Ok, I have to ask you about Obama.

reply to post by breakingdradles


Medicare, Medicade and SS is not just for the poor and lazy, very ignorant generalized thought.

I've worked with many people on these and they are completely and utterly disabled not able to a darn thing about it.( and I am not talking about "bad" backs or whiplash, or "depression" these are people who are reduced to bed care)
I'd like to see you in one of their shoes and then complain about these programs when you end up needing health care and have no where else to turn.
What are these people suppose to do, be weak give up or maybe you agree with the assisted suicides that some states have started to give out instead of paying the bill to make ones life manageable?
The problem is humans put money before health humans put money before everything, no one can do anything anymore based on the fact it would better a human life, we could live a life without money if we simply just did things to be productive members of society but people are too greedy they want something for their do nothing office jobs.
//////

And to OP it's best to just get your own facts and come to your own opinion/conclusion.
People will hate just to hate, and idolize to be like their idols.

You'll find a lot of people throwing "facts" at you, when it is nothing more then their own perception being skewed to fit their perspective/opinion.

reply to post by NoHopeForSome

If Obama wants to apologize for America's past sins, let him do it from the White House, from a position of strength. Apologizing in a forgien country is admitting weakness. When the Dixie Chicks critized Bush in Europe, they were flamed, their record sales plummeted, and they couldn't get air play.
When Obama does essentially the same thing, the damned MSM(except Fox) praises him.
Our country is slowly but surely being dystroyed from within, just as Stalin, and other Soviet leaders said it would.
I was born in America, and I have always been proud to be an American, from my earliest days. I couldn't wait for them to play the national anthem or say the pledge of alleigience so I could stand, remove my hat, if I was wearing one, or put my hand over my heart, and sing or recite the appropriate words. And I not only said them, or sang them, but I thought about what they really mean.
The average American, I think, still does this. But the liberals, who seem tol get all the press, are the ones who seem to get heard all of the time.
I pray daily that our country will turn around, and the true patriots will stand and be heard.

Originally posted by centurion1211

Originally posted by grover
Oh I am a staunch liberal and I am far happier when government takes care of its own...

Exactly what do you mean by that?

The government does not "own" me, so I do not expect or want it to "take care" of me. I am also not in need of "adult day care" as so many liberals seem to be, or in favor of.

Haven't you ever heard that phrase? A company takes care of its own by taking care of its employees (or should)... A family takes care of its own as in you take care of your wife and children (or should)... You are part of this nation and this society and as such you are part of the family that is the United States and as such a government takes care of its people by making sure there is justice, that children aren't starving in the streets and irresponsible businesses don't pollute the national air, land and water just to save a buck.

The wealthy don't need help but the down and out do... the marginalized do and any just society makes sure that there is at the very least they are helped somehow.

Social services are the cheapest way to prevent an uprising of the have not's against the better healed... historically speaking.

Not to mention it is the good, decent and moral thing to do.

Remember Jesus' teachings about the poor?

Originally posted by grover

Originally posted by centurion1211

Originally posted by grover
Oh I am a staunch liberal and I am far happier when government takes care of its own...

Exactly what do you mean by that?

The government does not "own" me, so I do not expect or want it to "take care" of me. I am also not in need of "adult day care" as so many liberals seem to be, or in favor of.

Haven't you ever heard that phrase? A company takes care of its own by taking care of its employees (or should)... A family takes care of its own as in you take care of your wife and children (or should)... You are part of this nation and this society and as such you are part of the family that is the United States and as such a government takes care of its people by making sure there is justice, that children aren't starving in the streets and irresponsible businesses don't pollute the national air, land and water just to save a buck.

Again I don't want to even be considered as "owned" by any government. And that's not what is says the purpose of the federal government is in the U.S. constitution - to "take care of the people".

The wealthy don't need help but the down and out do... the marginalized do and any just society makes sure that there is at the very least they are helped somehow.

Yes, but by teaching them how to fish rather than just giving them a fish (confiscated by the government from other hard-working fishermen).

Social services are the cheapest way to prevent an uprising of the have not's against the better healed... historically speaking.

But not by doing it on the backs of other hard working people.

Not to mention it is the good, decent and moral thing to do.

A self-avowed liberal preaching about morals? Who'd ever think we'd see that ...

Remember Jesus' teachings about the poor?

Yes, but I also remember that Jesus was preaching to individuals about the need to help take care of the needy among them - which is the same thing that conservatives advocate instead of asking government to do it. He wasn't preaching that to the Romans.

[edit on 6/9/2009 by centurion1211]

reply to post by grover


You are right Grover, and I think that the day that Obama had the briefing on the nations and he came out with the most sorrowful face and actually looked defeated was the day that he found out that the presidential power was not his alone.

