Revelation: The Beast from the Sea- a World State

I think we are here and have been since after WWII.

5 When He opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature say, “Come and see.” So I looked, and behold, a black horse, and he who sat on it had a pair of scales in his hand. 6 And I heard a voice in the midst of the four living creatures saying, “A quart[c] of wheat for a denarius,[d] and three quarts of barley for a denarius; and do not harm the oil and the wine.”

I think we are soon (1-15 years) going to be at the fourth seal and pale rider.

1st rider = European Imperialism.
2nd rider = World Wars 1 and 2.
3rd rider = Ever increasing desperity between the haves of the world (oil and wine) and the have nots of the world (days wages just enough to eat)
4th rider = Obviously some kind of thing that causes death of various kinds to an extremely massive amount of people.

Each of the first three riders appear to be carried out through the actions of men. This leads me to guess that the fourth rider will also be carried out through the action of men.

Each rider goes out a little quicker soon after the last, like how contractions get spaced closer together in labor.

I could be totally wrong about all of these guesses and I am not closed off from understanding anything differently.

a reply to: SelectStart
My understanding of the four horsemen is that they come almost simultaneously, or at least in very quick succession. I see them as different aspects of one grand catastrophe. That is, Plague, War, Famine, and the Death which results from all of these. This follows on from their purpose; they are God's reaction to the persecution of the previous martyrs, which is why the fifth seal shows the martyrs rejoicing at what is happening. The sixth seal is about the reaction of the rest of the world to the same catastrophe.

I invite you to consider these two threads;
Four Horsemen- Why?, which shows how the four horsemen and four chariots of Zechariah's prophecy are expressing God's anger against the world on behalf of his people.
Four Horsemen- How?, which offers my reasons for seeing them as aspects of one accumulating crisis.

a reply to: DISRAELI

The following verses are singled out of the Revelation to make this point:
The beast is a Satan powered king [therefore a man], who has had a terrible head wound, has disappeared,
and will publicly reappear, and amaze the world.

Revelation chapter 13

13v1'....I saw a beast coming out of the sea...'

13v2'. ...dragon gave him his power...'

13V3'... .and I saw one of his heads as if it had been slain, and his fatal wound was healed.....'

13v7'....authority over every tribe and people. ....... was given him....

13V12'...and he [beast from earth] makes the earth and those who dwell in it to worship the first beast who had the wound of the sword and has come to life....'


Revelation chapter 17

17v3'. ..and I saw a woman sitting on a scarlet beast, full of blasphemous names, having 7 heads and 10 horns.....'

17v8'....the beast that you saw was and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and to go to destruction. And those who dwell on the earth will wonder, whose name has not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they see the beast
that he WAS and IS NOT and WILL COME ....'

17v11'...and the beast that was and is not, is himself also an eighth [king] and is one of the seven...'

Based on detailed, unique, visible, verifiable prophecy/Revelation fulfillment, I assert/declare that the Vatican is the great whore of the Revelation,
Therefore I further assert the beast is Roman Catholic.
Can you think of a world famous Roman Catholic who has had a world famous terrible head wound under extremely mysterious circumstances?

I predict/prophecy in Jesus name that John F. Kennedy will publicly reappear, amaze the world, take world power, and is in fact the beast of the Revelation.

This fulfillment will confirm the truth of the Revelation of Jesus Christ.
This fulfillment will confirm the truth of Jesus Christ the living Lord & Savior.

KISSINGER and 666

Note there are two beasts of Revelation 13.
One from the sea.The other from the land.
One is a Gentile. The other is a Jew.

English is the world's single most widespread language:
A= 1 x 6 = 6, B = 2 x 6 = 12, C = 3 x 6 = 18, D = 4 x 6 = 24, E = 5 x 6 = 30, etc.

K= 66
I= 54
S= 114
S= 114
I = 54
N= 84
G= 42
E= 30
R= 108
+ 666

Kissinger's name equates to '666' by a simple formula.
Kissinger is Jewish
Kissinger is the world's premier "world statesman'

So: Re- Vatican, JFK, and KISSINGER
The question becomes-
Would Jesus Christ allow such literal fulfillment to occur coincidentally?
I say NO, Jesus would not.


