N. Korea Crisis - Updated as News come to hand

reply to post by Regensturm


I already posted that what my post isn't to good enough?

Originally posted by Tifozi
the US has fears and that not even their military power intimidates them.

Yes the US has fears and that's why they didn't take Saddam Hussein out the first time.

That made him even more bold and he wasn't intimidated by US Military power either. Remember this?

thinkexist.com...

“We are not intimidated by the size of the armies, or the type of hardware the US has brought.”-Saddam Hussein

But just because the power hungry dictator isn't intimidated, doesn't mean the outcome of the battle will be any different. Just look at how Saddam Hussein ended up.

Now if the US isn't fully committed to doing something, like taking out the leader as in the first Iraq invasion, then maybe it won't happen. As it turns out some of their fears about controlling the country after Hussein fell, were justified. But if the US make up their minds to do something, I don't think it matters how intimidated N. Korea is, just like it didn't make much difference with Saddam Hussein in 2003 when he was captured. Actually he did seem intimidated by the time he was captured, hiding in a hole in the ground.

China loves their buffer state.

China will step in to help NK if something happens.

China and NK are connected both physically,and economically.

Nothing will happen,I hope.

Originally posted by Agent_USA_Supporter
reply to post by Regensturm

 

I already posted that what my post isn't to good enough?

Not at all, I simply missed it. My mistake.

I've starred your post to make amends.

Originally posted by MikeboydUS
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

Looks like all the DPRK needs to do now is provide us casus belli and the ceasefire dies in a blaze of glory. Sure we might lose Seoul, but it can be rebuilt. People forget much of Germany and Japan looked like the moon after WW2. Within a decade it didn't look like the moon anymore.

Now I wonder should we invite PLA and Russian peacekeepers?

We don't need casus belli. We had none in Iraq and precious little for Afghanistan.

My only worry is that this news from China could be misdirection that is calculated to catch ROK and the US with our collective pants down. We can not believe everything the ChiCom says.

It's such a joke for SK and US. NK has just slammed SK in face. SK vows revenge but only dares to cry to its master US. The only thing the grandfather (US) and grandson (SK) can do is to "exercise" shadow boxing in front of China's gate, sweating profusely all along with the efforts and costs (born by SK). Here the grandpa makes a round-house kick, and there grandson returns with a jab. Big deal! Martial arts indeed. Taekwondo? US boxing? hahaha ...

How much more can US spend on these exercises? Russia and China have decided to settle bi-lateral trades away from USD. Other countries will follow suit. What can you do, USA? Wanna go to an all-out war? Bring it on! You think others do not have nukes? Please carry on with your muscle show, but your protein supply has been depleted.

US Aircraft Carrier group is the biggest joke. It costs 30 billion USD to create and 200 million to maintain per month. But it costs only 500,000 USD (anti-carrier missile) to destroy. Please make more AC groups, USA, please. The world begs you to do that.

reply to post by Arbitrageur


I think the US first have to fight their battle before they can determine their victory. North Korea ain't Iraq. North Kore is a much more disciplined people and they can shoot straight.

Our history dont predict who is going to win.

reply to post by Regensturm

Thanks gave you a star in return.

It seems Russia is chiming in on the Korean crisis as well. Like China, they have remained on the fence throughout this fiasco. China wants to resume six party talks, and now it seems Russia is vying for the same.

Russia Backs China’s Call for Six-Party Talks on North Korea

Russia supports China’s proposal to hold six-nation talks on military tensions stemming from North Korea’s Nov. 23 artillery attack on a South Korean island, Russia’s ambassador to the United Nations said.

“We think that if everybody could come to those talks, they could be useful,” Ambassador Vitaly Churkin said in an interview today. “We sort of view this initiative as a positive one.”

