Why hasn't the US made a formal apology to the Native Americans?

Screw any apology to the Indians. It was called war. Besides, I never once heard an Indian apologize the thousands of setters, colonists, or missionaries that they murdered and scalped for hundreds of years. Do you have any idea just how many battles and wars the Indians fought against just the Spanish? They lost because they were too damn stupid to make anything better than a bow and arrow or a spear, period.

I will certainly not expect that any country should apologize for winning wars. Boo friggen hoo. And if you want to pull some “This was my land” crap well then that won’t fly either because the Indians didn’t believe in land ownership, and yet at the same time, they accuse the white man of stealing their lands. So they can steal the lands from other Indians, but the white man can’t steal it from them, what a bunch of whinny boo hoo bullcrap.

Originally posted by Hot_Wings
Screw any apology to the Indians. It was called war. Besides, I never once heard an Indian apologize the thousands of setters, colonists, or missionaries that they murdered and scalped for hundreds of years. Do you have any idea just how many battles and wars the Indians fought against just the Spanish? They lost because they were too damn stupid to make anything better than a bow and arrow or a spear, period.

I will certainly not expect that any country should apologize for winning wars. Boo friggen hoo. And if you want to pull some “This was my land” crap well then that won’t fly either because the Indians didn’t believe in land ownership, and yet at the same time, they accuse the white man of stealing their lands. So they can steal the lands from other Indians, but the white man can’t steal it from them, what a bunch of whinny boo hoo bullcrap.

This is a great example of why people call us "ugly Americans."
No soul.

Originally posted by Hot_Wings
Screw any apology to the Indians. It was called war. Besides, I never once heard an Indian apologize the thousands of setters, colonists, or missionaries that they murdered and scalped for hundreds of years. Do you have any idea just how many battles and wars the Indians fought against just the Spanish? They lost because they were too damn stupid to make anything better than a bow and arrow or a spear, period.

I will certainly not expect that any country should apologize for winning wars. Boo friggen hoo. And if you want to pull some “This was my land” crap well then that won’t fly either because the Indians didn’t believe in land ownership, and yet at the same time, they accuse the white man of stealing their lands. So they can steal the lands from other Indians, but the white man can’t steal it from them, what a bunch of whinny boo hoo bullcrap.

It was called war by the white man, most educated people would call it genocide, and massacres, the practice of scalping started with the white men, as proof that they killed the "red-skinned heathens" in which they would get a whole whopping 25 cents!!! the Natives killed thousands, well the white man mudered millions, but I'm sure the blood in those thousands are worth at least a couple of millions of Natives, right?

Originally posted by TheForgottenOnes
www.wicocomico-indian-nation.com...



WOUNDED KNEE

About a week prior to the slaughter at Wounded Knee, L.Frank Baum, editor of South Dakota's Aberdeen Saturday Pioneer newspaper advocated the extermination of all America's Indians. Quote; The nobility of the Redskin is extinquished and what few are left are a pack of whining curs who lick the hand that smites them. The whites by law of conquest, by justice of civilization, are masters of the American continent, and the best safety of the frontier settlements will be secured by the total annihilation of the few remaining Indians.(WHY NOT ANNIHILATION?)Their glory has fled, their spirit broken, their manhood effaced, better they should die than live the miserable wretches that they are. Unquote.L. FRANK BAUM LATER BECOMES FAMOUS AS THE AUTHOR OF:


"THE WIZARD OF OZ."

An Indian named American Horse, who had been friendly to the American troops for years gave this narrative of the slaughter at Wounded Knee; "they turned their guns, Hotchkiss guns upon the women who were in the lodges standing there under a flag of truce, and of course as soon as they were fired upon they fled...There was a women with an infant in her arms who was killed as she almost touched the flag of truce, and the women and children of course were strewn all along the circular village untill they were dispatched. Right near the flag of truce a mother was shot down with her infant; the child not knowing that it's mother was dead was still nursing, and that especially was a very sad sight.The women as they were fleeing with their babies were killed together, shot right through, and the women who were heavy with child were also killed...After most of them had been killed a cry was made that all those who were not killed or wounded should come forth and they would be safe. Little boys who were not wounded came out of their places of refuge, and as soon as they came in sight, a number of soldiers surrounded them and butchered them there... Of course it would have been alright if only the men were killed; we would feel almost grateful for it. But the fact of the killing of the women and more especially of the of the young boys and girls who are to go to make up the future of the Indian people, is the saddest part of the whole affair and we feel it very sorely." Unquote"

Shortly after the massacre, Baum stated his approval, in the "Aberdeen Saturday Pioneer's paper stating that; we had better, in order to protect our civilization, follow it up and wipe these untamed and untameable creatures from the face of the earth.

