911 Debunkers Take Beating on ATS.

reply to post by K J Gunderson


and so, if she makes a statement about what she thinks is true, she deserves to be branded a troll if she doesn't immediately, on some jerk's command, cough up a bunch of links or something?

get real. you need to spend more time NOT on a message board.

if you wanna put me on ignore, that'd be fantastic.

sooner the better, in fact.

frickin kids.

[edit on 8-3-2010 by TrueTruth]

reply to post by TrueTruth


Thank you! I suppose a better way to pose this is for me to ask, why not? Why wouldn' it fall like it did? Explain why it would not fall, hittin buildings as it went down and land as it did?

reply to post by space cadet


i suppose the best answer i could give, would be to look at videos of how buildings fall during controlled demolitions, and to look at those that fell from other causes - they tend to fall at angles.

but it's not so much my bag anymore to rifle through this stuff. nowadays i just try to get the 'truthers' out there to understand what they've become, and how they are hurting the larger cause.

you have every right to ask a question, and you owe it to no one to jump at their command. these children are in dire need of manners.

other posters will no doubt take the time to discuss it with you more calmly. just not those here right now.

demand better!

Originally posted by esdad71
Yes, they were able to determine what happened inside the buildings after the 1000's of hours of research by people who are MORE than qualified. Sprinkle in a few nobel prizes and some heavy processing power and yes, you can recreate a collapse.

You mean recreate what's going on inside the building? As opposed to what's happening on the exterior of the building, which was blatantly out of line with what was actually observed of the collapsing building. Yet somehow this is inconsequential and we know the inner columns were correctly modeled anyway? Because it seems to me if they were so damned sure they got the inside right, they could get the exterior looking a little better than completely wrong.

When I watch videos of the WTC 7 I see the kink and the drop of the buildings on the roof seconds before it collapses. BEFORE the progressive collapse we see a failure. Now, in a demolition, you would SEE and HEAR the firing of the explosives and even if it was thermite as some suggest you would need something to ignite that would have left residue that is not available.

I want physical evidence.

All of that went out the window when it was hauled off. NIST didn't analyze any physical debris from WTC7 at all for their report. That means no analyzing anything for residues, either. So the chances of that are already shot all to hell. That doesn't mean it wasn't there, only that if it was, you aren't going to be able to find it anymore.

I am not an expert, I already said so. I have worked in construction, I have worked around demolition, I am trying to see what it is about this particular building that has truthers so sure that it is a conspiracy, because I do no see it. As I menioned, I lost family that day, telling me someone in my own counry did it, means a lot to me, however, I have not seen proof of this. these pictures only prove it looks normal.And if you drop something, does it not fall straiht down?

Originally posted by TrueTruth
reply to post by evil incarnate

 

maybe she simply hasn't spent as much time as some people have on reading tons of reports. this does not a troll make.

Making a claim and then refusing to back it up but attempting to distract 4 times a troll does make. Now you are just saying things. Why bother? Let her defend herself, ok?

maybe she'd be more inclined to say more if you didn't talk to her like some kind of buffoon. ever thought that maybe you turn people off?

With what? I did ask for examples right? I told you that you are lying about me and that you need to provide examples of what you claim I am doing. Have you found any?

trust me - i missed nothing. she came in, asked a couple of questions, and people jumped all over her like she was on fire.

I was polite. I never once attacked her questions. I never attacked her at all. Apparently you are blaming me for behavior you witnessed from others. This would be why you have no examples of what you claim I was doing.

I did ask you to prove what you were saying about me, right? What good is a claim you cannot prove? Is it worth anything?

You are mad about how people reacted to her questions. I never addressed her questions so I am not one of those people. If you have a problem with someone, please take it up with them. I was not rude at all. You have no quotes of me being rude in any way.

nobody needs to bark on your command - especially when you have no trace of civility in you at all.

I was actually very civil. This is my entire post right here -

This is a curious thing to say and star. Why would be surrounded by other buildings cause it to fall straight down? I am not attacking you but honestly asking what the logic is to this claim.

Where is the lack of civility? Where is the thuggishness? Where is the rudeness? You get one more chance. Show me where I have been any of the things you are claiming I am being or just go away. You are obviously lying or confused. I am willing to give you the benefit of the doubt and let you go back and look. See if you can find what you say you see.

vanish? go screw.

get back to me when you need two hands to count your pubes.

So I am the one being uncivil?

Originally posted by TrueTruth
reply to post by K J Gunderson

 

and so, if she makes a statement about what she thinks is true, she deserves to be branded a troll if she doesn't immediately, on some jerk's command, cough up a bunch of links or something?

Are you ill? She made a clear statement of FACT. Do you know what that means? She did not say 'I think this happened.' She clearly said it DID happen.

As far as immediately, what is it about 4 tries you do not understand?

get real. you need to spend more time NOT on a message board.

Unlike you who should spend hours here talking about other peoples pubic hair?

if you wanna put me on ignore, that'd be fantastic.

sooner the better, in fact.

frickin kids.

