The Final Minutes of the South Tower - The flaming inferno

For the most part I try not to even post on this topic anymore. People are very set in their opinions and I really don't see anyone changing another's mind at this point. Although it can be very amusing to watch the same old arguments posted again and again, and it is even more amusing to watch the believers of the official fairy tale lay down the same old traps and the truthers fall for them again. At least it would be very comical if it were not for the fact that this topic cost the lives of thousands of people and continues to claim lives today as more first responders die as a result of their courage on that day.

Originally posted by dereks

Originally posted by andy1972
WORLD TRADE CENTER 1
WORLD TRADE CENTER 2

Both damaged when airliners hit them, and the fire was not fought...

So now the fires were not fought? Not at all? Then what were those firefighters doing in the towers? Were they there to "document the event?" I have to wonder if you actually pay attention to what is posted or what you even post. Lets refer back to the transmission where the firefighter makes the claim of being trapped in the stairwell because of a fire. Does he not say that they (the firefighters) were going to "knock down the fire" before meeting up with other fire fighters? So if thats what they claimed, wouldn't that mean they were fighting the fire? Maybe they are just "truther lies" as well lol

WORLD TRADE CENTER 7

Rather severely damaged when WTC1 fell on it, unchecked fires burrnt for hours....

Wow...so enlightening and comical you are. So let me be sure I understand what you are saying. WTC 1 fell on to WTC Building 7 causing massive damage, in addition to unchecked fires caused Building 7 to fall into it's own footprint? This would sound reasonable except for one little detail.... if this were the case why it is that the buildings on both side of WTC 7 did not suffer this same demise? Just look at the aerial photos of ground zero...

Ground Zero
So you want people to believe that WTC tower 1 basically fell down doing damage to the building with the big hole in it's roof (but not causing collapse) doing damage to the building to the right of the one with the hole in it's roof (and not causing collapse) but went clear across the street causing so much damage to building 7 to cause collapse, but some how by an act of god did very little damage to the buildings on either side of 7? Sorry but the Jack and the beanstalk story is much more believable than what you are asserting here.

Let's not even touch on the fact that building 7 would have fallen into the path of least resistance, like all things do, if fires were raging out of control to a point to weaken the steel but instead it fell straight down into the path with the most resistance. Unless you are trying to say that the fire and damage caused ALL the steel in the middle of the building from the top to the bottom to weaken in a completely even spread out fashion which would make straight down the path of least resistance. And please do not try to tell me that building 7 didnt fall straight down. If you actually bother to click the link I provided for you, you can clearly see the very neat pile of rubble that was building 7 and again on either side, what certainly appears to be 2 very stable buildings.

Yes the only three steel framed buildings to fall by cause of fire....HOW BIZARRE IS THAT

So what other steel framed buildings had airliners hit them?

Fair question, and I would say just recently we had a plane hit a building in Austin Texas. I waited for that collapse, but it never came. Granted it was no where close to the size of what hit the towers, but no plane hit WTC 7 either.

Almost as bizarre as Alan Silverstein taking out insurance policies that paid DOUBLE INDEMNITY if damaged by terrorist attack....

Truther lie again www.911myths.com...

"Truther lie" LOL I just got such a big laugh out of that, and for that I should thank you. I personally do not call it a "lie" I call it someone being a bit misinformed. First off I am not familiar with anyone named Alan, but I am familiar with Larry who updated his insurance policy to include terrorist attacks, and in fact he did get paid double what the policy was worth when he argued in court that when a second plane hit the second tower it constituted two separate terrorist attacks and not just one and thus he was paid for each terrorist attack. Regardless of what anyone believes, one must admit it was a very shrewd move on Larry's part cause in the end he made a lot of money on his initial investment

Originally posted by MrWendal

Just look at the aerial photos of ground zero...

Ground Zero

Hey is that a cool pic or what?

Wow one building has a great big hole in it's roof, but it didn't fall down.

How come the building with a red granite casing fell down but no planes hit it?

Originally posted by ImAPepper

"numerous 10-45's code 1".

- Chief Orio Palmer
For those of you that don't know, a 10-45 code 1 is a dead person.

7. The structure of the tower was not melted or deformed.

Melted? This is another pathetic attempt to play the melted steel game. We all know the steel was not melted.

