Pelosi to Aspiring Musicians: Quit Your Job, Taxpayers Will Cover Your Health Care

reply to post by jibeho


Is not such thing as free, somebody is going to pay at the end of the day, those making under 26 thousand a year and those that do not work, will be joining the Medicaid ranks.

Subsidies well, when it said that companies have to offer "affordable health care" it doesn't say what type of care you are to get.

Cheaper premiums means less coverage, but you are stuck with the rest, medications, co-pays and deductibles.

for those that have private insurance they know exactly what I am talking about, but for those that never had insurance they will be facing a reality that may be bigger than they expect

reply to post by Miracle Man

I'm not dodging.

I simply do not want to answer your questions.

Oh boy...that was a good one...do you mind if I add that to my sig?

reply to post by OutKast Searcher


Omit my name and its yours.

reply to post by snowflake_obsidian


Okay then, diplomatically speaking, you suck. Forcing a business to supply health care is a horrible idea, and this is coming from someone who spent too much of his time working as an employee. A few of those jobs I had health care, and then lost that health care when I lost that job. But no one forced my employers to provide me with health care, until I moved to California.

I was tending bar when I moved here, and walked away from a great gig in Nevada, where many bands sucked, (we called them chasers, because they chased the customers the hell out of the lounge and back into the casino), but because a full time employee was "entitled" to health care insurance here in California, very few bars would allow full time employees, so in order to pay the bills, I had to turn to sales, which because it was commission only, those companies were "exempt" from this mandatory health insurance scheme.

I hated sales, but never really found a bar that would give me more than 25 hours a week. The reason I moved to California was to pursue my dreams as an artist, but I spent too much time being a damn employee. A few years ago, I finally found the courage to walk away from that and just be an artist. It hasn't been easy, and some days chicken, some days feathers, when it comes to eating, and health insurance? Fuggedaboutit! You can always tell when business is slow for me, because when it is, you'll find me posting in here quite regularly. Sigh. That sucks too!



[edit on 17-5-2010 by Jean Paul Zodeaux]

reply to post by seagull


Well not all of them are lazy, some of them are smart enough to know that until they hit big they have to find another way to put food in the table.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


Most bars are small businesses. I am not talking about small businesses, I am talking about big lucrative companies who are avoiding paying for benefits.

reply to post by snowflake_obsidian


Yes I agree with you, but remember what I say earlier, affordable health care is not the same as quality health care for those that have private insurance we know how the private insurance business works, if you own a car you know how the mandate car insurance business work, they are not regulated either, you get what you pay for.



[edit on 17-5-2010 by marg6043]

reply to post by marg6043


I completely agree. I don't think companies have to offer free health care. When I worked at wal-mart we paid quite a bit into our health care and even though I was still paying, I was appreciative of having them help out a bit. But even if the most basic care is available, I think it's better than no care at all if that is all you can afford for the time being.

I also think that if you are in that position to only afford a basic government plan (which I believe should still have some sort of premium) you should naturally strive to overcome that need and do better for yourself and your family.

Originally posted by snowflake_obsidian
reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux

 

Most bars are small businesses. I am not talking about small businesses, I am talking about big lucrative companies who are avoiding paying for benefits.

Maybe you might want to do some research on the number of people working for small businesses - the ones the obamacare bill will really hurt along with their employees - vs. how many work for large corporations.

Never mind, here it is for you and everyone else that thinks obamacare will only affect a relatively small number of businesses and employees.

article

According to the Census Bureau and the Small Business Administration, about 60 million Americans worked for small businesses in 2006. This is about 51 percent of the private, nonfarm U.S. workforce. They define small businesses as private firms having fewer than 500 employees.

The effect of this will be huge - and it is already not a positive effect.

Originally posted by snowflake_obsidian

I also think that if you are in that position to only afford a basic government plan (which I believe should still have some sort of premium) you should naturally strive to overcome that need and do better for yourself and your family.

One would hope.

However, the history of government entitlement programs in the U.S. is that people instead just get comfortable with whatever level of support the government doles out - paid for by the taxpayers, of course.

Why would anyone expect obamacare to end up working out any differently?

reply to post by snowflake_obsidian


That is why I supported the HCR in the beginning when the original bill call for public option a choice to stay away from private insurance give some competition and still pay base on peoples ability to pay for it.

But at the end we got something that is not even close, we got a bailout for the private insurance by mandate, bigger role of the IRS in our lives and not competition or regulation and in top of that a bigger Medicaid bill that will be passed onto the tax payer meaning those that will be mandated with private insurance premiums will have to forward also more tax to pay for the overinflated monster that Medicaid will become, not only at Federal level but a state level when it comes to taxes.

