Interview with the President: Jail Time for Those without Health Care Insurance?

ok, i agree , proposing jail time is a bit far fetched, but i disagree with what you said about the health care in uk. im from the uk and i think you missed the point. over here we dont just look at the money side of things. the point is that in our country we know anyone can get the healthcare they need at any time without the worry of price, and nomatter what your social standing. yes it is a struggle for our governments to keep a system like this running but it is the morral thing to do and most of us would not have it any other way.

Let's see.

After much thought, and talking it out with the husband, I've come to this conclusion:

I will not be buying the health insurance plan.

I will not sacrifice good healthy food for me or my family so that I can afford their plan.

I will not pay fines, nor will I sit in jail.

I will not be a slave to this system they have set up.

I have to say this and I'm sorry for having to do so.

You all are a bunch of fools, you don't even understand how screwed we all are.

First of all if this bill passes the Senate, which it will because it's so wonderfully historical, You will be required to pay for health insurance if statistically you are viewed as able to do so. If you are viewed statistically able to pay for health insurance, no matter how hard your actually struggling, and you do not do so your yearly earnings will be garnished by a 2.5% tax.

If you do not pay the tax of one year 2.5% of your earnings you will not go to jail because you did not buy health insurance, you will go to jail because you did not pay the tax.

Not paying taxes is a huge offence and you will be judged accordingly under any lower Cort system.

All of you don't even understand how observed being forced to have car insurance is and you expect not to be forced to buy health insurance? You don't even have to pay car insurance, you could walk, yet you still have car insurance don't you? Now just imagine yourself not buying an actually forced health insurance plane or the tax of the lack of buying one.

And just to let you silly people know before car insurance was mandatory insurance companies sold insurance with "uninsured motorist" policies. Even back them there was absolutely no reason to be forced to have car insurance and the people who did have car insurance usually always had uninsured motorist insurance.

Get used to it Copper-tops, welcome to hell.



Izzy.

That is still sneaky..not paying the tax. cmon, has obama or anyone bought this out front during any public or tv speech, BEFORE it was in process? no..lies its all lies.Really, maybe bush should have stayed in office...as much as we hated him, at least we all would never have been threatened with going to jail, beucase i needed medical treatment* or anyone else, for that matter.
I read the bill was dead by the time it got to the senate..did this bill pas or not? requirement to have health insurance?
Personally, i think they shuold have called it death insurance*

I'm really glad my grandfather, who was a WWII veteran, who fought for this country he loved, is not alive to see this day, where Americans are forced to be slaves.

reply to post by Asherah


For the sake of your Grandfather, and all our Grandfathers and their Grandfathers we must remember that America should still be the country we love. We all just need to keep fighting for it again.

Chin up kiddo, never throw the baby out with the dirty, filthy, disgusting, sorry excuse for government representatives (bath water).

Use your mind, learn how to think, We have all the laws and tools we need to set things right. We just have to discover them.

Edit: what else.....Spelling.

[edit on 11-11-2009 by Izarith]

Fascist? I don't think so. How is this any different from requiring drivers to have auto insurance?

People who don't have health insurance become a drain on the economy when they get sick or injured. Not only can't they work, they wind up getting emergency treatment or being put on disability. The state picks up the tab, eventually - and we all pay for that.

This way, we'll be paying for our own insurance. Oh, and chances are better that people will get treatments earlier, which could very well help prevent them from becoming more seriously disabled by their illnesses. The way it is right no, people without insurance don't seek help until they're deathly ill, and by then their treatment may wind up being far more expensive than it would have been, had they gone sooner.

The difference between auto insurance and health insurance is this:

If you don't have health insurance, the only person that could suffer is you,
But if you don't have auto insurance, you can ruin someone else financially.

So the go to jail if you don't have health insurance means you'll go for a victimless crime.

Way to go! Just what the people need - to worry about being punished even when not hurting anyone else in any way.

This is why this is wrong.

And to those who argue that the state is doing this for the general welfare of the people, don't forget that they have no problem killing millions around the world, and plenty at home. They are malthusian genocidal control freaks. It's not about helping us, even one tiny bit.

"They don't care about you, at all! At all! At all!" - George Carlin




[edit on 11-11-2009 by 30_seconds]

reply to post by 30_seconds

another difference is that if I can't afford the car and the insurance, I can always opt to walk, take a bus or taxi, whatever....
what is the option if you can't afford the healthcare or insurance? a fine, jail (ya, that will make it all more affordable for ya!), death???