Bloody Jeeezus! Baum's editorials are just as bad as the "Mein Kampf"! And this psychopath wrote children's books?

I'll never watch the Wizard of Oz the same way again... In fact I'll never watch it again.

No Apology, nothing good would come out of it. no matter how much you may think so. and, for those saying the
"white man" killed millions, is a half truth. smallpox, and other sicknesses killed more than anything else. fact is, when we came to the "new world' we brought with us germs and and other BIOs the the natives could not defend
against. thats what killed most of them.

and, remember the French, English and Spanish where in control for more than 200 years. its amazing, how little
people know. all that's known is "the white man" did something wrong... but the fact is, that's not the point there was plenty of wrongs to go around. and, now more than 100 years later many reservations are worse than 3rd world nations... I suppose thats the "white mans" fault also...

just chalk it all up to its a mess... it will never get resolved.... and no one will ever be happy about or or fully understand it....

and my answer to the former question:

Because the US is nothing but an imperialist enterprise run by foreign bankers and industrials, and based on mass murder and deception. And Canada is not much different, only more "victorian" in its rule.

Democracy and Liberty? Right to land property? If these are paid by the blood of Natives and destruction of their culture and sovereignty, how true are these concepts?

Originally posted by Echtelion

Originally posted by TheForgottenOnes
www.wicocomico-indian-nation.com...



WOUNDED KNEE

About a week prior to the slaughter at Wounded Knee, L.Frank Baum, editor of South Dakota's Aberdeen Saturday Pioneer newspaper advocated the extermination of all America's Indians. Quote; The nobility of the Redskin is extinquished and what few are left are a pack of whining curs who lick the hand that smites them. The whites by law of conquest, by justice of civilization, are masters of the American continent, and the best safety of the frontier settlements will be secured by the total annihilation of the few remaining Indians.(WHY NOT ANNIHILATION?)Their glory has fled, their spirit broken, their manhood effaced, better they should die than live the miserable wretches that they are. Unquote.L. FRANK BAUM LATER BECOMES FAMOUS AS THE AUTHOR OF:


"THE WIZARD OF OZ."

An Indian named American Horse, who had been friendly to the American troops for years gave this narrative of the slaughter at Wounded Knee; "they turned their guns, Hotchkiss guns upon the women who were in the lodges standing there under a flag of truce, and of course as soon as they were fired upon they fled...There was a women with an infant in her arms who was killed as she almost touched the flag of truce, and the women and children of course were strewn all along the circular village untill they were dispatched. Right near the flag of truce a mother was shot down with her infant; the child not knowing that it's mother was dead was still nursing, and that especially was a very sad sight.The women as they were fleeing with their babies were killed together, shot right through, and the women who were heavy with child were also killed...After most of them had been killed a cry was made that all those who were not killed or wounded should come forth and they would be safe. Little boys who were not wounded came out of their places of refuge, and as soon as they came in sight, a number of soldiers surrounded them and butchered them there... Of course it would have been alright if only the men were killed; we would feel almost grateful for it. But the fact of the killing of the women and more especially of the of the young boys and girls who are to go to make up the future of the Indian people, is the saddest part of the whole affair and we feel it very sorely." Unquote"

Shortly after the massacre, Baum stated his approval, in the "Aberdeen Saturday Pioneer's paper stating that; we had better, in order to protect our civilization, follow it up and wipe these untamed and untameable creatures from the face of the earth.

Bloody Jeeezus! Baum's editorials are just as bad as the "Mein Kampf"! And this psychopath wrote children's books?

I'll never watch the Wizard of Oz the same way again... In fact I'll never watch it again.

isn't that sad? when someone so accepted in mainstream society, feels that way? everyone was like that back then, and even today, lots of people hold bad feelings toward the Natives, but it goes both ways, sins of the fathers, I guess

reply to post by TheForgottenOnes


Ahhhh, I like this topic very much and its a great post.

