What does drinking out of a skull signify?

whenandwhere



We have TWO human skulls , FOUR human femur bones and one set (skull & femur bones) of plastic .

At least you admit that you use real human remains, whereas augustus masonicus denied it.

You know exactly where they came from and how they obtained them but you would rather make it look far more sinister by saying you have know Idea of where or how .

No, I don't know how they were obtained. Nobody in my commandery knew where they were obtained, and I've never talked to anybody else who knew where their commanderies obtained theirs. But kudos to you for knowing where yours got theirs I suppose.

How would you like it if some frat group got your dad or mom's skull and were using it for silly initiation rituals? I don't accuse the masons of devil worship or anything like that, but I do accuse them of desecrating human remains when they do this. And yes, I was guilty of it to.

drinking out of a human skull is about the same disregard for humanity

as having flayed skin from tattooed victims being used as 'lamp shades' by Nazi's of the WW2 era


despicable actions by depraved people who claim Illumination and Superiority over the masses


I accept hedonism but acts like those are beyond the pale and indefensible

reply to post by St Udio


Don't be so quick to judge...

In many African cultures, it is the ultimate sign of respect of one who has passed, as in those cultures, a part of the essence or spirit of the ancestor is then passed to the drinker through the ritual. If the ancestor was not a good person, then his skull would be buried and never drunk from.

Thus, saying it is despicable and degrading is merely your opinion based on your upbringing in a Western culture.

For many cultures who embrace ancestor worship, it is the ultimate form of respect for one who has passed on.

The symbolism is very deep and actually rather profound.

thelonious2
This is not true. Plastic skulls are not allowed to be used in the conferring of the Order of the Temple, and a real skull was used when I took the Scottish Rite 30th and 33rd degrees.

Sorry, no real skulls used here in New Jersey in the Scottish Rite. If you disagree then by all means come out and prove me wrong.

AugustusMasonicus

thelonious2
This is not true. Plastic skulls are not allowed to be used in the conferring of the Order of the Temple, and a real skull was used when I took the Scottish Rite 30th and 33rd degrees.

Sorry, no real skulls used here in New Jersey in the Scottish Rite. If you disagree then by all means come out and prove me wrong.

You are correct Augustus , not everyone uses real skulls . There is absolutely no rule stating plastic skulls are not to be used or a violation . In my state , plastic skulls are the norm in the YR . My Commandery is one of the oldest in my state and still retains all their original .... ermm....... paraphernalia .

reply to post by thelonious2

According to who? Please cite law or regulation that says such a thing. Prove what you say is true.

reply to post by kingswillquiver


It represents an allegorical philosophy of libations from one bone box unto another to quench their thirst for knowledge. Also wine maketh a glad heart! And brings cheer to those who are sorrowful via their ignorance.

reply to post by whenandwhere


My lodge here in Hellinois uses a real skull.

reply to post by thelonious2


Thanks for your response, always appreciate an honest insight that is shared, its curiosity that brings most of us to these kind of threads and that interest in esoteric symbolism.

Your fifth, your saying it signifies a 'death oath' correct?

Can anyone tell me, are they always adult skulls or do they use children's skulls?

oxford
reply to post by thelonious2

 

Thanks for your response, always appreciate an honest insight that is shared, its curiosity that brings most of us to these kind of threads and that interest in esoteric symbolism.

Your fifth, your saying it signifies a 'death oath' correct?

Can anyone tell me, are they always adult skulls or do they use children's skulls?

As I explained in an earlier post the symbolism of drinking from a skull is to remind us that we are born to die and even our Savior was not exempt . So What , you didn't like that answer that came from the ritual itself ? You skipped over the reasonable and correct explanations and went for the most sinister (and wrong) explanation because it fits into your narrow view , is that it ?

Children's skulls , now you are just being silly .

thelonious2

I went through this bizarre ritual when I was initiated into the Templars, and the desecration of human remains bothered me even then. Real human skulls are used, and I have no idea where they get them. Or how.

Oh really?

The candidate is required to take an oath on the skull called the "fifth libation". In it, he sentences himself to eternal punishment should he break the rules of his new club.

In every Degree in Freemasonry, all oaths are taken on the Volume of Sacred Law, not on a skull. But if you were ever a Mason, you'd know that.

Furthermore, what you claim is found on FreemasonryWatch.com, but certainly isn't the oath that I took when I did that Degree.

Let me ask you a simple question...
What you were wearing when you first entered the Commandery and what was written on your shield at that point?

reply to post by Saurus


I wouldn't hold your breath on real answers. I don't think Ms. Frost can come up with those answers on her own. She is a fairly good googler, but misses a few key points.

reply to post by whenandwhere


It had nothing to do with 'not liking the answer' just the way it was worded left me uncertain of what you were saying, hence why I asked the question, to see if I had understood correctly.

