J-10,from China,I am proud of it

Originally posted by gastric cancer
Now Chinese common military forces have already over Russia's.Because Russia is lacking of money.Now thousands of Russia experts are working in China for our weapon's development because Russia haven't enough money to them.
you got it all wrong

russia is giving away its crap tech to china, and stuffing it like some turkey with su-27 and other export crap, Russia feels the Chinese threat will not materialize for another 15 years. Whether or not Russia sells them weapons, China will be arming itself. It might as well be with Russian export crap weapons.

The new Chinese destoryor with "Zues shield defence system" have western style.We design the radar and we produce it by ourself.Russia haven't this tech.
this is also copy of russian RIF and american aegis system

[edit on 16-6-2004 by feindflug]

If we did go to war with China, there aircraft would be a good training mission for the trainees on the F-22. No missles have to be shot, so how do you know where there coming from with the F-22's Radar thing which shuts down the computers.

agreed... Or maybe they can use that modification to invade computer systems and have all those chinese aircraft shoot each other down

Originally posted by American Mad Man
agreed... Or maybe they can use that modification to invade computer systems and have all those chinese aircraft shoot each other down

the chinese wont have something that will outmach western or russian non-export military tech for decades, all they have now are piss poor copies and export crap

Alright feindflug, time for me to weigh it

I've been monitoring this thread since it started and I gotta say man you do not know what you are talking about at all!

I am throughly impressed with China, not because they are matching western tech but because they are leaping forward in their own tech faster than we ever could.

Remember that China is the only country to ever fight your beloved America to a stalemate using traditional military tactics, Korea ring a bell?

I would love to know what the Chinese have on the drawing board right now, they do have more enginers than the United States, Canada, European Union and Japan combined, there has got to be some absolutely genious level people in that.

America's sole position as global superpower is ending, China will surpass the American economy very soon and once the European Union gets around to a unified military, goodbye global supremacy. The golden age of the United States has past and the future speaks Mandarin and Romance Languages.

Also I think that the ditching of more next-gen military programs is in line for America as the full cost of your little jaunt to Iraq becomes known. I think the F22 project is an obvious place for cuts, as is the JSF, even though America could really use weapons like these and I think they show great promise.

So lets take a look a dozen years into the futue shall we:

If for some reason Bush is re-elected in 2004, your national debt will be astronomical, most of the money for it will come from China, as it has the last four years.

The US military will be making do with upgraded gen-4 fighters and only a handful of gen-5 fighters due to their high cost, the primary fighters will be the Super Hornet, Falcon and Eagle, much as they are today (remember how long the Phantom lasted even durring the Cold War arms race) and they will finally be getting sick of this war against Al Q that they just can't seem to win.

The EU will be testing the first gen-6 fighter, possibly being remotely piloted, and through their military alliance with China (which exists now) they will be selling their gen-5s to the PROC.

Russia will probably only be starting to produce the Berkut, and other high-end gen-5s in large numbers, mainly due to the fact that China bought all their design talent and they are still broke.

China will still be at peace with mostly everyone, although their new nuke carriers will be partroling the South China Sea and the J-10 will be a mainstay in their air force much as the Mig-21 is today. They will also be the largest economy on the planet.

Now who looks weak my friend?

May Peace Travel With Us
~Astral

Originally posted by Laxpla
If we did go to war with China, there aircraft would be a good training mission for the trainees on the F-22. No missles have to be shot, so how do you know where there coming from with the F-22's Radar thing which shuts down the computers.

Please Laxpla dont talk so tough about your country.

Just look in the news paper what is happening with War on Iraq.

Please are really pissed at the governement just for less then 1000 killed in Iraq.

Think about 1000 men a day minimum.

But yes you people have superior weapons.

Its just the moral and people reaction.