I think a well-publicized apology from the White House would be a good thing. But as mentioned before in other replies, this would show weakness on the behalf of the US government and doubtful it will take place. What I would like to see, if true indeed, is the return of Geronimo to his proper grounds of rest. But if the stone-walling by Yale and the Skull and Bones of the CNN reporter gives us any clue to the possibility of returning Geronimo to his ancestors and people, then this is unlikely to happen too.

Perhaps the thing to do is to make a movie, or even better a documentary about a group of people that sneak into Club 322 and return the proper belongings and Geronimo back to his people. You know, kind of like the movie Stone of Destiny, but they don’t give any thing back to the thieves.

Originally posted by Ghostinshell
No Apology, nothing good would come out of it. no matter how much you may think so. and, for those saying the
"white man" killed millions, is a half truth. smallpox, and other sicknesses killed more than anything else. fact is, when we came to the "new world' we brought with us germs and and other BIOs the the natives could not defend
against. thats what killed most of them.

and, remember the French, English and Spanish where in control for more than 200 years. its amazing, how little
people know. all that's known is "the white man" did something wrong... but the fact is, that's not the point there was plenty of wrongs to go around. and, now more than 100 years later many reservations are worse than 3rd world nations... I suppose thats the "white mans" fault also...

Yeah. Just as with what the White man did to actual Third World countries for more than 200 years. Taking over their land, abusing the resources, killing a huge portion of the people living there, taking others as slaves, and putting the survivors in concentration camps, where they are corrupted with all kind of poisonous substances, like the alcohol and the crack that turns them into zombies. So much for "civilization"...

Of course, even if parasites like "us" would apologize for their wrongdoings, they won't change their ways.

So still willing to fight to preserve your death cult? Is that all what Life's worth?

Originally posted by TheForgottenOnes

Originally posted by Echtelion

Originally posted by TheForgottenOnes
www.wicocomico-indian-nation.com...



WOUNDED KNEE

About a week prior to the slaughter at Wounded Knee, L.Frank Baum, editor of South Dakota's Aberdeen Saturday Pioneer newspaper advocated the extermination of all America's Indians. Quote; The nobility of the Redskin is extinquished and what few are left are a pack of whining curs who lick the hand that smites them. The whites by law of conquest, by justice of civilization, are masters of the American continent, and the best safety of the frontier settlements will be secured by the total annihilation of the few remaining Indians.(WHY NOT ANNIHILATION?)Their glory has fled, their spirit broken, their manhood effaced, better they should die than live the miserable wretches that they are. Unquote.L. FRANK BAUM LATER BECOMES FAMOUS AS THE AUTHOR OF:


"THE WIZARD OF OZ."

An Indian named American Horse, who had been friendly to the American troops for years gave this narrative of the slaughter at Wounded Knee; "they turned their guns, Hotchkiss guns upon the women who were in the lodges standing there under a flag of truce, and of course as soon as they were fired upon they fled...There was a women with an infant in her arms who was killed as she almost touched the flag of truce, and the women and children of course were strewn all along the circular village untill they were dispatched. Right near the flag of truce a mother was shot down with her infant; the child not knowing that it's mother was dead was still nursing, and that especially was a very sad sight.The women as they were fleeing with their babies were killed together, shot right through, and the women who were heavy with child were also killed...After most of them had been killed a cry was made that all those who were not killed or wounded should come forth and they would be safe. Little boys who were not wounded came out of their places of refuge, and as soon as they came in sight, a number of soldiers surrounded them and butchered them there... Of course it would have been alright if only the men were killed; we would feel almost grateful for it. But the fact of the killing of the women and more especially of the of the young boys and girls who are to go to make up the future of the Indian people, is the saddest part of the whole affair and we feel it very sorely." Unquote"

Shortly after the massacre, Baum stated his approval, in the "Aberdeen Saturday Pioneer's paper stating that; we had better, in order to protect our civilization, follow it up and wipe these untamed and untameable creatures from the face of the earth.

Bloody Jeeezus! Baum's editorials are just as bad as the "Mein Kampf"! And this psychopath wrote children's books?

I'll never watch the Wizard of Oz the same way again... In fact I'll never watch it again.

isn't that sad? when someone so accepted in mainstream society, feels that way? everyone was like that back then, and even today, lots of people hold bad feelings toward the Natives, but it goes both ways, sins of the fathers, I guess

Not exactly. More like the "roots of evil". Today's murderous racism of some people endures probably because they mechanically take part in the same process of "civilization" that their crooked Fathers started a few generations ago.

