Welcome to the Unpossible Future... The AGI Manhattan Project

reply to post by SaturnFX


I know : and YOU and kurzweil are WRONG

the prediction is build upon processor

not upon QUANTUM processor ... if you don't know something : you should learn before opening your mouth : or else you don't think and you just repeat what a guy said.

And for the comparison :
Why do you think kurzweil write his new book ?

because we are at the singularity.

reply to post by SaturnFX


1) dialectic

2) dialectic

People decide what they want : the world is complex : if they want a burger with no cheese : this is there problem : but it IS possible.

Is it better that your own vision of totalitarism : yes they choose so , but geek don't choose : they say YES : I want every kind of technology

reply to post by psychederic


I agree psychederic, there is hope for humanity. The only hope is to move away from this monetary system we live in, and are controlled by. I have recently discovered The Venus Project and it goals and statutes. More so than ever we are moving towards a total meltdown of everything. Our only hope is to find another way, please check out this link, www.thezeitgeistmovement.com and understand that I, a father of two, a husband, a son and brother want only what is going to unite all of humanity in the attempts for a better tomorrow.

There is no one way to do it alone, we must all join hands, and look towards our future, count our blessings, and correct our shortcomings, the megacomputers wont do that for us!

www.thezeitgeistmovement.com
www.youtube.com...

one of the few threads I deem worthy to post in:

Babylon will fall, it has in the past, it will again. They will not succeed, pure and simple I KNOW this, for we are tied to the biosphere, wither now or in a thousand years time I can see ahead and know the global systems WILL break down, for they need our nurturing caring compassion and understanding, not some malfeasance idea that we have control over the hand of the father.

We all have to go home, to not deny this, death is but a beginning of a beginning, I guess TPTB do not understand this.

Originally posted by psychederic
reply to post by SaturnFX

 

Sorry you are Wrong : you will learn that a biological corpse run with less energy :

fully disagree here, consider how much energy goes into growing enough food for a single person to live on...we are talking months of sunlight hitting a plant for it to grow to produce the vegetation needed to have a zero sum day...this is a incredible amount of energy over a long period of time...not to mention the requirements of water and the energy required to make that process continue.
If you eat meat, then your daily enegy requirement source goes through the roof...we are a incredibly ineffective and ineffecient machine...if we could eat say, a single grape a day and live perfectly fine, you might have a point...
Now, counter that with if we were able to get our energy through solar or wind power...suddenly we become perfect efficient machines, not needing 200 previous steps to convert the energy to the form we need but going directly to the source.

a biological body will be better for a lot of thing.

And one more little thing : only a biological body will give enough sensor for a human mind.

... or you want to live in a computer : ok ... then read accelerando, from stross

[edit on 15-7-2010 by psychederic]

We DO live in a computer, one made of biochemical materials and limited senses...no, sorry, but my little digital camera has FAR more ability than my eyes...this right here invalidates your argument about your sensor chat...a robotic or electronic body will be -far- more advanced than any million year old clunker design we are currently dealing with.

There is no way to stop the 'beast' because we don't know who is at the top - who's running things... we can't cut off the head of the beast because we don't know where to find it. All we do is chop away at the appendages which keep growing back.

Actually, all we do is talk about cutting off the appendages while the beast grows and grows.

Originally posted by IntelligenceGathering
one of the few threads I deem worthy to post in:

Babylon will fall, it has in the past, it will again. .

Babylon never falls, it just gets a name change time and time again...Babylon has been going on since the dawning of civilization and simply grows in power age after age in different guises.

reply to post by SaturnFX


You're right! I forgot to examine the ripple effects of the technology as a whole. Seems your avatar is appropriate. Forgive my occasional bout of shortsightedness. I think we will still have biological bodies to some degree though? Even if it were mostly electronic.

Originally posted by 3cnkeepif2rded
I agree psychederic, there is hope for humanity. The only hope is to move away from this monetary system we live in, and are controlled by. I have recently discovered The Venus Project and it goals and statutes. More so than ever we are moving towards a total meltdown of everything. Our only hope is to find another way, please check out this link, www.thezeitgeistmovement.com and understand that I, a father of two, a husband, a son and brother want only what is going to unite all of humanity in the attempts for a better tomorrow.

There is no one way to do it alone, we must all join hands, and look towards our future, count our blessings, and correct our shortcomings, the megacomputers wont do that for us!

