Burning In Hell? For Eternity? Wait a minute...BUT

reply to post by whatukno
And Abraham's bosom was ended when? Who descended into Abraham's bosom and took all those souls to heaven?

for 2000 years now Hell is by itself. The abode for the damned.

Finish this verse: "To be absent from the body is to be___________ with the _______"

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Never actually ended, but more than likely seldom used.

Remember what has been made cannot be unmade.

Originally posted by whatukno
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Never actually ended, but more than likely seldom used.

Remember what has been made cannot be unmade.

I didn't mean to leave you with the impression the structure where souls went before the death and resurrection of Christ was "destroyed", but merely after Christ good men and believers no longer go to Earth, born again believers now Go to heaven, or the "Kingdom of God".

Those who trusted God before Christ went to Abraham's bosom, those who didn't know God or who didn't trust God went to Hell. The beautiful thing is scriptures say that those who never heard about the Messiah before Jesus came to Earth were "preached" to by Jesus after He died! I think it's sooo merciful that the Lord gave them an opportunity to hear His gospel, that all men will have the chance to hear His gospel and accept it or reject it.

Anyways, here is as complete a study on Abraham's Bosom I can find. Reading it would save 2-3 pages in this thread of discussing it. The souls of born again believers from Christ to now no longer go to "paradise", they now go to the "Kingdom of God" or heaven if you will.

Hope this study clears up the confusion my friend.

reply to post by whatukno


Yeah, I've read The Bible. I'm wondering if you've even read what you've posted.

The rich man looked "up" and saw Lazarus "afar off", divided by a "great gulf" which "none may cross". The rich man was in "torments", while Lazarus was "comforted". There is absolutely no way any reasonable person could interpret this parable to mean that hell is Paradise. The two dead men were clearly in different realms, experiencing utterly different judgments.

This parable demolishes your point, so I have no idea why you posted it. Come to the Truth; God's mercy is open to you.

reply to post by GiveUpTheGhost


The point was, Hell is Hades of Greek mythology. The underworld. The point is, paradise is not heaven, but in fact just a different part of hell, or Hades, or the Underworld.

The kingdom of Heaven and the lake of fire, are two wholly different aspects of the afterlife. The kingdom of Heaven is not Paradise, cause Paradise is a part of hell. And hell is not the lake of Fire, because that is where god is going to cast his enemies in the final judgment to be destroyed.

That was the point.



[edit on 10/27/2009 by whatukno]

reply to post by whatukno


I wouldn't make it my "goal" to go to Hades... The Bible is explicitly clear that after the judgment Hades is cast into the lake of fire for eternity.

God basically clearing the trash bin so to speak.

Decide today you'll spend eternity in God's Kingdom, it's a free gift to anyone who wants it. All it takes if you to ask the Lord for it.

Pray the sinner's prayer, and you will have eternal life. It's easier than breathing, or blinking. The choice is yours alone my friend.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Me & God are cool, don't worry bout it.

He has a message for you.

Read your Psalms.

reply to post by whatukno
Of course! Psalms are the most beutiful verses in the Word. Kinda preoccupied now though, doing Romans and Proverbs.

I agree the Psalms are the most beautiful ones.

Originally posted by PeterGriffin
**I'D LIKE TO START WITH A CLARIFICATION...THIS IS NOT A DEBATE ON WHETHER OR NOT HELL EXISTS** IT IS ABOUT THE ACTUAL "BURNING FOR ETERNITY" IN HELL, ANY AND ALL OPINIONS ARE WELCOME***

I felt like this deserved its own thread. There are seveal discussions on "Is Hell Real" "Is Satan Real" etc...But not really (that I have found on this) -- If this has been placed in the wrong section of the site please help re-direct

*Burning in Hell*

Let's just say for a minute (ahemmm -- here it goes) that Satan IS Real...

And some "will burn in fire for all eternity"

What about this?? -- Ok, the initial reaction to the burning....AHHHHHH, AHHHHHHHHHHHHHH, followed by another even bigger AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.....BUT...ever broken your arm?? (or put your example here) The pain sucks...REAL bad, but after a while the pain SLIGHTLY subsides and gets a bit easier to deal with....

So...the "burning for eternity"...after let's say...an hour...The AHHHHHHH, would slowly turn into...Ouch, this sucks...and then after a week...."Man, this burning is ANNOYING more than painful"

OR we could just say that just like being cremated...you wouldnt get passed even more than a few minutes before being nothing but ashes

So is Satan Real....hmmm, maybe. Is hell real....could be.....

But even the "worst of the worst" whether they are people/demons/ whatever....GET TIRED...so there must be a few "breaks" in hell we're I guess we could try to find some ice for the burns...

**ONCE AGAIN, SINCE RESPONSES SEEM TO BE GOING OFF TOPIC** I am asking...even if it IS real...wouldnt we get used to the burning?? Plus, wouldnt there be breaks?...I know it's an odd question, but eventually we would get numb to the burns and used to it....no??

We know the BODY is adaptive because it is DNA restructuring to handle future threats. It is an evolutionary process of protection. not to say that I believe in evolution....per say, I believe in creation but I believe that while we are here as a people our bodies do adapt for future lineage benefits. I don`t, however, believe that the soul (being incorruptible as the bible describes) will be able to adapt to the torchers. Also, I believe the bible refers to incorruptible bodies upon the return of Jesus as well.

