Sorry, Vegans: Brussels Sprouts Like to Live, Too

reply to post by DevolutionEvolvd


I eat almost no meat but its for health and sustainability reasons. But I will say that the main argument for eating a fruit or vegetable is the some are designed to be eaten by an animal. This actually the best way for many fruits to reproduce. Ideally, certain fruits and veggies evolved so that you eat a tomato and you defecate the seeds onto the ground where the seed can germinate in a cocoon of fertilizer.

Without the eating of certain fruits and veggies by higher organisms, those plants would die off. This is how it works.

But again, the reasons to limit your meat intake are larger than a moral issue. The health benefits and the impact it can have on the world are much more important.

Originally posted by Rawhemp

Originally posted by Nutter

I've also heard from a couple sources that oral sex is a good source to b12

.

Again. How is this vegan?

How is this not vegan?

Veganism is a philosophy and lifestyle that seeks to exclude the use of animals for food, clothing, or any other purpose.

How is eating sperm vegan? You are using an animal (a man) for a purpose (B-12). Which is against the very definition of vegan.

reply to post by iamcamouflage

Originally posted by cushycrux
You all can ignore my post. I say it again: EAT YOUR DOG and start feeling.

Also the most of you seem not to know:

A Cow's life ends in Week 15-18, later you can't eat the meat anymore.
A Country like Germany with 87.000.000 People eat 4.000.000 Cow's a Year.
A Cow needs (age - 18 Weeks = 200Kg) 2000 Kg of Soja.
Makes a total of 2000 x 4.000.000 = 8.000.000 Tons of Soja only for Germany in one Year. And only for Cows to Eat.

And now - you feel bad about "EAT YOUR DOG" - If only one of you have to butch an animal, you would be a vergetarian tomorrow.


[edit on 29-12-2009 by cushycrux]

not true, i grew up on a farm, we feild butchered all our meat. pork beef chicken and venison. i watched and helped. i still eat meat

[edit on 29-12-2009 by wx4caster]

reply to post by watcher73


appreciate your insight.
language is limitation - so it is understood if miscommunication occurs.
perhaps proper punctuation permits precise perspective~
agree - mycorrhizae is not tree of souls (or concept there of)...concluded...
mycelial running, whether appropriately applied or not, was metioned as an Earthly counterpart to a beautiful ecosystem conceptulaized in Avatar, simply as a basis for comparison of possiblity.
mushrooms and movies are detracting here from essential considerations of plant consciousness.
we need no physical counterpart here to speculate the existence of an interconnected network of conscious entities existing as plant and planet~

we are All One

LOVE

reply to post by Bookworm242


Please locate and read the following book:The Secret Life of Plants. It was written by Peter Tompkins and Christopher Bird. Harper and Row 1973. If you don't believe that plants can feel, think and are perhaps experiencing some sort of reality; this book will change your mind. When I read about plants reacting to lie detectors and even medical tests I began to look differently at my salads. (Still eating them and meat too. I just believe humans are meant to be omnivores.) Still, if you have ethics about what you eat - this book will really affect you.

Originally posted by Bookworm242
When I read about plants reacting to lie detectors and even medical tests I began to look differently at my salads. (Still eating them and meat too. I just believe humans are meant to be omnivores.) Still, if you have ethics about what you eat - this book will really affect you.

I look at omnivores all the same...

...edible.

If you truly want to be an omnivorous, that would include other omnivores in your diet, too.

Originally posted by watcher73
Forgot about the mimosa too.

Still with all this movement I dont think there is a single plant that can actually move AWAY from danger.

No movement away, no pain.
No brain, no pain.

You could say the same about coral but thats considered an animal,sorry who is arguing that plants have a brain and central nervous system, and why is it important considering not all animals do?
Plants want their fruit to be eaten in many cases, to disperse their seed and many other crops are annuals so I dont really see what harm is being done, appart from filling them full of harmfull (for us) chemicals that is.

I eat what I like.

I like meat and fruit . . . vegetables, not so much. Also starches and fungi are delicious.

[snip] if you want to tell me that I can't eat meat. I care not if you want to eat kelp and tofu the rest of your life, so bug off. You have made your choice, and I made mine.

Any consumables are here on this earth for our consumption.

I don't think anyone in 3rd world countries has these discussions. They do as we should do. Eat what is naturally given to us, be it meat or plant.



Censor circumvention removed

[edit on 30/12/09 by masqua]

reply to post by Absum!
good thing i'm an omnivore.

