Gays 'will never go to heaven'

Originally posted by tezzajw

Gays 'will never go to heaven'

www.heraldsun.com.au

HOMOSEXUALS and transsexuals "will never enter the kingdom of heaven", a leading Roman Catholic cardinal said overnight.

Cardinal Javier Lozano Barragan said that while the Church regarded homosexuality as an "insult to God", this did not justify discrimination against gay and transsexual people.

(visit the link for the full news article)

It is my most fervant hope that Cardinal Javier Barragan goes to gay heaven and is forced to listen to Mika and Glambert for eternity.

reply to post by A Fortiori


He would probably secretly enjoy it, infact if Heaven is full of the likes of the Bishop then I would like to go to gay heaven too, at least you could dress well and have cocktails

Heaven exists just because it says so in a book?

I doubt it.

And if it did, wouldn't it be funny if god turned out to be gay?

Haha. Even more proof that most organized religions are still stuck in the 1800's.

I don't this this fits the description of "Breaking News".

Unless by breaking news you mean something that first hit the news stands in 1653.

I'll let you in on a little secret:
The organised religions have been using heaven and hell as a form of control of the masses for centuries.
They know as much about the reality of heaven as my big toe IMO.

If we go somewhere when we die,I would bet that we all go to the same place-If its an afterlife,great,if not who cares-you won't know anyways...

If our energy does transfer somewhere else after we die,I think all would go to the same place,does not matter if you are a sinner or a saint.

Just my opinion,but no one knows for sure.

Originally posted by IntastellaBurst



Apparantly this Cardinal is also on record for saying " Why would anyone want to have sex with another man when there's all these children running around"

that ladies and gentleman, is fact.

I'm not doubting your claim, but if you're going to make statements like "this is fact", please cite your source for this. Link, reference material, book, magazine, etc.

Otherwise you're just trolling.

When individuals make these kind of statements, I tend to ignore them. Why? Because they don't deserve any attention. They deserve to be thrown off a boat in the middle of the ocean.

It was a stupid thing to say not only for political reasons but also for Christian reasons. Judge not lest you be judged. It's so easy to fall into a Pharisee mentality.

wife told me to delete what i typed as i am incapable of typeing what i actually say and feel .
educated in the uk and i passed my exams well 6 of them .
but she is right.

good luck to all

[edit on 12/3/2009 by dashar]

Originally posted by Acidtastic
People can have what ever opinion they like, but if it's one filled with hatred, you can expect the opinion to be ripped to shreds, as other people hold different opinions to it. Other people mind, who aren't hiding their hate behind a book. They are the worse type.

Great, I'm glad you cleared that up for me.

Say what you want but gays are the biggest haters around you if you let on that you're not totally enamoured with their lifestyle. Many people don't like the gay lifestyle so just get over it and move on with your life.

Originally posted by Acidtastic
To the christians in the thread.

Is God wrong to have made me (and other gay people) this way? Because if God made me this way, there must have been some kind of intention behind it. As God is never wrong, are you calling God wrong for making people gay?

I'm not a God hater, before you say it, I'm a hater hater. I "hate" (feel sorry for, is more apt) those who use their own prejudices and present them as if it's Gods word. You lot crack me up. But then, you are also Gods will, so what do we do?

God did not make you that "way"....I don't pretend to know what contributed to your current orientation - but I suspect that like the rest of us your psyche is a combo of environment, parental imprinting etc, etc..No gay gene has been found though some admit to the possibility of a genetic component -time and research may still have more to tell on that one...

But I do know as a Catholic I am called to love you as I would love any neighbor, not to condemn you - As I mentioned in an earlier post ,outside of marriage, we are all called to chastity so there is more that unites us than separates us...and I certainly don't hate you because that goes against everything Christ taught - however I won't lie to you and say whatever you do is okay as I understand the teaching of the church - but in the end it doesn't matter whether I approve or not because it is between you and God - that's where the rubber meets the road and its your road - but should you need my counsel or support in any way as a fellow human being I'm there..period. And I think you will find that most "Christians" that people on here love to vilify would treat you the same way - with respect and love - This thread is basically just an excuse to do some bashing -Sadly it happens so often I've grown used to it....so maybe we have that in common as well..
all the very best to you...

PS: edit to say post below case in point - according to John I am not a "real" Christan - so there ya go...sigh....honestly can I come to your house for a get-away? I just so tired sometimes

[edit on 3-12-2009 by realshanti]

reply to post by tezzajw


According to the Bible, being gay is a sin. But it's no different a sin than any other which separates man from God and heaven. If a gay person accepts Jesus and repents (means turns away from) his sin of gayness then he too can be saved and go to heaven just like any other sinner, rapist or murderer, thief etc.

But Salvation through Jesus requires repentance. If a gay person says he believes in Jesus and does not repent of his sin and turn away from homosexuality, then he is not a true follower of Christ and will Not go to heaven.

