So, ATS, Pro-Life or Pro-Choice?

reply to post by Hefficide


and you can still condone the killing of a baby? Seriously?

Alright, left to you own conscience hopefully if your ever put to the test... it will bear out with ya....

Originally posted by tspark
reply to post by eNumbra

 

but if you can identify with the Baby being a human being then you would find that you could find a voice to speak with...

You specifically used immediate family as your example.

Comparing an unborn child to John Doe #34789 is not like comparing an unborn child to one's mother or father; and hence it became an emotional appeal that would attempt to circumvent logic with emotion.

reply to post by eNumbra

Originally posted by eNumbra

Originally posted by tspark
reply to post by eNumbra

 

but if you can identify with the Baby being a human being then you would find that you could find a voice to speak with...

You specifically used immediate family as your example.

Comparing an unborn child to John Doe #34789 is not like comparing an unborn child to one's mother or father; and hence it became an emotional appeal that would attempt to circumvent logic with emotion.

More like temper Logic with emotion, not circumvent...

and the same would go with any person on the street that you see.... would you save them or let them be murdered.... Family aside...if you let anyone just be murdered then there are extreme issues

Originally posted by tspark
and the same would go with any person on the street that you see.... would you save them or let them be murdered....

Are they living inside anther human being and dependent on that human being for their survival? If so, then it is that human being's decision to continue to carry them around or not. Not mine.

Being that this is the "Bully Pulpit" forum I refuse to answer simply because I think the idea has no place in politics.

It's a personal decision so why in the hell would you want any sort of law (whether against or in support of) pertaining to a personal opinion?! It's utterly ridiculous.

A MORE IMPORTANT question you should be asking is: "Do you support Nation Building, or would you rather see the money spent in your own country?" Because THAT'S a political issue that effects the entire populous of a country.

[edit on 7-9-2010 by tyranny22]

Pro life is just another way of saying Anti Woman.




Carlin said it best. Take notes, "pro lifers."

Originally posted by tspark
More like temper Logic with emotion, not circumvent...

and the same would go with any person on the street that you see.... would you save them or let them be murdered.... Family aside...if you let anyone just be murdered then there are extreme issues

The problem is that you are still equating a blank slate (unborn child) with a person who has people who may depend on them.

Nobody in their right mind is going to run into an abortion clinic and dive in front of the doctor's tools for their beliefs. Not even you.

As far as the little implication that I have issues for letting people be murdered, I weigh situations and look for the best decision before jumping head long into them.

Such novel times we live in where I can electronically emit my opinions and views upon others via this magical device called the intarweb. Who woulda thought FiOS would be something you woulda bought?

That being said; I am PRO-Don't-give-a-crapper.

reply to post by tyranny22
This is a political issue….

“Other legislation has defined the fetus as a person under fetal homicide or "feticide" laws.

Currently, at least 38 states have fetal homicide laws.

At least 21 states have fetal homicide laws that apply to the earliest stages of pregnancy ("any state of gestation," "conception," "fertilization" or "post-fertilization")”

www.ncsl.org...

To protect the unborn victim…

My question is… it’s homicide to end a mother’s unborn life but it’s okay if the mother chooses to do it herself?

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


The Questions still stands.... don't try to throw responsibility off to someone else

2nd line

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by technical difficulties
I mean, as we all know, the man doesn't do anything like protect the woman, or support her in anyway whatsoever, so why should he have a say?

"protect the woman"? Are you serious? Besides, how many single guys hang around after the girl gets pregnant? How many of them support the woman? Many of them run as fast as they can?

It's simple, just get them to prove that they didn't bail out on them. Now my idea isn't perfect, but it's better than not giving them a say at all.

Why should a man have any say for the fate of a child that he is going to take care of as well?

It would be nice if he could have a say, but it's not like he doesn't know that having sex could lead to pregnancy. He made the choice to give the decision over to the woman when he decided to have sex with her. THAT'S where he has a say. Once he gives that up, unfortunately, he no longer has control. But it's not like the guy is an innocent victim of the situation. He knew what could happen.

The problem with your statement is that Pro-lifers can say the same thing about women, so it's really not a valid argument.

Originally posted by eNumbra

Originally posted by tspark
More like temper Logic with emotion, not circumvent...

and the same would go with any person on the street that you see.... would you save them or let them be murdered.... Family aside...if you let anyone just be murdered then there are extreme issues

The problem is that you are still equating a blank slate (unborn child) with a person who has people who may depend on them.

Nobody in their right mind is going to run into an abortion clinic and dive in front of the doctor's tools for their beliefs. Not even you.

As far as the little implication that I have issues for letting people be murdered, I weigh situations and look for the best decision before jumping head long into them.

the "you" was general....not pointed at you...i'm equating life for life you can see this right? the person who takes a pro-choice stance ...male or female must be made to equate the unborn baby with real life, living people... else they are able to see it as an abstract form...easier to marginalize...especially for men...the woman should have a harder time due to the fact they are carrying the baby...

