Why 911

Originally posted by Donny 4 million
jj and mike

Since I read your replies to SP of late and see so much bias, prejudice, and denial. I decided to check out what you seem to be avoiding. Don't blame you.
Do you see any terrorist behavior here!

from the web

You'll continue to see this kind of bias and more if this becomes the topic of discussion. So far I’ve seen is a truckload of unsubstantiated pseudo data and plain old disinformation coming down the pike.

You can find out Mossad's operational history fairly easy because of their relative transparency as a Westernized country. Much of what you find on the Net is either from Israeli newspaper sources and even books like one time Mossad Chief Efraim Halevy's revealing biography as well as detailed bios of ex-Mossad agents.

We even know of what the Russians were up to all those Cold War years with the collapse of the Soviet Union. Ironically Russia is now run by the KGB with one time hit man Mr. Putin in charge.

But where is your equally long list of the activities of the intelligence agencies in the Muslim world to match the Israeli one and provide a full picture of the world of international intrigue?

So many countries are involved in double dealing and back stabbing with allies and enemies. But it is business as usual in places like the Middle East because there is no press, no investigative reporting. People have no knowledge of the activities of their intelligence services or ask questions.

A prime example of information blackout is Pakistan, which has been playing a triple hand for years, taking billions in foreign aid from the America, while plotting against the US at every turn.

So what foreign intelligence agency actively facilitated 9/11? If you say Mossad you identify yourself as a just typical uninformed conspiracy loon.

But for some reason you can’t just magically Google Pakistan’s involvement in 9/11.

And conspiracists don’t want to hear about it. They have their singular fixations on the US, Britain, Israel. To hell with history, the truth, facts,

Conspiracists just can’t get their heads around the involvement of the Saudis or Pakistani military intelligence in 9/11. Simple reason. The current crop of conspiracists have no interest at all on understanding what really happens in the world. It is simply an excuse to accuse or implicate their chosen demons. There is no such thing as terrorism to a conspiracists. It's all false flags.

Informed people in the world ignore the 9/11 conspiracy theorists for the same reasons they ignore UFO claims. Both not coincidentally are thought to involve US government cover-ups.

There is so much outright nonsensical BS passing for information these days.
It's become a mass videogame with decreasing correlation to world events.

I’ll cut short my rant knowing it’s falling no deaf ears.

I recommend doing REAL research – which doesn’t mean plugging in key words to Google.


Your Friendly Neighbourhood Disinformation Agent

M



[edit on 12-8-2009 by mmiichael]

posted by mmiichael

Your Friendly Neighbourhood Disinformation Agent

Your tiny tidbit of professional truth is quite refreshing Mike.

Originally posted by SPreston

posted by mmiichael

Your Friendly Neighbourhood Disinformation Agent

Your tiny tidbit of professional truth is quite refreshing Mike.

And one wonders what kind of internal world people have created for themselves when they honestly believe they are regularly interfacing online with Disinformation Agents.


from US Black Ops - dept #5179

Coptic christians are being rounded up and forced to convert to Islam. In Iran Christians were rounded up during the protests. In Kenya same scenerio. So along with 911, the Coptic Christian holy day, it can be determined that the next attack will have something to do with the Islamic struggle against Christians or Jews.
One suggestion I heard was the Yom Kipper war. With Israel having to go against Iran alone it could be that Iran will instigate on that holy day. But what about the attack on the US? Any predictions?

Originally posted by JJay55
Coptic christians are being rounded up and forced to convert to Islam. In Iran Christians were rounded up during the protests. In Kenya same scenerio. So along with 911, the Coptic Christian holy day, it can be determined that the next attack will have something to do with the Islamic struggle against Christians or Jews.
One suggestion I heard was the Yom Kipper war. With Israel having to go against Iran alone it could be that Iran will instigate on that holy day. But what about the attack on the US? Any predictions?

Although the Muslim strategists may seem married to their religious symbolism - one has to give them credit for learning new tricks.

