Alien Abduction: An astral phenomenon?

I dont think this approach actually gets to the truth. Yes much info and contact can be done in the astral, though not so much if its lower astral, simply in your astral body, if they raise your vibrations. But the problem with abductions/contacts/experience, as I will share from my own family and a friend of mind living thousands of miles away who just so happens to share some of my experiences with me, and other friends as well. We exchange notes the next day a lot. These experiences involve: siting of crafts. missing time, while awake and up in the night, suddenly an hour two mysteriously vanishes just when you begin to watch a television show, or have just noticed the time on the computer. wounds. physical wounds, gouges, small ones too, bruises, marks, needle marks even, and burning red splashes. wounds on the head, where a device was seen, and the neck. Wires and odd things popping out of wounds. One friend has the common reported triangle shaped markings/wounds afterwards, and for its the entire family as well as her young daugther.

There is a whole lot more to this experience than the astral realm. Ets are masters of all realms, the higher level ones. They even create planes or influence their creation. Those at least that are according to Drake's formula, level 3 societies.




[edit on 9-11-2009 by Unity_99]

Originally posted by Unity_99There is a whole lot more to this experience than the astral realm. Ets are masters of all realms, the higher level ones.

I tend to agree - and this is the other reason why I think the OPs theory is flawed rather. Not only do "astral" type experiences not rule out real ET involvement in these episodes, but there are so many aspects that are not purely astral in nature to the reported Grey abductions and encounters.

Originally posted by Malcram
reply to post by NightVision

 

Indeed. It would make a lot of sense for relatively small and physically fragile ETs (such as some Greys are reported to be) to operate fully or partially from another 'level' in which they are not as vulnerable as they are in the "physical" if they have that option, which I believe they do, because even we do although few of us are aware of it.


[edit on 9-11-2009 by Malcram]

I was thinking the other day about this thread. Maybe the Grey's telepathic abilities make them capable of abducting you in an astral state? Does that make sense? I've had an experience with Greys, but it is very questionable, but I felt their telepathic abilities, and that was very strange. VERY.

Also can somebody post a link to a great abduction case? Please no Betty and Barney Hill or Travis Walton. Please post something recent, since they are reported so often.

Sorry I have my doubts, I have had 2 unusual experiences but I want to hear some other's experiences. However, from what I've read, most sound like they are looking for their 15 minutes of fame...

Originally posted by game over man

Also can somebody post a link to a great abduction case? Please no Betty and Barney Hill or Travis Walton. Please post something recent, since they are reported so often.

Sorry I have my doubts, I have had 2 unusual experiences but I want to hear some other's experiences. However, from what I've read, most sound like they are looking for their 15 minutes of fame...

Game Over Man, since your exp. seems to be of the "grey race" variety, I would definately check out Jim Sparks story. Its appears to be highly credible, w. corroborating testimony from other abductees who've seen him as well as military/govt. contacts.



[edit on 9-11-2009 by NightVision]

Originally posted by Malcram

Originally posted by Unity_99There is a whole lot more to this experience than the astral realm. Ets are masters of all realms, the higher level ones.

I tend to agree - and this is the other reason why I think the OPs theory is flawed rather. Not only do "astral" type experiences not rule out real ET involvement in these episodes, but there are so many aspects that are not purely astral in nature to the reported Grey abductions and encounters.

Yes, and higher level ETs, drop their bodies like a pair of clothing. This entire thing complicates matters enormously. What may confuse some at night time, and they may percieve as an astral experience, tends to be a true ET phenomenum instead.

Originally posted by Unity_99

Originally posted by Malcram

Originally posted by Unity_99There is a whole lot more to this experience than the astral realm. Ets are masters of all realms, the higher level ones.

I tend to agree - and this is the other reason why I think the OPs theory is flawed rather. Not only do "astral" type experiences not rule out real ET involvement in these episodes, but there are so many aspects that are not purely astral in nature to the reported Grey abductions and encounters.

