Has Baxter International Released a New Biological Weapon in the Ukraine?

reply to post by Nichiren


Nichiren, it was a radio show so I'm sure there were plenty of witnesses, even if we can't find the audio yet. And I think the caller may have identified himself as Moshe, the same Moshe who later had the standoff with police.

Why not try to contact Dr. Ott? And IIRC Project Camelot know something about this incident as well.

I remember the flu virus in 1993, the whole family came down with it including my 3 grandchildren, let me tell you all, it was not like a flu virus i have ever seen during my prior 13 years as a health care worker.

Not only was i sick, i had to take care of my 3 grandchildren at the same time, one being an infant. We had all the symptoms A flu but it had a twist, vomiting every 30 minutes along with diarrhea.
I do not want to go through that experience again. I think taking Orange juice and 1000 mg of Vitamin C tabs helped out a lot.

Of course the grandchildren had prescribed medicine.

Was it the same virus as H1N1????.....i don't know.

I found this:
1993 flu


[edit on 2-11-2009 by tiso_us]

If all this data is true what is the end game?

There has to be more to this then just kill a lot of humans.

Just thought I'd add this to the discussion:

Date: Sun 1 Nov 2009 From: Irene Lai The Ukrainian Ministry of Health has released the following information (in Ukrainian) on its website . Some cases of influenza-like illness (ILI) and at least one death have been confirmed as due to influenza pandemic (H1N1) 2009 virus infection. Currently, there are or have been about 1000 people admitted to hospitals. (It is unclear from the report whether these numbers are current or cumulative). More than 100 are being treated in intensive care units. There are restrictions on large gatherings. Schools and entertainment establishments have been closed for 3 weeks. Another Ministry report (in Ukrainian ) states that as of Fri 30 Oct 2009, there are over 80 000 suspected cases and 33 deaths. The report describes 3 features of the outbreak: (1) Complicated courses in pregnant women, people of working age, children, and the elderly (but not as many), and people with cardiovascular and respiratory disease, diabetes, immune deficiency, obesity etc.; (2) Rapid spread; (3) In some cases, a viral pneumonia with rapid progression that is difficult to treat. -- Dr Irene Lai MB BS International SOS Level 5 Challis House 4 Martin Place Sydney NSW 2000 Australia [ProMED-mail thanks Irene Lai for providing these translations. It is clear that the outbreak has all the characteristics of influenza pandemic A(H1N1) 2009 virus infection, although a precise diagnosis has been established only in very few cases. For whatever reason, the Ukrainian authorities seem reluctant to reach this conclusion. The HealthMap/ProMED-mail interactive map of Ukraine can be accessed at: . - Mod.CP]

this comes from the ProMed mailing list organized by the International Society for Infectious Diseases, which typically only quotes epidemiologists and other professionals, and is not prone to overblowing these types of situations. Interesting to me that they call out the Ukraine gov't for not fully acknowledging the nature of the disease they're dealing with.

I don't know if this has been shown yet, but here is video of one of the scientists working on the synthesis of the 1918 virus with the H5N1 and most likely H1N1.

reply to post by MajorDisaster


Usually it's the one making a claim that should be prepared to back it up with actual facts. There is no mp3 on the web with J. Moshe calling in.

Sorry, I won't touch Project Camelot with a ten-foot-pole. After the (Dr.) Pete Peterson disaster they have lost all credibility and I think Bill is unwisely following David Wilcock's advice.

Seems like this needs serious investigation

Panic in Ukraine

info-wars.org...

"Authorities in Kiev, Ukraine, deny spraying of “aerosolized medication” by aircraft over city.

The office of Emergency Response in the district of Desniansko, Kiev, are tonight (30th Oct.) strongly refuting reports that light aircraft were spraying a substance over the city intended to counter a “swine flu pandemic” in Ukraine.

It was reported that light aircraft were seen over the Forest market area of the city (close to the Forest metro station) and they were spraying an aerosol substance intended to “counter swine flu”, this of course would constitute forced medication of the population.

The editors of local newspapers in Kiev received dozens of phone calls from concerned residents and shop owners in the Forest market area of the city reporting they had observed several light airplanes circling in the sky during the day spraying an unidentified aerosol into the atmosphere.

Retailers and local business people reported they were advised to “stay indoors” during the day by local authorities.

