N. Korea Crisis - Updated as News come to hand

Apparently, from his mouth, the ROK and US forces are under SK control (I personaly doubt that).

Yeah they aren't. South Korean forces are under ROK control...and US forces under US control... when war happens, all forces come under US control.

About the cost of reunification...
Buyers Pass Up $5 Trillion Bargain of Future: William Pesek

We haven’t seen anything yet. Irritation will rise once world leaders discuss money. Recent tensions brought the issue of Korean reunification to the fore as rarely before. The real questions are: How much will it cost and who will pay? They are big ones and they aren’t getting enough attention.

The price tag will be $2 trillion to $5 trillion over 30 years, says Peter Beck, a senior fellow with the Atlantic Council in Washington. A South Korean presidential committee puts it between $322 billion to $2.1 trillion, but come on. The costs of German reunification -- about $2 trillion and counting -- suggest even $5 trillion is optimistic.

Or you know, they can continue to live like they are now... with a little more food. After all, the difference between South Korean society and North Korean society would be like taking someone from New York and sending him on a technology advanced alien planet....

The technological evolution since 1950s is insane... and North Korea is still living in the 1950s.

reply to post by Vitchilo


Also not shure if it was posted before.

But South Korea's defense minister vows airstrikes if North Korea attacks again


edition.cnn.com...

reply to post by Karmayogi11
yes that and the Japan/ US drills/war games started today, funny thing is, no news about them as of yet, check NHK news, for up dates, still have feeling something will happen by the 6th.

reply to post by Vitchilo

Yeah they aren't. South Korean forces are under ROK control...and US forces under US control... when war happens, all forces come under US control.

Which is worst than it sounds.

If the US gains control of all military forces, that means it also becomes their responsibility for any action. Everyone with a sane mind can guess on what the consequences will be if China, or Russia, or other major country doesn't approve of the military action taken against North Korea, or in case of all-out war.

In practical terms, it's exactly the same as the US putting them-self's in the role of aggressor (aggressor is used under interpretation of other countries).

We see all the time the exchange of accusations in favor and against US policy. But the US also seems pretty enthusiastic in putting itself in a position where they can be charged to anything that goes wrong.

Apparently, North Korea deployed more tanks along the DMZ too...not just more MLRS.

A South Korean government source told the JoongAng Ilbo that North Korea’s army had recently added around 100 more multiple-launch rockets and about 200 tanks along the inter-Korean border.

About their tanks...
S. Korea Studies North's New Battle Tank

South Korean military and intelligence authorities are scrutinizing the performances of North Korea's latest main battle tank, believed to be the latest modification of the Soviet-built T-62, officials here said Aug. 17.

"The new tank appeared to have better mobility, survivability and firepower than the existing Chonma-Ho (Pegasus), apparently," a South Korean Ministry of National Defense official said on condition of anonymity.

According to a recent analysis published by Seoul's Defense Agency for Technology and Quality, an affiliate of the Defense Acquisition Program Administration, the Pokpung-Ho is believed to be armed with either a newly developed 125mm or 115mm main gun.

The improved version would be mounted with a 14.5mm KPV anti-aircraft machine gun, which is more powerful than the 12.7mm gun on older tanks, the analysis states.

Other improvements for the Pokpung-Ho include a laser rangefinder, an infrared searchlight and an up-to-date fire control system, according to the publication.

So their tanks are not THAT bad ...even if the frames are old. Kinda like Russia turning T-72s into high tech tanks with modifications...of course they don't have oil to run them... ... unless China or Russia provided it...

This business between north and south korea reminds me of a biblical prophecy; "at the time of the end the king of the south shall push at the king of the north, and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind" Daniel 11 i think.

I found some links that might be of interest, possibly already posted somewhere but:

DPRK's lovely website, operated by the "Korean Friendship Association" of international DPRK supporters. This site is so full of propaganda, it's comical

Official Webpage of The Democratic People's Republic of Korea (DPRK)


The most interesting parts though are in the FAQ section and the forum page.

London 24th November
The UK Korean Friendship Association today issued the following statement.We note with great concern as friends of Korea the serious situation that has arisen as a result of the south Korean puppet provocation on the 23rd of November.

The grave situaton is entirely due to the US imperialists and the south Korean puppets.The news agency Reuters has quoted south Korea as saying that it did indeed “test fire” before the Korean Peoples Army of the DPRK launched a retaliatory artillery barrage,this is an admission of provocation.Any firing in a disputed area at a time of high tension will invietably be treated as hostile and due countermeasures taken.

