The Gay Agenda -- You Can't Be Serious?

Originally posted by tothetenthpower

Originally posted by Moonman1111
reply to post by tothetenthpower

 

NASHVILLE, Tenn. (BP)--Most Americans believe that homosexuality is “against God’s will” and that same-sex “marriage” will degrade the institution of marriage, according to a new Los Angeles Times poll.

The poll of 1,616 adults, conducted March 27-30 and released April 10, showed that Americans hold seemingly contradictory views on some same-sex issues. For instance, a majority of Americans favor civil rights laws for homosexuals but oppose allowing same-sex couples to adopt.

AHAHA so 1600 adults is MOST of America?

That's laughable.

In a southern state no less.

You keep digging that hole.

~Keeper

Los Angeles Times is a newspaper based in LA, which is in California. Which is a Western state, not a Southern state.

Originally posted by Moonman1111
It has nothing to do with character or personality or love. It is about lust and attraction. That is what every gay relationship is built on.

I have GOT to hear where you got this little tidbit

-Kyo

reply to post by Moonman1111

Strawman Argument

Fallacy: Straw Man



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Description of Straw Man
The Straw Man fallacy is committed when a person simply ignores a person's actual position and substitutes a distorted, exaggerated or misrepresented version of that position. This sort of "reasoning" has the following pattern:


Person A has position X.
Person B presents position Y (which is a distorted version of X).
Person B attacks position Y.
Therefore X is false/incorrect/flawed.
This sort of "reasoning" is fallacious because attacking a distorted version of a position simply does not constitute an attack on the position itself. One might as well expect an attack on a poor drawing of a person to hurt the person.

Examples of Straw Man

Prof. Jones: "The university just cut our yearly budget by $10,000."
Prof. Smith: "What are we going to do?"
Prof. Brown: "I think we should eliminate one of the teaching as

Originally posted by Moonman1111

Originally posted by tothetenthpower

Originally posted by Moonman1111
reply to post by tothetenthpower

 

NASHVILLE, Tenn. (BP)--Most Americans believe that homosexuality is “against God’s will” and that same-sex “marriage” will degrade the institution of marriage, according to a new Los Angeles Times poll.

The poll of 1,616 adults, conducted March 27-30 and released April 10, showed that Americans hold seemingly contradictory views on some same-sex issues. For instance, a majority of Americans favor civil rights laws for homosexuals but oppose allowing same-sex couples to adopt.

AHAHA so 1600 adults is MOST of America?

That's laughable.

In a southern state no less.

You keep digging that hole.

~Keeper

Los Angeles Times is a newspaper based in LA, which is in California. Which is a Western state, not a Southern state.

Alright I'll give you that one, however it's still a flawed argument, it's only 1600 people.

Try harder. Your still about 29999840 short....

~Keeper

[edit on 2/25/2010 by tothetenthpower]

Originally posted by KyoZero

Originally posted by Moonman1111
It has nothing to do with character or personality or love. It is about lust and attraction. That is what every gay relationship is built on.

I have GOT to hear where you got this little tidbit

-Kyo

I would but I got two moderators who are deleting my posts. Even though I am not swearing or being vulgar in any. I'm done in this thread, have fun pushing the agenda, just don't cry when you get pushed back.

reply to post by Moonman1111


Exactly...you know darn well that posting proof isn't against the T/C. You just don't have any proof

and trust me I will never cry over hate-filled speech

bye

-Kyo

[edit on 25-2-2010 by KyoZero]

reply to post by Moonman1111


Um, Civility and Decorum ring a bell? I love when people blame the moderators for themselves getting smacked for acting like a child.

But, go ahead and beat your cowardly retreat now that your hate speak is being actively rebutted.