Local newspapers contacted government administrators in Kiev and were told that “no permission had been granted today (30th Oct.) for small aviation aircraft to fly within the city limits”. Also local FM radio stations in Kiev were regularly refuting the reports during broadcasts today, apparently under duress from local authorities."

if the above doesnt work


its happening.

its been planned for years.

Hi to everybody. I am from Ukraine even i don't leave there now.. I want to make several notes. 1. Dont trust a word to what ukr. officials are saying. Whatever they say is lie. 2.In Kiev and eastern part of Ukraine most of people don't take this all serious and don't understand why they closed schools. This flue doesn't look different from other years. 3.People in Western ukraine are quite concerned even no major panic. I found a person from Ivano Frankivsk. He has conncetions in the local ambulance. He is saying officials are hiding real numbers. Only today over 70 people were put to hospitals. As a matter of fact his close friend who works in ambulance got to hospital yesterday. Many cases people die in just several days. When they make autopsy they see lungs are completely destroyed like after a long time pneumonia. Doctors don't know what is it. He also sent me instructions for the hospital employees. They are colecting all kinds of tests and send them to Kiev and never get results.. If you want details about these instructions I can translate. Treatment is same for everybody.. But strange thing some of the ill people don't have fever... There are rumours in that region that a burial of people on which was tested biological weapon during USSR was open. But its just rumours so far. What is obvious is that above some cities AN26 are flying and sometimes spraying smth. I even got a picture... But officials completely deny this...

[edit on 2-11-2009 by Irinka]

reply to Irinka

OMG are you saying its much worse than the authorities are saying? Could you post the picture please?

[edit on 2-11-2009 by SpaceMonkeys]

Originally posted by Irinka
Hi to everybody. I am from Ukraine even i don't leave there now.. I want to make several notes. 1. Dont trust a word to what ukr. officials are saying. Whatever they say is lie. 2.In Kiev and eastern part of Ukraine most of people don't take this all serious and don't understand why they closed schools. This flue doesn't look different from other years. 3.People in Western ukraine are quite concerned even no major panic. I found a person from Ivano Frankivsk. He has conncetions in the local ambulance. He is saying officials are hiding real numbers. Only today over 70 people were put to hospitals. As a matter of fact his close friend who works in ambulance got to hospital yesterday. Many cases people die in just several days. When they make autopsy they see lungs are completely destroyed like after a long time pneumonia. Doctors don't know what is it. He also sent me instructions for the hospital employees. They are colecting all kinds of tests and send them to Kiev and never get results.. If you want details about these instructions I can translate. Treatment is same for everybody.. But strange thing some of the ill people don't have fever... There are rumours in that region that a burial of people on which was tested biological weapon during USSR was open. But its just rumours so far. What is obvious is that above some cities AN26 are flying and sometimes spraying smth. I even got a picture... But officials completely deny this...

[edit on 2-11-2009 by Irinka]

Thank you for the update, any more would be welcome.

Something major is going on over there... the small planes spraying is highly suspicious and I doubt it is to "fight" the virus....I bet it is the virus itself they are spraying.

it's only a question how long before this spills over into other countries

Seems like this has some truth....its now reported on the WHO Website, take a look:

"On 28 October 2009, the Ministry of Health of the Ukraine informed WHO, through its Country Office in Ukraine, about an unusually high level of activity of acute respiratory illness in the western part of the country, associated with an increased number of hospital admissions and fatalities."

"The situation is quickly changing with increasingly high levels of acute respiratory illness (ARI)/Influenza-like-illness (ILI) activity being observed in Ternopil, Lviv, Ivano-Frankivsk, and Chernivtsi regions. The higher levels of transmission in these regions corresponds to an increased number of hospital admissions and fatalities associated with severe manifestations of acute respiratory illness."

www.who.int...

reply to post by Did you see them

The office of Emergency Response in the district of Desniansko, Kiev, are tonight (30th Oct.) strongly refuting reports that light aircraft were spraying a substance over the city intended to counter a “swine flu pandemic” in Ukraine.

In their questions they should replace, "counter" with, "accelerate." Theyd probably get a more honest response lol

[edit on 11/2/09 by CSquared288]

Interesting how it's barely made mention on the mainstream media (I came across the original story on whatreallyhappened.com).

I had a real nasty flu attack back in the 90's I think, I was almost crippled in bed and I honestly thought I was about die, my entire body was shaking, I could barely think and I was delirious from the effects of the flu but I managed to get over it.

