Jesus (Yeshua) was a Jew, who died for a purpose..

Originally posted by randyvs
reply to post by dontreally

 

That gives me chills to read that the tomb got to you. Awesome.

I felt the same way. Here's a post I did on the trip you might enjoy: Israel Trip

And nope, my dog there is named Moses. He's a male.

reply to post by NewAgeMan


If you're familiar with members like Traditional. Then you know how good he is at cornering believers. He is very good at what he does my man. Believe me he's no slouch at all. That's why I said what I said. I have been a match for him at times and other times the guy (this is so hard to admit) he's had me wanting to reach through my web connection and grab him by the throat.

reply to post by NewAgeMan


I would have to go too deeply into Jewish theology to explain that to you.

Besides, i have written much on it in other threads and no one seems to care.

Just suffice to say, Yeshua ben Gamliel(as he is called in Talmud) was a heretic because he attempted to synthesize Greco-Roman views (the gist of which was egyptian in origin) with Judaism. He rejected the oral Torah(the 613 rabbinic laws) and said the only thing that was relevant were the 10 commandments which again were subject to interpretation.

Because of this, he was excommunicated by the priestly class demonized by history, the Pharissees.

Years before Yeshua came, the greeks were antsy to undermine the Jews observance of Torah. The sadducees, were essentially the 5th wheel of greece in Israeli society and they made way you could say for what Yeshua accomplished a generation or two later.

Eventually the hellenists succeeded when the "most greek of emperors" Hadrian, ransacked 985 Judean towns and killed 650,000 Jews in 250 CE.

This was the destruction of Judaism that the Roman-grecan establishment needed in order to pass off the forgery that is the christian tradition as legitimate.. And it didnt really catch on until the 10th century. Many of the supposed "christians" were still steeped in their earlier pagan practices, probably because the core of christian theology resonates with so many pagan mythos.. This was the case in Asia minor where many of the communities replaced sabazios or dionysus, with christ.

reply to post by schuyler


Thats very respectful of you.

Guess you dont like the Jews (or Judaism) very much.

reply to post by schuyler


Ok! alright and thank you so much I'm going to check that not now, but right now. Correction noted.

reply to post by schuyler

I replied to you, bottom of last page.

The best way for me to describe it to you, will be in the context of karma, and a type of paradox of karma resolved, and for that, please watch for that intro I will be typing in for the Bhagavad Gita like I said, once that frame is in place, and you see how bhakti is related to karma, and to the eternal Godhead in love and mutuality, then it ought to become clear, the reframe in eternity, that I realize I only alluded to, while asking people to assume all kinds of things, gaps, if you will, based on prior pieces of the puzzle that I've been assembling for a while now, and then to an increasingly degree of late. It if cannot be communicated and shared, then what good is it? I get that, but to arrive at the utter simplicity of it on the far side of complexity, we'll have to wander that ground together. So I guess I can't just say it in a mere paragraph or two, and will need more time, and your continued patience. Sorry again if I reacted there, as if pushed.

That's really neat your travel experiences, very interesting.

Originally posted by dontreally
Just suffice to say, Yeshua ben Gamliel(as he is called in Talmud) was a heretic because he attempted to synthesize Greco-Roman views (the gist of which was egyptian in origin) with Judaism.

Correct me if I am wrong my friend, but wasn't Moses himself a student of the Egyptian Mysteries?

Before Moses bringing the Ten Commandments down from Mount Sinai, the Jews were essentially a slave class of Egypt without a dogma of their own. It was this trek down Mount Sinai which brought the Jews their first set of laws by which to build a society and a name (more a title really) for their idea of deity, YHWH. I am that I am, a statement of the omnipotence of the creator. An intelligence beyond a name.

Furthermore, did not Moses make off with the Arc of the Covenant from the Great Pyramids and wasn't the first tabernacle erected in similar fashion as the pyramids to house the arc?

One would think that if anything, Moses himself modeled Judaism off of the Egyptian mysteries, Jesus being but a later student.

As for the Greco-Roman influence, I don't think this has anything to do with Jesus but is the direct result of Emperor Constantine attempting to create a Universal faith that was based on Judaism, the cult of Mithra, Christs teachings, and a healthy dose of Roman paganism (Namely the cult of Apollo), all with Constantine as the crown of this new Church. This point, I can certainly yield.