In regards to deformities of the structure:

Even as people streamed down the stairs, the cracks were appearing in the walls as the building shuddered and cringed. Steam pipes burst, and at one point an elevator door burst open and a man fell out, half burned alive, his skin hanging off. People dragged him out of the elevator and helped get him out of the building to the doctors below. "If I had listened to the announcement," says survivor Joan Feldman, "I'd be dead right now."

78th floor
Kelly Reyher, AON Corporation: The elevator split at the seams, the floor blew up. You could just sort of look right through the corner of the elevator into the elevator shaft and it was just all fire.

So I was able to crawl out. And then when I crawled out you just saw an absolute scene of destruction. Across from me, because when you crawl out you're facing the other elevator bank, they were completely destroyed. There was fire just shooting out those

source: "Accounts From the South Tower" The New York Times, May 26, 2002

77th floor
Somewhere around the 77th floor, the stairway walls were cracked, and you could look through the cracks and see flames. They were just quietly licking up, not a roaring inferno. And there was some smoke there, but again I think the stairs were pressurized, pushing the air out so we had less smoke in the stairway than you might imagine.

-Brian Clark

8. Rescue Workers were climbing on un-compromised staircases

As you can see above from the survivors, the stairwells were compromised. In FACT, in this very transmission at about the 8:18 mark of the YouTube Video, there were firefighters fighting a fire in the B - Stairwell:

Orio we are here on 78 but we are in the b stair we're trapped in here we've got to put some fire out to get to you............. All right, we are going to knock down some fire here in the "B" stair and we will meet up with you
- Joseph Leavey


[edit on 7-3-2010 by ImAPepper]

Firstly, apology to any who prefer, that this poster was not encouraged.
-----------------

Some of the stuff posted , albeit note the quotes are from WTC2!!! not WTC1
......(regardless if it was somehow intended to support the "truster" case?) goes IMHO to: one of the main issues.

The OS, (NIST) had to come up with a story to try and explain incidents as partially described in quotations cited.

Basically OS BS! ...it goes... that the aircraft spilled unexploded fuel into the elevator shafts.

We all can clearly see (in any decent footage) F175 hit a corner of WTC2 huge explosion on entry and come out the adjacent side with another fire ball.

Sunbstatial amount fuel ( hardly any) could have gone anywhere near the central elevators, below 78th lobby

So we have an eye witness account (quoted by (Dr!!) IamaPepper ) of....

-Massive fire and explosive force below skylobby level.

-So much force that it entirely blew the elevator floor (what were they aluminium? or stainless steel?)...to bits!!!

If ....there was some kerosene in the empty elevator shaft????? then the fire ball force would travel from ignition to the greatest oxygen supply... which would be DOWN! Couldn't have been coming up because on "a flicker" through cracks below on 77and 78 stairwell isolated they could "knock it down" and soon join their mates.

So what caused these massive explosions? That also cooked people?

Surely not the fire that the lady seem in white slacks waving was near, nor the oxygen starved black smolder that gradually filtered upward from impact in both WTC1 & 2.

NOTE: A demo would need the central core structure to be demolished with violent quick acting agents which burn at massive heat, to produce the "neatish" rubble pile in footprint.

Of course, fair enough, some damage toa few floors may have "bowed and distorted" support trusees. BUt they all let go in sequence evry perimiter and internal floor support collapsed at once so THAT according to the ....OS.... the floors fell horizonally....not at a angle that required further strain to break the intact supports.

The oxygen starved hydrocarbon fire would have esculated, but all the way to the top breaking every floor support? Nah!

We need a new, independent, international investigation into 9/11 because all available evidence doesn't add up to what we were led to believe.

Aye, I agree. But who? Can't trust the UN, can't trust any governments, can't trust the churches, can't trust anyone in power. So who?

Originally posted by Gregarious

We need a new, independent, international investigation into 9/11 because all available evidence doesn't add up to what we were led to believe.

Aye, I agree. But who? Can't trust the UN, can't trust any governments, can't trust the churches, can't trust anyone in power. So who?

How about firemen?

They all raced in to help people.

It's obvious that they were not in on the impending implosions. If they had prior knowledge they wouldn't have gone in.

So they should be the judge, jury and executioners.

Still shocks me to this day,

Im not sure if i belive Loose change two and the hidden message's that may or may not encode within its format.

lets examin some photos I have found recently to see if they can help with what ever your looking for, stange how there is so much evidence now to suggest it was possibly an insider job, some recently close up photos of the towers before they calapsed. I have seen so much footage about this and still think that the war on terror all started because of this.