Therefore I am COMPELLED to believe that it is prophecy fulfillment in progress.
The confirmation of my contention will be the public and literal reappearance of JFK who will take world power with Kissinger at his side.

I urge anyone to personally study and heed the entire Revelation.

Early in the Revelation of Jesus Christ,
God promises to bless anyone who reads or hears the Revelation and heeds it.

'...for the time is near'...'

'....and the whole earth was amazed and followed after the beast...'

wait and see....

Call on Jesus Read and HEED His Revelation!


The Lord once said, 'Surely, just as I have intended, so it has happened, and just as I have planned, so it will stand......' Isaiah 14:24

www.mosquitonet.com...

www.cwporter.com...

originally posted by: JohnPrewett
The beast is a Satan powered king [therefore a man],

I believe you have misunderstood the nature of the beast, as you should have learned from this thread alone.
There are two beasts in ch13, one from the sea and one from the land. The one from the sea has to be a political structure, while I understand the other beast as the leader of that structure. It would resemble the relationship between the Third Reich and Adolf Hitler.

who has had a terrible head wound

People get excessively literal about this business of the head-wound. They need to remember that this is all metaphorical imagery.
If the person involved IS the "head" of the structure, then anything that happens to him is "a wounding of the head", and this focus on his physical head may be a misdirection.
In fact there is another way of interpreting the image. The "heads" of the beast might be political states, successive representatives of the structure. If such a state disintegrates and then gets restored, then it could be said that the head has been "wounded to death" and restored to life. Isn't that exactly what happened when Putin restored some of the power of the old Soviet Union?

I assert/declare that the Vatican is the great whore of the Revelation, Therefore I further assert the beast is Roman Catholic.

This is a false connection. The great harlot and the beast are completely distinct entities, so thinking you have identified one does not help you to identify the other.

KISSINGER and 666

The gematria approach to interpreting 666 is completely discredited by the fact that it produces too many solutions. The internet will probably provide you with a million of them. If there is no way of telling which is right, gematria becomes incapable of giving any definite answer.
There is no scriptural backing for your claim that one of the beasts is a Jew (in my system, only one of them is a man).

I urge anyone to personally study and heed the entire Revelation.

The best way of doing this is to read through my series of Revelation threads.

Revelation project complete

a reply to: DISRAELI

17v11'...and the beast that was and is not, is himself also an eighth [king] and is one of the seven...'

So the supreme Beast is clearly a KING ... and a KING is always a MAN ....

and, of course a king must have a kingdom .... and the whole world will be his kingdom.

There is no good reason to doubt the "terrible head wound" is not JFK's literal head wound SEEN AROUND THE WORLD.
JFK, only avowed RC POTUS of the most powerful nation in the world [especially at time].

COINCIDENCE ? Scuse me, I think not.

The Vatican is the GREAT WHORE as millions have seen for centuries.

Since the Beast and Great Whore are connected in Rev 17, I am confident the Beast is a Roman Catholic.

I see visible and verifiable fulfillment .... just waiting for the Beast [who "was, is not, yet will be"] to publicly emerge and "amaze the world"



i.imgur.com...

imgur.com...

originally posted by: JohnPrewett
So the supreme Beast is clearly a KING ... and a KING is always a MAN ....

But there are two of them, as I have tried to point out, and only one of them need be a man.
"Beast from the sea" means the kingdom itself. See Daniel ch7.

and, of course a king must have a kingdom .... and the whole world will be his kingdom.

He dominates the rest of the world indirectly, through client states. Revelation calls them the "ten kings" (ten is a symbolic number and need not be literal).

There is no good reason to doubt the "terrible head wound" is not JFK's literal head wound SEEN AROUND THE WORLD.

I gave you a good reason, namely that Revelation works through metaphor.
I offer you another possibility. The Soviet Union was one of the "heads" of the Beast. When the Soviet Union and its empire fell apart (do you remember this?) that head seemed to have suffered a fatal wound. Now Putin is bringing it back to life, and the world wonders after it.

Since the Beast and Great Whore are connected in Rev 17, I am confident the Beast is a Roman Catholic.

