NASA Flight Director Confirms 9/11 Aircraft Speed As The "Elephant In The Room"

Originally posted by dubiousone

Originally posted by hooper
reply to post by TiffanyInLA

 

Well, of course I can not speak for my "Tricky" friend but I can say, again, thanks for your opinion!

By the way, if I tell them I know you can I get a little discount on the evidence that the United States government conspired to commit 3000 acts of first degree murder of its own citizens? $15.95 is a little steep for a DVD!

Is that a failed attempt at humor or did you just prove beyond any doubt that you have nothing worth hearing to say on this thread?

First, I am just asking questions. Second, no humor. This whole thread is basically spam to move traffic over to another webiste and sell DVD's. Why do you think the OP keeps linking to the website when it would be just as easy and clearer to just cut and paste the material?

Originally posted by Snarf
so if it's not a rocket, it's thermite

if it's not thermite, it's a hologram

if it's not a hologram, it's a radio controlled airplane

if it's not that, then we call into question the speed of the aircraft?

You people never give up, do you?

No matter how many times you're proven wrong...you just keep on going.

LOL yep. Did you read the OP report? NOW they're starting to argue over the density of air at sea level. This is going way, WAY past "inquisitive" and heading straight for, "fanatic".

Am I the only person to notice that if their blind zealotry to link 9/11 to a conspiracy...any conspiracy at all, apparently, just as long as there is one...was against an individual rather than the gov't, it would be considered railroading?

Originally posted by hdutton
I frankly find it amazing how "the official story" continues to fall apart as more and more logic is applied to the evidence.

I know there are "safe operating limits" in place for these craft. That does not mean these limits can't be exceeded, it simply means not many sane people would push beyond them.

However, just what are the operating limits of a human beings while preforming some of the manuevers done that day. Even trained pilots have trouble with "G" forces within the range which these planes experienced.

I can't figure out how a person can fly a plane while their eyeballs bounce around in their heads or after they black out.

The reason why they cover it up is because if people knew the Israelis were behind it people would freak.

reply to post by GoodOlDave


ahh as the screen name states is good ol' dave. Still a sucker born every minute who keeps on believing the official story.

Originally posted by hooper
Oh, and by the way, on the little homemade diagram you posted the redzone is labeled "structural failure" and on the little diagrams you just linked to the redzones are labeled "structural damage or failure". Care to comment on that edit?

It's good to see you finally clicked the link. Only took what, 5 attempts to post it for you?

The reason it says that is because they are using a generic V-G Diagram for purposes of training primary students. You would know this if you watched the video.

Notice how their generic diagrams omit the "Structural Damage" zone above and below the envelope, but its defined in this envelope.



The above is the original V-G diagram I posted on page 1 before inputting the 767-200 speeds. It is for a specific aircraft. The envelope is more defined.

I then took the above envelope and input the speeds with the same airspeed definitions for the 767-200, into it's respective speed zone. It was a rough sketch to give you an idea since it was clear you weren't able to comprehend the various airspeed definitions without me drawing a picture for you.

I tried to explain this to you here,

www.abovetopsecret.com...

But as usual, I need to repeat myself.

Pilots For 9/11 Truth themselves say they are trying to get Wind tunnel data and V-G diagrams from Boeing specifically for the 767-200. This was posted on page 1. They have been hitting brick walls. But still trying.

Since you guys keep avoiding my questions, it is moot to answer them at this point as your posts demonstrate you have zero aviation knowledge or flight time/training. I can now see why you continually evaded such questions.

Originally posted by hooper
First, I am just asking questions. Second, no humor. This whole thread is basically spam to move traffic over to another webiste and sell DVD's. Why do you think the OP keeps linking to the website when it would be just as easy and clearer to just cut and paste the material?

Why does the OP repeatedly link to videos streaming free on the web of the same analysis on the DVD's, if the OP was here to sell the DVD's?

Pandora's Black Box - Chapter Two, Flight Of American 77
pilotsfor911truth.org...