Originally posted by OceanStone
reply to post by tyranny22

 

This is a political issue….

“Other legislation has defined the fetus as a person under fetal homicide or "feticide" laws.

Currently, at least 38 states have fetal homicide laws.

At least 21 states have fetal homicide laws that apply to the earliest stages of pregnancy ("any state of gestation," "conception," "fertilization" or "post-fertilization")”

www.ncsl.org...

To protect the unborn victim…

My question is… it’s homicide to end a mother’s unborn life but it’s okay if the mother chooses to do it herself?

This law - woman who do not want one are legally protected from having one forced upon them.

Women who choose to have an abortion are legally free to do so. It still quite effectively protects the reproductive rights of all women. Fetus is still not a person despite ruling. Fetus is distinguished from human being. At no time was the legal status of a fetus changed in any way by this verdict.

Fetal homicide laws in general contain clauses that specifically exclude consideration of:

- Abortion procedures,

- Medical treatment, such as the removal of a uterine cancer or termination of a ectopic pregnancy which kills the embryo or fetus as an unintended side-effect, or

- Any action by the mother herself.

I am pro-death

Death sentence, eugentics, war, abortion - these all do the same thing and its to kill someone. Can't be for one and not the other or you are a hypocrite.

Pro-life or Pro-Choice? or did you mean - Pro-Life or Pro-Death? or, Pro-Choice or No-choice? i find the wording is suggestive and biased. Shouldn't the question be Pro-is a fetus a separate human being, or Pro-is a fetus merely an aspect of a woman's body?

Because of the way the phrase has been established in our culture it presumes that Pro-Choice equals the death of a human being, and not the removal of part of a woman's body which potentionally could become a human being...

I can honestly say I can care less,the abortion issue is just window dressing to me just one more thing to divide people with...

Originally posted by tspark
Would you stand by and let your mother or father be brutally murdered..sister brother..... its the same...instead of a baby that you don't know put someone you do in its place.... now would you have a say so?

Just curious at what point does zygote embryo or fetus deserve the same rights as a neonate? Do you know how many "babies" are killed in IVF treatment? Whay aren't pro-lifers picketing outside IVF clinics?

Originally posted by TokiTheDestroyer
So, ATS, Pro-Life or Pro-Choice?

[edit on 9/7/10 by TokiTheDestroyer]

Said it before..I'll say it again...BOTH! Who is "anti-life" anyways?

False choice/false semantics.

Sidenote...Got a call last week asking the same question...from "the political call center" in AZ according to my caller ID. They said they were conducting a poll. I said I am Pro-Choice...and I was about to say "Pro-Life" also...but the pollster hung-up on me when he heard "Pro-Choice".

Frustrated that an obviously BS skewed Poll was being done. I googled them and found out that they are a GOP pollster center....can't wait to see that survey making the rounds

reply to post by TokiTheDestroyer


This isn't a hard choice. If you play, you pay. It's as simple as that. If a woman goes out and gets pregnant without using a contraceptive, then she should own up to the pregnancy.

The only case is if the woman was raped, then that's a different story. She could have had serious damage done to her female anatomy, which could be detrimental to the baby's safety and/or her, thus giving her the option to abort.

I am PRO CHOICE!

I am also Child FREE By Choice.

And let me tell you - even *choosing* (via birth control and/or abstinence) not to have kids riles up alot of people. Really gets them frothing at the mouth!

I hear it all the time: "WHY aren't you married? WHY don't you have kids?"

Um - because I don't want to.

It drives people NUTS! I think because they are jealous. And it never occurred to them that they COULD live as they chose. They bought the MSM and religious Breeding Propaganda and its too late for them so they want to see everyone else just as miserable as they are.

There's nothing more irritating to The Famblee Values Set then a hot blonde with her own money living large, answering to no one, having her own nice home, and driving a rare $60K Benz sportscar. Oh no no no - females like me need to be overweight hags living off the beneficence of their husband in some particle board suburban crapshack and driving a beat up mini van just like them.

To me - "Pro Life" means - "Justify my boring breeder life by being miserable just like me."

No thanks. I'll stick with my CF lifestyle. And the honest parents out there will agree - go read any 'parents' chat board and you'll see numerous posts regretting the children and wishing they'd stayed Child Free. As well as general depression, alcohol and drug abuse, and suicidal tendencies. This is ALL you see on the parents chat boards - It's rare to see a "Mom" who is actually happy. Google such sites and see for yourself.

I have some (not serious) health issues that would necessitate me having an abortion should I become pregnant. But I don't even want to play that card. I'm all about CHOICE plain and simple.

Not to mention that the world is dangerously overpopulated as it is.

Young People - you have a CHOICE! as to how you will live! Be wary of anything the TV tells you to do. Make up your own mind. Have kids because you WANT to! Not because someone else strong armed you into it!

More and more people are going CF - it's a much easier and happier lifestyle.

Remember to be safe with sex also. To prevent pregnancy as well as STDs.

SeventhSeal - LOVE the George Carlin video! SPOT ON!!!