The nature of the connection is that the Harlot depends on the support of the Beast (and later gets attacked by it).
The Catholic church worldwide has never depended on the support of the American Presidency. However, religious authority has tended to require the support of secular authority.
So all we are learning from the image of ch17 is that the Harlot (whatever it is) is a religious authority of some kind, requiring the support of the Beast as the current version of secular authority (which later turns against the Harlot and destroys it).

originally posted by: JohnPrewett
So the supreme Beast is clearly a KING ... and a KING is always a MAN ....

originally posted by: DISRAELI
But there are two of them, as I have tried to point out, and only one of them need be a man.
"Beast from the sea" means the kingdom itself. See Daniel ch7.

"Beast from the sea" does NOT mean "the kingdom itself." The Beast from the sea is the SUPREME Beast. He is the same MAN as the KING of Rev 17:11.
The "Beast from the earth" is also a man. .... and in Rev 19 this man is called the "false prophet." As a king is always a man, a prophet is always a man.

I am confident the "sea" and "earth" designations mean the supreme "sea" Beast is a Gentile and the subordinate "earth" Beast is a Jew.
..................

There is no good reason to doubt the "terrible head wound" is not JFK's literal head wound SEEN AROUND THE WORLD.

originally posted by: DISRAELI
I gave you a good reason, namely that Revelation works through metaphor.

No, that is not a "good reason" ........ No way Jesus would let this LITERAL FULFILLMENT come to pass if it were not fulfillment in progress.
When literal fulfillment makes perfect sense, there is no need to look for a metaphorical interpretation.
...............

Since the Beast and Great Whore are connected in Rev 17, I am confident the Beast is a Roman Catholic.

.................

originally posted by: DISRAELI
So all we are learning from the image of ch17 is that the Harlot (whatever it is) ..........................

The Vatican is the Great Whore. Pure and simple. One of the three most certain prophecy fulfillments of all.
Being certain the Vatican is the G.W. is a key part of seeing how perfectly JFK fits the supreme Beast description.
And Henry Kissinger will be JFK's head cheerleader !

originally posted by: JohnPrewett
"Beast from the sea" does NOT mean "the kingdom itself." The Beast from the sea is the SUPREME Beast. He is the same MAN as the KING of Rev 17:11.

Have you read Daniel ch7 at all? The beasts from the sea are kingdoms, not kings.

I am confident the "sea" and "earth" designations mean the supreme "sea" Beast is a Gentile and the subordinate "earth" Beast is a Jew.

This comes from nowhere. There is nothing in scripture to back it up.
As you read through Revelation, you may notice that it keeps talking about "heaven, earth, and sea" as the three divisions of the world. When the dragon is expelled from heaven, the angel's warning is given to "the earth and sea", the other two divisions. So I suggest that the two beasts of "earth and sea" are set up against "the one from heaven", namely Christ. Daniel obviously prompted the thought of "beast from the sea", and this leaves the earth as the last member of the three divisions. Therefore "beast from the earth".
From John's description, my own conclusion is that the first beast is a political structure, and the second is the leader of the same structure. He obviously resembles Hitler in being a leader with a loud mouth.

No way Jesus would let this LITERAL FULFILLMENT come to pass if it were not fulfillment in progress.

Why should Jesus bother to stop human events happening just because people might be capable of misunderstanding them?
Excessive literalness is the curse of Biblical interpretation, and especially in dealing with Revelation, which presents so much in the way of symbolic imagery.
When Jesus returns, are you expecting to see him with seven swords comig out of his mouth?

The Vatican is the Great Whore.

That is not relevant. As I keep telling you, the great Harlot is not the Beast, and identifying the great Harlot does not help us to identify the Beast. Don't forget that the Beast will eventually destroy the Harlot.
In any case, Kissinger will probably die fairly soon, so your obsession with him will have to be transferred somewhere else.

a reply to: DISRAELI

I'm not so sure we should take revelation so literal. Genesis begins the story as the fall of man and revelation is the restoration of man. Maybe there are layers of literal and metaphorical and spiritual meanings all wrapped into one. The WORD is truly that powerful.

Let us be reminded John had a dream. Revelations come in dreams and they carry symbolic meaning.

When you wake up from a dream you tend to decipher the symbolism. Water in my dreams symbolizes spirit. So I think it's safe to say what we all want to know is what did John's dream mean to him? What does it mean to us? I'm sure there are thousands and thousands of interpretations but it's rather fun to try and decipher.