[edit on 25-2-2010 by Watcher-In-The-Shadows]

reply to post by tothetenthpower


I honestly don't get where you are coming from...
I have read most of the postings. You started of nice asking a question you knew would be slandered. Because it is a very complex issue. We all have our views, but it would seem you are looking for something to gripe about. You asked... and you received. Of course the KKK is gonna get on here and say some crap. Deal with it for you initiated it. Sounds like WANTED drama to me. I think this thread should be deleted all together. It's rather disgusting. Thanks for ruining my meals. I have a feeling in the pit of my stomach ready to puke thanks to you. Hope you are happy.

You don’t have to be gay in order to sympathize with them over the prejudice and hatred that they face, or for any other discriminated against minority for that matter. Just a modicum of charity and simple human decency will do.

The amount of abuse that gays receive, just for being what they are, both as children, and as adults is terrible. I have witnessed it first hand and nobody should have to go through that.

The depression and suicide rates among gay teens are appalling. I knew a boy who blew his brains out after his good church going parents disowned him for being gay.

My late wife and I gave refuge to a young man after his parents threw him out because he was gay. Afterward, I made sure my stepsons clearly understood that there was no difference between them being picked on because they were black and Chinese; and somebody else being harassed because they were gay. Both are wrong.

A former coworker’s fundamentalist parents, refused to have anything to do with him after he announced that he was gay, even unto death. They wouldn’t even consent to his burial, and his grieving lover had to go to court to beg for permission to lay him to rest.

I don’t care what church you go to, such behavior is mean spirited, hateful and wrong. And, no amount of Bible thumping will change that. The Bible has been used to justify many things, not all of them good, just or moral. Remember slavery?

Jesus enjoined us to love one another, to “do unto others, as you would have them do unto you”.

Jesus taught us to “judge not lest we be judged”.

Jesus urged us to be more concerned about the beam in our own eye than the mote in our neighbors.

Jesus told us to “let he who is without sin, cast the first stone”. And yes he told the woman to “go now and sin no more”, but not before asking her who remained there to judge her, and when she said no one my lord, he replied, and neither do I. And, if Jesus would not pass judgment, then who are we to do so?

Jesus had harsh words for the sanctimonious, the self-righteous and the arrogant letting it be known in no uncertain terms that he was not impressed by their piety. He preferred to sit down and break bread the sinners and the outcast instead.

And, how would Jesus react the Fred Phelps of the world who said nothing about the sin and brutality of Matthew Shepherd’s murder yet protested his life with “God hates Fags” placards at his funeral?

I have known plenty of good and decent gay couples that have been together for decades and obviously love and care for each other deeply. Excepting sanctioned vows, they are as married as any I know. And, I have known married couples that violate the sanctity of those vows from the moment they get up in the morning to the moment they go back to bed.

I have known gay people who were the salt of the earth, and some that were total jerks. Just like the rest of us. And, I will no more pass a value judgment on them simply because they are gay than I would anybody else. How people behave towards their fellow human beings is what is important, and that is what they should be judged by.

I am not anti-Christian, far from it. I do my best to live the life of tolerance and compassion that I believe Jesus taught us we should live. But, I have little patience with those who insist that their version of Christianity is the only authentic one and that if you do not believe as they do, you are damned. I have a hard time believing that Jesus would be more impressed with dogma than empathy. Of course these are the same people who claim that it is you who are bigoted if you do not tolerate their prejudices. No bigotry should ever be tolerated, and it is a travesty of true spirituality to attribute any prejudice to God.

I learned long ago that what goes on in the recesses of the human heart is far more important than what goes on in bed. I learned that compassion and mercy have far more soul than dogma and doctrine. I learned that tolerance and charity open the heart and that fear and resentment closes it. I learned that hatred poisons the spirit. And, I learned that to change the world you must change hearts and minds first. I don’t expect to change anybody’s heart or mind but I can hope and I can try. “If I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing.”