No surprise here and how anyone, unless in a coma could not see the absolute control becoming a reality. The deception and lies from congress (237 multi-millionaires amongst them) the white (now black) house and all the other crap that congregates in Washington DC has truly reached a level comparable to Nazi Germany. Concentration camps included. H1N1 and all of its morphology coming to your neighborhood as it is super charged with a deadly vaccine. The elitist are nothing but evil incarnate, the kind that smells of a roted corpse. Hell awaits all of them. You will burn baby burn.

Darkness can not hide the truth forever and it only takes a spark of truth and light to kill massive amounts of this evil. I will stand against this and I know many others will stand also. Knowing that life without truth and freedom is no life at all.

Originally posted by chiron613
Fascist? I don't think so. How is this any different from requiring drivers to have auto insurance?

Operating a personal motor vehicle is a privilege, it is not a right! No one forces you to have to drive a car; you choose to do so out of convenience. Before you hit me with the “right to locomotion” stuff, requiring you to have a license, tag, registration, and insurance is not considered an impediment to your right to locomotion, this has been upheld in case law. You have other options available to you for locomotion such as public transport, riding as a passenger, or none motorized transport.

This is entirely different then requiring someone to carry medical insurance or face jail time and fines. You have no other option, as you do with transportation, in this instance. It is being forced on you, and is thus unconstitutional. If you allow this to happen, then what are they going to force on you next? Maybe being implanted with a tracking ID chip? Choosing what religion you can or cannot believe in? What you read? Why not what’s to stop them at this point?

Two very different things, and the analogy of car insurance was simply made to win over the people who have no common sense as just how different those two subjects are from each other.

Originally posted by chiron613
Fascist? I don't think so. How is this any different from requiring drivers to have auto insurance?

People who don't have health insurance become a drain on the economy when they get sick or injured. Not only can't they work, they wind up getting emergency treatment or being put on disability. The state picks up the tab, eventually - and we all pay for that.

....You must still be living with your parents because it is obvious you have no idea what you are talking about....

First of all when people work, THEY PAY FOR SOCIAL SECURITY and other taxes which pay for Social security disability, etc... Most employers nowadays have "Worker's compensation" in this way they wash their hands clean if their workers get injured, since for the most part employees can't sue an employeer if they have worker's Comp.

Also you only get disability IF YOU HAVE WORKED...and the amount you get is dependent of how long you have worked, and how much money you have made.... You can also buy supplemental health insurance from your employer, and many offer this, but of course you ahve to pay more monthly.

People that have no insurance, and need to go to emergency ARE CHARGED FOR WHATEVER HEALTHCARE PROBLEM THEY HAVE...you don't pay #...THE INJURED PERSON DOES....

Before I met my wife she didn't have insurance, and when she was really sick she would have to go to the emergency, and SHE ALWAYS HAD TO PAY FOR HER TREATMENTS, and prescription drugs....

If you have no insurance, and you need to go to the emergency, most hospitals can't send you away, they have to take you in, but YOU get the bill...not the taxpayers...

The only way ALL taxpayers get to pay for everyone else is THROUGH SOCIALIZED HEALTHCARE....

It is obvious people like you just want to make wild claims to excuse your saviour for screwing us up....

But keep cheering for your saviour....

Originally posted by chiron613
This way, we'll be paying for our own insurance. Oh, and chances are better that people will get treatments earlier, which could very well help prevent them from becoming more seriously disabled by their illnesses. The way it is right no, people without insurance don't seek help until they're deathly ill, and by then their treatment may wind up being far more expensive than it would have been, had they gone sooner.

Better treatments earlier?......again you have no idea what you are talking about... First of all SOCIALIZED healthcare ALWAYS makes things worse...you could get healthcare for some regular problems, like an ear infection, or a cold, and still the waiting hours are much worse under SOCIALIZED healthcare..... but worse problems will take you a really long, long time to get solved.

I remember having to wait half a day at the hospitals whenever I got an ear infection in Spain...and guess what? they had, and have SOCIALIZED healthcare there...

Second of all, you get second, and even third rate healthcare, and there are more fuc# ups, since doctors are spread thin, and those with barely any training work as if they were experienced doctors....

