Exposing Christianity

Originally posted by Romantic_Rebel
reply to post by anarchist-rebel

 

You know, there's numerous anti-christian sites online these days. Why always make something so terrible and ugly? Of course Christianity has had it's shares with violence and what not in the past. Does that make it evil? What about other belief systems? As a Atheist I'm ashamed of other Atheist always trying to be what they hate the most and that is promoting fear to change a person's belief.

Actually, disembowling someone for religion sake is pretty #ing evil.
2nd line.

reply to post by PublicDefenseCorp

It wasn't done for "religion's sake", it was done for power and money for the Catholic church. They just did it under the veil of religion, they perverted the message of Christ for their own gains. I can't think of a single teaching of Jesus that condoned disemboweling people.

Originally posted by Watcher-In-The-Shadows
reply to post by ashanu90

 

Let me put it this way. Do you fault modern southern caucasians for the inequities of slavery during the 19th century? Don't answer please I am not here to bait you, but, that is the equivilant of what you are doing here.

either way you bait me if i say nothing you will say i am lost for words if i say something you will call me an idiot for answering a rhetorichal question

no i do not blame southerners for slavery and when have i ever said modern christians are eveil? you didn't say that but thats what your getting at.

what is the point of christianity in the first place? christians still use fear to gather followers
"if you don't beleive you will go to hell"
what loving god would send you to hell for being a freethinker
and no im not saying christians can't be free thinkers don't even start that

anyone have any thoughts?

Originally posted by Romans 10:9
Christians have been the most persecuted group in all of history.

Thats phenomenal rubbish.

The Jews have the Christians beat by a long shot, and I'm not even talking about the Holocaust. Everyone had a crack at the Jews. From the ancient Babylonians, Greeks, and Romans, to the medieval and Renaissance Europeans, right up into the early 20th century Pogroms in Russia.

I hereby mock and deride your absurd statement.

Seem to be missing the point... dudes.

"Exposing" suggests 'revealing'... but I learned about the Inquisition in 5th grade.

"no for religions sake...." I think the only people they disemboweled were heretics of one kind or another.

Jesus' Father, the Power of Israel...is good for blood....especially of the guilty.
Judas, Jezabel, Egyptian Army, the Worshipers of Baal.... etc, etc.

Jesus did not teach this, and it would be mere speculation to say that his father commanded this during the early stages of the Church as a slight 'incentive'.

I'm not saying or casting judgment on anyone or anything, but it seems to be redundant to debate a religion with absolutely no Theological basis or perspective.
You call yourselves 'conspiracy theorists' or 'freethinkers'.... yet all ad hominem attacks are blinding to yourselves.

EG. Where is the proof that the inquisition was for moneys sake?
Because their is proof it was for religions sake.

How do you establish 'speculative intent'.....
I mean they killed the Knights Templar after the the Crusades....hmmmmm

We are not emotional beings....like dogs.
We are Sentient... you know like, stop feeling, and construct a useful argument.

The matter of the fact is .... this forum exposes nothing but common knowledge.
It is a logically inductive form of fitting history to a supposedly paranoid agenda....
I say supposedly because I personally have a huuuge grin on my face.

But, for the sake of the matter... apocalyptically hypothetically, while Muslims bomb their own, and Buddhists burn themselves alive... the Jews and Christians won't, and therefore will win. Additionally, many 'heretic' lives will be saved for fear of being disemboweled.

Survival of the fittest, huh Darwin?

reply to post by Zombomb
"EG. Where is the proof that the inquisition was for moneys sake?
Because their is proof it was for religions sake."

It was for the sake of Money and Power. The message of the protestant evangelicals was stealing thousands upon thousands of Catholics from their churches. The Protestants were telling them that it was okay and encouraged to read their Bibles, and that salvation was faith alone, with no need of "works" that the Catholics didn't like.

Originally posted by anarchist-rebel
I came across this site and thought it'd be good to share since I haven't seen it on here (ATS). I'd love to hear thoughts from Christians, or about how they can justify this.

www.exposingchristianity.com...