Now if you pull Christs teachings out of the bible and leave Constantines perversions behind, what in those teachings is heretical?

Originally posted by dontreally
He rejected the oral Torah(the 613 rabbinic laws) and said the only thing that was relevant were the 10 commandments which again were subject to interpretation.

I can see how this could be an issue. Moses founded the faith of Judaism and is handed the laws from God in stone that would rule the people of Israel. Later down the road, those laws aren't good enough any more so an oral tradition of more laws begins and is passed down mouth to ear. Through later generations and various interpretations, the oral law no longer coincides with the original law written in stone. Yeah, I can see why he would rebel against this. Particularly when the original Ten Commandments were enough to keep a society peaceful and prosperous while maintaining favor with the creator.

Originally posted by dontreally
Because of this, he was excommunicated by the priestly class demonized by history, the Pharissees.

This was another thorn in the side with Christs teachings. He taught people that they were the link to God, that there was no need for a Priestly class. No worries here my friend. Look what Constantine did, he put the Priest class right back in.

Christ certainly did rebel against the Jewish establishment, but his followers were Jews who had enough of what the establishment was doing to their society. Times then weren't so very different than times now. Just as Jesus threw the money lenders out of the Temple of God, we are once again on the precipice of throwing them out of the Temple of God again. This time, it will be the true temple of God, our hearts, and they won't be welcome back.

Moses gave Ten Commandments

The Oral Torah gave 613 laws that are open to interpretation (Much like our own laws)

Jesus gave two Commandments - Love God, Love your Neighbor.

Seems pretty obvious to me my friend. I'll be judged by Jesus' Commandments, You be judged by which ever you choose.

With Love,

Your Brother

reply to post by IAMIAM

YHWH. I am that I am, a statement of the omnipotence of the creator. An intelligence beyond a name.

I stopped reading here as its clear you dont know what your talking about. אהיה. Its this word which is translated in English bibles as "i will be". "I am that i am" is Ehyeh Asher Ehyeh, not יהוה - YHWH. The tetragrammaton doesnt have a precise translation but its constituent letters form the words היה, הוה,יהו was, is and will be, and so this name in itself connotes 'being'.

the protokols of xion are REAL.

it is funny, how 'jooish' reporters, professionals, etc all chimed in, to TELL US, that the protokols were faked.

they are real.

i IMPLORE everyone on these boards, to read the protokols of xion. you will be amazed at how real they are, and how a book written in 1875 or so, has come true.

i have no problem with the chozen, i just know their game plan. it is a shame they are taught they need to rule the world with an iron fist of apartheid and servitude.

jesus fought the protokols back then, and i fight the protokols today.

go read them for yourself, and judge for yourself if they are real or not.
do NOT listen to me, or any other person's opinion of the book. just READ IT, and then determine whether or not you think it is is real or 'fake'

the media does the same thing now. they lie about everything. if an article comes out they do not like, they say its fake, and use all their media resources to 'tell' us its fake.

the protokols, unfortunately for humankind, are real.

Originally posted by Fractured.Facade
Funny how so many seem to know what Jesus was, while completely failing to see him for what he is and will be for all eternity.

A fraud or someone that never existed? Which one

reply to post by dantanna


The sicilian aristocrat julian avola once argued the same thing. He acknowledged that they were faked. Its already completely acknowledged that the protocalls were based on a book written 40 years earlier in france called "Dialogue in Hell Between Machiavelli and Montesquieu". This is actually a fact. Any juxtaposition made between the two texts clearly proves this.

So explain that. Avola himself asininely and prejudicely concluded that because whats stated in the protocalls has come true than its message must also be true. But how can that be true at all, when an earlier, french writing served as the template for the 'the protocalls of the learned elders of zion'. this would than suggest that whoever wrote this book wrote it based on a structure found in another french book. If the message resonates with what appears to be the situation today, i think another possible answer is the Jews being used as scapegoat.

Makes a hell of alot more sense than completely submitting to the simple message of the protocalls despite the fact that a book was written 40 years earlier that reads almost exactly the same.

no offense but you all sound crazy when u start quoting bible versus. eats cheese burger and sits outside and looks at the stars now thats life.

reply to post by dontreally


go continue calling Jesus a fraud, it worked so well for you people over the last 2000 years.

this is how messed up jews are: military occupation, systematic starvation and murder of innocent people o.k., eating a pork chop, bad.