I also don't think that he is socialist but that is the game been played now under him, but the power is for corporate America still now to be made into law, just look at the health care bill, if that doesn't open the eyes of many in this nation as to whom hold the power nothing will.

reply to post by centurion1211

Do you really think us liberals are not inspired by morals? How ignorant of you.

It is a strong sense of morality and social justice that is at the base of liberal ideology.

Originally posted by grover
reply to post by centurion1211

 

Do you really think us liberals are not inspired by morals? How ignorant of you.

It is a strong sense of morality and social justice that is at the base of liberal ideology.

It's all about actions ... I could type forever about how misguided the above statement is, but alas, that's not what this thread is about.

reply to post by centurion1211

YOU might think it is misguided but that is all.It doesn't change the fact.

When will you conservatives ever get it... its not ALL about you and your outlooks and opinions... that we all have the same core morals and ideals... just because I disagree with you on some issues does not diminish my sense of morality and justice.

After six months of this guy, we know nothing of Obama.

We don't know how he paid for his expensive Ivy League education, nor do we know how he was able to obtain an upscale lifestyle in spite of no visible means of support. (If only it were that easy for the rest of us)

We know for a fact that his formative years were not spent in America, and thus he isn't American.

He's never had a real job. He's never run a company, or even shift supervisor at the local 7-11. He's never met a payroll. (and it's starting to show when you look at our deficit numbers)

Obama is unlike any, and I mean completely unlike any other President this nation has ever had.

Obama never had any military experience, thus his complete lack of understanding of it's core principles. He doesn't know, doesn't care that he doesn't know, and won't learn.

Obama as far back as we can see is constantly blaming others, and when it becomes politically advantageous, casts off his friends like a wet jacket. Some principles there.

Obama is the first Blame America President, and is constantly off in other countries apologizing for whatever seems to be politically expedient at the moment.

Over half of Obama's life, he's been shoulder to shoulder and aligned with political and social radicals who wish to see America fall.

Obama wants to convert America to the European model of socialism and non-productivity, through burdensome taxation and the elimination of capitalism.

Obama wants to compel us to embrace a nationalized health care where lines will be as long as my . . . suburb block.

Obama won't touch our vast reserves of oil, coal, and shale reserves, instead letting prices be influenced by entirely foreign nations.

Obama is literally choking the "capital" out of the captalist goose that's been laying the golden eggs since our foundation. We are not broke, but now beyond broke.

Obama has no trouble violating Constitutional and contract law in using extortion against our insurance industry, our banking industry, our automobile industry and other corporations.

Obama's own party will not ask questions nor challenge him on anything, passing disastrous spending bills without even reading them.

The press won't call him to task, as they consider him omnipotent and omniscient.

To make matters worse, he wants to crush opposing views under an archaic Fairness Doctrine.

He promised a lot of things, including not raising taxes, and that one's coming soon.

Finally, Obama prefers power grabbing and controlling as opposed to governing and leading.

Other than that, I think he's just wonderful.

That tingling in my leg?

The Fed's hand in my pocket which already has a hole in it.

reply to post by dooper


What utter nonsense. You can find out all those questions simply by actually looking as opposed to just parroting what the right wing noise machine says about him.

Just because you spend your formative years overseas does not mean that you are not an American...

He was a professor for one and two by all accounts including his, Michelle was the major bread winner.

Those are just two answers.

reply to post by grover

I beg to differ. He wasn't raised in America as an American kid, his values during his FORMATIVE YEARS were foreign, his past is a bit mysterious, all his records have been sealed, and if you don't live here, you don't fit in. Your values are different.

And even Michelle couldn't put him and her through school, nor could she afford their nice house - oh - that's right! His terrorist friend made him a "deal-DEAL" on some of his land.

Who financed this guy?

The KGB? CAIR? The Marxist/Leninist League International?

That's the thing.

We don't know anything about this "stranger" who showed up, and somehow shot right into the White House.

Originally posted by grover
reply to post by dooper

 

What utter nonsense. You can find out all those questions simply by actually looking as opposed to just parroting what the right wing noise machine says about him.

Just because you don't agree doesn't make doopers many, many points incorrect.

Just because you spend your formative years overseas does not mean that you are not an American...

Perhaps in obama's case it means exactly that - especially when your "formative years overseas" include your birth.

He was a professor for one and two by all accounts including his, Michelle was the major bread winner.

Now we understand where he got the philosophy that living off other people's work and money is the way to go ...

[edit on 6/9/2009 by centurion1211]

I like to keep things simple.

In that spirit, ladies and gentlemen... I offer my humble opinion/conspiracy theory.

It IS ATS, is it not?

Mr. Sotero not only spent his formative/socialization (interesting choice of words, bianchi...) years in a country other than the United States, he was perhaps born in another country.

This would obviously render him Constitutionally disqualified to be POTUS...

I ask one thing...

SHOW ME THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE.

Sorry about the caps, but I need to be perfectly clear here. I don't want the "doctored" online versions I've seen. I want full page, certified ads in EVERY paper in the land. I want to SEE that what I suspect of this tool is NOT true.