Originally posted by DevolutionEvolvd
Edit to add: I was cooking burssels sprouts while writing this thread.

So, I presume that the impetus to start this thread is based on you having heard the Brussel Sprouts scream when you dumped them into boiling water?


Humor aside, all of study in Nature & Life lead to a single basic fact; All life survives only by consuming other life. Even the plants themselves must feed on the rotted remains of their own ancestors in the soil...In fact, the fertility of the soil depends almost entirely on how long that the dead have been rotting in it! Plants feed from the nutrients of the dead...Herbivores eat plants (in many cases, while the plant still lives!)...Carnivores eat herbivores, even if (in the case of humans) usually prefer our meats & plants to have been killed some time prior to consuming it. When those at the top of the food chain die, they in turn feed nutrients back into the soil...Completing the cycle of life.

If you're the sensitive & squeamish type, next time you want to cook up some corn on the cob, remember to start wearing ear plugs.

Originally posted by cushycrux
I Think Wallachian is 100% right. The next question for me is, how you can have a dog or a cat and at the same time you eat "cow children" every day at McD?

Is it probably possible that meat eaters exactly feel, that something is inconsistent in there picture of the world. Maybe the moral astpect of a burger hurts all the time you eat one. So lets say vegans are killing plants so its okey when i LET kill YOUNG animals every day for "JummyJummy". Can you tell me that this is necessary?!

Why dont cook your dog? So, now ask again why some vegetarians getting agressive if you are so ignorant to all!?

why do you think that all meat eaters don't eat cats and dogs? it's a cultural difference, it has nothing to do with morals. there are meat eaters who eat cats and dogs. heck, there are even some who eat tarantulas.

I'm 1.94 Meters, 95 Killograms and very healty @34Years, i don't eat animals since 21 years now, so tell me what my problem should be exactly?!

your problem is that you are ignorant and hypocritical.

If you eat a egg or two pee week and some nuts and a bit soya or chickpeas. YOU NEVER NEED MEAT TO LIVE HEALTHY.

Some people like eating meat. it's their choice. deal with it.


[edit on 29-12-2009 by technical difficulties]

reply to post by DevolutionEvolvd

This is a topic dear to my cold little heart. I have long felt that the folks I like to call "Life Fetishists" are collectively in the clutches of a severe disconnect from some of life's basic facts. Let me explain. Your average Vegan, Petan, Right-To-Lifer tends to believe that they are being spiritually and morally superior to the rest of us by decrying the destruction of select forms of life, usually mammals, but some go further. They believe that, by making the lives of other species a kind of sacred object, that they are elevating themselves as caring and feeling human beings. It's all very cute but it's also very wrong.

200 years ago there were no Vegans, no Petans and no Right-To-Lifers. Why? Because 200 years ago most of the people in this country lived in rural areas and not in cities and suburbs. Why would that make a difference? Because farm people back then raised crops and animals for survival. They understood that, if something didn't die, they couldn't eat, and if they didn't eat then it would be them that died next! They understood a rather basic fact that is woven into the text of all religions, if you care to look for it, namely that it is Death that sustains Life. And this is true across the boards. Even the plants are nourished by the decayed remains of their fallen bretheren, whose bodies have been borken down by worms, bacteria, etc into the bio-active detritus that they can feed on.

In my opinion the beginnings of the Life Fetish Movement starts with the metropolizing of America and the alienation of most Americans from the basic facts of survival. Back in the day most Americans were familiar with the acts of slaughtering, dressing, cleaning and butchering an animal that you had hand-reared to provide many meals for your family. Today most people think that meat just shows up in the supermarket every day in convenient shrink-wrapped packages for you to take home and cook. Even tho the labels state that it is chicken or beef or veal, your average modern cosmo person makes no connection between the steak or chop in their shopping basket and the living, breathing critter that it was a few short days ago. They simply do not realize that something warm and alive had to give up its existence in order to sustain them.

On a basic philisophical level it is entirely dishonest to claim that you choose to revere Life over Death when it is obvious that, without Death, there can be no Life. I prefer to revere the Big Mystery that is the Life/Death cycle. I appreciate the life that was sacrificed on my behalf, and I understand that, in some not too distant future, that it will also be my turn to give-up-the-ghost and provide nourishment for a host of other organisms. That's just how Life works. Life is like a disease that gets passed from one thing to another. It's like a gift that you can only claim for a while and then you have to give it off to another.

Originally posted by MidnightDStroyer

Originally posted by DevolutionEvolvd
Edit to add: I was cooking burssels sprouts while writing this thread.