Without compassion, we are no better than our prejudices.

reply to post by tothetenthpower


(you should probably refrain from using "southern states" to bolster an argument anyway, since the southern states are primarily black, which makes it sound like you think the black people are all those negative connotations. geographical location means nothing these days, in the advent of modern transportation and job markets. )

reply to post by tothetenthpower


hmm, i always find the it's not natural argument about homosexuality funny. it's natural, it's just not productive in producing more children.

god knows i've seen enough examples myself of gay animals, especially dogs lol. a man can be gay the same way a man can prefer blondes to brunettes.

as for the whole not being able to produce children point. considering how we can surely all agree that mankjind is doing its best to ruin the world, we are over-populated, aggressive, expanding into even more space in nature and killing everything we know. by not being able to have kids gays actually contribute a little bit to slowing down our destructive progress by not producing more little terrors to ruin the world.

human kind is a complicated and itelligent species which has reached a stage of evolution whereby we can make moral decisions as well as acting on our instinctive bodily nature. if an endangered species like a snow leopard for whatever reason didn't want to have offspring, whether for homosexual reasons or for any other reason, it would be terrible for the animal as the species needs new cubs desperately to survive. but with humans we find it acceptable if a married couple don't wish to have children and yet it's unnatural if a gay couple can't have children? in both cases the gay and straight couples don't further the human race with offspring so both are as 'unnatural' as each other.

if you have to be mentally ill to be attracted to a person who can't provide you offspring then do you not have to be mentally ill to choose not to have offspring if you are straight?

there are an awful lot of closet homosexuals in the world who hide behind the exterior of finding gay people disgusting. the number of times i have read about people who convinced themself they were straight, even got married and had kids before they couldn't accept it any more. people convince themselves that homosexuality is unacceptable because it makes them uncomfortable, but a lot of other things do that without people thinking they should be illegal.

i am a straight man, but i don't find the prospect of sleeping with another man any less attractive than sleeping with a 50 stone woman. the thought of both is disgusting to me, but both deserve to be respected as people who are simnply not my taste. i find overweight people repulsive even if they're female, it doesn't mean they don't deserve just as much respect because i find thme unattractive. everyone has their own tastes and what one person thinks is hot the other person thinks is ugly, THAT is nature.

as for teaching young kids in school about gays. everyone who is here will have been to school and been bombarded by words like gay, fag etc as insults. the word gay has been adopted by pop culture to mean anything which is either bad or weird. in our schools our children are learning from use of the word gay around them that homosexuality is gay and weird and intollerable. the school doesn't teach them this, but growing up in our current society does. if by our schools simply teaching kids that when they are older they may be more attracted to the same gender is not the end of the world for humanity, then perhaps they will learn to grow up without harbouring prejudices towards gay people from a young age. at school we are tought that to insult another person simply for having a different way of life, like a religion which doesn't affect you is wrong, yet nobody teaches kids that if they themselves feel gay tendencies then surpressing those feelings will only make their lives worse. NOBODY is telling kids to be gay, there is simply a movement for gays to be considered as equals who deserve respect as anyone else and also rights (which in the vast majority of the world are far from equal).

Originally posted by ReverseDecay
reply to post by tothetenthpower

 

I honestly don't get where you are coming from...
I have read most of the postings. You started of nice asking a question you knew would be slandered. Because it is a very complex issue. We all have our views, but it would seem you are looking for something to gripe about. You asked... and you received. Of course the KKK is gonna get on here and say some crap. Deal with it for you initiated it. Sounds like WANTED drama to me. I think this thread should be deleted all together. It's rather disgusting. Thanks for ruining my meals. I have a feeling in the pit of my stomach ready to puke thanks to you. Hope you are happy.

Well if you let something on the internet disturb, particularly a conversation, then perhaps you don't belong in this conversation anyway.

No I wasn't looking for "drama" I was simply trying to start a conversation in order to counter some very blatant homophobia that was coming across in the last few weeks.

~Keeper

reply to post by KyoZero


I guess that goes to the root of the issue. People are trying to get rid of religion, and many other freedoms that people enjoy in our nation. There are people on both sides of the fence that are doing this.

On one side there are homosexuals screaming everytime someone says that it is wrong. Remember people are entitled to that opinion, and they have the right to voice it.

On the other side are people that want to have homosexuals killed or locked up, which is equally wrong.