[edit on 8-3-2010 by TrueTruth]

Sorry if I am not mature enough to say things that make no sense, are not true, and call people names and talk about their pubes. Some day I will be a big boy like that.

Thank you so very much, Thetruth. If the OP had hired someone to come in here and completely back up what they were saying, they could not have done as good a job as you. For that, you get a star!

"a troll is someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community"

I have done none of this. I have clearly stated I am not an expert, and I am lookin for an answer, why do you believe what you do. Oh and it is not 4 tries, it is 4 times tryin to get an answer. I get answered with more ??????'s. I give up on this thread. Bye.

[edit on 8-3-2010 by space cadet]
edit to add, I have missing keys, just want to say that efore you say something about my typing too.

[edit on 8-3-2010 by space cadet]

reply to post by evil incarnate


This is roughly where your tone turned, as you began to become indignant that your marching orders were not followed:

"
That is simply not true though. Where is this damage to the other buildings from all that debris bouncing off and back inward all the way down?

You can clearly see in the video that the building goes straight down. Where do you see anything bouncing off of any other buildings?

Where is the damage report about these buildings?

What you are saying sounds all nice and good but it is completely contradicted by all the evidence considered evidence by both the truthers and the supporters of the OS.

Unless you can prove otherwise, it seems you are just saying things. "


***


People can't make observations now? People can't 'just say things' without you going on to call the a troll? Get over yourself.

***

She then tells you this is based on her personal experience being around demolition sites, to which you responded:

"Please, either back up your claim or tell me you cannot. It is really that simple. I am not looking to go around in circles with double talk. It only takes one response.

You made a claim, please present the evidence or retract it. That simple. Anything else is obviously trolling.

Now to the person that said truthers just put anyone they disagree with on ignore...please take note of the fact that I have asked this question 4 times now. Should I not put a person on ignore for playing games instead of just standing by what they say?"

***

Can you honestly not understand how accusing her of 'double talk', accusing her of 'obviously trolling', and then saying she ought to be ignored.... is plain old rude?

If you truly can not, then perhaps I should be more sad for you than angry, but it is what it is. You were rude. Own it. It'll make you a better person.

reply to post by K J Gunderson


I'm guessing by the warning on your profile that I'm not the first person to point out your 'social deficits'.

Maybe you should consider whether there's a reason for this reaction in your tone.

And maybe you should look at the concise 'troll' definition cadet posted- notice that it does not include 'does not answer any and all demands immediately' .

I tend to think you know exactly what it is you are doing that is wrong. And if not, well, then you're in for a rough life.

reply to post by TrueTruth


when i said, "buddy", i was referring to beck, not you.
i'm not upset you won't make me chase my tale, er, that i'm not worthy of a discussion with you, either.

i only held your words up to a mirror for you, anyway. i'm happy you didn't like what you saw.

Originally posted by TrueTruth
reply to post by evil incarnate

 

This is roughly where your tone turned, as you began to become indignant that your marching orders were not followed:

"
That is simply not true though. Where is this damage to the other buildings from all that debris bouncing off and back inward all the way down?

You can clearly see in the video that the building goes straight down. Where do you see anything bouncing off of any other buildings?

Where is the damage report about these buildings?

What you are saying sounds all nice and good but it is completely contradicted by all the evidence considered evidence by both the truthers and the supporters of the OS.

Unless you can prove otherwise, it seems you are just saying things. "


***


People can't make observations now? People can't 'just say things' without you going on to call the a troll? Get over yourself.

Now my tone changed? I thought I was uncivil? Where is that? Thuggish behavior? All you have now is a change of tone? That is not what you claimed before resorting to talking about my pubic hair.

People can just say things and make observations all they like. When they claim that what they observed is a fact then that requires proof.

When I ask 4 times for proof and get nonsense distractions as responses, that is trolling. There is a reason you have been asked why you do not understand this concept and you refuse to even address it. This is the reality, sweety.

She claimed something was true and I simply asked her to back it up. I then had to ask 3 more times. Why should I have to ask more than once if she is interested in the truth and an honest discussion? Can you explain that?

She then tells you this is based on her personal experience being around demolition sites, to which you responded:

"Please, either back up your claim or tell me you cannot. It is really that simple. I am not looking to go around in circles with double talk. It only takes one response.

You made a claim, please present the evidence or retract it. That simple. Anything else is obviously trolling.

Now to the person that said truthers just put anyone they disagree with on ignore...please take note of the fact that I have asked this question 4 times now. Should I not put a person on ignore for playing games instead of just standing by what they say?"

***

Can you honestly not understand how accusing her of 'double talk', accusing her of 'obviously trolling', and then saying she ought to be ignored.... is plain old rude?

Can you not see how playing games and making me ask the same question about the claim she made 4 times constitutes nothing more than trolling? Still looking for uncivil and thuggish.

If you truly can not, then perhaps I should be more sad for you than angry, but it is what it is. You were rude. Own it. It'll make you a better person.