They may not be looking at Hsun-Tze's "Art of War" but they are learning how to play the game better from the recent past.

Israel created the impression they had to delay their strike into Gaza for 3 days then hit hard catching everyone of guard.

A lot was learned by the engagements with Israel in 2006 and Gaza. An academic historian has shown the new asymmetrical warfare tactics that have developed.

Wars are as much about public image as military battles.

Personally I don't see an imminent conventional war between Israel and Iran. They talk about it too much and spew out rhetoric non-stop. This is a good sign. It means they are playing for an audience rather than getting ready for battle.

When all gets quiet - that's when to start worrying.

Israel does not want to lose population. Iran knows it's Russian military equipment is often dysfunctional. They know too Putin won't back them in a crunch. Russia has serious problems right now and the last thing they want to do is expose their own vulnerability.

The wild card in this all is the Mad Mullahs who run the show in Iran. Frustrated by the fact that their 30 year Islamic Revolution is in stall mode, they may decide to go for broke. They may feel mobilizing the people now would be a positive step. A few million dead Iranians may not be an overriding concern for them. It gets them sympathy and makes them look like the underdog - which they want.

Hamas and Hezbollah may get cold feet too and stay offside in a confrontation. They feed off Iranian largess but have no great loyalty to an Iran with it's back to the wall.

In typical lame fashion I expect Iran will settle for hitting some Jewish target in the West to signal their hostility. But not much more.

This is improv analysis, but I don't see anything more than Iran just playing around on the fringes, more attempts at destabilizing Iraq, more antagonizing Israel, making the US uncomfortable, but generally playing it safe, for now.

We'll see.

Mike


[edit on 12-8-2009 by mmiichael]

Originally posted by mmiichael

Originally posted by Donny 4 million
jj and mike



m
You'll continue to see this kid of bias and more if this becomes the topic of discussion. So far I’ve seen is a truck load of unsubstantiated pseudo data and plain old disinformation coming down the pike.

d
Mostly you but jj too. You want to define and confine the 911 terrorist scenario to only include Muslims exclusivly. BOOOO! won't happen.

m
You can find out Mossad's operational history fairly easy because of their relative transparency as a Westernized country. Much of what you find on the Net is either from Israeli newspaper sources and even books like one time Mossad Chief Efraim Halevy's revealing biography as well as detailed bios of ex-Mossad agents.

d
So what the camel dung did I just post to you that got you all up on your hind legs.

m
We now even know of what the Russians were up to all those Cold War years with the collapse of the Soviet Union. Ironically Russia is now run by the KGB with one time hit man Mr. Putin in charge.

d
AND?


m
But where is your equally long list of the activities of the intelligence agencies in the Muslim world to match the Israeli one and provide a full picture of the world of international intrigue.

d
Lay out your outline and lets talk but jj will ban you from her thread.

m
So many countries are involved in double dealing and back stabbing with supposed allies and enemies. But it is considered business as usual in places like the Middle East because there is no press, no investigative reporting. People have no knowledge of the activities of their intelligence services or ask questions.

d
So you are sayng that means the USA has to settle for Et Tu Brute. I think not.

m
A prime example of information blackout is Pakistan, which has been playing a triple hand for years, taking billions in foreign aid from the America, while plotting against the US at every turn.

d
Sounds a lot like Isreal to me.

m
What foreign intelligence agency actively facilitated 9/11? If you say Mossad you identify yourself as a just typical uninformed conspiracy loon.

d
The prof. can answer that with some moon phase charts .

m
For some reason you can’t just magically Google Pakistan’s involvement in 9/11.
Why? Because conspiracists don’t want to hear about it.

d
Handle the immediate problem first then the illiegimate kids.

m
It creates excessive cognitive dissonance for them. They have their singular fixations on the US, Britain, Israel. To hell with history, the truth, facts,

d
Much better than being subjected to state brainwashing Mikey

m
Thry can’t get their heads around topics like the involvement of the Saudis or Pakistani military intelligence in 9/11. Simple reason. The current crop of conspiracists have no interest at all on understanding what really happens in the world. It is simply an excuse to collect data that accuses or attempts to implicate their chosen demons in every war or horrendous event. There is no such thing as terrorism to a conspiracists. It's a false flag.