So, I presume that the impetus to start this thread is based on you having heard the Brussel Sprouts scream when you dumped them into boiling water?

Humor aside, all of study in Nature & Life lead to a single basic fact; All life survives only by consuming other life. Even the plants themselves must feed on the rotted remains of their own ancestors in the soil...In fact, the fertility of the soil depends almost entirely on how long that the dead have been rotting in it! Plants feed from the nutrients of the dead...Herbivores eat plants (in many cases, while the plant still lives!)...Carnivores eat herbivores, even if (in the case of humans) usually prefer our meats & plants to have been killed some time prior to consuming it. When those at the top of the food chain die, they in turn feed nutrients back into the soil...Completing the cycle of life.

If you're the sensitive & squeamish type, next time you want to cook up some corn on the cob, remember to start wearing ear plugs.

Sadly, most of our modern crops are no longer nourished by replenished soil. They are forced to yield by the administration of nitrogen rich fertilizers. When I was a boy it was not uncommon to see fields left to fallow for a few years in order to relenish the soil. Nowadays those fields are foreced to produce year after year thru aggressive fertilization. This is not good for the crops or for the soil, but this is the reality of our world today. There are billions of people who need to be fed and there is only a limited space upon which to grow the crops to feed them. We can no longer afford to allow a fiend to go unproductive for a few years. We need those fields to be in constant production, and that means fertilizer enhanced with chemical nutriants. This world could never have reached 7 billion plus people without them.

Originally posted by technical difficulties
reply to post by Absum!

 

good thing i'm an omnivore.

Now now, don't let us so easily class you into those groups of Vegans, Petans, and Yadas Yadas.

There are moral issues involved here, and you surely wouldn't want to be one of these and be considered liberal, too.

At least, be bit conservative and take on being an Organic Omnivore!

Originally posted by godless
They are forced to yield by the administration of nitrogen rich fertilizers.

You are so full of poo-poo.

[edit on 29-12-2009 by dzonatas]

Originally posted by awake1234
reply to post by watcher73

 

appreciate your insight.
language is limitation - so it is understood if miscommunication occurs.
perhaps proper punctuation permits precise perspective~
agree - mycorrhizae is not tree of souls (or concept there of)...concluded...
mycelial running, whether appropriately applied or not, was metioned as an Earthly counterpart to a beautiful ecosystem conceptulaized in Avatar, simply as a basis for comparison of possiblity.
mushrooms and movies are detracting here from essential considerations of plant consciousness.
we need no physical counterpart here to speculate the existence of an interconnected network of conscious entities existing as plant and planet~

we are All One

LOVE

Well I guess I get what youre saying mostly. I just knew avatar was going to be brought into this and in my opinion didnt really need to be.

Wasnt punctuation...more the skipping of some words.

Starred your last post.

Peace.

[edit on 29-12-2009 by watcher73]

Originally posted by Spiramirabilis
reply to post by Chett

 

I'm a human - I choose not to eat animals

it's a choice

it's a personal choice - and though some people seem to want to jump on vegetarians (not sure why exactly) it is just that - a personal choice

People that jump on vegetarians are usually sick of being looked down on and judged inferior by vegetarians for having a different dietary choice.

It's Ok to be a vego if you want, but that does not mean everyone else needs to know about it or be judged negatively or scolded because they do not do the same as they do.

[edit on 29/12/0909 by Krusty the Klown]

I remember reading an article in New Scientist by a researcher in the sixties who studied plant response to stimuli.

He found that when a plant was cut or damaged, not only was there a chemical response but also a spike in electrical activity in the plant.

I'll see if I can dig up the article.

Originally posted by dzonatas
There certainly are other ways to reduce the poo-poo from dairy farms, the largest cheese manufacturer (bigger than McDonalds) has given up dairy farms in gone in favor of non-dairy cheese:

Well, since the subject of cheese came up, try Googling "Pizza Hut Cheese"
Let's go & put some silicone in our diet, huh?
Yeah, it's less the kind of food we eat that's the real problem...It's what "they" put in with it. Is it any wonder public health is threatened?

Choice of food doesnt make anyone morally superior. The fact that we have so many choices of easily available food in grocery stores and mini-marts makes the choice between meat or vegetables as much a moral compromise as choosing between cats or dogs.

Eating your preferred food everyday is a luxury not shared by everyone and unless its Soylent Green, morality has no part or consequence in your choice.


"Mmmmm... Soylent Green" - H. Simpson