Dealing with cops, understanding your rights,.... by a cop.

reply to post by theQuest


you can record whatever you want but if you are in an accident and you are interfering or not cooperating then this changes things. it seems like everyone here who dislikes cops is looking for reasons to cause problems when something happens. people who continuously get pulled over turn around and blame the cop. why?
how about taking responsibility for your actions not in front of me but to yourself.

reply to post by surfnow2


Maybe years ago. Now I would say the majority abuse their power in some way. They have too much desire for it. And quotas also cause huge problems. Just look at some of the examples I posted on the first page. I think they would follow the government blindly against the people and even have contempt for the people a lot of time. Just look at the riot cops in canada that incited violence to get the crowds riled up so they would join in and could be arrested. Seriously go back to the last page and look at my last post.

reply to post by gallopinghordes

Were you wearing that dress ...

Originally posted by xXxtremelySecure

Originally posted by wrkn4livn
What the officer says is true. You have the right to travel (walk) anywhere you want within the confines of the US (well, outside restricted areas like the Whitehouse compound, private property etc.). Driving is a privilege reserved only for responsible persons.

edit on 16-1-2011 by wrkn4livn because: (no reason given)

This is what I have thought everytime I wrote one a ticket, for driver w/o license, expired tags, etc.


reply to post by seeashrink

 

I have to agree with you here most of the "sovereigns" we have had problems with ended up being 96.

Secure

Are you an American? I would assume so. But you "believe" in violating the rights of the natural people?

It is undisputed that the use of the highway for the purpose of travel and transportation is NOT a
mere PRIVILEGE, but a "COMMON AND FUNDAMENTAL RIGHT" of which the public and
individuals cannot rightfully be deprived. (Emphasis added) See: Chicago Motor Coach v.
Chicago, supra; Ligare v. Chicago, 28 N.E. 934; Boone v. Clark, 214 S.W. 607; American
Jurisprudence 1st Ed., Highways 163

Refute and rebutt that WITH some evidence?

Again, PROVE UP YOUR CLAIM.

If any person (cop/lawyer/judge) claims that any other definition of the term “motor vehicle,” that varies from the
definition below that would include any carriage or contrivance NOT used for commercial purposes, exists at law, or in any Federal and/or State statute, let him come forth by sworn
affidavit, as such a claim would nullify, under the Void for Vagueness Doctrine, all statutes or
rules that include the contradictory term.

Title18, UNITED STATES CODE Sec. 31
PART I - CRIMES
CHAPTER 2 - AIRCRAFT AND MOTOR VEHICLES
Sec. 31. Definitions
When used in this chapter the term –

(6) “Motor vehicle” means every description of carriage or other contrivance propelled or
drawn by mechanical power and used for commercial purposes on the highways in the
transportation of passengers, passengers and property, or property or cargo;

(10) “Used for commercial purposes” means the carriage of persons or property for any
fare, fee, rate, charge or other consideration, or directly or indirectly in connection
with any business, or other undertaking intended for profit[.]”

Cops DO NOT have the right nor the authority to stop anyone for having no license or plates on their PRIVATE PROPERTY automobile. You obviously have never read American Jurisprudence nor any other "legal" document. What you claim to enforce are merely statutes, ordinances and regulations, they ARE NOT LAWS!!!

If there is no victim and no damaged property, there is NO CRIME. Prove there has been a crime committed!!!

"... [T]he exemptions provided for in section 1 of the Motor Vehicle Transportation
License Act of 1925 (Stats. 1925, p. 833) in favor of those who solely transport their
own property or employees, or both, and of those who transport no persons or
property for hire or compensation, by motor vehicle, have been determined in the
Bacon Service Corporation case to be lawful exemptions. --In re Schmolke (1926) 199
Cal. 42, 46.