d
Back this up with some data please.

m
The majority of knowledgeable informed people in the world ignore the claims of conspiracy theorist for the same reasons they ignore UFO claims, which coincidentally the real truth of which is now considered to be a US government cover-up. Because despite some interesting data buried in there is so much outright nonsensical BS.

d
I am sure you have some back up data here also.

m
I’ll cut short my rant knowing it’s falling no deaf ears.

d
Fib mikey, you are still babbeling.

m
I recommend doing REAL research – which doesn’t mean plugging in key words to Google.

d
Been there done that!

m
And then coming back with a deeper more objective view of how the world is operating toy.

d
You need some rest son.


Your Friendly Neighbourhood Disinformation Agent

M

I read that the reason it was 9/11 was that Bin Laden was a huge Public Enemy fan.

reply to post by JJay55


reply to post by mmiichael


It is a tag-team of counter-terrorism educators comprised of JJay55 and mmiichael to ensure that all of the Above Top Secret membership is sufficiently frightened of the Islamic Al Qaeda boogeyman.

Aren't the scare tactics just grand? Booooo.

Are the disinformation specialists preparing Americans for a war of naked aggression US invasion of Iran?

posted by mmiichael

Your Friendly Neighbourhood Disinformation Agent

posted by JJay55

Actually I'm a counter-terrorism educator with a 40 year background in Islamic studies. I teach at a university level and have many years of experience working with seasoned professionals in this effort.

source

[edit on 8/12/09 by SPreston]

Originally posted by Donny 4 million

I am sure you have some back up data here also.

You missed the whole point.

There are dozens of books and hundreds of articles that go into specifics of the the insurgencies, asymmetrical warfare, terrorism campaigns, etc emanating from the Middle East. From independent journalists and historians from many countries.

It's all there if you want to explore it.

I keep pointing to this particular site as a handy reference. And it's open source and input form all perspectives

There is no shortage of data and discussion online.

This COUNTER TERRORISM Blog is recommended

counterterrorismblog.org...

and they supply a load of links at the site:



9-11 Public Discourse Project

About.com Terrorism Issues Page

Andrew McCarthy's NRO columns

Business Executives for National Security

Brookings Institution's Iraq Index: Tracking Variables of Post-Saddam Iraq

Brookings Institution Saban Center for Middle East Policy

Center for Immigration Studies - Terrorism & National Security Page

Combating Terrorism Center at West Point (United States Military Academy)

Council on Foreign Relations Terrorism Site

"The Croissant", founded & edited by Olivier Guitta

Douglas Farah's website

EU-Belgian Red Cross Terrorism Victims' Site

EagleSpeak

European Union's Fight Against Terrorism Site

Evan Kohlmann's Global Terror Alert

FBI Counterterrorism Website

Financial Action Task Force (FATF)

Focus on Sunni Extremism

Foundation for the Defense of Democracy

FrontPage Magazine

Gates of Vienna Blog

Google Terrorism Site Directory

Government Executive Magazine Homeland Security site

Heritage Foundation Homeland Security Project

Hudson Institute's International Security page

Institute for Counter-Terrorism at Interdisciplinary Center Herzliya

Intelligence & Terrorism Information Center at the Center for Special Studies

International Association For Counterterrorism & Security Professionals

International Strategy & Assessment Center

InternationalSecurityResources.com

Internet Haganah

Steven Emerson & the Investigative Project on Terrorism

Jamestown Foundation Global Terrorism Analysis

Jeff Stein - CQ SpyTalk

Jihad Watch

LauraMansfield.com

Law, Terrorism and Homeland Security Blog

Little Green Footballs

MEMRI (Middle East Media Research Institute)

Michael Yon's Online Magazine

Middle East Forum

Mudville Gazette

NEFA Foundation ("Nine/Eleven Finding Answers")