It seems the US/SK are reluctant to take the bait this time, military maneuvers continue, and strong condemnation is their rhetoric. Still, I hope the talks can resume, but it seems they have done little to avert provocative acts from North Korea in terms of the attack on the SK vessel, the artillery barrage on the SK island, and recent developments of the nuclear program graduating to an industrial scale. They are clearly up to something. It could it be the last gasps of a dying government, a show of force for more leverage during future talks, or a show of force to their big brother China as they grow tired of their disobedient child?

The Wikileaks cables have shown that China is growing weary of its partnership with North Korea, and it seems they have become more of a liability than an asset like in the past. One thing is for certain, the US/SK are taking a tougher stance toward North Korea, and are steering clear from the diplomatic pleasantries being thrown around by China and now Russia. China is going to have to send a strong message to their North Korean partner to cease their destructive behavior, and until they do so; the US/SK military activities are going to continue and escalate as the situation warrants it.

Even though Russia wants to get back to the table, little or no progress will be made. NK will agree to stop progressing with their nuclear ambitions and not attack SK in return for aide of some kind. When that aide gets too thin, NK will do something else to get more. NK's needs to be dealt with, either China does it or SK does it, it still must be done.

Originally posted by habfan1968
Even though Russia wants to get back to the table, little or no progress will be made. NK will agree to stop progressing with their nuclear ambitions and not attack SK in return for aide of some kind. When that aide gets too thin, NK will do something else to get more. NK's needs to be dealt with, either China does it or SK does it, it still must be done.

Yeah, I see a pattern as you have pointed out with North Korea. The country is on the ropes and these talks seem to have been used as a tool to get concessions from the developed nations. The North say they are going to cooperate, blah, blah, blah, and then they get some kind of aide package. Like you say when the aid gets thin they act out whether it is a violent act or a nuke test, and everything comes to a stand still. The world is on edge, and then China, Russia, and others preach calm and the talks resume. Then talks resume, aide is delivered, and the cycle continues.

This time however, I think if talks are to resume, if NK violates their end of the bargain; there will be dire consequences. Whatever the consequences are, they must be carried out and no side stepping this time. Let the chips fall where they may. I am open for talks, as long as they have teeth, and NK can expect dire consequences if they continue to dictate terms of the talks through provocative acts.

Originally posted by killallbullies
It's such a joke for SK and US. NK has just slammed SK in face. SK vows revenge but only dares to cry to its master US. The only thing the grandfather (US) and grandson (SK) can do is to "exercise" shadow boxing in front of China's gate, sweating profusely all along with the efforts and costs (born by SK). Here the grandpa makes a round-house kick, and there grandson returns with a jab. Big deal! Martial arts indeed. Taekwondo? US boxing? hahaha ...

How much more can US spend on these exercises? Russia and China have decided to settle bi-lateral trades away from USD. Other countries will follow suit. What can you do, USA? Wanna go to an all-out war? Bring it on! You think others do not have nukes? Please carry on with your muscle show, but your protein supply has been depleted.

US Aircraft Carrier group is the biggest joke. It costs 30 billion USD to create and 200 million to maintain per month. But it costs only 500,000 USD (anti-carrier missile) to destroy. Please make more AC groups, USA, please. The world begs you to do that.

You forgot USS Carrier have 3x Phalanx CIWS that will take care of anti-carrier missile. Your next argument?

Yeah that phalanx system against a missile going at 13000 mph... MIRV... good luck with that.

Phalanx won't be able to stop that missile when it's finished. Forget it. It won't be a simple anti-ship missile. It will be a MIRV intercontinental ballistic missile, probably launched from a submarine.


More news.
China blocks UN action against N Korea December 1, 2010

And China is dropping North Korea uh? Yeah. Actions speak more than words.

# Xinhua: Sr. party official Wang Jiarui heads from Beijing to Washington. (#Koreas likely top agenda item). about 4 hours ago via TweetDeck

# Re US-Japan-ROK meet next week on #DPRK, State Dept.'s Crowley says: "Stay tuned. We'll have more to say about that probably tomorrow. " about 5 hours ago via TweetDeck

# WH spokesman Gibbs on #DPRK: "...you’ll see progress on multilateral discussions around this over the next few days." #Koreas about 5 hours ago via TweetDeck

Also forgot to add this ...