"It is obvious that those who operate motor vehicles for the transportation of persons or
property for hire enjoy a different and more extensive use of the public highways. * *
* Such extraordinary use constitutes a natural distinction and a full justification for their
separate classification and for relieving from the burden of the license tax those who
merely employ the public highways for the transportation of their own property or
employees."
--Bacon Service Corporation v. Huss, 129 Cal. 21, 248 P. 235, 238." (State v. Karel, 180
So. 3 at 8.)

Come on already, most of the people know that a traffic stop is all about commerce and NOT right and wrong, THAT IS THE PROBLEM!!!!!!!!!! It's all about MONEY and CONTROL!!!! It IS NOT about protecting the public. Read Article 1 Section 1 of ANY State Bill of Rights...

MINNESOTA STATE CONSTITUTION
ARTICLE I
BILL OF RIGHTS

Section 1. OBJECT OF GOVERNMENT. Government is instituted for the security, benefit and protection of the people, in whom all political power is inherent, together with the right to alter, modify or reform government whenever required by the public good.

How dumb do you have to be NOT to be able to see that? Come on people.

Originally posted by seeashrink
reply to post by seeashrink

 

I don't understand what you freeman folks are after. I disagree with big government and ours is certainly too big. I agree that our taxes are too high and are wasted for the most part. Having said that, I still don't understand you folks. Do you think that everyone should strap on a gun and when there is a dispute with anyone, you should just shoot it out? Do you live in a house with city water and sewer? Are you willing to have the water turned off? I think that you probably take advantage of every privelege you complain about and are not willing to do away with any. You are not willing to register your vehicle, but you are willing to buy highly taxed gasoline to make it run. Is this not fueling (pun intended) the same system that you want to see changed? If you really believe in what you are doing, then walk or ride a bike everywhere you go. Don't take public transportation because they pay a gas tax as well. As I said before, you folks are part of the problem, not the solution.
Seeashrink

obviously you are unaware of the many cleaner burning fuels people could hav access to, provided the government wouldn't lead so many to believe it's gas or nothing. and on a side note, before i learned about the rights which all whom are a member of the human family hav, i did wut i wanted anyway. N if i were to find out that i did not hav those rights and freedoms, i would still continue to fight. who is any to make judgment upon another. that right is reserved for the almighty. i do, and hav always done wut i want, because i hav the right to, regardless of wut laws are placed before me. i hav always done the best i could to help those in need, and in no way hav i ever knowingly harmed another. furthermore i prefer for people like you to remain up on your high horse.
it helps the good, kind, honest, and caring people spot out the evil doers whom point down upon those who are in no way different from themselves, except that of their own deceiving thoughts, which further separate themselves and others from FREEDOM. so go ahead, call your masters upon my soul and strike me down.
the only way you will ever prevent me from being free, is by the act of murder. and note, i don't like guns, nor do i feel the need to own one. guns are used out of desperation. a feeling which iv long forgotten. furthermore, the only reason i hav been educating myself of these things, is to help others who are in need of my knowledge. i don't fear death, nor loss of "freedom". my heart will never fall from the desire to help others, and my mind shall always be free.

reply to post by daddio


What is all this you speak of and where can I begin learning this?

reply to post by seeashrink

I don't understand what you freeman folks are after. I disagree with big government and ours is certainly too big.

Yet you are playing one of the most important roles in keeping the government machine going.

Do you think that everyone should strap on a gun and when there is a dispute with anyone, you should just shoot it out?

Private security would be more effective at preventing crimes (where there is a victim) than the police. We are forced with the threat of violence to fund (through taxation) a monopolized policing system which reports to the blatantly corrupt government machine (which is all about looking after corporate interests) rather than those who directly fund it. I would prefer to decide which free market security entity I give my money to. If it turns out that any of its employees act in a corrupt manor my money would very quickly be going to a competing firm. This would ensure the competing security companies act honorably and to the will of the people.

Private investigators from the free market are also already far more successful at solving crimes than the police detectives we are forced with the threat of violence to pay for (who get paid the same whether they solve the crime or not).

Do you live in a house with city water and sewer? Are you willing to have the water turned off?

Just as I pay a free market electricity company to supply me with electricity, I would prefer to have a free market company supply me with water and sewerage services.