The U.S., its followers and some bosses of international bodies should drop such bad habit as thoughtlessly accusing somebody before learning about the truth about the incident.
If they shield south Korea, the criminal, without principle, just for being their ally, this is little short of feeding oil to the fire.
The DPRK that sets store by the peace and stability of the Korean Peninsula is now exercising superhuman self-control but the artillery pieces of the army of the DPRK, the defender of justice, remain ready to fire.

www.korea-dpr.com...

I'm fascinated by this kind of perspective coming out of the western world. Though I suppose the idea of pro-DPRK propaganda being spread by people who have nothing to do with Korea at all just sparks my interest. That, and I haven't really seen this side of the story portrayed anywhere, not that I give it much credit regardless.

And that's not the only comical thing I found this evening!
Cracked.com has taken notice of current events on the Korean front

6 Reasons North Korea is the Funniest Evil Dictatorship Ever

And a tumblr page, for Dear Leader himself...I present: Kim Jong-Il Looking at Things

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/b8a891a11060.jpg[/atsimg]
"looking at the kitchen cabinet"

kimjongillookingatthings.tumblr.com...


Enjoy

--Kit.

Yeah NKorea is run by a madman... but which dictator isn't insane in the first place? Mao was having sex with virgin underage girls all day long... not washing or brushing his teeth because it was ``capitalist`` doing so... the NKorea government using fresh dead people to cut them into pieces for the meat to serve as the popular soup content for the next day....

Rights panel to discuss resumption of anti-Pyongyang broadcasts
The North sure won't like that. An attack on those broadcast loudspeakers is probably on the books.

S. Korea eases restriction on industrial transports to N. Korea
Yeah... The SKorean government is taking the North Korea killing of it's civilians REAL SERIOUS uh?

S. Korea names new defense minister
Well now he's been sworn in... just waiting for him to announce the new dates for the drills near the border.

And more insanity from NK :

Rodong Sinmun (#DPRK): "Danger of a war is increasing hour by hour" due to intensified US-Japan-ROK military alliance. #Koreas 18 minutes ago via TweetDeck

Sure...sure.

reply to post by bekod


In response to you thinking something will happen on the 6th, check this out:

The biggest blow will come on Dec. 5, when extended benefits will expire for more than 100,000 people — an unprecedented number.

Interesting syncronity here.

Article here

N. Korea warns against further military drills in tense waters

North Korea on Sunday warned against South Korea's plan to resume fire drills and hold more joint exercises with the United States in waters near their tense western border, saying nobody can predict the consequences of the drills.

More BS by NKorea.

Obama: US-S.Korean alliance 'stronger than ever'

The US-South Korean alliance is "stronger than ever," President Barack Obama said Saturday in the wake a deadly North Korean assault on its southern neighbor.

"At a time in which there are increasing tensions on the Korean peninsula following the North's unprovoked attack on the South Korean people, today we are showing that the defense alliance and partnership of the United States and South Korea is stronger than ever," Obama said.

Yeah...we'll really see how strong that alliance is if war breaks out, lasts for months with no end in sight and when they ask for US troops... We'll see how the American people really think...

As if it matters what the American people think.

Never stopped them before, and the American people never really tried to either.

All we can do is hope it'll be different this time.

So apparently the South Korean exercises near the border will be this week and possibly start as soon as tonight 8PM eastern (Monday morning SKorean time), depending on the weather conditions.


So I've been reading ROK (Republic of Korea-South Korea) Defense White Paper 1995-1996 when I stumbled upon this :

p.43
China's military policy toward the Korean peninsula is geared toward stability and tension reduction, while it maintains a formal alliance with North Korea symbolized by the 1961 Treaty of Friendship, Cooperation, and Mutual Assistance.

China DOES have a military alliance with North Korea... so yeah.

China wants stability, as many said here... and anyone that destroys that stability (US-ROK) with their provocative drills, will piss off China...

EDIT : Another interesting tidbit from the report...
p.49

The era of Kim Jong-Il seems to have begun without any difficulty, given the on-going process of political stabilization in North Korea. Nevertheless, we cannot rule out North Korean military adventurism toward South Korea through it's military superiority, should North Korea fail to arrest economic deterioration, confront difficulties in solving the nuclear issues and improving diplomatic relationships, or face a domestic political crisis.

So here's the 4 points why NKorea could start a war with SKorea.
1- Economic deterioration. (it's worse now than probably at any time)
2- Difficulties in solving the nuclear issues. (No talks...no solving of nuclear issues)
3- Improving diplomatic relationships (Which have been going down the drain a lot since 2006)
4- Face a domestic political crisis (Which is happening now due to regime change)

So yeah... 4/4... chances of war are really high.

