"Alternative Substances Forum" -- Conspiracy issues related to drugs, but NOT recreational/persona

I have already seen numerous posts breaking the rules, the ecstasy thread as a prime example has several people alluding to taking pills. I dont think this subject can be discussed without stoners and doomsayers, every thread will boil down to "I love and take drugs, they are great" and the arguments will be "drugs kill everyone" then it will desend into petty squables, I was glad to see this subject banned to be honest. The biggest conspiracies about big pharma are never discussed just recreational drugs which is borning and repetitive. Just my opinion

Very good addition imo! Thanks

Sorry, i can't really see this part of the forum being any use to me as i would most likely break some of the rules of the site and also give people on the site a possible perspective of myself that may be looked on as negative.

BLUELIGHT may be a better place to seek advice on drug trends, don't get me wrong i may pop in to see how things pan out but i think it best if i keep my view on drug related topics off the boards.

Originally posted by On the level
I have already seen numerous posts breaking the rules,

So have I, and several members are facing a ban this morning.

If you see something we've missed, please use the post-alert feature to tap on our shoulder.

Thanks.

reply to post by PC equals Newspeak


I have carried far more than the American Flag as an avatar. And while you have cherry picked what to read from my reply. I humbly ask that you answer those questions that were in the following paragraph that was my reply. Don't answer them to the board (or even to me--for I am not that important), I ask that you answer them for yourself.

You see, I have had quite the drug education myself. Now while you may scoff at the fact that my knowledge and experience is not from doing drugs and other psychotropic substances. Rest assured that there are reams of information that I could provide, without a pro nor negative bias, on a whole gambit of substances by name.

Guess what. That information is also inappropriate for posting here on ATS for the exact same reasons that I stated in that following paragraph. Rest assured that I do however have two threads in the works and they will be posted. And as anyone can tell you, they will be quite lengthy as I can be rather verbose in my postings.

Now given my track record for threads...I do not expect many replies, but it is information that can be shared in a responsible manner and won't skirt the line. Look for it in the coming days to weeks as time allows for me to write.

But do look at it this way, a month ago you would have been hit with a few warns and possibly just outright banned for admitting the level of your use despite the reasons. The site has made quite a step forward. At least we do not have to run that old "brain on drugs" frying egg commercial every time a post is made. Avoiding direct misinformation is a huge step forward.

IMPORTANT UPDATE

Within a few hours, too many threads and posts have begun that focus far too much on personal use and legalization issues. Since advocacy of legalization relates directly to personal recreational use of drugs, such discussion is not allowed in the new forum.

Please focus exclusively on the wide ranging conspiracy issues related to drugs, such as government involvement in drug trafficking, pharma influences, and the war on drugs (to name a few).

reply to post by SkepticOverlord




There was a pretty extensive thread on '___' in RATS.... i just searched and couldn't find it there.... i forget the author... has it been moved to the new forum?

It was a fascinating read.

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


excellent. i personally am an avid lover of this topic having studied ethnobotany and ethnoecology. I think that mind altering substances have played a very long and often overlooked element in the development of the human species and such topics are incredibly engaging and relevant to the ATS community. I hope that we can live up to your standards or by your rules on this one and keep this forum open.

cheers to the ATS team for making this happen.

This is a breath of fresh air! Ive had too many posts deleted due to a closed mind about drugs! This is a very good move!

reply to post by whatukno Yes, & I told you I understand the point about caution, however, with my membership on the line, I would like to be totally clear on the point as to whether a philosophical position that prohibition is wrong per se would be construed as "promoting" or "alluding to" illegal activity. I feel it is unclear as stated by SO, particularly since there are threads here in which members have committed the crime of sedition just by what they've posted.
You then made assumptions about my motives & accused me of dishonesty.
I think you've got me confused with PC equals Newspeak! I haven't mentioned censorship once, nor a desire to post personal drug experience.
I agree, its their site, they can do what they like. Still, I dont want to have to contact a Mod everytime I wish to express my opinion regarding drug policy, that would feel oppressive. In the absence of clarification however, I am forced to do as I have so far: not contribute to any of the new forum's threads except this 1.

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


Dear sir. Will te ATS crew move older on-topic threads into here, or do we need to repost them?
Where does Big Pharm get their Opium from?

Al Qaeda: "The CI-A Team"

U.S. "Interests": Hardcore Drugs

It'd be much better to move them in there. Starting another "where does big pharm get their opium from" would be LAME, and that thread could help answer this question for others.

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
Within a few hours, too many threads and posts have begun that focus far too much on personal use and legalization issues. Since advocacy of legalization relates directly to personal recreational use of drugs, such discussion is not allowed in the new forum.