Out,
Russian

Hah it will be like shooting fish in a barrel and as sad as it is most americans need to shut up and support the troops i am american and soon will be joining the army but if i see my neighbor marching down the street saying he is anti war when i and alot of other fine men are defending his azz you dont feel good and wander wtf is wrong with him and the rest of the anti war and global peace idiots dont they realize we are a species that will never have totoal peace because its the way we are so they just need to grow up shut up and deal with the real world instead of whining like little B****!

Russian, well said.

And feindflug, if you are so interested in who ripped off what remember that the Americans ripped off the design for the B2 bomber from the German Nazi concept and blueprints for the New York bomber. They designed it in 1944, and it took you how long to build one?

Now I am not saying this as a slight to the B2 at all, it's an amazing bird, and good on America for building it, but the point is that even the great United States builds on the shoulders of others. It's not a sign of weakness, but a wisdom to build on the best of what everyone else has in weapons. Please try to Remember that.

May Peace Travel With You
~Astral

Originally posted by WestPoint23
Hah it will be like shooting fish in a barrel and as sad as it is most americans need to shut up and support the troops i am american and soon will be joining the army but if i see my neighbor marching down the street saying he is anti war when i and alot of other fine men are defending his azz you dont feel good and wander wtf is wrong with him and the rest of the anti war and global peace idiots dont they realize we are a species that will never have totoal peace because its the way we are so they just need to grow up shut up and deal with the real world instead of whining like little B****!

This is my point exactly.

How do you feel defending people who hate you and march agaimst you.

And that is just a SMALL war with less then a 1000 killed in a YEAR!

Think a 1000 a day!

The whole US will start march with that news!

They will kill the president and make anarche.

Out,
Russian

Originally posted by The Astral City
America's sole position as global superpower is ending, China will surpass the American economy very soon and once the European Union gets around to a unified military, goodbye global supremacy. The golden age of the United States has past and the future speaks Mandarin and Romance Languages.

i dont consider 2050 very soon

Also I think that the ditching of more next-gen military programs is in line for America as the full cost of your little jaunt to Iraq becomes known. I think the F22 project is an obvious place for cuts, as is the JSF, even though America could really use weapons like these and I think they show great promise.
agreed, but modified 4th gen fighters are still better then anything china can make


The EU will be testing the first gen-6 fighter, possibly being remotely piloted, and through their military alliance with China (which exists now) they will be selling their gen-5s to the PROC.
what military allaince? they still have that arms embargo on china since 1989 and they stay a good little american lapdog

Russia will probably only be starting to produce the Berkut, and other high-end gen-5s in large numbers, mainly due to the fact that China bought all their design talent and they are still broke.
what? it is not the 90's, russian economy is already on its feet and is improving very fast, the russian 5th gen aircraft should take off in 2006 and enter production 4 years later, china by that time will only have crappy j-10 copies and export su-27

China will still be at peace with mostly everyone, although their new nuke carriers will be partroling the South China Sea and the J-10 will be a mainstay in their air force much as the Mig-21 is today. They will also be the largest economy on the planet.
they cant even build a carrier, so they bought a crappy ukrainian aircraft carrier, then couldnt modernize it into a military one and turned it into a hotel and the other into a casino

[edit on 16-6-2004 by feindflug]

Astral city - you make a few good points, such as the fact that China is catcching up.

Your problem is the gross over exageration of them and the EU, and the underestimation of the US...

A few things to consider (in millions):
US Total GDP: $10,383,100
Chinas Total GDP: $1,266,052
Site
I would say it will be more then "very soon" before China overtakes the US economy.

As far as the EU becoming a single fighting force, that is just not true. You really think that France and England and Germany and Ireland and Scotland and Spain ect ect ect ect are going to say all for one? Who leads this army? Who makes the final call to go to war? Do you think France is going to let England tell it to go to war? Give me a break. The closest they will ever get is a mutual protection pact from invasion. Even if they did, all of Europes tech combined is still behind the US.