Roof of World Trade Center North Tower, 11 September 2001
New York City Police Department Aviation Unit (civilian aircraft banned over NYC)
Via National Institute of Standards and Technology FOIA Release of 3,160 Electronic Records of the WTC Collapse Investigation

The helicopter had approached the roof through near-blinding smoke to check for and evacuate survivors but found none. Cellphone calls said occupants attempted to batter the doors open but could not; escape downward was blocked by fire and debris, there was no way out. The building-code-mandated, panic-hardware exit doors to the roof were illegally locked to prevent access to the antennas which allegedly emitted hazardous radiation

cryptome.org...

cryptome.org...

cryptome.org...

cryptome.org...

cryptome.org...

cryptome.org...

(cryptome.org...) very interesting website I have stubled accross * enjoy.

reply to post by In nothing we trust


I would be genuinely interested to find out what you believe. There are many, many perspectives on what happened, and it pays to look into all of them.

I saw you mention the possibility of the radio transmissions being jammed. If they were, that would be a rather important piece of the puzzle, wouldn't it?
What could be the cause? EMP? Or a deliberate attempt to conceal evidence? I'm sure there could also be a lot of mundane reasons as well, but it certainly gets you thinking.

What are your ideas?

A number of possabilites could have caused this I will note them in order of what I have learnt from News, people, and transcripts,

All planes suppost to be grounded because of a Norad intelligence game to strike the pentagon and other locations including the twin towers,

Footage of UFO's and Silver unmarked Planes still flying over the twin towers,

Leaflets with the twin towers in cross hairs, depicting them as a target relased before hand,

7 billion dollar insurance claim made before the world bank incase of a terrorist attack as the building was so old that the interior work needed to be replaced.

Head of intilligence building callapses for no reason... along with more than 20 other buildings in the area

Gold apparently being removed from the towers or close building money never recovered.

Agents aprently sent into the building before hand to remove the steel structures called out different office sections to gain access without panic.

CIA payroll may have been paying Osama - who was apparently in hospital and being guarded by one of them at the time.

Bush reading a book upside down to the school kids and pretending not to know anything.

arabic people caught filming the incident. Terror accross the media when showing the same pictures over and over again to shock people into a fearfull state,

Explosions going off below areas then the floor calapses.

Fire rescue workers pulling people out of the basement on fire , reporting explosions near the elevator shafts.

Prior warning given to pentagon officials and people not to board those planes,

Terror campain to invade other countries, possibly.

Some kind of Isralle coverup of information on a possible connection or coverup again, to discreadit the current government and doings?

Political government leaders admiting it was an Inside job, possibly more dissinformation - I really dont know if we will ever get the truth behind this,

Small Thermo Nuclear devices - termite traces found ,

I really think this is to get the most intelligent people or patriots who belive in their country to some how become a scapegoat, and then be used as a so Called (nut or Terrorist) to be targated or used to then feed the masses with acurate facts that are shocking and un deniable,

Really its just an excuse to start WW3 , and if it comes i can tell you now i would opt for the seccond option because a war like that will end all wars.

thats if there is even anything left. I say move on what has happend in the past has already happened. Only a Super computer with with enough power will tell us the answer and im sure it will not be what the majority of people think is correct thats for sure. Things like this are out of our control, untill we take control of the situation and that is becoming stronger and better so next time we can help more people to survive , survival of the fittest and strongest. I feel sorry and forgiive the people who have attacked us. But I will not lay down and die the fight must go on we are still at war and we need to work together more to create a better future free of this constant panic that we live in. I say it was a wake up call and now we are still thinking about the precious life that was lost. What about all the killing we are doing right now? War is a way for the PTB to make money and to depopulate. Things are moving very rappid these days and I would say according to this information www.freepressinternational.com another attack has been planned and I just hope that its non Nuclear.

If the fire was so hot it could melt steel, then how did these people survive both the initial aircraft impact, aswell as the "inferno."

www.historycommons.org...

911research.wtc7.net...

Originally posted by ROBL240
If the fire was so hot it could melt steel, then how did these people survive both the initial aircraft impact, aswell as the "inferno."

www.historycommons.org...

911research.wtc7.net...

She didn't survive. She actually jumped to her death.

Originally posted by ImAPepper

Originally posted by ROBL240
If the fire was so hot it could melt steel, then how did these people survive both the initial aircraft impact, aswell as the "inferno."

www.historycommons.org...