You are not willing to register your vehicle, but you are willing to buy highly taxed gasoline to make it run. Is this not fueling (pun intended) the same system that you want to see changed? If you really believe in what you are doing, then walk or ride a bike everywhere you go. Don't take public transportation because they pay a gas tax as well.

It's about convenience. If you refuse to buy gasoline because you are unable to avoid the government tax then the government is having a far greater negative impact on your freedom than if you just pay the tax. It's not about trying to change anything (that's impossible, it's become too big), it's about living free. Traveling long distances would be almost impossible without gasoline (with the currently available and easily affordable technology). I don't support the government but I still pay taxes because it is more convenient for me to do so than sit in a prison cell.

As I said before, you folks are part of the problem, not the solution.

I disagree. These types of people are helping others question their conditioned culture and value their and others freedom. The problem comes from those who enable the government machine. The thugs who attempt to violently enforce a certain way of life on others whom they do not know or understand. It should really be no surprise that people are offended by this and resist it. Putting the uniform on lets honest citizens know that these are no longer free thinking men but the blind enforcers of the corrupt system. It's no wonder their social circles consist mainly of other cops with very few outsiders.

have to ask ,

are civilians required by law to "up hold" the law ,
what i mean is , is there a law text some where
the requires "natives" of your law customs
to intervene if they see a crime in progress

does not intervening in a crime make you a criminal ?

the only thing Ive seen in the last 20 some odd years, is the departments chasing after federal grant monies and their own private federal holding facilities. it seems that this has been the driving forces for the modernization of their departments. the cops aren't really stopping anything, it just gives the scared taxpayer a little better nights sleep thinking that they're being protected from the big bad wolf, which they're really not..its a false sense of security on the taxpayers dime.

I'm not blaming the police, they're just as gullible as everyone else, but they need to wake up and quit playing into ole unckle sammies agenda and focus on a bigger picture , which is focusing on their own corruption and investigating and incarcerating the people that writes their checks, instead of predating sheeple drivers that make the mistake of getting near them. making the roads safe doesn't require searches and harassment, i love how they ask you if you have any illegal drugs, guns, or kitty porn on every stop. its none of yas friggen business what i have in my car. mind your own business and if i was speeding give me a friggen ticket and get on your way, so i can go watch porn....HAHAHAHAHA....RETARDS go bust your judges and prosecutors and the bankers their blowing.

then you will all be our HEROS

Originally posted by seeashrink
reply to post by seeashrink

 

I don't understand what you freeman folks are after.
Seeashrink

WE ARE FIGHTING FOR THE VERY SAME REASONS THIS COUNTRY WAS FOUNDED FOR!!!

reply to post by zerbot565


In some cases a crime of omission can occur when someone is obligated to report something to police. Examples are generally, but not in all cases or states, violent crimes. Usually there are administrative regulations on the books requiring medical people and educators to report suspected child abuse, injuries etc. Hospitals are generally required to report if a patient comes in with suspicious injury, and of course if a patient dies under conditions indicative of homicide they are required to report it under law. Citizens are generally required to report felonies and crimes involving children. There are many other examples, but you get the idea.
Comm

Originally posted by GogoVicMorrow
reply to post by surfnow2

 

Well are the cops taking it out on civilians because criminals are getting out of hand?
I mean in the last year I've seen sooo many videos and heard so many stories where cops kill or use excessive force on innocent people for no reason. Even the ones that aren't obeying or did break the law in the below videos and stories were met with unnecessary force where the cop could have easily taken control because they were elderly or children and the top two videos are flat our murder without cause.

Examples:

www.cbsnews.com...
(he got 7 days paid leave)

www.cbsnews.com...

www.kgw.com...