Flight Of United 93 Now On Google Video, Pandora's Black Box - Chapter Three
pilotsfor911truth.org...

9/11: Attack On The Pentagon - Official Release, Full Film Now Available to the Public on Google
pilotsfor911truth.org...

9/11: The North Flight Path (official Release), Aerodynamically Possible - Witness Compatible
pilotsfor911truth.org...

Full Film - 9/11: World Trade Center Attack, Embedded and Streaming here!
pilotsfor911truth.org...

Keep bringing this strawman up every other page hooper/tricky/trebor, I'll just keep posting the free links and prove your real agenda. that you can't debate the facts so you claim there is some ulterior motive for the OP.

Isn't it counter productive to post free streaming video if you're trying to sell the DVD?

Hmmm, don't bake your noodle too much thinking about that one.



[edit on 12-7-2010 by TiffanyInLA]

i guess you people can't just 'agree to disagree'

the emotional investment here is just off the chart (or VG diagram i guess).

thanks for starting this thread.

I work this guy who is convinced that the moon landing footage is FAKE but the 911 story is the real deal... a bunch of crazy's highjack planes and fly them into things he tells me. I say man how can you belive that the moon landing is fake but 911 is real? If the moon landing is fake then everything you have ever been told is a lie. For me the "ELEPHANT in the room is the PENTAGON. Were is the debri on the lawn, were are the bodies, were are the engins, were are the seats, were are the wings????? Even if the plane crashed into the pentagon WERE IS THE DEBRI in the 1st photos of the crash. And im sorry but I just dont belive that the "PENTAGON" has no anti aircraft defense and the only video that we are fead is the 3 sec time lapsed guard shack video PLEASE. Also no windows are blown out and how convenient that the side that was hit was under constuction and no one was working on those floors. THE PENTAGON IS THE SMOKING GUN.

Just my thoughts.

[edit on 12-7-2010 by CharlesBronson74]

reply to post by TiffanyInLA


Tiffany,

I am going to make a bunch of assumptions.... First one is.. I assume I am right in my assumptions.

You know way to much about this subject.


You are not a new member here.. Just a new name!
You are not a woman! (Nice pic... makes me want to agree with you)
You are not leaving any of this open for debate.. You came in here with your mind made up.
You didnt post this article for debate.. You were trolling( In the fishing sense of the word)
You were waiting for a few to disagree...and already had this arsenal of "facts".

This entire thread was a set up... you already caught a few fish, that are all excited now!

Good luck in your fishing expedition!

reply to post by Mobius1974


I questions the screen name as well. I have yet met a smart woman from LA....

if indeed she is a woman and from LA, then kudos to her.

510 knots=586 MPH

At 35,000 feet max cruising speed is 493 knots=568 MPH for the 767-200.

Source

Things to remember:

-Thickness of the atmosphere at low altitudes will impact performance.

-The planes were fairly heavy with fuel etc.

-Even a shallow dive will impart a lot of energy.

-Men bent on killing themselves are not overly concerned with safety.

-Radar systems are not perfect and I would guess there is + or - of at least 10 mph

Given all of this I find it easy to see how these planes were exceeding maximum design limits.


[edit on 12-7-2010 by Helmkat]

Originally posted by TiffanyInLA

Are you willing to put your name to your above claims as did Deets, Aimer and Kolstad?

It appears it is you trebor, who is trying to sell snake-oil.

Fine. Take your "experts" and go to court. Wait...you already tried that and it was thrown out, I believe, before anyone could even burp:

A court may dismiss a claim as "factually frivolous" if the facts alleged are "clearly baseless", that is, "fanciful", fantastic" or "delusional" Denton v. Hernandez, 504 U.S. 25, 32-33 (1992) (quoting Neitzke v. Williams, 490 U.S. 319,325,327,328 (1989)) Courts have not hesitated to dismiss complaints asserting delusional claims of conspiracy.3 Indeed, courts have dismissed other cases alleging delusional conspiracy theories about the attacks of September 11,2001. Because Gallop's claims are factually baseless -- indeed, because they are fanciful, fantastic, and delusional -- they are dismissed.