I disagree. ZM calls for AGI to run the worlds 'political' system, and globally dictate rationing of the worlds resources. They want to hand over dictatorial control of the entire planet to The Machine. This is a key reason why ZM/VP (ZP) are my arch nemesis. They serve as a devious subversive indoctrination campaign to condition people into loving The Machine that the 'NWO' is already building.


Zeitgeist Movement = most hardcore NWO propaganda ever.

It was a good thing for them they banned for from their forums for challenging them on those points.

[edit on 15-7-2010 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

btw saturn, In my humble opinion I disagree, if there was anything more efficient than i believe we WOULD be that "thing."

We where given our ability to create technology in it's many forms and functions TO reduce the required energy to grow food, harvest crops, ect. You are correct that the human body requires an amazing amount of time/energy kilojoules, whatever to live, we cannot live off a single grape (that Indian guy who says he has never eaten in 30 years must be the minority.)

Honesty I am calling you out for what you are, somebody who is in favor of the technocrats. I hope your filthy rich or connected, otherwise you'll be exterminated via the ultimate discrimination with the rest of us, no eternal life in a metal husk or on a silicon chip for YOU!

There is no improving upon man until we attain a new level of conciousness, one that steers us away from this topsy-turvy world we have allowed to be built up around that, I firmly believe that, please feel free to CALL me out on my ideological holier than thou principles.

Excellent thread. This is something I have been researching for a very long time.

To those who think that transhumanism is the great next step on the evolutionary ladder, I say be careful. I don't want to live forever. I don't want to become more than human. I wouldn't accept it if it gave me my youth and vitality back. I will be one of the useless eaters that is exterminated for the greater good. But you go ahead and eat the fruit, you will not die but you'll be like the gods! That is until the AI realizes that humanity in whatever form it takes is the problem. Hope by then you have some cheetah genes spliced into that transhuman body.

reply to post by IgnoranceIsntBlisss


Are those things you really think you deserve... or a good father or mother would do to a child?

Your delusions would make a good movie.... but are not based in any logic or understanding.

Originally posted by IntelligenceGathering
btw saturn, In my humble opinion I disagree, if there was anything more efficient than i believe we WOULD be that "thing."

Correct, and thats the point...we will be...we are evolving, no matter how weird you think the concept of intentional mechanical evolution may be, it is actually a natural process of upgrading...we are a animal that continues to evolve to its surroundings, the move to a mechanical/electrical system is just as natural as going from furry animal to less furry adaptation, or from a jelly body to a hardened exoskeleton. I see technology as a perfectly natural aspect of society.

Really take a moment to consider the vast energy it takes to run us, the source is the sun, but it has to go through tons of processes to finally get to us in energy...as a really basic example, imagine if we could just install solar panels in our skin and gave us direct energy...this is just a example, not a real theory, but it gets the point across...you would save the energy of the sun growing the plant, the energy picking the fruit from the plant, the eating and digesting, etc...endless energy loss...but go out for 10 minutes a day in the sun and voila, you are good for the day

We are evolving...we are our own designers now...instead of a half million years of natural adaptation, we will accomplish adaptation to new environments overnight...hell, we may one day live perfectly fine on the surface of mars with no terraforming required once we "upgrade" our system to get energy directly from the sun or the many other places energy can be harnessed.


incidently, I love these types of threads...really

This video by my new collaborators over at TransAlchemy shows the latest in 3D gaming trends.

It shows a Sony spokesman delivering a charismatic sermon...
"deep down inside we all serve one master, one king, and His name is GAMING, FOREVER MAY HE REIGN"!





[edit on 15-7-2010 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

Originally posted by darkelf
Excellent thread. This is something I have been researching for a very long time.

To those who think that transhumanism is the great next step on the evolutionary ladder, I say be careful. I don't want to live forever. I don't want to become more than human. I wouldn't accept it if it gave me my youth and vitality back. I will be one of the useless eaters that is exterminated for the greater good. But you go ahead and eat the fruit, you will not die but you'll be like the gods! That is until the AI realizes that humanity in whatever form it takes is the problem. Hope by then you have some cheetah genes spliced into that transhuman body.

-sighs-

WE will be the AI...its not about creating a new lifeform...its about upgrading our body.
Will there be some wild AI? for sure...but we will always keep it in context of where we are...they will always have sticks to our guns so to speak.
all we do always ends up serving us...you think that when we create a superintelligence, 4 seconds later it wont be slapped into our system? heh...
The transhumanist thinking is not about creating a perfect robot, its about striving for evolving our species to the next step.

As far as remaining amish...that is perfectly fine...do what you want...even the most cutting edge transhumanist likes to go camping now and again...such quaint luddie villages will no doubt be great vacation spots away from "the grid".