Yes, and higher level ETs, drop their bodies like a pair of clothing. This entire thing complicates matters enormously. What may confuse some at night time, and they may percieve as an astral experience, tends to be a true ET phenomenum instead.

I think that both Malcram and Unity_99 are each correct in their interpretations here, I also think that this is is an argument over semantics. In my mind the difference between the travelling through the "astral" plane, and one "dropping their bodies like a pair of clothing" is so similar as to be effectively the same. The question that I think is pressing is not HOW, but WHY.

Further, I suggest that the argument over Extra-dimensional vs Extra-terrestrial is purely intellectual at this point. I would be content to say "Extra" and leave it at that for all it gets us.

tamale

edit: grammar

[edit on 9-11-2009 by Tamale_214]

Originally posted by Tamale_214
the allies of humanity material proposes that the first contact with ET forces for most planets will be resource collectives. Groups that work together to obtain natural resources necessary for their continued survival.

With all do respect, we don't need any extraterrestrial technologies, we are clever enough to evolve technologically on our own; given the current circumstance of greedy one's this is not going to happen even if the aliens or whatever you want to call them landed tomorrow offering us proton, zoton, voton reactors for unlimited energy source power.

Realistically the free source energy is already been devised and implemented by our very scientists; unfortunately the reason we are lacking is because there is a little thing called mutual silence among this controversy.

Originally posted by krystalice

Originally posted by Tamale_214
the allies of humanity material proposes that the first contact with ET forces for most planets will be resource collectives. Groups that work together to obtain natural resources necessary for their continued survival.

With all do respect, we don't need any extraterrestrial technologies, we are clever enough to evolve technologically on our own; given the current circumstance of greedy one's this is not going to happen even if the aliens or whatever you want to call them landed tomorrow offering us proton, zoton, voton reactors for unlimited energy source power.

Realistically the free source energy is already been devised and implemented by our very scientists; unfortunately the reason we are lacking is because there is a little thing called mutual silence among this controversy.

I rather think that you misunderstand me. I do not think that the collectives that I refer to here want to give us anything that will benefit us, rather I think that they don't care about us one way or another, except as a hurdle to jump or a natural resource to exploit. Basically, the scenario that I am arguing is one in which we are the Native Americans and they are the European colonialists infecting our blankets with smallpox.

[edit on 9-11-2009 by Tamale_214]

reply to post by Tamale_214


Now that I read it; I understand your point. Though given the circumstance my theory still stands firm for those that dwell on the circumstance that some kind of Disclosure would bring them means of global peace or an evolution of new source of energy offered or discovered by the extraterrestrial vehicles and so forth.

reply to post by krystalice


Oh I totally agree with you, wholescale disclosure will not bring us world peace or spiritual ascension, not in the way people pie-in-the-sky hope anyway. I nonetheless think that disclosure would help humanity break out of the current paradigm and open up to the next--however, those who think that our space-brothers are going to save us are going to be sorely disappointed by the kind of saving that we get

tamale

[edit on 9-11-2009 by Tamale_214]

reply to post by Tamale_214


I agree that public disclosure at this point is "Pie in the Sky". Given my experiences I grow weary of these battles to force authorities to alleviate these burning questions. It only serves to distract and perpetuate dis-trust.

With all of the evidence that is available we still debate what is real and unreal. What has come of the evidence that cell phones and all the technology has helped document....everyone needs even more proof.

Disclosure is happening...one person at a time.

Originally posted by Skyfloating
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/f67c2a29f280.jpeg[/atsimg]

I would like to discuss the theory and idea that "Alien Abductions" are a spectral-phenomenon, or to use a word people are more familiar with, an astral-phenomenon.
Thoughts?

Hi Skyfloating, I don’t know how you do it but I can’t keep up with all your interesting threads, you shuffle them out of your sleeves as if it cost you no time, you are not manipulating time in some way do you?