I know Mr. Sotero is only a puppet. He's been groomed to do his job. That is what he is doing, as well as he can... Which isn't fooling anyone who's awake.

By the way... Where's Osama?

Why are we still in the sandbox?

... But you promised!!

Waaa!

reply to post by NoHopeForSome


Each anti-Obama poster has his or her own individual reason for hating and or fearing President Obama. Some worry because he’s black, others because he has an odd name or because he’s a Democrat. A few believe he’s a pawn or a main player in the New World Order/One World Government/Luciferian/ Illuminate secret society that wants to take away civilian firearms and enslave society. Others believe he is somehow linked to the Christian devil. (One poster will give you a complete breakdown of bible code numerology that without a doubt shows everything about Obama is inherently evil.)

However, I think the root of the fears/hate are that Obama is not playing by the status quo and it’s looking like there is a good chance that he will actually be able to make some of the changes he’s talked about.

Bucking the Status Quo
Whether you agree or disagree with his actions and public statements there is no denying that they’ve been different than many of his predecessors. This scares people because they don’t know what’s going to happen tomorrow. It removes them from their comfort zone and can sometimes force them to examine their own lives and the choices they’ve made.

Getting Things Done
President Obama hit the ground running and hasn’t stopped. He’s got ideas on pretty much everything, from how to win our two wars to how to insure our entire population. Unlike other presidents it’s looking like he might actually be able to put some of these ideas into action. That presents the possibility of real concrete change. That just pushes some people over the edge.

The truth is that Obama is a moderate Democrat who wants to do what’s best for the country. The problem is that he’s facing a pretty messed up world with a bottomed out economy, two wars, a nuclear North Korea, the threat of terrorism, a rebuilding of foreign relations and so on and there is no handbook on how to fix all this. There are no guarantees what he does will make things better and if they don’t the world could be in for even more hurt. That truly is scary but doing nothing is even scarier.

reply to post by demo_man07


I'm sorry... If you knew me, you'd know an apology is pretty hard to come by, and always well deserved.

I was under the impression that every one of my countrymen KNEW about the lies we've all been fed.

Let's assume not (you know what happens when you assume)...

Let's assume that NOT all of my countrymen know about the lies... (We'll go back to that, if need be... I want to stay on topic)

WHERE'S THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE???

When McCain's citizenship, and indeed his place of birth was questioned, he promptly allowed full public access to ALL documentation of his birth. That, my friends and countrymen, is integrity.

Not saying that the guy wasn't told what to do, by somebody...

Again, this IS ATS...

And I truly despise to keep flogging a dead horse...

Can I see it, Barry? Just me?

You don't have to show anybody else... Just me.

Ok?

reply to post by demo_man07


If Obama is a moderate Democrat, then you're saying the Democratic party is Marxist.

That's not exactly comforting.

"However, I think the root of the fears/hate are that Obama is not playing by the status quo and it’s looking like there is a good chance that he will actually be able to make some of the changes he’s talked about."


What change? The continuing of the Patriot Act, or renditions? Would that change he promised have anything to do with the way he voted for FISA? Oh, I know, he promised the nation that he would bring the troops home in 6 months, you mean that change? Or how about the big stimulus, what is it $11 per paycheck that is very stimulating, and a big change!

The man has snowed us, period. Look at the people surrounding him, change? Sommers, Geitner, all the Bush boys handling the war effort...what change could you possibly be referring to?????

[edit on 6/9/2009 by redhead57]

For some reason people tend to psychologize presidential politics. They often project their own distorted personal feelings about ther family, power, sexuality, their own lives, etc. onto the President in an odd way. Why this happens is in itself an interesting question and one I cannot answer myself.

Personally, I see Obama as a very small figure in the grand scheme of things, not particularly central to the massive tectonic shifts that are currently rocking the geopolitical world and shaking the fundemental global capitalist architecture to its core. What he does or does not do has increasingly less bearing on the situation. The actual power of the office of the Presidency itself has been on the wane for some time. By now, it has noticbly...dwindled, I guess I would say. It surprises me that many people continue remain blind to what seems to me a very obvious fact. But I suppose that's always the case...



[edit on 6/9/09 by silent thunder]

because he is a liar and is going to put a stumbling block in front of israel like revelation says the warrior balak, kinda sounds like barak hmmm. food for thought

reply to post by silent thunder


Nice point Thunder.

People may focus on the President (or really on anyone in a position of power or anything people deem to be powerful, like an intangible secret society) because it externalizes their fears. It gives them an enemy to rage against, but since the target of the rage is so far away you can get angry and stomp your feet but never really have to take action.

This externalization can also be used to dodge personal responsibility, i.e. I can’t get a job because the MAN doesn’t want to hire Latinos or I can’t get a job because Latinos take them all.