So?

edit on 16-1-2011 by GogoVicMorrow because: (no reason given)

WTFFF??? i watched the first 3 vids you attached, by then i wasnt much in the mood for seeing more. those were extremely disturbing. i think in some cases a sociopath may put on a badge as a mechanism to act out their own psychosis on others. sociopaths exist in every strata of society, so its inevitable some would be cops. we all know that some are politicians. some are gangmembers, but some are even teachers...

in the case of both videos 1 and 3, these two sociopaths pretending to be officers were WITHIN the letter of the law, as it comes to their police officer powers, and they knew it, and used it as an opportunity to both snuff someone and taser a granny. the problem here is that psychopaths were given that much range to operate within legally, and had training that promotes a view of the citizen that is without empathy. one very clear definition for a psychopath is "without empathy".

most cops are not psychopaths. but there is a psychopathic aspect to the new breed of command-and-control training and clear leeway in the conditions-of-self-defense training: the citizen is to be viewed without empathy or compassion to comply with the officer's power and security. this type of training creates an "us and them" complex in the officers mind, because this type of training is always linked to the officer's own physical security, as in "if you try to simply arrest grandma in a gentle way, she will pull out a gun and kill you, so just taser her or you might as well be committing suicide-by-grandma"... thus we have these insane taserings. give a true-psychopath training and unprecedented power and authority, train him in a psychopathic model for human interaction, and you will have these snuff-films on youtube. the reason andy and barney fife arent the sherrifs department in mayberry anymore is that they were TRAINED under a new model (introduced and expanded in the last few decades) to view us all as threats and possible perps, not as humans. thus, one solution to the types of abuse in these vids would be to humanize their training, limit tasering/deadlyforce powers, and break the brotherhood-of-silence to allow mechanisms to remove psychopaths from the profession.

but it looks like its all rolling the other way... any cops that would be on ATS are bound to be much more openminded and more so critical-thinkers than your average cop, so civil conversation and debate is possible with us all equal in a citizen's forum, like so many neighbors and friends. but the powers that be shape general training and operation policies in law enforcement - they control the general slant and style with which law enforcement as a whole views the populace, and set trends in law enforcement style, in much the same way as they make many of the laws. these officers representing here on ats dont shape policy or law, they are like you and me, people trying to do the right thing while squeezing our humanity into being cogs within some socio-cultural machine over which we have very little control. we dont seem to be the ones who control which way this thing is rolling. expect more taserings on your youtube videos soon, no matter how many good cops you meet on ats.

reply to post by surfnow2


Not everyone that gets pulled over has done anything wrong. People get pulled over for the color of their skin, how they dress, all kinds of reasons that have nothing to do with the law. The town I used to live in didn't have many people of color, so they targetted the young. You would get pulled over and harrassed for being young. After a while the people of the town got so fed up with their kids being harrassed, we disbanded our police force.

I can see pulling someone over for speeding, fine, but that doesn't give the police a right to treat people as if they just robbed a bank and ran some kids over or something. Also the police use dirty tricks like riding people's bumpers with their brights on to get people to speed. Happened to me once, and the cop was a psycho. Threatened me through my lawyer at traffic court, after disobeying a SGT that told him not to show up for court over the radio.

Police have a general us against them attitude, which in turn creates that attitude in the people. After what happened to me at the hands of a psycho cop, I will never again pull over for the police in an area where there aren't a whole bunch of witnesses around to keep the cops in line. Not that witnesses will always deter a psycho cop, but it does sometimes.

reply to post by surfnow2


WTF crashed through razor wire? Sucks to be that guy... What did he do, crash into a prison fence or something?

reply to post by ukWolf

I don't need to reread my post, I wrote it. Yes, after being fired as a cop, I was rehired as a cop. It happens all the time in the US, especially when the people doing the firing were corrupt and everyone knows it, as in my case. As a matter of fact, two other people in my organization had run ins with the same Sheriff. The only place that I have contradicted myself is in giving that thread the title I gave it. Seems I can't leave it alone.
Seeashrink.
PS: that sheriff is no longer in power.

People are born free men, unless you give them permission, not one single person has power over you or your actions.