The Inquisition was a campaign of torture, mutilation, mass murder and destruction of human life perpetrated by xtians. The church increased in power until it had total control over human life, both secular and religious. The Vatican wasn't satisfied with the progress made by regional leaders in rooting out heresy. Pope Innocent III commissioned his own inquisitors who answered directly to him. Their authority was made official in the papal bull of March 25th, 1199.7Innocent declared "anyone who attempted to construe a personal view of god which conflicted with the church dogma must be burned without pity."

One of the torture methods mentioned was "making the victim drink tons of water, while making them swallow pieces of knotted roped, and then yanking the rope out, thus disemboweling the victim"

Not bashing xtians or anything...

Anyone actually reading the Gospel of Christ would know that these people were not Christians. There was an organization called the Catholic Church, that claims the name of Christ as if it were their own, but that was and still is an organization with it's own laws, rules, and religion. I could put on a fireman hat and coat and call myself a fireman and then go around lighting fires that burn down buildings, but that doesn't make me a fireman. Training, and doing the deeds of a fireman makes me a fireman. Obeying the code and creed of the fireman makes me a fireman. An organization calling itself Christian yet now doing the deeds of Christ cannot be Christian by it's very actions against the Gospel of Christ. Read the Gospel (Matthew, Mark, Luke, or John) and see if what the Catholic Church did was Christlike or not. It was not. So the argument against Christianity here is refuted.

My fingers ache just at the thought of how long i could go on with this topic! Interesting post and link though.. thank you for sharing..

As everyone I am sure knows, all religions have blood bathed pasts.. in the name of their chosen 'saviour' of course.. and its always disgusted me. I asm far from being a Christian myself, because most xtians give the whole lot of them a bad representation.. usually simply using the title of xtian to make people assume they are good and kind and at all ethical..when its just a cover of sorts.. I have a feeling this happens more often than not.
Most (not all) Xtians themselves annoy me though, with or without torture within their history. But is certainly isnt just this particular faith that has done such atrocities.

haha! this can be a reaaallly long topic...
i' mean, "You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone," (James 2:24) and " . . . so also faith without works is dead," (James 2:26)....then we have a whole new conversation!
Or if it is God's will for the 'heretics' to die if conversion is refused is being put up for discussion, hardly anyone is using a Theological basis.... because if they did the answer is most definitely 'YES'... this is the Religious purpose of the church.... stated in the first page, all the way up to 'Revelation'.
Additionally to the motive of attacks against Protestants was the 'Eucharist'.
Now I guess we could go on and on about how the Church can use a 'piece of bread' to cause to much death blah-blah-ad hominem-nonsense-nonsense....
then the point is missed entirely. We ARE talking about a RELIGIOUS event... you know, the ones that pertain to spiritual realms and souls right?
it would be beneficial to put aside personal 'speculation' as to such because Science goes both ways.
We are dealing with motive and ethics as though it seems. Which is in fact a good topic.
In response to whether 'disemboweling' people is ethically Christlike the answer is no.
Though as previously stated, Judas was completely 'disemboweled' by God after hanging himself....So it is not Un-Godlike.
I personally disagree with coercion and prefer to 'allure', but both work, and prudence is above all... and so establish the disastrous effect of the 'will of men' in during the Inquisition.
Now, seeing as the Knights Templar themselves were killed after the Crusades for their own Heresy, we can in fact deduce that 'money' was not the prime motive...after all they brought 'tons' of gold in and could keep doing so; therein refuting the argument of the Church an 'organization'. The term is wrong; "Institution" is better.....because of it's such laws.
Also, Protestants were not the only ones prosecuted during these times and killing 'Cannibalistic Indian tribes' does not really benefit the economy per say.

So basically I can't seem to figure out what is being exposed:
Let's review some facts:
Disemboweling People is probably bad... ok got that.
The Catholic Church apologized and recanted its support for the Crusade...ok got that.
Whether money is the motive for killing poor people... not sure.
The Christian God of Peace rose to power despite the Crusades... got that.
Catholic Relief Services and other organizations do more to help people than the Governement.... got that.
The Catholic Church has less power than 'Anti-Christian Military Forces' but way more 'influence'... ok got that....
So.... what are we talking about? hmm.... It's either "opinions" or "Why aren't you Catholic?"..........i have a feeling we are stuck in Opinions.

reply to post by Zombomb


I don't consider the Lord to be a liar..