Our goal as humans since the fall is to discover and adhere to the state of mind that reaches at-one-ment. Whereas we are one with God, no longer separate. Since the fall we have separated our self and this is where the nature of God vs the nature of man comes into play. Suffering is immense when we are separated so again the main goal while here is to get back to being at one with God.

When I think of Babylon and the whore I think immediately of America and Hillary. The phoenix rising... the woman rising... coming full circle and the lady represents Lilith or Mary. Time coming full circle back to the beginning.

What I have to keep reminding myself is if you go back in time thousands of years ago our fellow man was connected to nature. They were connected so much they used the heavens/stars to formulate their opinions regarding God. It's no surprise then numerology and astrology were used significantly when writing. Much more poetic and less literal back then.

Also when you take Francis Bacon into account, who he was and how he viewed the world and religion it leads me to believe the symbolism in the Bible is coded as well, BY HIM. Very hard for someone in modern day to understand. My opinion of course.

When I think of something coming out of the Sea... I think of modern day, " Israel Leviathan Project" ( leviathan meaning --sea monster, satan, dragon). If you are not familiar with the Leviathan Project please inform yourself because it's a war maker in the making. Natural Gas Pipelines in the Mediterranean sea... not so sure we are by nature supposed to be messing with the energy of the Earth. Just seems like it's a beast that shows it's ugly head by causing wars and could be the destruction of the Planet. The TPP ( Trans Pacific Pipeline) same thing... causing greedy wars around the globe.

I wish we knew for sure the symbolic and spiritual meaning behind John's dream but I'm afraid the speculation is still on going and there is no way for us to know because we are no longer connected to nature to even understand times past. This is another downfall for man. Something has to give.

originally posted by: MamaJ
I'm not so sure we should take revelation so literal.

My interpretation of Revelation is a lot less literal than some, I can promise you. For example, this thread got bumped in the first place because another user is taking "wound in the head" more literally than me.

So I think it's safe to say what we all want to know is what did John's dream mean to him?

Quite so. That's why my starting-point is the Old Testament imagery which fills the book, and gives us nearly all the clues we need about what it meant to the first readers.

Also when you take Francis Bacon into account, who he was and how he viewed the world and religion it leads me to believe the symbolism in the Bible is coded as well, BY HIM.

Rather implausible, given that nobody has noticed any particular differences between the Bible he is supposed to have "edited" and all the other editions of the Bible existing before his time or simultaneously during his own time.
If he made any changes, they would have been spotted, and controversialists would have pounced upon them. Since nobody noticed any changes, he can't have made any.

When I think of something coming out of the Sea... I think of modern day, " Israel Leviathan Project"

But you rightly asked earlier "What would it mean to John?" I'm sure John would have immediately thought of Daniel ch7, and his understanding of the image would have been based on that.

there is no way for us to know because we are no longer connected to nature to even understand times past.

We can still read the Old Testament. That's where all the clues are. The Biblical God is a God who communicates, and this is where he is communicating.

a reply to: DISRAELI

Rather implausible, given that nobody has noticed any particular differences between the Bible he is supposed to have "edited" and all the other editions of the Bible existing before his time or simultaneously during his own time. If he made any changes, they would have been spotted, and controversialists would have pounced upon them. Since nobody noticed any changes, he can't have made any.

I disagree, it's so plausible when you really study it and think about it. I'm not alone in this.. the evidence suggests he is responsoble for the literary masterpiece of the KJAV. I believe strongly he is the reason there is a "code" within the Bible.

Since Bacon used the ‘Shakespeare’ pseudonym, the peculiarity in the KJAV of the construction of Psalm 46 can be accepted as evidence that Bacon marked it to show his involvement. The 46th word from the beginning is ‘shake’ and the 46th word from the end is ‘spear’. In previous translations of the Bible these words had been placed differently in relation to the beginning and ending of the Psalm, and ‘shake’ had earlier been written ‘shoke’. It is evident there was more than coincidence involved, and if this was not coincidence it means that Bacon went to the trouble of arranging the text to identify his involvement with the rewriting of the KJAV. The ‘46’ connected to this establishes the certainly of the absence of coincidence. The ‘46’ seems to be a reference to the number of translators still alive when the KJAV was completed, and also to the fact that that Bacon’s ‘mask’ William Shakspere of Stratford on Avon was 46 years old at that time. No doubt, this detail was added to rule out the possibility that the anomaly was coincidence.

www.sirbacon.org...

www.sacred-texts.com...

www.fbrt.org.uk...