New South Wales (Australia) "secureNSW" Countering Terrorism

National Intelligence Council

National Memorial Institute for the Prevention of Terrorism

New America Foundation Foreign Policy Page

Patriot Debates: A Sourceblog for the USA PATRIOT Debate

Russia-Eurasia Terror Watch

September 11 Victims List

Rita Katz's SITE Institute

StrategyPage

Terror Finance Blog

Terrorism Research Center

Terrorism, Counter-terrorism, and Homeland Security Page (PDA site)

Terrorism, Security, & America's Purpose Conference

23rd of October - Beirut Bombing Veterans Blog

UK Intelligence Community Online

U.S Treasury Dept's Office of Foreign Assets Control (with links to designation lists)

U.S. Air Force Counterproliferation Center

U.S. Defense Dept. - Central Command (CENTCOM)

U.S. Defense Dept. War on Terrorism Site

U.S. Department of State's Patterns of Global Terrorism 1985-2004 (book purchase site)

U.S. Government Accountability Office (GAO) Reports on Terrorism

U.S. Justice Dept. - USA PATRIOT Act site

U.S. Library of Congress 9-11 Documentary Project

U.S. Mission to EU - Terrorism & Homeland Security page

U.S. Office of the Director of National Intelligence

U.S. State Dept. Counterterrorism Coordinator

U.S. Treasury Dept. Office of Terrorism & Financial Intelligence (TFI)

United States Action

Washington Institute for Near East Policy

Originally posted by SPreston
Are the disinformation specialists preparing Americans for a war of naked aggression US invasion of Iran?

You won' have to worry about Iran, Sgt Preston. They're reading your messages and are aware you're on their side.

Just give them your address in case they decide to do some random bombings in your neighbourhood.

They know you fight on the side of Truth and Justice against American and Israeli tyranny.

With your wide range indepth knowledge of foreign affairs you will be made a Muslim world hero and have your own harem.

Start making a list of enemies for them to behead. It's your duty.

The identified Disinformation Agents on this forum is a good place to begin.



M

[edit on 13-8-2009 by mmiichael]

Actually I'm a counter-terrorism educator with a 40 year background in Islamic studies. I teach at a university level and have many years of experience working with seasoned professionals in this effort.

Anyone can be a forum troller, few can get a higher education.

Anyone can claim to have 40 years experience in anything.

You claimed McVeigh was executed hastily - it was around four years after his conviction. So you'd be completely wrong about that.

You claimed that most terrorists have engineering degrees, yet refuse to provide any evidence for this. Not even Ramzi Yousef had an engineering degree, so you'd be wrong about that too.

You claim Mohammed Atta's behaviour fits the cell structure you describe, confusing an individual with a group. So you'd be wrong about that too.

You claim that in the UK there are 30 cells that MI5 don't know about, 'probably more'. If they don't know about them then you sure as hell don't. So you'd be wrong about that too.

You claimed that the means of attack on Glasgow Airport (a jeep with some camping stoves in the back) is 'Islamic', when all sorts of non-Muslims have used jeeps and camping stoves for all sorts of reasons. So you'd be wrong there too.


I would suggest that if indeed you are an educator then you're an exceptionally incompetent one since you constantly say things that aren't true. However, I don't think you're an educator at all, because I still believe someone as dimwitted and misguided as you couldn't get away with talking utter bull# for decades and getting paid to do so.