I love Jesus Christ! every day of every hour! May you all celebrate His birth with rejoicing and fond memories this year, amen.

Originally posted by NewAgeMan

....he neither ran, nor fought back......(in the traditional sense)

Luke 22:36

"""He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one."""

Luke 22:38

"""The disciples said, "See, Lord, here are two swords." "That is enough," he replied."""


It's a sin to commit suicide. There's evil in the world and if you don't arm/protect your life....that's suicide.

Even Jesus Christ said you have a right to protect your life. Otherwise he would have never told anyone to buy a sword.

Originally posted by dontreally
I stopped reading here as its clear you dont know what your talking about. אהיה. Its this word which is translated in English bibles as "i will be". "I am that i am" is Ehyeh Asher Ehyeh, not יהוה - YHWH. The tetragrammaton doesnt have a precise translation but its constituent letters form the words היה, הוה,יהו was, is and will be, and so this name in itself connotes 'being'.

Fair enough my friend. "Being", still vague and impersonal. It is not a humnaistic diety such as Zeus or Apollo, which was my point. It is something beyond human understanding. It is something which is greater than all. It is ALL. Anything less than all could hardly be a creator of all, would you not agree?

I am not here to denigrate your knowledge my friend, just sharing my view. You have a closer view of the Judaic traditions because you have most likely lived your life within them. I have not, so I will yield on the semantics. What I am trying to do is find the common ground, that which we can agree on, and along the way learn something from each other.

Now that you know my position, will you reconsider addressing the rest of my post?

With Love,

Your Brother

Originally posted by Pervius
Even Jesus Christ said you have a right to protect your life. Otherwise he would have never told anyone to buy a sword.

This is why he would not allow his followers to fight the Romans when they came to arrest him? This is the parable of turning the other cheek?

My friend, much has been written into the story of Jesus Christ's life by Constantine to usurp his teachings. Early Roman murals of Jesus Christ even went so far as to have him depicted as a Roman Emperor dressed in full battle regalia. Does this image resonate with the life he lead, the lessons he taught of Love and Forgiveness, and the sacrifice he made to demonstrate the lessons and life?

To know Jesus' lessons is to discern them from what has been added to the tale to conceal them.

Is your life worth more than your Brothers to God? Does a parent value the life of one child over the other? Which of your own children would you see perish that the other might live?

With Love,

Your Brother

Originally posted by IAMIAM

Originally posted by dontreally
Just suffice to say, Yeshua ben Gamliel(as he is called in Talmud) was a heretic because he attempted to synthesize Greco-Roman views (the gist of which was egyptian in origin) with Judaism.

Correct me if I am wrong my friend, but wasn't Moses himself a student of the Egyptian Mysteries?

Before Moses bringing the Ten Commandments down from Mount Sinai, the Jews were essentially a slave class of Egypt without a dogma of their own. It was this trek down Mount Sinai which brought the Jews their first set of laws by which to build a society and a name (more a title really) for their idea of deity, YHWH. I am that I am, a statement of the omnipotence of the creator. An intelligence beyond a name.

Furthermore, did not Moses make off with the Arc of the Covenant from the Great Pyramids and wasn't the first tabernacle erected in similar fashion as the pyramids to house the arc?

One would think that if anything, Moses himself modeled Judaism off of the Egyptian mysteries, Jesus being but a later student.

As for the Greco-Roman influence, I don't think this has anything to do with Jesus but is the direct result of Emperor Constantine attempting to create a Universal faith that was based on Judaism, the cult of Mithra, Christs teachings, and a healthy dose of Roman paganism (Namely the cult of Apollo), all with Constantine as the crown of this new Church. This point, I can certainly yield.

Now if you pull Christs teachings out of the bible and leave Constantines perversions behind, what in those teachings is heretical?

Originally posted by dontreally
He rejected the oral Torah(the 613 rabbinic laws) and said the only thing that was relevant were the 10 commandments which again were subject to interpretation.

I can see how this could be an issue. Moses founded the faith of Judaism and is handed the laws from God in stone that would rule the people of Israel. Later down the road, those laws aren't good enough any more so an oral tradition of more laws begins and is passed down mouth to ear. Through later generations and various interpretations, the oral law no longer coincides with the original law written in stone. Yeah, I can see why he would rebel against this. Particularly when the original Ten Commandments were enough to keep a society peaceful and prosperous while maintaining favor with the creator.