Not had anything similar for a long time however what bothers me is the effects I have experienced over the past 3 years where I can feel the flu symptoms but they never quite fully develop - instead I have this lingering half flu that screws me up for a month (right now I can feel the effects thanks to the onset of the winter weather here in the UK).

I fully believe biological agents are being produced on a mass scale now and this ties in neatly with the spate of deaths over the past few years of scientists involved in type of bio research and development.

I think it was Kissinger who once said the solution to the world problems would have to come in the form of a world wide pandemic to enforce a global population control - i.e. it would require the deaths of many people.

Edit: found the old article I read Link...

The human body has a capacity to endure many hardships so I will not be surprised if we get a surge of mass pandemic like deaths and then a sudden drop as people start to develop the necessary biological defenses to fight off the man-made viruses.

[edit on 2-11-2009 by old_god]

[edit on 2-11-2009 by old_god]

reply to post by SpaceMonkeys

It is hard to say to be honest.. We have elections on Jan 17th. These elections will be very dirty one.. Ukrainian people are fed up with all kinds of scandals. The latest one was about deputies raping children. Most of public just looks to this flu story as exagerated. They think Timoshenko is just using this to promote herself and to show how active she is. On TV you can see more politicians talking about this then doctors. On the other hand some locals from Western Ukraine are saying its worse then they are saying. Lots of rumors and no information. There was info that today representative from WHO should come to Ukraine. But nothing like this on the news today. You have to understand that even it is a swine flu, they are absolutely not ready. Not mentioning vaccine, they don't even have facilities to make tests to understand what it is. They don\t know what it is not necessarily becase its something horrible, but they don't have facilities to make investigation... About the picture. I have it on my PC, but I failed to insert it. If i do just copy paste, i will not be banned??

www.pravda.com.ua... -- you can see an article.. Thats what public will believe easily.. You know, I am very concerned about Ukraine, its my motherland.. But this is the only post I found that takes it seriously.. If you go to any forums in Ukraine, you will see people are just joking about it..

But again this article was written by a journalist who works for Yanukovich... Nothing is clear.. The only thing is clear its all in chaos..


[edit on 2-11-2009 by Irinka]

[edit on 2-11-2009 by Irinka]

guys i live in kiev and i'd like to explain some facts about ukraine
1.there is no secret baxter lab at least in kiev and in big cities in western ukraine, the adress on their official cite is just an adress of the office.maybe there is a secret lab in some secret places but not in kiev for sure.and epidemia could not start due to infected vaccines because there are no vaccines against h1n1 in ukraine.at all!our government ordered it a couple of days ago.
2.the main reason of the wide spread of flu or pneumonia or whatever is that no one was preparing to the fact that in winter there will be more sick people.there are no medicines in our pharmacies there are no even bandages that you wear on your face like it was in mexico so people just infect each other in transport, in shops, at work...
3.according to ukrainian media about 40 people died, i don't know whether they lie (they can)but this is official information
4.there will be soon president election in our country so everything that politicians think about is not saving people but increasing their own ratings and stealing more money that they "spend" fighting with epidemia.
5.the blood samples were sent to london as we don't have the lab to diagnose h1n1 virus so if there was something dangerous europe would at least close its borders for ukrainians)
so it's 50% about panic and 50% about real danger

According to information here the population of the Ukraine is approx. 48 million, and according to information here the current number of people infected is 255k, so that would equate to a current infection rate of around 0.5% of the population.


Approx. 3.2% of the worlds population was killed by the 1918 flu pandemic, with around 33% of the worlds population being infected.

So whilst what is happening in the Ukraine is worrying, there's a hell of a long way to go before things get as bad as they were in 1918

reply to post by Argyll


You’re confusing the panic scenario we are shooting for with irrelevant facts. Perhaps you should try one of those medical blog thingies!

Dyncorp and Baxter Profit Motive

Legal immunity set for swine flu vaccine makers
July 20, 2009

Vaccine makers and federal officials will be immune from lawsuits that result from any new swine flu vaccine, under a document signed by Secretary of Health and Human Services Kathleen Sebelius, government health officials said Friday.

Since the 1980s, the government has protected vaccine makers against lawsuits over the use of childhood vaccines. Instead, a federal court handles claims and decides who will be paid from a special fund.

The document signed by Sebelius last month grants immunity to those making a swine flu vaccine, under the provisions of a 2006 law for public health emergencies.