"For the LUST of money IS the root of ALL evil.

If you're the Catholic church and millions of your parishioners are poised to leave the church because of the Revelations given to the reformers, then guess what it was exactly that they were scared of losing? People, but the Catholic church didn't simply see their parishioners as PEOPLE, but dollar signs.

You're most likely forgetting what the church SOLD at that point in time...

INDULGENCES.

Originally posted by Roark

Originally posted by Romans 10:9
Christians have been the most persecuted group in all of history.

Thats phenomenal rubbish.

The Jews have the Christians beat by a long shot, and I'm not even talking about the Holocaust. Everyone had a crack at the Jews. From the ancient Babylonians, Greeks, and Romans, to the medieval and Renaissance Europeans, right up into the early 20th century Pogroms in Russia.

I hereby mock and deride your absurd statement.

How about some stats then...

* More than 43 million Christians have been killed for their faith since the crucifixion of Jesus.

* It's been estimated that more Christians have been martyred in the 20th Century than in all the prior 1,900 years combined.

* There have been more than 26 million documented cases of martyrdom in this century alone.

* More than 200 million Christians in over 60 nations face persecution each day, 60% of these are children.

* 150,000 to 165,000 are martyred each year.

reply to post by Romans 10:9

Those are interesting statistics, but where is the link that's associated with them? You gotta show your source for those numbers friend.

www.persecution.com...

reply to post by Romans 10:9


Ok, I know there aren't supposed to be any one-liners so I'll make this fancy.
Awesome.
Funny how emotional people are really just fearful.
Long live the sentient being.
As far as Revelations are concerned that should be a big one.
I also like 'denial' alongside 'disclosure'... because without both present,
there wouldn't be much of any conspiracy 'theory'.

Yeshua is my God. Righteous and true he is. Most abundant is his mercy.

The things man has done to man. He has also done to the son of God.

It is man who has done these things, of his own free will.

Ashanu90

also i don't see how anyone can accuse someone of witchcraft since magic doesn't exist

What is the next thing you will strike from existence?

[edit on 17-3-2010 by randyvs]

reply to post by ashanu90

either way you bait me if i say nothing you will say i am lost for words if i say something you will call me an idiot for answering a rhetorichal question

Um. No. I said what I meant and I meant what I said. Now, if you really really wish me to act like a jerk.... Well.......... I still don't think I can or will accomidate you. But, kindly do not pass judgement on me for things you think I might possibly do, you do not know me as well as you apparently think.

no i do not blame southerners for slavery and when have i ever said modern christians are eveil? you didn't say that but thats what your getting at.

Look at your comments. Look at the name of this thread.

what is the point of christianity in the first place? christians still use fear to gather followers
"if you don't beleive you will go to hell"
what loving god would send you to hell for being a freethinker
and no im not saying christians can't be free thinkers don't even start that

Fascinating that you would contradict yourself. Or do you think speaking in contradictions is a constructive thing?
Sime fact of the matter is, you're not Christian and that is fine. Regardless of how much you may think that they are arrayed against you. But, you are in no position to judge because you are no better than they are.

anyone have any thoughts?

Any thoughts you wish to hear right?

reply to post by Full_Vision


Humans will invoke whatever concept best suites them to get what they want.

Originally posted by Romans 10:9
www.persecution.com...

Thank you for posting that brother. i always get a kick when the facts blow the rhetoric out of the water.

Why why why must every belief system err whatever always shoot for the woe-be-me-I'm-most-pursecuted BS??? Do they think that makes them seem more right? I don't understand.

Originally posted by Watcher-In-The-Shadows
Why why why must every belief system err whatever always shoot for the woe-be-me-I'm-most-pursecuted BS??? Do they think that makes them seem more right? I don't understand.

Start on page one and follow the conversation if you really care to know why it was brought up in the debate.