Originally posted by PeterGriffin

What about this?? -- Ok, the initial reaction to the burning....AHHHHHH, AHHHHHHHHHHHHHH, followed by another even bigger AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.....BUT...ever broken your arm?? (or put your example here) The pain sucks...REAL bad, but after a while the pain SLIGHTLY subsides and gets a bit easier to deal with....

So...the "burning for eternity"...after let's say...an hour...The AHHHHHHH, would slowly turn into...Ouch, this sucks...and then after a week...."Man, this burning is ANNOYING more than painful"

OR we could just say that just like being cremated...you wouldnt get passed even more than a few minutes before being nothing but ashes

I'm not sure what "hell" you're speaking of but if taken from Scripture (Biblical) then your questions are in error for there is no time outside of time and space. So after "an hour" makes no sense. The "pain" would be constant and you would have no idea of "time".

Going further into your questions we have more problems.....again if speaking of a Biblical hell....is the "burning" or "fire" a literal physical fire in which people burn and burn or is it a figure of speech?

Jesus states that many people will be "cast into outer darkness" but how can hell be a place of "darkness" while there is also an unquenchable fire which would provide light and not darkness? So this leads us to ask just what is literal about hell?

Well what we do grasp from a reading of Scripture is that "death" comes in 2 forms. 1) A physical death and 2) a spiritual death. Those called out of the world for salvation die a physical death but not a spiritual death. Those who are not called for salvation die both physically and spiritually because they have only their works to be judged upon after death and they are all found to be unworthy. The Believers are not judged after death for salvation for they are ALREADY saved while alive physically.

The "weeping and gnashing of teeth" is what we can then take literally for it is an expression of grief and guilt, but at what? Well eternal separation from God. That is what "hell" is.....they have been separated from God and even while alive they may have denied God BUT they knew or had the presence of God around them. They rejected God BUT they were the benefactors of His Grace.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

I didn't mean to leave you with the impression the structure where souls went before the death and resurrection of Christ was "destroyed", but merely after Christ good men and believers no longer go to Earth, born again believers now Go to heaven, or the "Kingdom of God".

Those who trusted God before Christ went to Abraham's bosom, those who didn't know God or who didn't trust God went to Hell. The beautiful thing is scriptures say that those who never heard about the Messiah before Jesus came to Earth were "preached" to by Jesus after He died! I think it's sooo merciful that the Lord gave them an opportunity to hear His gospel, that all men will have the chance to hear His gospel and accept it or reject it.

Anyways, here is as complete a study on Abraham's Bosom I can find. Reading it would save 2-3 pages in this thread of discussing it. The souls of born again believers from Christ to now no longer go to "paradise", they now go to the "Kingdom of God" or heaven if you will.

Hope this study clears up the confusion my friend.

I can see that you have a great love for the Lord by your postings and that's a blessing but as a brother in Christ I must question this teaching that "Jesus preached His gospel to those in paradise" because there is no evidence of this at all.

Please first understand that I once taught this very same thing (I taught classes in church, apologetics and home studies), basing it on passages from Peter but one day I was confronted by another brother in Christ who told me I was in error. I of course disagree, became defensive and began to show him my proof Scriptures and he then began to dismantle all I had come to believe in regards to Jesus and souls in paradise. It did not happen over night but the more I studied about it the more I came to see that I was in fact teaching in error.

What changed my outlook the most was the Greek wording and a passage I plain overlooked.

"Father, into your hands I commit my spirit" Luke 23:46

Now that is a reference to Psalm 31:5 but it holds great meaning in this topic because Jesus gave up His "spirit" to God the Father who lives in "paradise" for to the Hebrew mind there are 3 "heavens". The first being earths atmosphere where the birds of the air fly. The second being that of the stars and planets and the 3rd utmost and highest heaven is where God resides.

This is what Paul speaks of when in 2 Cor. 12 he speaks of a man he knew who was "caught up to the third heaven.......(12:4) caught up to paradise" Now was this man Paul? Some believe so but many also claim it was John, which I tend to lean to.....but anyway with the above in mind notice what Jesus says to the thief upon the cross in Luke 23:43....

"I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise."

This is replied by Jesus to the thief just after the thief stated,

"remember me when you come in your kingdom"

The thief was looking at a future event and was basically asking Jesus to remember him when Jesus came back but Jesus said, in a nutshell, that TODAY (not later, of course there is no time in eternity) you will be in paradise.

So since Jesus gave up His spirit to God and since God dwells in the third heaven, also called paradise, He and the thief went to be with God after they died. Their physical bodies went to the "grave" but their spirits went to be with God the Father.

In Christ



[edit on 31-10-2009 by TangoVooDoo]

reply to post by TangoVooDoo


Thank you, I've come along way and it was none of my doing, I fought the Lord and His Holy Spirit every step of the way and finally submitted. lol

Now, commiting to the Father His spirit simply means "it's in your hands Father", and Jesus told the thief he would be in "paradise" with Him that day. Paradise was Abraham's bosom and was in the Earth, not the third heaven, and Jesus told people when He was alive that no man had seen the father yet, "Heaven" was empty until Christ was resurrected and went there as a man. He was the "firstfruits".

And there is a specific verse that said the Lord went to "preach to those in prison in the Earth, and Isaiah speaks of the "bars in prison" in Hell. Paradise was never "prison", it was a place of comfort for every follower of god before Christ walked the Earth.

But honestly, we can all have our different beliefs on different scriptures corrected when we get to heaven, now all our energy should be telling people the gospel of Jesus Christ. There is an eternity to satisfy those types of debates. Let's make sure we are trying to help as many of our lost brothers and sisters here on Earth, that's what matters.

Agree brother?