Do you ever wonder why people from around the world COME TO THE UNITED STATES FOR HEALTHCARE, when in their countries they have SOCIALIZED HELTHCARE?.... Perhaps now you understand why...but then again, probably not... which is the reason why so many naive Americans think "SOCIALIZED HEALTHCARE will solve their problems....




[edit on 11-11-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

Originally posted by defcon5

Originally posted by chiron613
Fascist? I don't think so. How is this any different from requiring drivers to have auto insurance?

Operating a personal motor vehicle is a privilege, it is not a right! No one forces you to have to drive a car; you choose to do so out of convenience. Before you hit me with the “right to locomotion” stuff, requiring you to have a license, tag, registration, and insurance is not considered an impediment to your right to locomotion, this has been upheld in case law. You have other options available to you for locomotion such as public transport, riding as a passenger, or none motorized transport.

This is entirely different then requiring someone to carry medical insurance or face jail time and fines. You have no other option, as you do with transportation, in this instance. It is being forced on you, and is thus unconstitutional. If you allow this to happen, then what are they going to force on you next? Maybe being implanted with a tracking ID chip? Choosing what religion you can or cannot believe in? What you read? Why not what’s to stop them at this point?

Two very different things, and the analogy of car insurance was simply made to win over the people who have no common sense as just how different those two subjects are from each other.

I'm telling you guys, You don't understand how this works.

By your own definition of the difference between Auto insurance and what is being forced upon us now you only give the government more authority to do what it is doing. Please let me explain why your own warped perception is your down fall.

You here by state that just because Driving is not a right but rather a liberty you can be forced to pay Auto insurance even tho back when it was not mandatory insured motorists had uninsured motorist protection. And that because some guy can walk 100 miles to work as an option it's ok to force him to do something. Your own thoughts are more tyrannical than you give them credit my friend.

If this bill passes you will not go to jail for not buying heath insurance as long as you pay the 2.5% garnish on your yearly earnings. Congress has the complete constitutional right to tax anything they want even the air we breath as long as the direct or indirect tax meet the constitutional requirements. So even constitutionally they have the power given by them by the constitution of the United States of America to Tax you directly for not buying heath insurance as long as the tax is in according to the direct tax requirement.

They day you realize that even supporting the fact that a man be in any way coerced to pay for car insurance gives more power to further enslavement is the day you realize why this county is the way it is. Until then go get your health insurance Copper-top.

The government is not doing anything unconstitutional or illegal. What it is doing is using our own stupidity and lack of empathy, yet again, just like it did before car insurance was not mandatory, to make money off your A$$.

In a country such as the UK where health care is passed out like happy meals, they are implementing additional charges to do what? "Restrict the supply of healthcare" The system simply cannot contain the demand, and the costs are over whelming the government run health care system..
All you need to do is Google "European health care deficits" and you will find a host of articles and reports to the true condition of these "utopian" social programs.

But they don't work.

You are right that the National Health Service here in the UK isn't working, but it is not the system that has caused this, but the beaurocracy of the government that is to blame. There are now twice as many beaurocrats and pen pushers in the NHS than there are beds in the hospitals, nurses on the wards or doctors in the country. THIS is the problem. The government keeps throwing money at the NHS, but it doesn't go to the patients, but to the managers etc.

You say Healthcare is passed out like Happy Meals, but surely healthcare should be available to all. Are you trying to say that decent healthcare should only be available to those that can afford to pay for it? What happens to the rest? Oh yeah, they're left to die like the poor scum they are.

If the NHS was reformed and the doctors and medical staff put in charge of where the moey goes, it would work perfectly, just as it has for decades.

It also doesn't help that the illegal immigrants and people who don't pay into the system get the same health care as someone like me, who has paid National Insurance payents since I was 16 years old.

The system may not be perfect, but at least the rich and poor alike can get equal medical treatment. My father is retired and is on a large number of meds to control high BP and other ailments, which come to about 12 tablets a day. He gets these for FREE. These are meds that he would never be able to afford if he were charged for them.

Anyway, for those that don't like it, there's still private hospitals out there.

p.s., I don't know of these "extra charges" that are mentioned here. So far this month, I have had an x-ray, ultrasound scan, seen my GP 3 times and had my monthly prescription renewed. Extra Costs - £0

[edit on 11-11-2009 by nik1halo]

Just a word about being "able to afford" paying for health care.