It’s an interesting discussion but here are my first thoughts about it so far.

I never wondered myself that possibility, but despite that, I personally do not believe that.
That doesn’t mean that I don’t believe in the existence of spectral or astral phenomenon, but I don’t see that phenomenon as being responsible for the abduction phenomenon.
I do think however that some sort of contact with other-dimensional beings could easely gives a person that impression.

To give you an idea about really suddenly appearing strange creatures and some sort of suddenly appearing gate [other dimensional???] from which they saw a being crawl out, listen then for instance to that marvelous interview below, it has to do with the book from Colm A. Kelleher, Ph.D. and George Knapp, Hunt for the Skinwalker.

A rare interview with former NID's Director Colm Kelleher explaining the strange and weird events with the infamous Utah Ranch. This interview is part one (of two). Lots of UFO Sightings in both Canada and the US. And the SkepticOverlord returns to tells us the hottest topics.

Colm Kelleher, Part 1 Hunt for the Skinwalker

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Colm Kelleher, Part 2 Hunt for the Skinwalker, I cannot find it ????

ABOUT THE BOOK

For more than fifty years, the bizarre events at a remote Utah ranch have ranged from the perplexing to the wholly terrifying. Vanishing and mutilated cattle. Unidentified Flying Objects. The appearance of huge, otherworldly creatures. Invisible objects emitting magnetic fields with the power to spark a cattle stampede. Flying orbs of light with dazzling maneuverability and lethal consequences. For one family, life on the Skinwalker Ranch had become a life under siege by an unknown enemy or enemies. Nothing else could explain the horrors that surrounded them -- perhaps science could.

www.paraview.com...

For another amazing interview about such strange happenings I advice everyone to listen to this one.

Tonight on Paratopia, ufologist/scientist Phil Imbrogno takes us on a winding journey that starts with a simple suggestion from legendary colleague J. Allen Hynek and ends with the discovery of portals to other dimensions in Upstate New York.

Break out the popcorn and get ready for an eerie ride into the heart of ufology, which beats with a blood far, far stranger than any alien we can imagine.

paratopia.podbean.com...

By the way, a very interesting site from Jeff Ritzmann and Jeremy Vaeni .

Originally posted by Skyfloating
So why do I think that the "Grays" are not actually ETs but astral-beings? Because:

* Almost all Abduction accounts take place in the bedroom in states of sleep, half-sleep, half-waking, etc. The only way the astral-world is accesible is in a state between waking and sleeping.

That is a widespread misconception and not correct, look for instance what Stanton T. Friedman said about it here, and he is not the only one with that view.

I hadn’t had high hopes for the book Abducted: How people Come to Believe They Were Kidnapped by Aliens by Dr. Susan A. Clancy. After all, the segment about abductions which featured her on Peter Jennings’s grossly-misleading “documentary” on February 24, 2005, was definitely unscientific. The focus was on sleep paralysis with no recognition being given to multiple persons being abducted at once, the fact that most abductions have taken place other than when the abductee was sleeping in bed, and that many people have recalled the details without the use of hypnosis. This despite the fact that all of these had been discussed by Budd Hopkins during his PJ interview, but never made the program.

www.v-j-enterprises.com...


[edit on 9/11/09 by spacevisitor]

[edit on 9/11/09 by spacevisitor]

[edit on 9/11/09 by spacevisitor]

[edit on 9/11/09 by spacevisitor]

Originally posted by NightVision

Originally posted by game over man

Also can somebody post a link to a great abduction case? Please no Betty and Barney Hill or Travis Walton. Please post something recent, since they are reported so often.

Sorry I have my doubts, I have had 2 unusual experiences but I want to hear some other's experiences. However, from what I've read, most sound like they are looking for their 15 minutes of fame...

Game Over Man, since your exp. seems to be of the "grey race" variety, I would definately check out Jim Sparks story. Its appears to be highly credible, w. corroborating testimony from other abductees who've seen him as well as military/govt. contacts.