BTW, mainstream Christianity does Not consider the Catholics to be the Christian authority on matters of concerning the Bible.
This is a popular misconception. Real followers of Christ know and understand many of Catholic beliefs are a mixture of christian and pagan beliefs. Study history how the catholic church in Rome and Catholicism was first formed and you will see what I mean. So it's no wonder the Catholics could come up with a statement like this and misconstrue the whole matter.



[edit on 3-12-2009 by JohnPhoenix]

Originally posted by tezzajw

Gays 'will never go to heaven'

www.heraldsun.com.au

HOMOSEXUALS and transsexuals "will never enter the kingdom of heaven", a leading Roman Catholic cardinal said overnight.

Cardinal Javier Lozano Barragan said that while the Church regarded homosexuality as an "insult to God", this did not justify discrimination against gay and transsexual people.

(visit the link for the full news article)

If you are not a Christian than you will do as you please and if you do not beleave in heaven it doesn't effect you. He clearly says this does not justify discrimination.

On I purley scientific natural stance we have sexual organs to reproduce. How can same sex do this. Life must reproduce to exist.

Originally posted by realshanti

God did not make you that "way"....I don't pretend to know what contributed to your current orientation - but I suspect that like the rest of us your psyche is a combo of environment, parental imprinting etc, etc..No gay gene has been found though some admit to the possibility of a genetic component -time and research may still have more to tell on that one...

Realshanti, I acknowledge your opinion but there is no way that being gay is something that someone can be lead into unless it's already part of their nature. If two gay men adopted a kid would the kid also grow up to be gay? I'd say no way, unless it's already in the kid's nature.

For the thread, I wish people would believe in God but totally dismiss religion. Isn't believing in just God enough for people? Why confine yourselves to the shackes of religion?

Originally posted by GorehoundLarry
When individuals make these kind of statements, I tend to ignore them. Why? Because they don't deserve any attention. They deserve to be thrown off a boat in the middle of the ocean.

Hmm... That's the same way I feel when most homosexuals or homosexual supporters start spouting off at the mouth about the gay right to spread GRID via bathhouses...

Because they don't deserve any attention. They deserve to be thrown off a boat in the middle of the ocean.

How ironic.

"Gays will never go to heaven."???

Many religions revolve around King David. Many believe that King David was a favorite in Gods eyes. Granted the bible never says this, it does say the Lord favored him. Therefore this statement would imply the Lord mentioned in the bible is very different from God.

King David said he loved Jonathan more than any woman. They stripped it down and got it on (so to speak ) in the fields. They said vows before the Lord in those fields and the Lord blessed them.

So it loos to me like the Lord mentioned in the bible is not the same God that the church associates with.

mmmmm this is getting good. looks like i have some rereading to do. I wonder how many entities were labeled 'Lord'

Funny how one little statement can speak volumes.

[edit on 3-12-2009 by mrsdudara]

reply to post by JohnPhoenix


Well said, sir. :clap:

To stress again, Catholicism is NOT the authority of Christianity and does not speak for all of Christianity. The Bible does. Unfortunately, what's written in a book is often left open to interpretation, especially the portions which are written intentionally symbolic (such as Revelations). As Christians translate and unravel the meaning of the Bible, it's important for them to realize that it's best that they only preach their version of enlightenment to those who are willing to listen and not judge others. What is in the mind of God is not for man to say or speculate and is blasphemous to do so. Who goes to heaven is between each individual and the Holy Trinity (God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit).

Originally posted by Hawkwind.

Originally posted by realshanti

God did not make you that "way"....I don't pretend to know what contributed to your current orientation - but I suspect that like the rest of us your psyche is a combo of environment, parental imprinting etc, etc..No gay gene has been found though some admit to the possibility of a genetic component -time and research may still have more to tell on that one...

Realshanti, I acknowledge your opinion but there is no way that being gay is something that someone can be lead into unless it's already part of their nature. If two gay men adopted a kid would the kid also grow up to be gay? I'd say no way, unless it's already in the kid's nature.

For the thread, I wish people would believe in God but totally dismiss religion. Isn't believing in just God enough for people? Why confine yourselves to the shackes of religion?

You may be right Hawkwind, that's why its incumbent upon me to place no conditions on my love for you as a human being - and that is how I treat my friends - all of my friends, straight and gay, Protestant, non believers, Catholic, and four legged people as well -feline, canine and feathered - lol...

"Isn't believing in God enough" - wow -now that's the question of the year and for another thread would be great to explore- but yeah it would be nice if folk could speak off the record on this and without the buzz words of their particular denomination - but the news article quoted made that somewhat impossible since it was a Catholic higher up that made the remark that ignited this thread..again ...sigh...I'm going for a lie down now....my head hurts

Originally posted by northof8
Hmm... That's the same way I feel when most homosexuals or homosexual supporters start spouting off at the mouth about the gay right to spread GRID via bathhouses...

Because they don't deserve any attention. They deserve to be thrown off a boat in the middle of the ocean.

Great, another fundamentalist....why come to ATS? There are plenty of biggoted religious sites where you can state BS like this and then get patted on the back by other fundies and carry on why you know more about human behavioural science then everyone else.