If the test is "can you pay for it", then there is already a problem. Having fallen on hard times before, I can tell you this. If you make $40k a year (family of 4) and the level for "affording" something is $30k a year...what happens when you are paying off credit cards at a level of $1000 per month? Well...they don't count that into the math. Your $40k minus the $1000 per month equals $28k. However, your ability to "afford" health care will be based upon your $40k. So even when they realize that unless you make $30k you can't afford it...you don't fall into that lower group since your money for credit card payments doesn't count.

This math applies to a lot of other problems going on now... mortgages, rent, car payments, etc. Everyone's particular situations differ. For example...where I live there is no public transportation, unless you can get 20 miles to the nearest bus. So...in my case, I need a car. But my car payment isn't figured into the math.

There are so many problems (or reverse loopholes) in this health care plan. How about the idea that if you CAN'T pay for health care, even if they think you can...you still get fined? It sounds like just a threat but...if you can't afford the cost of the health care, you regardless owe the fine. So, where an individual is now (financially), can be made worse and they could still end up without health care. (eg. SALARY - FINE = LESS_THAN_SALARY) on which you may already be barely getting by.

While this isn't my situation at the moment...I'VE BEEN THERE, and it isn't pleasant nor fair.

Come on people. Sorry if you voted for this group...I promise I won't point and laugh...but don't do this to the American people just because you want to pretend this is a good thing. It isn't.

Don't worry about Obama's petty threats. When it comes down to it and bullets start flying, the revolution will start and the people will win. Obama needs to read the History books.

Originally posted by 12212012
Don't worry about Obama's petty threats. When it comes down to it and bullets start flying, the revolution will start and the people will win. Obama needs to read the History books.

Ah yes, of course because government think tanks have not foreseen this right?

You guys are so gullible I think it would be harder to lead children into disneyland than to get you "The south shall rise AGAIN!" jokers right into play.

Put your guns in their holsters and pick up the constitution and about 1000 law books and read them please. There are more powerful legal ways to get things done Vs you giving an excuse for the much anticipated declaration of marshal law.

Originally posted by nik1halo

You are right that the National Health Service here in the UK isn't working, but it is not the system that has caused this, but the beaurocracy of the government that is to blame. There are now twice as many beaurocrats and pen pushers in the NHS than there are beds in the hospitals, nurses on the wards or doctors in the country. THIS is the problem. The government keeps throwing money at the NHS, but it doesn't go to the patients, but to the managers etc.
................

ooohhhh...riiiight... it is not that the NHS in itself doesn't really work...let's blame it on politicians instead...that must be why most NHS are bankrupt, and are not working....

But hey, having a healthcare that doesn't work, and at the end causes bankruptcy is supposed to be "civilized" now-a-days.....

Originally posted by 30_seconds
The difference between auto insurance and health insurance is this:

If you don't have health insurance, the only person that could suffer is you,
But if you don't have auto insurance, you can ruin someone else financially.

So the go to jail if you don't have health insurance means you'll go for a victimless crime.

Victimless crime? What about all the people who are paying the insurance? If you don't pay into the system, yet still require healthcare, then they are basically paying for you. They are the victims.

This is one of the problems we face in the UK with our NHS. People not paying into the system, but still being a drain on resources.

I haven't looked into how these payments will be handled in th US, but here, they are simply taken straight out of your pay packet, just like income tax. You don't miss the money, because you never had it to spend in the first place (although I wish I did, lol). This is why non payment isn't an option here, unless you are self employed, in which case, yes, non payment of National Insurance results in a fine or possible jail (note the spelling for our American friends) time.

Believe me, as one of the people paying insurance, you soon get annoyed at those who do not, by either refusing to work (and there are many people who refuse to, rather than simply being unemployed) or by dodging their taxes.

Originally posted by Izarith
Put your guns in their holsters and pick up the constitution and about 1000 law books and read them please. There are more powerful legal ways to get things done Vs you giving an excuse for the much anticipated declaration of marshal law.

Fair and true...assuming you have the time and money to afford taking legal action. Don't forget how many people have to work crazy hours just to make a living...and still don't have disposable cash to gamble on a lawsuit.

Guns (as you mentioned) are the poor-man's justice. Not that I would ever condone shooting a politician in the eye, melting his body with lye and pouring the remains down a sewer drain. THAT would just be wrong!