It all has to do with the same old damn patriarchy after all... like we don't come from the Mother... right.

Originally posted by Echtelion

Originally posted by Ghostinshell
No Apology, nothing good would come out of it. no matter how much you may think so. and, for those saying the
"white man" killed millions, is a half truth. smallpox, and other sicknesses killed more than anything else. fact is, when we came to the "new world' we brought with us germs and and other BIOs the the natives could not defend
against. thats what killed most of them.

and, remember the French, English and Spanish where in control for more than 200 years. its amazing, how little
people know. all that's known is "the white man" did something wrong... but the fact is, that's not the point there was plenty of wrongs to go around. and, now more than 100 years later many reservations are worse than 3rd world nations... I suppose thats the "white mans" fault also...

Yeah. Just as with what the White man did to actual Third World countries for more than 200 years. Taking over their land, abusing the resources, killing a huge portion of the people living there, taking others as slaves, and putting the survivors in concentration camps, where they are corrupted with all kind of poisonous substances, like the alcohol and the crack that turns them into zombies. So much for "civilization"...

Of course, even if parasites like "us" would apologize for their wrongdoings, they won't change their ways.

So still willing to fight to preserve your death cult? Is that all what Life's worth?

so one sided, how far back do we go? the fact that the ROMANS enslaved everyone they beat? maybe
Italy should pay for that, or the fact that the "church" killed millions, maybe they should pay too...

Oh, I know the middle east nations where the first to enslave people so lets have them pay for that....

HUMANS have be waring and committing wrongs against each other since the first spear. saying one "race"
committed more than any other is delusional.

I'm not going to quote Hot_Wings, but his/her post doesn't just suffer from a lack of perspective, or compassion, there is a fair amount of ignorance that it seems lots of people posting in this thread are guilty of.

Properly speaking, we probably shouldn't just group all Native Americans together. Yes, there were some tribes that were less than "noble", as a group, certainly by European standards. Perhaps they were more war-like, or figured stealing was AOK, as long as they weren't caught. No, Native Americans weren't perfect, but the fact is, they were many very different peoples, essentially lumped together way back then, just as they are today.

Native Americans weren't even one "race", as far as that concept usually goes. One tribe might be rather light, another dark, one with more Asian features, another with perhaps more "European" features, and that was noticed long before intermixing. They had different languages, different cultures, traditions, etc. Some actually had more in common with the white man, than they might with another Indian tribe.

I'm not bringing this up to shower some ridiculous liberal sympathy on Native Americans, I'm just bringing it up for the sake of accuracy.

In my earlier post, I mentioned the Nez Perce tribe, one that is somewhat local to where I reside. These were not Apache, they did not care for war. They were organized as a loose confederation, and managed to beat the white man handily when it came to their particular specialty, the breeding of some of the best horses the world had ever seen.

I know, I suppose no one cares about horses today. The member I had responded to initially made that clear enough. But horses aren't actually the point. Many of these native peoples were "naturally" in various states of of potential compatibility with the white man. No, not all tribes would manage to live in peace, for various reasons, but there were tribes that could easily have existed side-by-side with the white man, had there been less ignorance, and more mutual respect.

The Nez Perce again, IMO, was an excellent example of a tribe that should have been regarded as a potential ally to the white man. They had already proved they were cooperative, voluntarily giving up much of their lands, simply to secure peace. They had a valuable skill that to this day is universally recognized by those who know the Appaloosa breed of horse, possibly the most intelligent in the world, their living legacy and testament to advanced animal husbandry that could have made the white man jealous. Their form of government it seems could also have been integrated.

Further south, as most know, there were "city dwelling" tribes that actually were more or less "integrated", at least when Mexico still ruled that part of the country.

Going further back, we also notice that historically, Indians did make alliances, and fought wars with, and against, whether the British, or Americans, and even Mexicans, but the point being that there were tribes that could see a bigger picture, and would align themselves with those who seemed to share their interests.

Rationally, the white man moving West "should" have been able to live in peace with various tribes (again, not all). Actually, this did happen rarely, but usually rather briefly, as in the case of the tribes who got along with the Mormons. But then again, they both had a mutual enemy at the time, the US government. And the friendship didn't exactly last, especially once the Indians were thrown in front of the bus, so-to-speak, to cover up Mormon atrocities. But, that kind of expedience could happen anytime, anywhere I suppose.