Anyhow like I have already said in the thread I highly doubt it has one static meaning.

My question regarding adult and childrens skulls was a genuine one, its got nothing to do with 'being silly'.

reply to post by oxford


Most Lodges have artificial ones.

However, as an illustration, in years gone by, bones may have been found by a policeman, for example, never identified by a forensic pathologist, and eventually ended up with a Lodge. However, these have normally been with the Lodge for many, many years, since when laws in that regard were less strict or non-existent.

In my experience, only the very old Lodges may have real bones, and those bones are usually very old.

Not that it makes any difference, as all the lectures about our emblems of mortality are symbolical anyway. It's just nice to try and make the degrees as authentic as possible. I once went to a Lodge in a rural area, where they used plastic arrows from a toy shop in one of the additional Order's degrees that I belong to. Somehow, the lesson of the arrows just lost all its impact.

reply to post by Saurus


Thanks for the honest reply Saurus it is always appreciated, I get what your saying, the rituals are handed down and have been for a couple hundred years and with them the paraphernalia, there is a whole history to the ritual and also the energy that is built from it being repeated in the same place with the same things. Been interested in shamanistic practices so get where your coming from.

I'm genuinely surprised, had no idea your rituals were so shaman like for want of a better word!

But in all honesty I find it really creepy and I'm not sure ethically I like the idea because the paraphernalia are from unknown origins. There is also that whole 'rest in peace' ethical issue. Stuff like this is sooo far out of the ordinary Joe's remit its not surprising most people have a negative view of Masonry (its not the best PR is it lol). Have you ever personally seen childrens skulls being used or are they all adults? (I really don't see that as a silly question!)

Surprised you guys don't make your own ritual implements which is customary for most magicians and shamans, love to see that advertised, 'Paper Mache Skull making with the Masons, Tuesday at eight' lol

oxford

But in all honesty I find it really creepy and I'm not sure ethically I like the idea because the paraphernalia are from unknown origins. There is also that whole 'rest in peace' ethical issue.

You're thinking from a strictly Western point of view. To really find truth and understand mankind from all cultures and religions, you must see the world through their eyes also.

oxford

Stuff like this is sooo far out of the ordinary Joe's remit its not surprising most people have a negative view of Masonry (its not the best PR is it lol).

Mystery schools are by their nature esoteric. If they weren't, they would be regular schools. Masonry is not for everyone. We attract those with an insatiable desire for knowledge and truth, which often requires the candidate to put themselves out of their comfort zone and question all that they know.

How can a person truly have faith if they have not put every single one of their beliefs through rigorous testing, and then still believe? If a man is afraid to question what he believes, then he doesn't truly have faith, does he?

Have you ever personally seen childrens skulls being used or are they all adults? (I really don't see that as a silly question!)

I have only seen one real skull used (in all the Lodges that I have visited) and it was an adult skull.

It means all the clean glasses are used up, and you're down to using the decorative bits to drink from.

I was a freemason for 4 years..not much in comparison to many, but I retired as I simply didn't have time to go to meetings and had a 2 year old son that needed my time. (Family comes first in freemasonry as it should in life full stop).

In my time I never once drank out of a skull, was not asked to, and didn't see or hear of anybody else in the lodge doing it. This id yhe first I have heard of it.. so I'm reluctant to believe it's true.

However what I do know is that they hold high regard in symbolism. It's all around us for those that will wake up and see. I would suggest it symbolizes attaining the knowledge that is required to reach a 33rd degree.

Freemasons are the good guys folks. Let's pull away this false veil of satanic bs and secrecy because youcan find out what you want to know on their official site or off the net (discernment required to filter truth from lies as in most things on tinternet). You can even go into lodges and be shown around on open days..ask questions etc. And they'll answer too.

There are however several bodies as in 'governing bodies' that in some cases do not recognise each other (I've seen this same thing in the martial arts community). They also have different ways of doing things and saying things..

So..for my part, I can hand on my heart say the truth as I have seen it.. freemasonry - satanic..absolutely not.. drinking from skulls..absolutely not..

Some of the kindest, good hearted, truthful and honest men that raise millions of pounds per year for many charities..not requiring a big thank you or even a mention that they donated.. just goodwill to ALL men.. Absolutely.

reply to post by vivid1975


Brother, the drinking from a skull thing is a York Rite thing apparently. I am not a member, so I also have never heard (other than here) about this practice. I have been told by other brothers who have been through the York Rite that this is fact.