S. Korea, U.S. in consultations for more naval drills: official
Really? Because it worked so well in the past...

reply to post by Vitchilo


Good Job with the updates in this thread
Thanks for staying on task and on topic.

reply to post by Vitchilo


Thanks for the update. I believe the last thing we need is the UN trying to march in there. I'm pretty sure those guys are corrupt, I'm not saying North Korea isn't, just that it makes no sense for corrupt people to police other corrupt people. But hey, look at the US prison system.

Originally posted by Vitchilo
Yeah that phalanx system against a missile going at 13000 mph... MIRV... good luck with that.

Phalanx won't be able to stop that missile when it's finished. Forget it. It won't be a simple anti-ship missile. It will be a MIRV intercontinental ballistic missile, probably launched from a submarine.

But you forget this little number when the United States used a naval asset (Aegis System) to down a satellite in orbit; the satellite was traveling quite fast:

The satellite and the missile will be heading toward each other at about 22,000 mph. The satellite is about the size of a school bus, authorities have said, and the missile will be aimed at its fuel tank, which is about 3 or 4 feet long.

Source

reply to post by nonnez


Hitting a satellite on your own terms with quite a preparation, you also know the trajectory and there's only ONE of them... yeah.

But hitting a dozen + live warheads heading your way at 13000 mph when you don't know their entire trajectory + you have no preparation time beforehand and only a few minutes to launch the anti-missile countermeasure... good luck with that.

That is if you even detect the missile in time... I'm just saying that at the moment, a US carrier strike group would be sunk... but of course this will likely change with the advances in the US anti-missile shield technology upgrades... but this whole thing is for another thread.

reply to post by Vitchilo


I was not not trying to start another argument; I was just trying to point out that it is not an impossibility just as the sinking of an aircraft carrier. If an object can be tracked . . . it can also be shot down regardless of when it was launched or whichever direction.

I agree . . . time to get back on topic.

Now confirmed that they will do more drills.

USFK sources say not aware of when next joint naval drill with #ROK will be held but note series of maneuvers were agreed on at 2+2 talks. about 2 hours ago via TweetDeck

But right now the GW is going back to Japan. So if North Korea goes nuts over the December 6 drills, no US carrier will be in the area... well the Carl Vinson will be in the area I suppose.

Group launches anti-N. Korean balloons

Might be something... might be nothing... apparently Japan sent a boatload of jet fuel to South Korea...but of course the US is saying that it's all normal...

U.S. military: Nothing unusual about jet fuel shipment from Japan to S. Korea (Reuters)

U.S. Navy seeks to move jet fuel in rare Japan-Korea route-trade

The United States Navy is seeking a medium-range oil tanker to move at least 30,000 tonnes of jet fuel from Japan to South Korea, industry sources said on Wednesday, at a time of heightened military tension on the Korean peninsula.

The transport route is unusual for jet fuel, shipping sources said

And Hillary is saying that all will be solved with talks... there's a problem here...

- China just hours ago defended North Korea at the UN.

Secretary of State Hillary Clinton is expected to meet with her South Korean and Japanese counterparts here early next week to discuss China's proposal to convene an emergency meeting of chief nuclear envoys to the six-party talks on ending North Korea's nuclear weapons programs.
Early next week... as in COULD BE TOO LATE.

Precision.. the December 6-12 exercises are not in Yeonpyeong Island waters... but there is still one planned for those waters.

More news...

REUTERSFLASH: China says will handle #Koreas dispute as a "responsible great power", will not show favouritism. 17 minutes ago via TweetDeck

Ahahahaha. Yeah sure. You just did it a few hours ago at the UN! FAIL!