Originally posted by Wertdagf
Are those things you really think you deserve... or a good father or mother would do to a child?

Your delusions would make a good movie.... but are not based in any logic or understanding.

You should maybe listen to the people building the AGI. Even they all admit there's no guarantees we wont be exterminated, and basically concede that we'll have to merge with them to have any true hope of not being stomped out.

You're going to have to explain how I'm deluded, rather than just stating that I am, otherwise that shows you to be deluded.

Originally posted by IntelligenceGathering
Honesty I am calling you out for what you are, somebody who is in favor of the technocrats. I hope your filthy rich or connected, otherwise you'll be exterminated via the ultimate discrimination with the rest of us, no eternal life in a metal husk or on a silicon chip for YOU!

Yes, I am a technocrat...I am in full favor and hope for a technocracy as defined....given what we have now verses what could be, a technocracy is far better than democracy

Technocracy is a hypothetical form of government in which engineers, scientists, and other technical experts are in control of decision making in their respective fields. The term technocracy derives from the Greek words tekhne meaning skill and kratos meaning power, as in government, or rule. Thus the term technocracy denotes a system of government where those who have knowledge, expertise or skills compose the governing body. In a technocracy decision makers would be selected based upon how highly knowledgeable they are, rather than how much political capital they hold.

As far as the whole if your not rich, your gonna be slaughtered...well, thats just your pessimistic view of your own self worth...after all, who would want -you- around.

The only thing that we have to fear is secrecy...and the only reason to keep things secrets is fear of luddie sabotage...so, the only thing to fear are the ones trying to stop progress by default because progress is what will happen naturally...those trying to stop it are disrupting a natural progress and creating more damage than they are pointing out.
I have discussed the "gray goo" issues 15 years ago...what is the gray goo issue? you probably dont know, but in 10-20 years from now, mainstream will hear of it and flip out completely by ignorance, thinking they are the first ones to think of it and start bombing facilities that have long since gotten past the issue.

Technology is the field equalizer...we are aware of the problems on earth because of progression of technology informing us and empowering the people...so who would be the ones that want the technology that is day by day waking people up to the corruption of the world...it is of course those whom thrive on secrecy. The more you talk about how the tech must be stopped, or we must abandon all our gadgets, the more you scream for the old system of hidden abuse and mass control to remain the norm.

Freedom through evolution.

wow could you spell it out more for us who you work for saturn 2.0, seriously.

Any case I eluded to this earlier, we will not evolve like this, pure and simply, more is at foot than this, we will evolve in our minds and hearts, not in this unsustainable and frankly diseased way. Technology can only take us so far, I firmly believe that.

Mankind always uses technology for military applications first and foremost, if we where meant to be immortal in this physical shell, I believe we would, pure and simple.

This is not to say that I don't believe we should always reach, learn and understand. But the way we do it is to destroy, conquer, rape, pillage, and stomp over. There is very little true knowledge of understanding in the systems that are attempting to drive us into dark ages 2.0.

I believe we will evolve inside ourselves, through looking within, not outside at technology and its military applications and social media (aka intelligence gathering, operations.)

I see what you mean by saying that this MUST be the next step in human evolution, in attempting to improve upon "god's" design, but I call foul play. I believe this to be the ultimate perversion, the ultimate doom of man. To take away what makes us as special and unique as each individual snowflake is to die while still live. We are meant to evolve not as terminators and t1000's with transistors, batteries, and quantum computers, but as being of life leaving this three-dimensional shell for the next phase of existence.

To improve upon god's design in this way is only going to further the illusion of separation, this illusion that the spirit within hold's no sway over our physical shell. The next phase of human evolution MUST be of spirit, into the unseen world made flesh and blood before you, as you yourself ARE.

reply to post by IgnoranceIsntBlisss


What connection can you draw between an infinite intelligence and poor african people who raise chickens in huge farms? Your flashing videos of things that anyone with more than just a human perspective would understand as an inefficient and dangerous way to treat life.

Your comparisons and the examples in your head are absolutly ignorant.

Originally posted by SaturnFX

Originally posted by unityemissions

Oh my, you're actually putting technology up over philosophy!


[edit on 15-7-2010 by unityemissions]

No, I said philosophical issues can be resolved through technological progression...making the initial philosophcial issue invalid.

Uh, how is this not elevating technological progression over philosophical issues?

This most certainly stems from a lack of human spirit.

It's not if we can, it's if we should.