Here is Francis Bacon's work on the New Atlantis... he was a remarkable genius with coding/gematria. fbrt.org.uk...'s_New_Atlantis.pdf

originally posted by: MamaJ
I disagree, it's so plausible when you really study it and think about it. I'm not alone in this..

Of course you're not alone, because the modern world is full of conspiracy theorists who haven't thought things through.
Quoting them doesn't count as evidence.

I ask again. Where is the evidence that ANYTHING has been changed? Previous English translations are available, for comparison purposes, as are the contemporay translations in Latin, French, German, Swedish... etc etc.
If any significant alterations had been made, they would be noticeable AND they would have been noticed at the time.
So what were they?

The standard conspiracy line of "he had the opportunity, so he must have done it" just isn't good enough, and yet it's really all you've got.

a reply to: DISRAELI

In the links I gave you proof. It's no secret... google scholar... you will find many who upon investigation know this to be true.

It's real easy to find and just to let you know.... this fact, in my opinion, means so much more accuracy for the Bible itself.

It brings/brought the WORD to life.

Meanings of words change when translating. Words are powerful in this sense and shouldn't be taken lightly. "dominion" over the earth.... well "dominion" being added into the translation or taken away with another word which has a different meaning.. changes the entire scene and meaning of. It matters.. literally.

Bacon wasn't your ordinary man and he had a few alias names as well. Reading his works and studying him is fascinating to say the least.


My belief is everything happens for a reason and there is a reason why he edited the books before publication. It's also my belief he was inspired by God and lived his life accordingly. His family line is also fascinating.

Before you denounce it's plausibility, research it for yourself if you haven't already and then let me know your thoughts.

originally posted by: JohnPrewett
"Beast from the sea" does NOT mean "the kingdom itself." The Beast from the sea is the SUPREME Beast.
He is the same MAN as the KING of Rev 17:11.

originally posted by: DISRAELI
Have you read Daniel ch7 at all? The beasts from the sea are kingdoms, not kings.

I've read it. And in regards to determining what the Revelation means, I deliberately disregard it. My contentions regarding the Revelation come from the Revelation EXCLUSIVELY. Regarding determining OUR end of era scenario, I consider the other books to be sidetracks and sources of confusion. I rely EXCLUSIVELY on the Revelation. Rev 17:11 says Beast is a KING. A king is a MAN. You are refusing to heed the Revelation.

I am confident the "sea" and "earth" designations mean the supreme "sea" Beast is a Gentile and the subordinate "earth" Beast is a Jew.

originally posted by: DISRAELI
This comes from nowhere. There is nothing in scripture to back it up.

OK, but later you're going to find that is what the Earth/Sea distinction means.
And, the Gentiles nations are compared to the restless "sea" [need I look it up for you ?]
.... and to God, Israel looks like a little Island in the midst of the vast Gentile sea.

..................

No way Jesus would let this LITERAL FULFILLMENT come to pass if it were not fulfillment in progress.

originally posted by: DISRAELI
Why should Jesus bother to stop human events happening just because people might be capable of misunderstanding them? .............

The odds are greatly against having the only avowed Roman Catholic POTUS when USA was clearly the MOST POWERFUL NATION in the world .... the beloved of the Mass Media ......get a "fatal appearing head wound" ....under EXTREMELY mysterious circumstances ..... generating hundreds of book and UTubes etc debating EVERYTHING about the event.

I'm confident Jesus would NOT allow such "coincidental" literal fulfillment of HIS Revelation.
It's just a matter of who knows Jesus the best. We'll see.

The Vatican is the Great Whore.

originally posted by: DISRAELI
That is not relevant. As I keep telling you, the great Harlot is not the Beast, and identifying the great Harlot does not help us to identify the Beast. Don't forget that the Beast will eventually destroy the Harlot.
In any case, Kissinger will probably die fairly soon, so your obsession with him will have to be transferred somewhere else.

Here you greatly err. The Vatican-Great Whore fulfillment is exceedingly significant. Both in itself [sheds great light on past present and future] .... and as visible verifiable confirmation of the truth of Jesus. Servants of Jesus SEE this confirmation IS highly significant and valuable.