Then you start talking about Europe testing a gen 6 fighter. LOL! they need a gen 5 one first! The Euro Fighter is a gen 4 plane dude, it doesn't even use RAM or an internal bay for storage. Plus no one there has any experience putting a stealth fighter into service. The US has 3 generations of stealth planes and a 4th in line, which will be followed by the B-3. It usually takes about 20 years to put a brand new fighter into service, so i guess by the year 2050 the Europeans will have their gen 6 fighter, meanwhile the US won't even be using maned aircraft any more, we will be using cheaper, stealthier, and faster unmanned air craft (we already have them in service) and space based weapons.

Don't kid yourself, The US will be top dog well into this century at the very least.

Originally posted by American Mad Man
so i guess by the year 2050 the Europeans will have their gen 6 fighter, meanwhile the US won't even be using maned aircraft any more, we will be using cheaper, stealthier, and faster unmanned air craft (we already have them in service) and space based weapons.

Don't kid yourself, The US will be top dog well into this century at the very least.

by that time there will be already hypersonic aircraft

Russian, I can talk tough, when I can walk the walk While people are building there ground weapons, were already expanding outward and going to space ideas.

Originally posted by Laxpla
Russian, I can talk tough, when I can walk the walk

While people are building there ground weapons, were already expanding outward and going to space ideas.

Its ok Laxpla we love you...

We love you...

No wait THEY love...

Damn...

Sorry I am lost.

But yes please try have a open mind.

It will help you in life.

Out,
Russian

Originally posted by Russian

Originally posted by WestPoint23
Hah it will be like shooting fish in a barrel and as sad as it is most americans need to shut up and support the troops i am american and soon will be joining the army but if i see my neighbor marching down the street saying he is anti war when i and alot of other fine men are defending his azz you dont feel good and wander wtf is wrong with him and the rest of the anti war and global peace idiots dont they realize we are a species that will never have totoal peace because its the way we are so they just need to grow up shut up and deal with the real world instead of whining like little B****!

This is my point exactly.

How do you feel defending people who hate you and march agaimst you.

And that is just a SMALL war with less then a 1000 killed in a YEAR!

Think a 1000 a day!

The whole US will start march with that news!

They will kill the president and make anarche.

Out,
Russian

It It defenatley wont go that far i think if we got in a big war with china and our country was threatend that the people will rally together like WW2

Originally posted by WestPoint23


It It defenatley wont go that far i think if we got in a big war with china and our country was threatend that the people will rally together like WW2

Remember MEDIA in WW2 did count very skratch a soldier had...

Out,
Russian

Originally posted by Russian

Originally posted by WestPoint23


It It defenatley wont go that far i think if we got in a big war with china and our country was threatend that the people will rally together like WW2

Remember MEDIA in WW2 did count very skratch a soldier had...

Out,
Russian

What?

Originally posted by WestPoint23

Originally posted by Russian

Originally posted by WestPoint23


It It defenatley wont go that far i think if we got in a big war with china and our country was threatend that the people will rally together like WW2

Remember MEDIA in WW2 did count very skratch a soldier had...

Out,
Russian

What?

Ok I will clerify.

If a soldier is killed dont you see it in the news paper?

Well in WW2 in the newspaper they didnt have an article for every person killed they just had article for every 50,000 killed and people still were queit but in 2003 with less then 1000 killed people are about to bend the government the fu*k over. If you know what I mean.

Out,
Russian

unmanned combat air vehicle.

It's true that the F-22 will probably be underfunded and not produced sufficiently.

There's also probably a reason why: UCAV.

It's true that unpiloted vehicles will never fully replace expertly piloted fighters.

If the mission is sufficiently demanding and high priority, the military will send out UCAV's one-way, lik e a tomahawk.

UCAV?

Is that all US is shooting at for 6th generation?!

Russia thinks its 6th generation will be a space fighter!

As they say...

Shoot higher to be the best.

Out,
Russian