No doubt you'll report this to the moderators too, and avoid the fact that I've demonstrated you're either a liar or don't have a clue about terrorism, or both. You have made provably false statements of fact.

reply to post by mmiichael


In 1967 I was armed with a M14 guarding my base, from an insurgent task-force backed by two super powers,
China and Russia.
Pretty bad odds wouldn't ya say?
We Americans who live in trailers and chew tobacco brought that war to a close along with the help of Richard M. Nixon. Whom by the way did it because the people asked him to.
(the last time anything like that has happened)
The crowd that you seem to represent have tried their damnedest to return us back into those dastardly days.
At the same time standing on our necks so we can't even own a house. You are a brain washed upity PUP to believe the folks you attempt to protect have anything to offer the USA but a hard time.
You see Mikey the math is there.
1 super power (plus) another super power = They ain't kicked our ass yet.
Plus they were not handicapped by all the fanatic mubo-jumbo JJ says the folks of the ME are.
I guess if we had to kick their butts, all we would have to do is wait till prayer time and have at em while they are preoccupied.
So that's why I have little fear of your war mongering.
I will save my energy for the real enemy. Thank you very much.
Israel is struggling for it's survival. Islam is not. More mistakes are made through desperation.
BTW I am sure you know that it was the trailer folk that gave the folks in Israel a home in the first place.
I don't think asking for their co-operation is a big deal. it is to much to ask?

[edit on 13-8-2009 by Donny 4 million]

Originally posted by Donny 4 million
[
We Americans who live in trailers and chew tobacco brought that war to a close along with the help of Richard M. Nixon. Whom by the way did it because the people asked him to.
(the last time anything like that has happened)
The crowd that you seem to represent have tried their damnedest to return us back into those dastardly days.
At the same time standing on our necks so we can't even own a house. You are a brain washed upity PUP to believe the folks you attempt to protect have anything to offer the USA but a hard time.
You see Mikey the math is there.
1 super power (plus) another super power = They ain't kicked our ass yet.
Plus they were not handicapped by all the fanatic mubo-jumbo JJ says the folks of the ME are.
I guess if we had to kick their butts, all we would have to do is wait till prayer time and have at em while they are preoccupied.
So that's why I have little fear of your war mongering.
I will save my energy for the real enemy. Thank you very much.
Israel is struggling for it's survival. Islam is not. More mistakes are made through desperation.
BTW I am sure you know that it was the trailer folk that gave the folks in Israel a home in the first place.
I don't think asking for their co-operation is a big deal. it is to much to ask?

With all due respect, you can interpret certain events in the world and come to the conclusion that fit your needs. Most people do.

I won't go into my personal history here - but you make assumptions based on no knowledge. I've probably seen more than you have, first hand. I'm the last person in the world to invite or encourage war. But I've learned to recognize the signs of it coming and that preventing it saves lives.

Nations have always fought over land and resources. Through 20th Century the Americans, Britain, other European powers were in conflict with the likes of Russia and China for control of regions.

I wish that millions of innocent lives weren't lost in the quest for power. But ignoring aggressive threats does not change situations. Tens of millions have died because their governments chose to ignore hostile warning signs just as you do.

You call the rising confrontation between Islam and the West mumbo jumbo.
The Muslim world itself disagrees with the motives you attribute to them.
I've spoken to hundreds of professional class educated Muslims and value their opinion on the subject more than yours. The attacks on 9/11 were an invitation to direct conflict in the Middle East. An asymmetrical war on home turf. Wanting to interpret it differently doesn't make it so.

You buy into the story the US bankrolled the very existence of Israel which shows little knowledge of the actual history of the country. On that topic do you know anything about the foreign aid the US provides, the amounts, who it goes to, why? I get the impression you aren't nearly as informed of the complexities of modern history as you like to think you are.

You think your personal experience and focusing on situations that conform to your decided world view informs you of who is antagonistic and who is not.

Everybody assembles information and forms opinions. Sometime they're right, often they're wrong. You might consider the possibility you're not always right.


Mike


[edit on 13-8-2009 by mmiichael]

Originally posted by mmiichael
The Muslim world itself disagrees with the motives you attribute to them.
I've spoken to hundreds of professional class educated Muslims and value their opinion on the subject more than yours. The attacks on 9/11 were an invitation to direct conflict in the Middle East. An asymmetrical war on home turf. Wanting to interpret it differently doesn't make it so.