I know the Harlot is not the Beast and I never said it was. Do try to read more carefully. Both the Beast are MEN.
Yes, IF KISSINGER were not the subordinate Beast [Jew from the "earth"] then he probably would die fairly soon.

It is relevant toward identifying the supreme Beast because they are connected in Revelation 17


typos

To all: I am not at all surprised so very, very few can see that JFK fits the Beast description and will reappear and is the Beast.

NO surprise at all. BECAUSE, the Beast is still waiting in the wings ....out of sight.

Whereas the Vatican is RIGHT OUT IN THE OPEN and most "Christians" can't see that the Vatican is the Great Whore of the Revelation .

No wonder that people who can't see what is in PLAIN VIEW cant see what is still out of sight.

Not only that ....... sheeeesh, there are still people who refuse to see the Jesus fulfilled the Messiah description.

Still people who refuse to see that modern Israel fulfills the OT predictions of Israel being dispersed and regathered.

So no wonder people can't see the two Beast fulfillments.

originally posted by: JohnPrewett
And in regards to determining what the Revelation means, I deliberately disregard it. My contentions regarding the Revelation come from the Revelation EXCLUSIVELY.

Then you are deliberately choosing NOT to understand the book of Revelation.
God did not put out Revelation in isolation from other books, and he did not intend it to be read in isolation. That is as bad as taking individual verses out of context and trying to understand them in isolation from anything else. All you are doing is imposing your own meaning, instead of trying to understand God's meaning.
God communicates through the Bible as a WHOLE.

originally posted by: DISRAELI

originally posted by: JohnPrewett
"Beast from the sea" does NOT mean "the kingdom itself." The Beast from the sea is the SUPREME Beast. He is the same MAN as the KING of Rev 17:11.

Have you read Daniel ch7 at all? The beasts from the sea are kingdoms, not kings.

I am confident the "sea" and "earth" designations mean the supreme "sea" Beast is a Gentile and the subordinate "earth" Beast is a Jew.

This comes from nowhere. There is nothing in scripture to back it up.
As you read through Revelation, you may notice that it keeps talking about "heaven, earth, and sea" as the three divisions of the world. When the dragon is expelled from heaven, the angel's warning is given to "the earth and sea", the other two divisions. So I suggest that the two beasts of "earth and sea" are set up against "the one from heaven", namely Christ. Daniel obviously prompted the thought of "beast from the sea", and this leaves the earth as the last member of the three divisions. Therefore "beast from the earth".
From John's description, my own conclusion is that the first beast is a political structure, and the second is the leader of the same structure. He obviously resembles Hitler in being a leader with a loud mouth.

No way Jesus would let this LITERAL FULFILLMENT come to pass if it were not fulfillment in progress.

Why should Jesus bother to stop human events happening just because people might be capable of misunderstanding them?
Excessive literalness is the curse of Biblical interpretation, and especially in dealing with Revelation, which presents so much in the way of symbolic imagery.
When Jesus returns, are you expecting to see him with seven swords comig out of his mouth?

The Vatican is the Great Whore.

That is not relevant. As I keep telling you, the great Harlot is not the Beast, and identifying the great Harlot does not help us to identify the Beast. Don't forget that the Beast will eventually destroy the Harlot.
In any case, Kissinger will probably die fairly soon, so your obsession with him will have to be transferred somewhere else.

Your analogy of Third Reich & Hitler to Beast from the sea & false prophet is not entirely correct.
Daniel 7 says that the 4 beasts are kings and kingdoms:

17 ‘These four great beasts are four kings who shall arise out of the earth. 18 But the saints of the Most High shall receive the kingdom and possess the kingdom forever, forever and ever.’ 19 “Then I desired to know the truth about the fourth beast, which was different from all the rest, exceedingly terrifying, with its teeth of iron and claws of bronze, and which devoured and broke in pieces and stamped what was left with its feet, 20 and about the ten horns that were on its head, and the other horn that came up and before which three of them fell, the horn that had eyes and a mouth that spoke great things, and that seemed greater than its companions.

The 4th beast/ king is the dragon, the one with 'teeth of iron and claws of Bronze'. Same 'dragon' from Revelation 12, 13, 17 with the same Leopard, bear, and lion for both.