That is your opinion. How do you think you have been? Read my first question to her again. Oh that is right, you do not need to. You acknowledged that I was polite because my "tone changed." Well, your tone never changed. Tell me something.

You can think I was rude all you like and there is nothing I can do about that. You admit I was polite at first though. So how is someone who has been nothing but rude in any position to judge someone they admit was at least polite to begin with? Glass house much?

The bottom line is that I have no asked you twice to show where I was thuggish or uncivil. I will not be asking again. You have added nothing to this thread, this discussion, or even the conversation I was having with spacecadet. You have just been rude and that is all. I have no need for that.

reply to post by BlackOps719


I agree with you, that Science will answer many questions about the 9/11 Conspiracy.

I can't believe some"debunkers" are still using the old silly theories put out years ago on purpose to try and stop the real truth surfacing at a future date.

Hopefully soon, more people will realize that Real Science and real Physics can't be disputed or "debunked".

I'm Sure we will still have a couple of "debunkers" trying to defend the OS even right to the very end

reply to post by billybob


sure you were. makes.... no sense at all.

and my words? i liked them just fine. in fact, they're great.

all i didn't like was your assumptions about me. not that they're unique - but boy does it get old watching people make a false dichotomy sort of knee jerk categorization - anyone who questions truthers is a Bush apologist.

blah blah blah.

that kind of smear gets old real fast.

do try to come up with something more original.

reply to post by evil incarnate


funny thing is, she asked 4 times for some kind of explanation as to why her observations didn't make sense to you guys, and instead, you demanded SHE explain herself.

so, you did what you accuse her of, and you were rude about it to boot.

if you can't see it, that's your loss.

truly is.

just be thankful you have the internet.

reply to post by evil incarnate


Look Evil, I was not makin a 'claim' or a 'fact', I was making an observation. Don't you get it? My proof? the picture that was posted by he OP.

Originally posted by TrueTruth

I'm guessing by the warning on your profile that I'm not the first person to point out your 'social deficits'.

Yep, you are an amazing judge of character. Are you a criminal profiler? you are truly amazing. Here I thought my super friendly looking avatar would fool everyone but not you.

Maybe you should consider whether there's a reason for this reaction in your tone.

I think you are confusing me with evil incarnate. First you confused them with people who attacked spacecadet's questions and now you are confusing him with me.

The difference is that I do not care what your reaction to me is.

And maybe you should look at the concise 'troll' definition cadet posted- notice that it does not include 'does not answer any and all demands immediately' .

What are you special? What is it about "immediately" you do not understand? She was asked FOUR TIMES!!!!

I would really love to hear you explain how there is anything immediate about that. Can you? Will you even try? I am betting it all on NO.

I tend to think you know exactly what it is you are doing that is wrong. And if not, well, then you're in for a rough life.

Yes, because I am some young child lacking the appropriate number of pubic hair to please you, right? Would you like to come count mine? Start with the grey ones, junior.

How about you get something through your little head. I never pretended to be the most polite person in the world but you are lashing out at me and others for crap that happened before we even posted in this thread. You are an idiot if you cannot understand that 4 times is 3 times too many to call it an "immediate" demand before she is labeled a troll. Do not try and tell me what kind of life I am in for when I have lived your life, evil's life, space cadets life, and still have a bit left to go. I grew out of worrying about other boys pubic hair counts decades ago. Wait, I never went through that phase. Well, I have still had decades and decades for it to come around but it never did.

You assume much and so far have been nothing but wrong. You really are doing an amazing job for the OP. If I could tip you, I would. No go discuss the boys pubic hairs somewhere else please as that kind of juvenile BS is really beneath even some of the lowest ATS standards. It is also a window into the freudian mess that is your intellect that I care not a glimpse through, thank you very much.

reply to post by evil incarnate


me? nothing but rude?

that's entertaining. in fact, just a short while ago, i got a star in another thread for being civil and open minded.

from me, you get what you give.

bsbray was being rude, so i decided to engage him, so to speak.

and you were being rude as well.

maybe you really don't see it. i suppose that's possible.

if so, then let me educate you:

You were being rude. You can't just demand crap from people, and then insult them as you did if they don't give it to you. You could just as well have answered HER question, by offering an explanation of how buildings fall. But you didn't. Instead, you chose a more confrontational approach. And it was obvious you were headed in that direction - experience and all, you know.

Take umbrage all you like. I don't care at all.

But I'm right, and someday, you'll know it.

reply to post by TrueTruth


you implied that truthers are fanatics and followers of fanatics. i pointed out that the OS believer crowd is as fanatic and hateful as any crowd.
it really wasn't that personal against "you". thin skin?

[edit on 8-3-2010 by billybob]

reply to post by K J Gunderson


you have no idea what a troll is. you can invent your own definition for words if you like, but don't be surprised when other people look at you funny.

and if you're really old enough to have gray hair, then I'm at a loss to understand your behavior. i guess then, there's no excuse for it.

but i imagine you know that - you just enjoy being a lousy person.

awesome life!

(aren't you a little old for the whole goth thing?)



[edit on 8-3-2010 by TrueTruth]