There is going to be no solution to this problem until both sides are able to meet in the middle, and I am able to concede some ground. I believe homosexuals should have the right to live together, have civil unions, purchase houses toghether. In essence I believe their actions are not illegal.

However, I believe that homosexuals should let somethings go, like marriage, and the ability to adopt children. If you want children find someone of the opposite sex and have them. But do not expect to raise a child in a home with poor moral values.

All that being said, the homosexuals on this board do not seem to be able to understand the difference between hatred and opinion. I saw a couple of people spouting ideas based in hatred, but for the most part they were provoked by being called bigots and such.

We have our beliefs, we don't want to be persucuted for them anymore than you do. Learn to accept it. Remember we do out number you, and you catch more flies with honey.

If you want more rights, do it the way Martin Luther King Jr. did. Don't try and get your way by cursing people, attempting to destroy their integrity, and being vile.

I am a person that loves all people, however I believe that there are somethings in this world that are just wrong to do. I don't like them, I will tell you I don't like it, and if you disagree tell me, but I will defend myself when you come at me calling me names.

My opinion is just as good as your wether you like it or not, so get over it!.

Originally posted by undo
reply to post by tothetenthpower

 

(you should probably refrain from using "southern states" to bolster an argument anyway, since the southern states are primarily black, which makes it sound like you think the black people are all those negative connotations. geographical location means nothing these days, in the advent of modern transportation and job markets. )

I agree, I wasn't thinking of that metric when I initially put it in. My reasoning was that most southern states aren't as progressive as the northern ones, there was no intent to make it sound like I was singling out blacks or anything.

Thanks for the heads up.

~Keeper

reply to post by Moonman1111


yes, dark ages. riiiight in the middle of them, never to be seen again in the light of rationality. Gay couples aren't "the light" but they are the norm, for themselves. And that's all that matters, because it doesn't have any implications for you, what so ever. Do you know why that is? Because it's got sweet FA to do with you. As you are not gay, and are not in a gay relationship.

tadaaaaa

*jazz hands*

Homosexuality is something that has always disgusted me. Wait, let me clarify: male homosexuality . The reason it disgusts me is because I cannot personally imagine myself being intimate with another man. It's just gross. My own personal preference. Women turn me on. That's why I am straight. For gay men, they are turned on by other men. It's just the way their minds are wired. Their hormones react to sexual stimulation by other males, right? That is how I view homosexuality and heterosexuality. Sexual stimulation based upon the chemicals within the individual body. I completely accept homosexuality. The only problem I have is that I think it may be a counter-evolutionary mutation. Humans (and all mammals) are made to sexually reproduce with egg & sperm, naturally. The only way to reproduce and further the species is by natural sexual intercourse, with a man and a woman. Two men cannot reproduce. Therefore it is my belief that homosexuality is an evolutionary error that pops up in very few humans. It just seems like a lot because there are 7 BILLION of us on this planet.

With all that said, do I think homosexuality should go away, be banned, or whatever? No. Just like we shouldn't kill or dispose of people with other genetic flaws, homosexuals should be allowed to practice their lifestyle freely. After all, I think they are only a small percentage of the entire world population, and they are certainly not threatening. They're just FABULOUS!

Edit for helluvit.

[edit on 25-2-2010 by OrphenFire]

reply to post by KyoZero


but I didn't mention 'damage'..I didn't even mention 'males'...I simply pointed out that homosexuality (in either gender) is against the workings of nature. What are you actually complaining about?

reply to post by tothetenthpower


hey i hear caucasians are now officially a minority.
this should be interesting

Originally posted by Moonman1111
It has nothing to do with character or personality or love. It is about lust and attraction. That is what every gay relationship is built on.

err... correction... every relationship of any kind, not just gays. I am a heterosexual guy... I know how we think.

-rrr

Agreed, the only GAY agenda is for them to be treated equal. To this day we are still learning about the biology of ourselves, people are born everyday with different genetics, biology, and chemical makeup. There is no changing the way people are born. Accept it.