That is another thing that has not been discussed here, the tax hike that we all be facing by 2014 because the HCR is not free

reply to post by centurion1211


I wasn't referring to government supported health care at all when I was referring to businesses that get out of offering benefits. I have also said that I do not necessarily support the current proposed health care reform.

Regarding the second post, I think that having a premium on health care will help with that issue. If they can afford the fair premium and want to stay on it, fine, they are still paying for a decent chunk of their health care anyways. For those who refuse to work and can't even afford the premium, well they can't get on government insurance anyways.

We could even go one step further and require for people on the system to prove that they are working to improve their situations. Now this is already done for welfare and many people know how to get around it and many intake workers ignore that people are doing this but I think we can do more to enforce that as well.

I just don't understand the one side that says we should not help our fellow man in the least little bit and then the other side that says we should give it to everyone for free. There can be a reasonable common ground here, we just need to go out of our comfort zone and disengage ourselves from our pledge to our political sides to find it.

Also, I see the word Socialism thrown around like it's a bad word. Now I don't think that with the things we have become accustomed to, ideal socialism would work. However in a socialistic society, the idea is not to take care of people who refuse to do for themselves. The idea is for everyone to do their share and help the community. In a true socialistic society, those not willing to work for their share are shunned and ostracized.

thanks for the replies guys! i'm still for health care reform so hopefully we can have a chance to go into the bill and tweak some things to make it more reasonable.

and i just want to add, what i would hope pelosi means by this, quit your job, as long as you are making some sort of living wage from your art or whatever the case may be, and the government will help you with insurance, in my opinion this would be reasonable.

oops double post.

[edit on 17-5-2010 by conspiracy nut]

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher
reply to post by dragnet53

 

From the stuff I have read about you on ATS I am going to say that you are definitely a partisan hack.

That is fine...you are free to your opinion.

I just find it funny that you follow up that post with this one

sweet so I can quit my job and people can pay for my health care? But what about my other bills does it also cover the cost Pelosi??

How the hell does a house wife have that much power? I don't mind women in power just as long as they are educated, but her I don't have a clue at all.

You go ahead and try that...go quit your job if that is honestly what you think she is saying.

I'm just going to let the "house wife" comments speak for themself.

She is saying basically quit your jobs so your creative techniques can flourish.

reply to post by semperfortis


I didn't see Pelosi say that taxpayers will cover their health care. She said exactly what is on the mind's of many people who don't like their jobs but are afraid to leave because of the high cost of health care. Paying for individual health care is OUTRAGEOUS. With this new bill, supposedly, you won't have to pay such high premiums whether you have this job, that job, or no job.

Nowhere did I hear her say that people should quit their jobs so the taxpayers can pay for their health care. She said exactly this:

We see it as an entrepreneurial bill,” Pelosi said, “a bill that says to someone, if you want to be creative and be a musician or whatever, you can leave your work, focus on your talent, your skill, your passion, your aspirations because you will have health care.”

Anything else is simply misinformation, assumptions, or jumping to conclusions. Come on people...

**Note: I hate Pelosi and I hate HCR so I'm not being biased

Edit: nevermind


[edit on 17-5-2010 by nunya13]

reply to post by mooseinhisglory



Oh God..a Socialist who thinks he, and those like him must be given free healthcare... I wonder what's next...a free car?... a free house?....

Don't give me that crap "but I am working even if it is only 6 months in a year so I should get free healthcare"... Why is so wrong about having AFFORDABLE healthcare instead of "DEMANDING free healthcare"?....

You people have no idea what Socialism really is... You have it in your heads that "it is utopia" yet you have NEVER lived the rotten fruits of Socialism...

Meanwhile you keep asking for Socialism in the U.S. the world is full of Socialist dictatorships...

You want to claim the mix of Socialism in Europe is an "utopia"?.... Christ...there are RIOTS in Europe quite frequently as Socialists keep asking for "more free things", not to mention the crime waves of Europe which always follow Socialism.... Meanwhile the Socialist elites that want to implement the same utopia you people keep asking for have caused the current global economic problems so they can implement their One World Socialist dictatorship...

There are times I really wish your wishes come true SO YOU CAN WAKE THE HELL UP AND SEE WHAT SOCIALISM REALLY IS.....


[edit on 17-5-2010 by ElectricUniverse]

reply to post by nunya13


and could you tell us how in the world is this "Socialistic healthcare" going to pay itself?...

Are you one of those who thinks money grows on trees?...

If you don't know that the taxpayer will be the one to pay for the new taxes that are coming you are really naive...