I bolded the important words and phrases above to help you out.

I think that pretty much sums up your "experts"...fanciful, fantastic and delusional.

So, go ahead and take your "experts" with their flight time and their "credentials" and their aircraft and their moon bases and their "falling apart at 450 knots" and do something other than try to sell cute teddys with your logo on them on the internet.

To close, I believe the fact that Deets, Aimer, Kolstad and the rest of your "A Team" put their names to these fanciful, delusional, factually baseless and factually frivolous claims speaks more to *their* credibility in the toilet than anything else.

Originally posted by Mobius1974
Tiffany,

I am going to make a bunch of assumptions.... First one is.. I assume I am right in my assumptions.

You know way to much about this subject.


You are not a new member here.. Just a new name!
You are not a woman! (Nice pic... makes me want to agree with you)
You are not leaving any of this open for debate.. You came in here with your mind made up.
You didnt post this article for debate.. You were trolling( In the fishing sense of the word)
You were waiting for a few to disagree...and already had this arsenal of "facts".

This entire thread was a set up... you already caught a few fish, that are all excited now!

Good luck in your fishing expedition!

My motive for starting this thread is exactly what the OP shows, that a NASA Flight Director feels the speeds are the "elephant in the room".

I had no doubt in my mind the JREF herd would come out of the wood work with repeated strawman arguments, character assassination, spin and libel, and they did, they are predictable. Too bad their tactics work against them.

If you think I posted the OP to bait them, no, not at all. But I was prepared for their onslaught, as you can read.

reply to post by trebor451


Those bolded words were interesting. Its fantastic that so many people made so much $$$ with the 9/11 Put Options that strangely happened right before. Theres nothing "delusional" about that?

reply to post by TiffanyInLA


Strawman arguments????

We are on the team of WE WON IN COURT>>.. I am not going to argue with you...
You are using 911truthers studies and graphs as proof...

If I had the time or simply gave a crap .. I could drum up graphs and charts to show you for what you are.. A person willing to believe anything done correctly with power point...

"It was so well presented....it must be true"

So what is/was your other ATS name?

reply to post by TiffanyInLA

But as usual, I need to repeat myself.

No, you need to explain yourself. "I" did this and then "I" did that doesn't mean a hill of beans to me.

You decided that you would edit your little homemade diagram so that it would appear that failure is gauranteed after a certain rate of speed is met. Sorry not buying it just because you colored it in.

Failure analysis. Lets see the calcs. Thank you.

reply to post by TiffanyInLA


Everyone from NASA is credible??
Tell that to the woman that drove across the country wearing depends....
In another thread, you and others would state "NASA lies about everything or covers everything up."

Any topic or subject can be unbalanced...all you have to do is add a semi credible source!

That source could be off their meds for all you know.


I think an IP check is in order here!

[edit on 12-7-2010 by Mobius1974]

Originally posted by trebor451

Originally posted by TiffanyInLA

Are you willing to put your name to your above claims as did Deets, Aimer and Kolstad?

It appears it is you trebor, who is trying to sell snake-oil.

Fine. Take your "experts" and go to court. Wait...you already tried that and it was thrown out, I believe, before anyone could even burp:

So you don't want to put your name to your claims as Deets has done.

Not surprised.

You may also want to read the response and appeal on the above court decision.


(33kb .doc)

Try to stay on topic Trebor, thanks.

[edit on 12-7-2010 by TiffanyInLA]

reply to post by Mobius1974


I have to agree Mobius.....the power of POWER POINT

reply to post by TiffanyInLA

Isn't it counter productive to post free streaming video if you're trying to sell the DVD?

Not if your trying to develop traffic to sell advertisement. Tell you what. Since you are so sincere about your cause, take all those videos and post them on Youtube with no reference to pilots for this or that.