8.28.10 - Celebrate the Dream, Reject the Nightmare

Originally posted by Mak Manto

"'Sir, prove to me that you are not working with our enemies.' And I know you're not. I'm not accusing you of being an enemy, but that's the way I feel."

Thats a question many have and considering Islam the way it is and its confilcts with christianity give Beck a star for being up front and not hidding behind a mask.

What concerns me about the likes of Beck an co. is the way they are able to spout incitements to racial and religious hatred via asking questions and framing their comments in the 'just the way I feel' manner. Does anybody else think this is a little dangerous?

reply to post by LarryLove


I dont and Beck wouldnt bother if he knew that muslims are allowed to hide thier true feelings in these matters by way of taqiyya.


[edit on 28-8-2010 by Logarock]

reply to post by Basilis


there are some of us "older" and "wiser" people who havent posted in this thread because there is no point.

because of the futiliy of it all.

what does posting in a thread actually change?

people who want to hate they will
people who defend will


for people talking about martin luther king and if he actually read this thread and other threads. im pretty sure he would shake his head in disgust and say a prayer for us all.


theres an old saying if i knew what i know now when i was "18"

when i was 18 i thought i knew it all like every other 18 year old.

but a piece of advice listen to what older people say well some of us

we may not always be right be we all have something you dont have expierence and wisdom.

there will come a day when you will see the truth of that comment.

just my humble opinion:p

[edit on 28-8-2010 by neo96]

Originally posted by Mak Manto

Originally posted by Logarock

Originally posted by eNumbra

Originally posted by DocEmrick
but comparing him to Glenn Beck is like comparing a Lexus to a Kia.

[edit on 27-8-2010 by DocEmrick]

I believe that's exactly the point being made.

Beck plays some big American hero fighting for the people when history teaches us that he's simply a jester.

And so King is was what them.....a complicated philanderer? A noble philanderer?

You can think whatever you want of what King was, but Glenn Beck has stated he's nothing more then an entertainer, a rodeo clown.

He's stated that, himself, so he shouldn't be taken seriously.

Well no I would not toss King out on these grounds....just saying that for the op its kind of hard to toss stones sometimes.

As far a Beck he does efface himself more than he should its boring.

That's a question many have and considering Islam the way it is and its conflicts with Christianity give Beck a star for being up front and not hiding behind a mask.

Christianity is of the same vein. Christianity has its terrorists, just like Islam does. I've never heard Beck asking a Christian politician if they're working with the Army of God...

It's bigoted, my friend.

reply to post by Basilis

Now this doesn't come from just the Glen Beck haters on here, this goes to all of you. As a 18 year old, I never had a hand in creating what state this country is in, and all you can do is bicker about who's kinda right, or sorta wrong, while it crumbles! Am I the only one who sees how ironic this is? You're arguing against hate while using hate, which creates more hate that fuels the downfall of this country.

and you are awesome, someone must have raised you right, the old farts on this forum can learn a lot from you,

TY, have a nice day.

Originally posted by Mak Manto

No, partisanship is for people who long to see the nation divided along party lines. That's sort of the whole point of 'partisanship'.

I'm talking about real partisanship. Yes, the partisanship you reference is towards political divisions within the country's parties.

But constitutional rights, something Glenn Beck goes on about, is not something you can fight against. Partisanship, in this case, is towards bettering it for all Americans.

What then, in your view, is "real partisanship"? I take it that you believe that dividing along party lines is some sort of "fake partisanship", but you neglect to inform as to your notion of "real" partisanship.

Just saying "bettering it towards all Americans" is what BOTH sides claim, and lacks the defining core of what makes that 'partisan'.

Well now, you may be on to something there! Examples, please. Presenting facts on which to base your opinions may well be enough to sway me!

Well, for starters, how about the recent mosque issue? Glenn Beck says he believes wholeheartedly in the Constitution, and freedom of religion is guaranteed.

And you don't?

If you DO, what has Beck done that is against that stance?

See, that's what I mean by 'examples' as opposed to 'charges'. You've here made a charge, without providing an example of how you think a violation has occurred.

Or how about when he had Keith Ellison on, the first Muslim to ever be elected to Congress, and he said to Congressman Ellison:

"'Sir, prove to me that you are not working with our enemies.' And I know you're not. I'm not accusing you of being an enemy, but that's the way I feel."

Indeed, what ABOUT that? What there supports your premise?

Originally posted by Mak Manto

That's a question many have and considering Islam the way it is and its conflicts with Christianity give Beck a star for being up front and not hiding behind a mask.