I am sure there are good cops out there, but here it is a business and they are out to propogate it with ticket revenue and any confiscated criminal property that they can turn into some use. People have stated that the government is behind the current of illegal drugs being brought in and sold over the black market. I do not know if that is true, but many local police have found that they can become a more profitable business if they also control the illegal drug trade and regulate it. Meth cooks have been asked to "work" for the police, making product and allowing the cops to pick out the customers and arrest them at their leisure. They confiscate their belongings, both drugs and money are taken and either pocketed or turned in to an "off the books" account. Many of the cops end up users of these drugs, there is a very high prevalancy of cops that use speed "to gain that edge on a perp."

Many convicted criminals have reported that the amount of drugs turned in was far less than the whole amount, and usually it is the minimum amount needed for a felony conviction. The rest is either pocketed by the cop or used as false evidence if needed in the future, or even for their "undercover work."

So these cops are allowed to do illegal acts that they are supposed to prevent under the guise of working "undercover." This they are doing without any viable regulation comittee; no one to "enforce the enforcer." Police create the problem that they are suppoed to be there to fix.

Yes I would give up nearly all my comforts that i take for granted to live in a world where the people regulating us were not themselves criminals with criminal ideals excersized for monetary gain and power to control the population. From my limited research it seems that we enter into an agreement to be held accountable to the rules and regulations that govern traffic (and give the cops the right to fine or arrest you for violating them) at some point when we apply for our license or register our vehicle; which is surely a topic for a different thread.

I applaud any cop who is brave enough to be decent and respectful to others and actually works to protect the citizens of his community. When I travel in other areas I have to remind myself that cops aren't always so corrupt as what I have come to expect in my area. I have met and talked with many kind officers or ex-officers that proved to me they aren't all bad. When the Nazis came to power in Germany they used Jewish police to regulate the Jewish people. If we were to retaliate against our opressors we would only be hurting ourselves and causing more problems than would be fixed. Gun-toting anarchy is not the answer to our dilemna here. We have to set peaceful messages into action that will crash upon their brows time and time again, like waves of the ocean until finally they see the truth in it.

(thank you for starting this post and may we all learn from each other to better the world each day as it comes)

reply to post by urmenimu2


I agree with almost everything you say (though, I don't know why a sociopath would become a teacher when they could in fact be a cop and enjoy themselves more ) In the very first video it turns out he wasn't really within his rights and training. If you count there is only a about 7 seconds between the time he begins his commands and unloads his gun, the bullets hit the guy in the side, why? Because he had his back to the officer and was deaf in one ear. He was shot turning around with a closed knife in his hand.

I understand they are trained differently.. but that is EXACTLY my problem. They are trained as soldiers, with not empathy. People will be a lot less objective of having soldiers actively patrolling their neighborhoods if they are called police and throw back to days of the friendly sheriff. So even if theoretically (and I doubt it's so) if most of them were friendly, empathetic, soldiers with the heart of gold, you could still run into the cop in video one and he blow you away and that is the end of you. Imagine you are pumped full of shots and another cop on the scene is squeezing your hand as you are fading to black saying,, "dude, that sucks, but we really aren't all the bad."

I'd rather just avoid cops all together than run in to psycho cop on an off chance.
Unfortunately you can't do that because they are finding more and more reasons to abuse your rights.

Originally posted by DZAG Wright
reply to post by daddio

 

What is all this you speak of and where can I begin learning this?

The best thing to do is to U2U me and I will e-mail you all the info I have, it is a ton!! And never has it been rebutted by the "government".

Originally posted by LegalTender

Originally posted by seeashrink
reply to post by seeashrink

 

I don't understand what you freeman folks are after.
Seeashrink

WE ARE FIGHTING FOR THE VERY SAME REASONS THIS COUNTRY WAS FOUNDED FOR!!!

Wish I could star and flag this response a trillion times and more. Sad that cops don't get it. And they view themselves as honest Americans. I view them as scum, it's just a job to them, they DO NOT care if they are subverting the natural rights of man or violating the Common Law, it is a paycheck and power trip of which they have no clue. Sad really, just sad.