is Proof.

lol

Yeah and i saw david copperfield make the statue of liberty disappear! lol

reply to post by ThisPlaceIsDifferent


If logic was involved in the antichrist event would those that took the leap of faith be able to tell the difference if they were set up to wait for it. If it comes people are programmed to link it to their bible teachings.

An athiest could answer all my questions. It would just come from your own theory about what is indeed going on which I am also wide open to hearing.

Please indulge me.

reply to post by Akragon


Thats actually exactly my point as well. If they are teachings of how to live then why do they all end up being phsycic and preaching the future end of the world or new beggining even.

What is the truth behind why the stories were written and could it be anywhere near what I was talking about? If not what do you think it might be?

Here's the way i look at it....
Christianity asks for your faith in something that you could not possibly confirm with hard evidence.

However, people are afraid if they don't "believe" in Jesus, that they will go to "Hell" for eternity.

What about good, honest living people who don't believe?
Is God gonna send them to Hell anyway?

Christians say yes, you'll go to Hell for not believing, and that's where I draw the idiot line in the sand... no thanks!

If that's how it really works, then God is a first class a-hole.

reply to post by DeReK DaRkLy


Show me a good person who not once has ever lied, stolen, cheated, committed adultery. Everyone has sinned, myself included of course. But.. Jesus died for our sins so that we did not have to pay the penalty for it, and all you've got to do is accept Him as your Saviour. How can you see that as anything but love?

reply to post by RapturedNotBeamed

Christians will be removed from this earth.

If you believe this, please read this thread....

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by Brianegan
reply to post by Akragon

 

Thats actually exactly my point as well. If they are teachings of how to live then why do they all end up being phsycic and preaching the future end of the world or new beggining even.

What is the truth behind why the stories were written and could it be anywhere near what I was talking about? If not what do you think it might be?

A lot of those stories were written to reinforce their doctrine... Fairy tales made up to further TPTB's control over the populous... You'll notice all through out the bible "Gods people" killing for him....committing mass murder in the name of God or because he told them to do so.

God doesn't want people to kill other people its as simple as that. If we all took the stories of the bible litterally, we'd be a society of lunitics, murderers etc etc...

The only thing in the whole of the bible that matters at all are the words of one man....

reply to post by Akragon


Weak.

First, no - we can't know the day/hour/year that it's going to happen. Some people pretend to, and use that to sell books however.

Second, yes - if anyone has accepted Jesus as Saviour and God, and His death as payment for the penalty of our sins, then those are the people who get raptured. That's God's word, and everything else has held true so why would I doubt this?

reply to post by RapturedNotBeamed

Jesus died for our sins so that we did not have to pay the penalty for it, and all you've got to do is accept Him as your Saviour. How can you see that as anything but love?

What if I would rather accept full responsibility for my actions, rather than take the "Get Out of Hell Free Card" ?

See anything wrong with that?

reply to post by DeReK DaRkLy


Go ahead. In fact, that is exactly what you're doing if you refuse what Jesus is offering.