The undemocratic illegalisation of certain substances ('___', MDMA, '___', THC, ...) is considered by many psychonauts to be a conspiracy intended to limit man's ability to think outside of the box and seek genuine enlightenment. As such, advocacy of legalization goes beyond just recreational use of drugs and is an issue closely related to conspiracy and it makes NO SENSE WHATSOEVER to ban this topic.

reply to post by PC equals Newspeak


Could you not discuss imperical data relating to why the substance in question is safe for human consumption in moderation without discussing personal use or the legality of it ?

Originally posted by gYvMessanger
Could you not discuss imperical data relating to why the substance in question is safe for human consumption in moderation without discussing personal use or the legality of it ?

I guess so, but this also seems to be a breach of ATS policy if I understand SkepticOverlord correctly.

Originally posted by PC equals Newspeak

Originally posted by gYvMessanger
Could you not discuss imperical data relating to why the substance in question is safe for human consumption in moderation without discussing personal use or the legality of it ?

I guess so, but this also seems to be a breach of ATS policy if I understand SkepticOverlord correctly.

In fact, I just noticed that a thread explaining the difference between stoners and psychonauts as well as a thread explaining that the dangers of XTC are overrated have both been deleted and that a thread asking why some drugs are illegal has been closed. This should illustrate how narrow the allowed perspectives really are.

reply to post by SkepticOverlord

Since advocacy of legalization relates directly to personal recreational use of drugs, such discussion is not allowed in the new forum.
Please focus exclusively on the wide ranging conspiracy issues related to drugs, such as government involvement in drug trafficking, pharma influences, and the war on drugs (to name a few).

Well, there we have it then. Except I cannot for the life of me see how the WoD can be discussed in an intellectually honest fashion if alternatives such as decriminalisation & legalisation cannot be discussed.
I'll keep an eye out for policy changes, but otherwise I see this forum as useless. Nobody was talking about their opinion of recreational use in mentioning things like govt collusion in drug trafficking etc. elsewhere on the site, so what is the point of this?

To me it looked like the Why Are Drugs Illegal thread had strayed into squabbling between advocates of use and not use as opposed to dealing with the meat of the subject itself.

For me allowing this topic is important because drugs, of both the legal and illegal persusassion hold a massive sway over modern lives and the lives of our ancestors, its possibly the biggest buisness out there, with that kind of money there are serious questions which need to be asked.

Certainly there is the arguments made by some regarding why certain drugs are denied us due to consciousness arguements, possibly even with serious spiritual applications (depending on your mind set). But again I think if you want to really discuss that topic it can be framed in a way which is acceptable to everyone.

reply to post by PC equals Newspeak

In fact, I just noticed that a thread explaining the difference between stoners and psychonauts as well as a thread explaining that the dangers of XTC are overrated have both been deleted and that a thread asking why some drugs are illegal has been closed. This should illustrate how narrow the allowed perspectives really are.

I was looking forward to a discussion on that topic, I am unsure how to follow the rules on this issue.

So I guess I will wait and see.

Originally posted by Bunken Drum
Except I cannot for the life of me see how the WoD can be discussed in an intellectually honest fashion if alternatives such as decriminalisation & legalisation cannot be discussed.

Exactly !

Originally posted by Bunken Drum
I'll keep an eye out for policy changes, but otherwise I see this forum as useless. Nobody was talking about their opinion of recreational use in mentioning things like govt collusion in drug trafficking etc. elsewhere on the site, so what is the point of this?

It's probably a smokescreen. They give the impression that they're more lenient, while in fact little to nothing has changed. It's a common tactic in propaganda or PR.

Originally posted by gYvMessanger
To me it looked like the Why Are Drugs Illegal thread had strayed into squabbling between advocates of use and not use as opposed to dealing with the meat of the subject itself.

This is probably why that particular topic is just closed while others were deleted.

Originally posted by gYvMessanger
For me allowing this topic is important because drugs, of both the legal and illegal persusassion hold a massive sway over modern lives and the lives of our ancestors, its possibly the biggest buisness out there, with that kind of money there are serious questions which need to be asked.

Also, do note that many legal drugs are more dangerous and/or far less beneficial than many illegal drugs, which makes no sense unless you look at the hidden agenda....

Originally posted by gYvMessanger
Certainly there is the arguments made by some regarding why certain drugs are denied us due to consciousness arguements, possibly even with serious spiritual applications (depending on your mind set).

True. The psychonautic experience is little more than a post-modern equivalent to shamanism and is practiced by many from a spiritual point of view. The only reasons I can imagine for it not being discussed on this forum are narrowmindedness or a hidden agenda.

Originally posted by PC equals Newspeak
The only reasons I can imagine for it not being discussed on this forum are narrowmindedness or a hidden agenda.

I'd have surmised your imagination would be keener.