Christianity is of the same vein. Christianity has its terrorists, just like Islam does. I've never heard Beck asking a Christian politician if they're working with the Army of God...

It's bigoted, my friend.

Using the Army of God and what their one (1) famous case hardy supports your statement considering all of the thousands killed of late by Islamic nuts and their hundreds of cases. As well it hardly puts christanity to the question. A better fit would be if Glenn asked the pope if the church supported polygamy just because some sects of the Mormons still do it.....even if the pope doesnt consider the mormons part of the real church.

The truth about the terrorist sort of muslims is that they are not obscure sects but main stream groups struggling for top position, killing each other by the bus load, or killing the reprobate non muslims. And there are some sects of Islam that they dont consider real muslims as well.

reply to post by Stormdancer777



Not to sound like Steven Colbert but in times like these we are better off tossing tomatos than holding hands and singing kumbaya.

Originally posted by General.Lee
reply to post by tspark

 

Amen...

I have yet to find fault with Glenn's message. He presents facts and quotes his sources. I really don't get all the hate. He is a patriot and loves his country and he is clearly distraught over the direction it is taking. How can anybody find fault with that?

And for those of you who post quotes of a pretend "news man" from a comedy channel...please. Are you serious? I can't take Jon Stewart any more serious than I would Bill Maher or Tina Fey. How you can link to a "source" such as Comedy Central is beyond words. No wonder we ended up with such a loser for a president...one only has to look at our voter base.

[edit on 28-8-2010 by General.Lee]

Then you're not fact checking, and the "loser" president is no such thing, the last one, yes, this one, no, he's battling Republican schmucks who make demands and then still say no to everything. Duly elected, he's the president, unless you want to disregard the constitution and the way the founding fathers set up our electoral system.
Hypocrite.

reply to post by nenothtu


Dude, you're not listening. Plenty of people on here have given legitimate reasons why Glenn Beck is not to be taken seriously. I don't remember calling names myself, but maybe I did, however, it seems to me that the Tea Partiers are the ones who like to call names like "socialist" "commies"
"liberal scum"...shall I go on? I'm pretty sure it was the Bush disciples who perpetuated the idea that conservative= patriot, liberal=terrorist sympathizer. Again, hypocracy.

Originally posted by SevenThunders
Thank God for Glenn Beck who is finally telling it like it is. Frankly I ignore all things related to King, since he represents evil to me.

You can't be serious. Jesus would kick his rear out of the temple with the rest of the money changers. Generation of vipers, man, generation of vipers.

Originally posted by OneNationUnder
OMG, sad, sad individual you are. It's not about the day, it's about the message on that day.

"You will see something on Saturday that has not happened in America for 228 years."

What would that message be? Forget MLK, his little stunt was nothing?

Originally posted by Logarock
Using the Army of God and what their one (1) famous case hardy supports your statement considering all of the thousands killed of late by Islamic nuts and their hundreds of cases.

There are plenty of other Christian terrorists out there but if you like, how about we go with Irish politicians? Are they all to be presumed terrorists? Are there not several nations in the world that have been terrorized by whites of European decent? We better ask them all that too? Hmmm, come to think of it, either example above involves Christians. All Christians and all Muslims and all white people and all Irish, or any other European heritage are all the be asked if they are working with terrorists from now on.

What then, in your view, is "real partisanship"? I take it that you believe that dividing along party lines is some sort of "fake partisanship", but you neglect to inform as to your notion of "real" partisanship. Just saying "bettering it towards all Americans" is what BOTH sides claim, and lacks the defining core of what makes that 'partisan'.

Constitutional rights is real partisanship. Supporting those rights for all Americans is real partisanship.

And you don't? If you DO, what has Beck done that is against that stance? See, that's what I mean by 'examples' as opposed to 'charges'. You've here made a charge, without providing an example of how you think a violation has occurred.

I do believe in it. Glenn Beck, though, doesn't. He can't believe that only churches or synagogues can be built there and that mosques can't BECAUSE IT'S RELATED TO ISLAM.

If he says that he believes in the constitution, then he believes in freedom of religion, and property rights, both of which allows Muslims to build there.

Indeed, what ABOUT that? What there supports your premise?

Why did Beck have to ask Keith Ellison to prove he's not working with Islamic terrorists? Is it because he's a Muslim, and to Beck, all Muslims are either terrorists or are working with terrorists?

It's bigoted...