911research.wtc7.net...

She didn't survive. She actually jumped to her death.

Are you really this stupid? You do this all the time. You respond to people by demonstrating that you have no clue what you just read. Let me show you again...

people survive both the initial aircraft impact, aswell as the "inferno."

Whether she jumped to her death, shot herself, drank poison, or had a stroke, she still survived both the initial aircraft impact, as well as the "inferno."

The dispute is about the temperature she was withstanding before she jumped. There should have been no woman to jump, just a burned corpse.

Your response does not even make sense, as usual. Why are you like this? Who is disputing whether or not jumping would have killed her? The point is that where she was standing is supposedly far too hot for her to be able to stand there for any length of time.

She did indeed survive THE IMPACT AND THE FIRE. She did not survive hitting the ground but no one was disputing that, genius.

[edit on 8-3-2010 by K J Gunderson]

Originally posted by K J Gunderson
Whether she jumped to her death, shot herself, drank poison, or had a stroke, she still survived both the initial aircraft impact, as well as the "inferno."

No, she really didn't. Do you think she jumped out of boredom?? The point it, she chose how to die. She would either burn to death or die from smoke inhalation. She chose another route. So, what caused her to jump? Hmmmmmmm..

hint: fire or smoke





[edit on 8-3-2010 by ImAPepper]

Originally posted by In nothing we trust

Originally posted by MrWendal

Just look at the aerial photos of ground zero...

Ground Zero

Hey is that a cool pic or what?

Wow one building has a great big hole in it's roof, but it didn't fall down.

How come the building with a red granite casing fell down but no planes hit it?

Because different things, in different circumstance react.....differently! That's right! There are no hard and fast rules that tells us exactly how every building is going to react. The level of information required to make an exact prediction is metaphysically impossible to ascertain with the level of precision to make general claims as to physical behavior.

We make like to think that physics is this infallible portal from which all answers can magically appear, but physics can only tell us as much as we tell it. The more information, the more reliable the predicition, preiod.

Originally posted by ROBL240
If the fire was so hot it could melt steel, then how did these people survive both the initial aircraft impact, aswell as the "inferno."

Just an FYI... the title of this thread is:

The Final Minutes of the South Tower - The flaming inferno

Edna Cintron was in the North Tower. This will be the last post I will make regarding her.

Originally posted by ImAPepper

Originally posted by K J Gunderson
Whether she jumped to her death, shot herself, drank poison, or had a stroke, she still survived both the initial aircraft impact, as well as the "inferno."

No, she really didn't. Do you think she jumped out of boredom?? The point it, she chose how to die. She would either burn to death or die from smoke inhalation. She chose another route. So, what caused her to jump? Hmmmmmmm..

hint: fire or smoke





[edit on 8-3-2010 by ImAPepper]

Awwwe shucks. Guess I was just too blunt the last time. If English is not your native tongue then just say so and I will understand what the issue is. No matter what made her choose to jump, she still survived the impact and the supposed steel melting heat. That was what was said and that is a fact. You can cry about how she chose to jump all day long and speculate as to why but the fact is that she did indeed survive the impact and supposed heat. If it was as hot as it was supposed to be, she would not have been able to choose to do anything. Not sure what is so foreign about the concept.

reply to post by K J Gunderson

Here's another angle.
In a very hot environment one wears FIREPROOF CLOTHES.
Any less and you have a BIG problem with clothes,esrecially the metal fasteners getting hot enough to burn you and in fact causes combustion.Depends on the fibre.Any synthetic is bad,cotton less so,wool good,hemp great(paradoxically)
So her blouse looks ok to me.Butane lighters as well.

Jeez....so many 'bunkers!!

they dont like this thread do they!!

All the usual suspects acting as "wingmen" for one another..a bit like tag team wrestling!!

Hilarious!!

Great video OP....small fires collapsed these buildings??
Even more hilarity!!

HAHA....!!
As for imapepper...seems your in a pickle too mate...!!

Pickled pepper!!

[edit on 8-3-2010 by benoni]

reply to post by benoni


Not sure everyone has read all of the posts...

@ _BoneZ_, I'm kicking this one downstream, in case you missed it the first time. Or, did I miss your response?

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Read them all ...thanks for your concern....


My faves are the tag team duo posts....you know, "hunting in packs" and all that....