Originally posted by dontreally
Because of this, he was excommunicated by the priestly class demonized by history, the Pharissees.

This was another thorn in the side with Christs teachings. He taught people that they were the link to God, that there was no need for a Priestly class. No worries here my friend. Look what Constantine did, he put the Priest class right back in.

Christ certainly did rebel against the Jewish establishment, but his followers were Jews who had enough of what the establishment was doing to their society. Times then weren't so very different than times now. Just as Jesus threw the money lenders out of the Temple of God, we are once again on the precipice of throwing them out of the Temple of God again. This time, it will be the true temple of God, our hearts, and they won't be welcome back.

Moses gave Ten Commandments

The Oral Torah gave 613 laws that are open to interpretation (Much like our own laws)

Jesus gave two Commandments - Love God, Love your Neighbor.

Seems pretty obvious to me my friend. I'll be judged by Jesus' Commandments, You be judged by which ever you choose.

With Love,

Your Brother

edit on 23-12-2010 by IAMIAM because: (no reason given)

I am deeply impressed with your rebuttal. even though I am only an insignificant nobody. May there be more discerning people like you.

Merry Christmas, as we celebrate freedom from flawed mortal's domination and subjugation attempts upon humanity whom are our Divine Creator's children.

For what purpose did Jesus die? To fulfill a sacrifice? A human sacrifice?

As a christian you must believe that a human sacrifice is an acceptable form of atonement and salvation. Though I'll bet each one winces when imagining the Aztecs performing their human sacrifices. There must be further dissonance with squaring up how a god said to be merciful and loving was also stricken with blood lust and enjoyed the odor of sacrifices.

For those who believe Jesus IS the Lord, one must wonder why this god sacrificed himself to himself. And, was it a sacrifice at all if he survived death and still reigns in heaven? And if Jesus WAS Lord, who did he pray to at Gethsemane?

The whole thing is a bit convoluted to me and I don't personally believe in human sacrifice, nor would I worship a bloodthirsty god. Had I been present at Jesus' execution I would have felt compelled to stop it and would have if I could. The death of Jesus was senseless, not purposeful.

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer
For what purpose did Jesus die? To fulfill a sacrifice? A human sacrifice?

Jesus had to die because two Empires could not exist with the spreading of his teachings. On one hand there was a Priest class Empire who held dominion over a people on the other a military Empire who held dominion over all. Christs teachings were contrary to both of these Empires and if allowed to spread, would have defeated both Empires. Had Christ resisted being put to death, he would have acted contrary to his own teachings of love and forgiveness. He died as an example of his teachings. This cemented in the minds his lessons to his followers. The early Christians spread like wild fire. They suffered the same torments as Christ. They were put to death by torture and being fed to lions. Neither Empire could defeat them for each death only encouraged more to join this peaceful resistance. This is why Constantine had to convert. The only way to defeat them, was to become one of them and distort the teachings, shroud them in false doctrines.

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer
As a christian you must believe that a human sacrifice is an acceptable form of atonement and salvation. Though I'll bet each one winces when imagining the Aztecs performing their human sacrifices. There must be further dissonance with squaring up how a god said to be merciful and loving was also stricken with blood lust and enjoyed the odor of sacrifices.

Atonement is a doctrine of the Mithraic Cult which was written into Christs teachings to give the Roman Empire the dominion over the populace. Christs message was that all are Gods children.

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer
For those who believe Jesus IS the Lord, one must wonder why this god sacrificed himself to himself. And, was it a sacrifice at all if he survived death and still reigns in heaven? And if Jesus WAS Lord, who did he pray to at Gethsemane?

Again, this is a distortion of Christs teachings by the Roman Empire. Jesus never said he was God. He stated he was the Son of God (the spirit) and the Son of Man (the flesh), and so are you.

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer
The whole thing is a bit convoluted to me and I don't personally believe in human sacrifice, nor would I worship a bloodthirsty god. Had I been present at Jesus' execution I would have felt compelled to stop it and would have if I could. The death of Jesus was senseless, not purposeful.

This is good my friend. How would you stop it without harming anyone else?

When you are willing to put your life on the line for all your fellow man, then you will know Christs message.

Spread it, and we can all stand united against the Empires that seek to enslave us.

With Love,

Your Brother