[edit on 9-11-2009 by NightVision]

Thank You!

Originally posted by Skyfloating

Originally posted by The Shrike
Not everything you said is as said. Especially the "hag" episode. I'm an experiencer.

Thanks for sharing that experience.

I am not saying that Hags and Grays are the same thing, Im saying that they show-up in similar states. The idea is that they are both astral.

Yet, possibly the most famous and most respected "astral traveler", Robert A. Monroe (The Monroe Institute) doesn't mention aliens in his many OOBEs.

Originally posted by Tamale_214
discourse on discerning disinformation

Quoting my Favourites from that article:

Encouraging suspension of discernment
Misapplying spiritual principles
Debasing humanity
Limiting awareness of hyperdimensional reality
Offering false dichotomies

But:

"Fear is a path to the dark side"

So I wont be buying into paranoia or fear of them, even if they were malevolent. If they are malevolent they would want us to fear in order to feed of the energy.

Essentially:

Discernment

Fear

[edit on 10-11-2009 by Skyfloating]

Originally posted by Malcram
For instance, the idea you posted that abduction being an "astral phenomenon" (in some cases) would mean it was "not an extraterrestrial phenomenon" is flawed, I believe, because it assumes that there can be no relationship between "real" ETs and the "astral plane".

Sure the astral can also be extraterrestrial and vice-versa. But the Greys seem to be very much less physical than what humanity currently thinks when it thinks "alien".

Therefore, there is no reason why an ET civilization which has learned to access and operate with mastery on this level, either through technology or development of their own system, could not also use "astral projection" to achieve certain goals.

Oh I see. You`re thinking: An extraterrestrial race that uses astral-techniques, rather than an astral-race.

Thats certainly an option.

Originally posted by Witness2008
Both the physical and the astral are at play in my life and my families.

In figuring out this mystery its important that you told us that both were involved.

The physical was disturbing having waken to the effects and marks on my body. My dog and cat also experienced the physical, they vomited a great deal and wanted nothing to do with the room that it had transpired in.

I keep getting that its a real negative vibe. What some Grays say though is: "It only seems negative because you cant handle it". While there is some logic to that, I wonder if thats a lie.

These incidents involved being shown craft and in some kind of holographic window I was allowed to see the misery we live in along with a few other things.

There is a noticeable tendency for them to point out how miserable and humans are - implying that we need their help or something.

Have you ever been in the military..anything along those lines?

Not that I consciously know of....

[edit on 10-11-2009 by Skyfloating]

Originally posted by infinite
Yes, one of the trailers shows footage of a ladies body language suddenly altering - as in possession. Breaks into twitches and a "fit" - similar to demonic possession. Then, she is lifted into the air

It comes down to the question of whether they are negative beings by nature and induce fear or only appear negative because of our already inherent fears.

That question is a classic in all of theology, philosophy, etc.

Maybe the answer is a mixture of both.

Originally posted by NightVision

Many contactee reports confirm that our human mind has much more ability than we are aware of. This either due to the level of consciousness a human carries, or inactive and untapped DNA. Perhaps some ET's have found a way thru advanced tech. to tap into those latent abilities within themselves and us.

Thats likely. In retrospect my impression of the Greys is that they are rather weak, having to bully up on the terrified child that I was. Maybe its not they who are coming to save us but vice-versa.

Originally posted by Unity_99
There is a whole lot more to this experience than the astral realm.

You'll find that most are willing to consider that. No problem at all. My own OP is only from a perspective of what I experienced.

However, "astral realm" does not mean the unreal, vague quality many ascribe to it. It can feel very real.

Ets are masters of all realms, the higher level ones. They even create planes or influence their creation. Those at least that are according to Drake's formula, level 3 societies.

Not all entities would be "masters of all realms". There is reason to doubt that these specific entities (not talking about any other ET species here) are what they try to appear to be.