Daniel 7 is where the 'sea' and 'earth' idea comes from. Dan 7:2 vision says 4 beasts from the 'sea', the interpretation of the vision Dan 7:17 quoted above says 'earth'.

2 Daniel declared, “I saw in my vision by night, and behold, the four winds of heaven were stirring up the great sea. 3 And four great beasts came up out of the sea, different from one another. 4 The first was like a lion and had eagles' wings. Then as I looked its wings were plucked off, and it was lifted up from the ground and made to stand on two feet like a man, and the mind of a man was given to it.

5 And behold, another beast, a second one, like a bear. It was raised up on one side. It had three ribs in its mouth between its teeth; and it was told, ‘Arise, devour much flesh.’ 6 After this I looked, and behold, another, like a leopard, with four wings of a bird on its back. And the beast had four heads, and dominion was given to it. 7 After this I saw in the night visions, and behold, a fourth beast, terrifying and dreadful and exceedingly strong. It had great iron teeth; it devoured and broke in pieces and stamped what was left with its feet. It was different from all the beasts that were before it, and it had ten horns.

When Revelation uses the term 'beast from the abyss' (generally translated 'bottomless pit') it is referring to the beast from the sea & beast from the earth, both of which comprise Daniel 7's 4th kingdom. In Daniel 7, the dragon has 10 horns, then an 11th horn arises afterward. The 11th horn is the False prophet, the beast from the earth of Rev 13. The beast from the sea is the dragon himself, the 4th king who owns 10 horns.

Put another way, in Daniel 7, there is the 4th king with his 4th kingdom. This is the beast from the sea, ruled by what most would call the 'antichrist'. 4th king, with 4th kingdom, then 10 horns, then 11 horns. the 11th horn is the false prophet, aka the beast from the earth.

That's why in the 5th Trumpet, there is the dual reference to the beast from the bottomless pit being called Apollyon for the Greek and Abaddon for Hebrew. Which gives credence to JohnPrewett's contention that one beast is a Gentile and one is a Jew.

It's the same idea going on in Rev 17

8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. 10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space. 11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition. 12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.

the 7th king is the 4th king of Daniel 7, the beast from the sea. The 8th king is of the 7th king = the 11th horn which is the beast from the earth.

The beast from the 'abyss'/ 'bottomless pit' is the generic term for both the 4th king with 10 horns (sea 'abyss') and the 11th horn (earth 'abyss').

The beast from the earth says to worship the beast with the mortal head wound (Rev 13:14). This is a literal person with a literal head wound. This literal person is the individual referenced in Zechariah 11:17, the 'worthless shepherd'.

“Woe to my worthless shepherd, who deserts the flock! May the sword strike his arm and his right eye! Let his arm be wholly withered, his right eye utterly blinded!

a reply to: jcrash
The first three beasts in Daniel are normally understood as Babylon, Persia, Alexander's empire. In other words, political powers rather than individuals.

originally posted by: DISRAELI

originally posted by: JohnPrewett
And in regards to determining what the Revelation means, I deliberately disregard it.
My contentions regarding the Revelation come from the Revelation EXCLUSIVELY.

Then you are deliberately choosing NOT to understand the book of Revelation.
God did not put out Revelation in isolation from other books, and he did not intend it to be read in isolation. That is as bad as taking individual verses out of context and trying to understand them in isolation from anything else. All you are doing is imposing your own meaning, instead of trying to understand God's meaning.
God communicates through the Bible as a WHOLE.

You are deliberately refusing to heed the Revelation .... most specifically Rev 17:11
You are deliberately refusing to take into account that in Rev 13, immediately after the Beast is revealed,
the Revelation repeatedly refers to the Beast by pronouns that refer to a MAN.

"his, his, his, his, him,his,his,his,him,he,he,he,his,his,his,him,him,him

Long string of pronouns applicable to a MAN.

Then you ignore and belittle the GREAT CLUE which is the Revelation 17 Beast and Great Whore connection.

so ......... you don't know WHAT the Beast is because you refuse to heed the Revelation. The Revelation God sent to Jesus's servants.

a reply to: JohnPrewett
There is more than one Beast (ch13).
Only one of them need be a man.