If anyone agrees with me, at least partially, that there should have been some compatibility between settlers, and some of the native tribes at least, then why does history record precious little peace, and too much horror?

I think that part of the answer continues to this day: Ignorance, and prejudice, and greed, and the abuse of even that relatively small edge of power that came with numbers.

As far as an apology, whether already made, or needed at all, well fine, perhaps move on, I can see the logic perhaps. But as many are pointing out, things may be going on even TODAY. How sure are we that such things as sterilizations are not still continuing, somewhere, somehow? Will a decade or two pass before we learn of what the current horror is?

JR

reply to post by JR MacBeth


I think you have made some good points, like I said its a mess.....

reply to post by ellieN


Dwell in the past?

I live in the present and desire strongly free and independent Indian Nations.

What can't you people get about that?

We want our freedom from you.

We don't belong to the US, we are not yours to dictate to.

Like any other group on the planet, we want our freedom.

Can you hear me yet?

What gives you or the US the right to hold us in subjugation, to claim our resources, to dictate how we raise our children?

The past is done and gone, but that doesn't mean we should disappear because we're inconvenient to you.

Don't want to support us?

Fine, then get the hell off our lands: what you pay, you pay as rent.

How can Americans claim to stand for freedom and democracy when they deny it to those they stole it from?

We'll do just fine without you: much of the coal, uranium, timber and rare earth resources are on our lands, i.e., within current reservation boundaries. We can restore the bison herds and share them as we did of old.

When will we be free?

We would prefer not to have to fight you for it, but we've been patient for over a hundred years, waiting for you to fulfill the promise of our freedom when we were ready for it. Well, we are, and we grow less patient by the day.

Why do you refuse?

Free us.

Let us negotiate the new boundaries and rules, and live side by side in peace.

But as different peoples with different ways from yours.

We are not you, and have no desire to be ersatz yous. We desire the freedom to walk our own paths, make our own mistakes, and solve our problems in our own ways.

Can you hear me yet?

Originally posted by Ghostinshell

Originally posted by Echtelion

Originally posted by Ghostinshell
No Apology, nothing good would come out of it. no matter how much you may think so. and, for those saying the
"white man" killed millions, is a half truth. smallpox, and other sicknesses killed more than anything else. fact is, when we came to the "new world' we brought with us germs and and other BIOs the the natives could not defend
against. thats what killed most of them.

and, remember the French, English and Spanish where in control for more than 200 years. its amazing, how little
people know. all that's known is "the white man" did something wrong... but the fact is, that's not the point there was plenty of wrongs to go around. and, now more than 100 years later many reservations are worse than 3rd world nations... I suppose thats the "white mans" fault also...

Yeah. Just as with what the White man did to actual Third World countries for more than 200 years. Taking over their land, abusing the resources, killing a huge portion of the people living there, taking others as slaves, and putting the survivors in concentration camps, where they are corrupted with all kind of poisonous substances, like the alcohol and the crack that turns them into zombies. So much for "civilization"...

Of course, even if parasites like "us" would apologize for their wrongdoings, they won't change their ways.

So still willing to fight to preserve your death cult? Is that all what Life's worth?

so one sided, how far back do we go? the fact that the ROMANS enslaved everyone they beat? maybe
Italy should pay for that, or the fact that the "church" killed millions, maybe they should pay too...

Oh, I know the middle east nations where the first to enslave people so lets have them pay for that....

HUMANS have be waring and committing wrongs against each other since the first spear. saying one "race"
committed more than any other is delusional.

European empire's, and America's, wealth is based on stealing, slavery and the destruction (or recycling at best) of foreign cultures. The Roman Chuch did that to every single pagan society in Europe since it's very birth, and through the Romanus Pontifex extended that to Africa, America and any other invaded territory.

Natives in North America did not have such imperialist practices, and did not destroy the land around them with things like concrete and Monsanto GMO crops. Not even the empires in the south did that. They adapted to it, studied it, gaining throuhg the ages extensive knowledge of plants, trees and animals, and since there wasn't any notion of ownsership of the land or goods, there was no use to invade other people's land.

Pretending to be neutral? Aren't you taking the side of the invaders by defending their mediocre world? You know there is no such thing as neutrality, aside from death.

It's not Europeans that are bad... it's the civilization they still collaborate with that's deeply wrong, and rotten from within. No other known empire in history was so barbaric, mindlessly destructive and exploitative as this one.