N.K. overwhelmingly superior to S. Korea in asymmetrical forces': gov't data

North Korea has an overwhelming edge over South Korea in terms of asymmetrical forces with more than 200,000 special warfare troops, according to South Korean government estimates released in recent days.

Defense Minister Kim Kwan-jin said during his confirmation hearing on Friday that the North's asymmetrical forces such as strategical weapons, submarines and special warfare forces were increasingly becoming a "serious threat" to the South Korean military.

"An additional attack by the North using its asymmetrical strengths is the most serious threat as of now," Kim said.

The North is believed to have about 200,000 special warfare troops while South Korea has only 20,000, according to a recent report by the ministry to the National Assembly.

The North is also believed to have some 150 missiles, about 2,500 to 5,000 tons of chemical weapons agents and the capability of producing five to eight nuclear weapons with 30 to 40 kilograms of plutonium in storage. The South, however, has only 50 missiles and no nuclear or chemical weapons.

Due to its overwhelming inferiority, the South Korean military is depending on its combined forces with the United States to cope with the North's asymmetrical threats, the ministry said.

It also said the military has raised its alert status on cyber warfare readiness, called "Infocon," a notch from fifth to the fourth level, facing growing cyber threats from the North following its artillery attack on a South Korean border island on Nov. 23.

Tension has increased since the shelling of Yeonpyeong Island near the tense border on the Yellow Sea killed two marines and two civilians.

Wonder how a comparison of tanks on either side the DMZ add up because S.Korea added another 200 tanks onto the border region recently.

How can this war be prevented if S.Korea insist on continuing their shelling exercies near the DMZ???!!!

Any new news? I haven't heard anything new lately. South Korea should have acted more swiftly when they were attacked! Someone needs to give kim jong il a good old fashioned ars whipping!

reply to post by luchini33334


Not *really* new, but a few more details:

S. Korea begins naval firing drills around peninsula SEOUL

Dec. 6 (Yonhap) -- South Korea's military on Monday launched live-fire drills in the waters off all three coasts of the Korean Peninsula, renewing its commitment to tougher retaliation against any future provocations by North Korea, officials said.
...
On Sunday, North Korea issued a statement criticizing this week's live-ammunition maneuvers, accusing the South of being "hell-bent on the moves to escalate the confrontation and start a war."

South Korea's new Defense Minister Kim Kwan-jin, who took office on Saturday, repeated his vows of retaliation, saying his military will "take strong measures so that North Korea can't dare to provoke again."

"The naval firing drills started at 29 locations along three coasts as scheduled," a JCS official said on condition of anonymity.
...
The North's Korean Central News Agency (KCNA) on Sunday accused South Korea of planning this week's drills and "rapidly driving the situation on the Korean Peninsula to an uncontrollable extreme phase."

"No one can predict to what extent the situation will deteriorate in the future," the KCNA said.

english.yonhapnews.co.kr...

So hoping that this is more of the usual bantering back and forth.

According to "Yonhap", "Twitter", "Xinhua", and many others sources, "Live Fire"!!! Excersizes are now currently taking place!!!

Hope they pick good targets, and everyone keeps their cool....???

Also "Yonhap" reporting increase in ROK marine forces, as well as PM cancelling Malaysian trip...???

Should be an interesting 24 hrs, keep us up to date everyone...

ROK military ordered to immediately retaliate if attacked again...???

Severe change in rules of engagement!!!

Sounds like the die has been cast, one screw up now by the North, and its on!!!

reply to post by freetree64


What's happening now?

Hello people. I haven't been following this thread closely although I've been following the NK situation via other interfaces.

Anyway, I thought I'd toss up several North Korea-related clips I came across recently. Although these do not deal with current events per se, North Korea watchers might find them of interest.

1) Here is the first part of a short, two-part series on the Korean War. It's a nice visual "Korean War in ten minutes" -style refresher course, so to speak, mostly dealing with the strategic and geopolitical aspects of the war. You can view the second clip from Youtube as of this writing.




2) Here is the first part of a VERY interesting BBC series on US defectors in North Korea. The clip focuses on James Dresnok, a defector still living in North Korea, and includes extensive interviews with him. The series is of interest because most of the limited information on defectors focuses on Jenkins, who left NK a few years ago and now lives in Japan. There has been very little information on the other US defectors, and this goes a long way to rectifying that. The other clips in the series can be accessed via Youtube as of this writing.




3) Here's the first part of a longish and excellent series called "The Korean War in Color." The other clips in the series can be accessed vua Youtube as of this writing.