I want to address this issue specifically.
Yes, we were invited there. There was no invasion. Very important to understand. Very important.
Along the same lines, Islam still speaks in ancient metaphor. The US speaks a different language, more evolved but more literal. Therefore 911 to the West=911 emergency number because we speak literal. 911 in Islamic language is way more complex and involves history, honor, passion, dedication, faith, and much more.
We must understand this enemy and the message they are sending. It's like they are repeating over and over that their invitation to fight is on and the West is like, wow, dude, a fight? what? dude. Meanwhile Islam is serious.

Click here to learn more about this warning.

The ignore option on this forum really comes in handy for those who namecall and twist posts into cherrypicked nonsense.

Anyway, understanding Islam is critical!
Again, population density causes migration, which in turn causes conflict. For example:
www.jpost.com...
"Israeli sources confirmed on Thursday Yemeni media reports that the overwhelming majority of the final remnant of Yemen's ancient Jewish community, numbering some 250 people, are looking to leave the country due to persecution and violence."
While these Jews are escaping violence it's likely they will move to a place where there will be continued violence because of their RELIGION.
It's very simple: Islam is not plural. They do not accept any other religion except Islam. Islam considers Christians, Jews, and non-muslims to be inferior. Until Islam can accept the Golden Rule this will not change. It is not likely Islam will change. It is Islam's goal to force all non-muslims off of land they consider theirs. Today 57 countries belong to the OIC, Organization of Islamic Countries. Today Islam is expanding into Thailand, and Kenya in mass proportion. Today Islam is expanding into the UK, Nigeria, Chechnya, The Stans, Myanmar and Congo at alarming rates. Today Islam is demanding Sharia Law in the US, Canada, and EU.
If you don't see this trend clearly it's time to Open Your Eyes. Islam has made a clear calling. Islam has attacked and continues to threaten and Americans seem to disregard this message. It is a real message that the US government will have to deal with very soon.

pewglobal.org...
"One of the ironies in the survey is the extent to which Pakistanis embrace some of the severe laws associated with the Taliban and al Qaeda, even as they reject Islamic extremism and these extremist groups. The new poll finds broad support for harsh punishments: 78% favor death for those who leave Islam; 80% favor whippings and cutting off hands for crimes like theft and robbery; and 83% favor stoning adulterers."

So even though the Pakistanis generally disapprove of the Taliban and AQ in the past year they still have instilled the principles of Islam.
Again, Sharia Law contains the death penalty for those who leave Islam. And this law is carried out just like US law is carried out daily.
Sharia Law is practiced in 57 OIC countries.
Many Westerners cannot grasp this fact.

Originally posted by SPreston
reply to post by JJay55

 

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/83ddc3ef5af3.jpg[/atsimg]

Why would Islamic tradition or the Koran have anything to do with 9-11 when traitors within the US Government and US Military and Israelis and Zionists carried out the 9-11 Inside Job?

Perhaps the symbol of the towers on the cover of the FEMA Training Manual from 1997 would be as good a reason as any.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/b29f86d234af.jpg[/atsimg]

In 1997, the US Department of Justice and FEMA, the Federal Emergency Management Agency published this self-study course with this cover. Only the North Tower of the twin towers of the World Trade Center has a mast.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/222687d10403.jpg[/atsimg]

On September 11, 2001, the target was struck. Four years prior someone in our government must have known the target. Or perhaps this was just a coincidence. What do you think?

"We get all kinds of manuals here at my agency, this one came from FEMA. Notice the date on Emergency Response to Terror - June 1999. After 9-11, we got a notice from FEMA to tear the covers off of all of these."

www.the7thfire.com...

911? Seems as good a reason as any doesn't it?

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/63b7387179af.jpg[/atsimg]

Sp
By any chance do you have anymore of these type posters?
I think they are the best explaination I have seen for Why 911.

Crikey. Training manuals with crosshairs prove that it was an inside job. Wow, that's amazing.
It's easier to deny the real cause than search for it, eh?

I'm really tired of all the anti-US government sentiment from certain forum members.... who I will put on ignore because their posts are not of value.

[edit on 14-8-2009 by JJay55]