But no worries, the natural tendency of un-brainwashed humans to love life and freedom will have its last word on your empire.... Mr Palpatine.

Law and Order shall not prevail.

reply to post by apacheman


ok, I heard you. but, in the last 100 years with the reservations system the only thing that was done was create a huge mess of land that in many cases is worse than 3rd worlds. and, the few shining spots where gambling etc a caste system as cropped up as halves and halve nots (the rich, and everyone else.)

sure, there are allot of mineral rights on some reservations. But not all, and many reservations would be beyond poor. if we unplugged the reservations, if you think its bad now.... but thats not the point it would never happen.
the US GOV, would never allow antonymous regions other than what has already been allowed.

reply to post by Echtelion


soo... you believe in chaos....

I do not, say who is right, only that in history much is colored. and, the truth of it is not always what we think.
and, law and order shall prevail.... it is my wish.....

reply to post by Hot_Wings


Everywhere they fought, they fought in defense of their homes and families.

White settlers had absolutely no right to settle without permission of the owners of the land.

How would you feel if some Hindus came to your town and starting knocking down your business district and rebuilt it in an utterly different manner, protected by an army while they did it, claiming it was legal because they bought it from some Buddhists?

And then to prove the point, they slaughtered a few hundred of your kin, burned your fields, girdled your trees, shot all your cattle and stole your children?

Would you fight to stop them? Would it matter if some were civilians?

This is what the Americans did from the moment they won the Revolutionary War.

By the way, do you know what one of, if not the, major causes of the war was?

It wasn't taxes, as the myth goes.

It was the fact that in the Royal Proclamation of 1763, no colonies were to be extended west of the Appalachian mountains, all beyond was recognized as belonging to the original inhabitants.

The freedom Americans fought for more than any other was the freedom to steal Indian lands.

www.ask.com...

One of the biggest problems confronting the British Empire in 1763 was maintaining peace with North American Indians who lived on the land acquired from France in the Treaty of Paris. Many of these people—primarily in the Great Lakes region—had a long and close relationship with France, and were dismayed to find that they were now under British sovereignty. Pontiac's Rebellion (1763–1766) was an unsuccessful effort by Native Americans to prevent Great Britain from occupying the land previously claimed by France. The Proclamation of 1763 had been in the works before Pontiac's Rebellion, but the outbreak of the conflict hastened the process. British officials hoped the proclamation would reconcile American Indians to British rule and thus help to prevent future hostilities.

The proclamation created a boundary line (often called the proclamation line) between the British colonies on the Atlantic coast and American Indian lands (called the Indian Reserve) west of the Appalachian Mountains. The proclamation line was not intended to be a permanent boundary between white and American Indian lands, but rather a temporary boundary which could be extended further west in an orderly, lawful manner[citation needed]. Its contour was defined by the headwaters that formed the watershed along the Appalachia-all land with rivers that flowed into the Atlantic was designated for the colonial entities while all the land with rivers that flowed into the Mississippi was reserved for the native Indian population. The proclamation outlawed private purchase of Native American land, which had often created problems in the past; instead, all future land purchases were to be made by Crown officials "at some public Meeting or Assembly of the said Indians". Furthermore, British colonists were forbidden to move beyond the line and settle on native lands, and colonial officials were forbidden to grant lands without royal approval. The proclamation gave the Crown a monopoly on all future land purchases from American Indians.

Almost immediately, many British colonists and land speculators objected to the proclamation boundary, since there were already many settlements beyond the line (some of which had been temporarily evacuated during Pontiac's War), as well as many existing land claims yet to be settled. Indeed, the proclamation itself called for lands to be granted to British soldiers who had served in the Seven Years' War. Prominent American colonists joined with land speculators in Britain to lobby the government to move the line further west. As a result, the boundary line was adjusted in a series of treaties with Native Americans. The Treaty of Fort Stanwix and the Treaty of Hard Labor (both 1768) and the Treaty of Lochaber (1770) opened much of what is now West Virginia and Kentucky to British settlement.

reply to post by Ghostinshell


Then America should quit calling itself the land of the free and own the tyranny.

Anyway, sooner or later it won't matter what the US allows or doesn't.

History says that one day we'll be free again...the only question is how many lives it will cost.

We don't belong to you.

reply to post by apacheman


somehow, I doubt that reason...
www.harlingen.isd.tenet.edu...