Originally posted by Logarock

Originally posted by Mak Manto

That's a question many have and considering Islam the way it is and its conflicts with Christianity give Beck a star for being up front and not hiding behind a mask.

Christianity is of the same vein. Christianity has its terrorists, just like Islam does. I've never heard Beck asking a Christian politician if they're working with the Army of God...

It's bigoted, my friend.

Using the Army of God and what their one (1) famous case hardy supports your statement considering all of the thousands killed of late by Islamic nuts and their hundreds of cases. As well it hardly puts christanity to the question. A better fit would be if Glenn asked the pope if the church supported polygamy just because some sects of the Mormons still do it.....even if the pope doesnt consider the mormons part of the real church.

The truth about the terrorist sort of muslims is that they are not obscure sects but main stream groups struggling for top position, killing each other by the bus load, or killing the reprobate non muslims. And there are some sects of Islam that they dont consider real muslims as well.

Then go to a country, logarock, where certain freedoms are limited to certain people...

If you want to cheer on Glenn Beck who says America is the greatest country of all time, that we give so many freedoms that so many countries don't, fine by me.

BUT YOU STICK BY WHAT YOU SAY. You can't say you hold the same thoughts as the Founding Fathers, that you believe in the Constitution, and then say you don't want Muslims to be able to build a mosque, or that homosexuals shouldn't have certain rights.

Originally posted by staver
reply to post by nenothtu

 

Dude, you're not listening. Plenty of people on here have given legitimate reasons why Glenn Beck is not to be taken seriously. I don't remember calling names myself, but maybe I did, however, it seems to me that the Tea Partiers are the ones who like to call names like "socialist" "commies"
"liberal scum"...shall I go on? I'm pretty sure it was the Bush disciples who perpetuated the idea that conservative= patriot, liberal=terrorist sympathizer. Again, hypocracy.

Taking a man seriously is a different thing than trashing his character for the sake of partisan bickering. I don't really care whether anyone takes him seriously or not, but perpetuating the divide via character assassination of your opposition is another thing altogether.

If one has a beef with the message, then it's up for debate. What I'm seeing is a lot of unsupported attacks on the messenger, and that just perpetuates the divide, which I suppose to you, given your own partisan rant ( "Tea Partiers","socialist", "commies", "liberal scum", "Bush disciples") , is a GOOD thing, eh?

Please, by all means, keep demonizing your opposition, rather than debating their message. Keep on strengthening that divide. As a man once said who both sides claim to revere: "United we stand, divided we fall."
Go for it.

When it all comes crashing down, I'll be hiding in the weeds, watching.

Taking a man seriously is a different thing than trashing his character for the sake of partisan bickering. I don't really care whether anyone takes him seriously or not, but perpetuating the divide via character assassination of your opposition is another thing altogether.

I don't consider it character assassination. It's not like the examples I put up were of me interpreting a situation like he does, and then goes on about Obama's a socialist, or a commie, or a perverted Christian...

My examples come FROM THE MOUTH of Glenn Beck. He says these things that makes me not take him serious.

Originally posted by Mak Manto
Constitutional rights is real partisanship. Supporting those rights for all Americans is real partisanship.

Constitutional Rights is an issue, not partisanship. Partisanship implies that there is another party, one who expressly says, in your example, that Constitutional rights don't exist.

I do believe in it. Glenn Beck, though, doesn't. He can't believe that only churches or synagogues can be built there and that mosques can't BECAUSE IT'S RELATED TO ISLAM.

If he says that he believes in the constitution, then he believes in freedom of religion, and property rights, both of which allows Muslims to build there.

Glen Beck has said that Constitutional rights don't exist? I don't watch the man, so I have to take your word for it. I'll try and get somewhere that I can watch him, though, to verify that for myself. If he said it once, he's bound to say it again some time. It would be easier and less time consuming if you could provide a source for that statement, a quote, but I'll do the legwork myself if I have to.

Why did Beck have to ask Keith Ellison to prove he's not working with Islamic terrorists? Is it because he's a Muslim, and to Beck, all Muslims are either terrorists or are working with terrorists?

It's bigoted...

So he's a bigot now, rather than an interviewer in this circumstance. Might it be that there were questions pertaining to Ellison's loyalty in the minds of many folks, and Beck was seeking an outright statement to refute those questions?

No, of course not. Bigots don't help their perceived opposites out that way, do they?

I seem to recall a lot of doubts surrounding Ellison's election, as I had to explain to several folks that time would tell, and they were convicting before a trial.

Maybe I just misremember...