Overpopulation Makes No Sense!

reply to post by bobbylove321


dude, we have an abundance of food your right, but its FAKE and genetically altered to last long. We started genetically altering foods because WE KNOW WE CANT DEPEND ON CROPS for the amount of people living on this planet. Your thread in general is makes NO SENSE as if you got the idea, did a couple google searches and posted your idea here on ATS. Its an issue we all know about. Thats why wars are essential. We know we have to kill off other humans and the only way to do that is turn them against each other to kill each other. WE ARE OVERPOPULATED. Why do you think it was 75 degrees in December in the Nations Capitol. I advide you to do more research bofore posting assumptions.

Well i for one really enjoy looking out the window to see bugger all houses and not walking on a street surrounded by thousands of people. Basically bobbylove, your dead dead dead WRONG.

Im sorry i couldn't read past the first page of this thread i just had to say something. The world IS overpopulated how can you say its not? i for one wouldnt want it any bigger, and you are blatently disregarding all the other species of life that exist on this planet!! almost all of it was here before us, if we cover all that space then where are they gonna live?? I would suspect someone like you would think they would be fine in a zoo where we could look after them with our magic technology or something to that effect. In reality not your fantasy dream land where the great immortal humans dwell, the earth would be much better off with half the current population. You need to wake up and realise that we are bad for this earth, look at the damage we have already done!! we made hundreds of animals extinct and damaged so much that can never be undone.

We have a huge gift of intelligence (some of us) and we could use it to better this place infinately, imagine this planet with only 1 billion of educated environmentally aware uncorrupted people, the could live and coexist with fish (haha sorry couldn't help it), with animals and plants instead of the viral infection we have inflicted on our world as of this present day? Maybe the world needs to destroy itself so we can restart and learn this lesson we missed the first time around? I sure dam hope so.

reply to post by Amagnon


The point I'm making is we can work within the natural systems, after all, we evolved in them. Just because there is a lot of humans does not mean we have to ruin the pristine environment. Indeed, we only do so because a very few of us control the technology available.

There is no upper limit for population growth in a universe the size of ours with as many resources and energy available. The energy and the space is a available, to those that choose to see it.

All land is arable, with the aplication of technology. We could grow food in caves if we wanted to. We could build greenhouses on the moon. There is really no limit, as reality has fractal geometry.

Now, if we don't evolve our processes and our mindset, of course we are overpopulating. But it's not an absolute, it's a changeable circumstance.

reply to post by andre18


You're clearly an idiot so I will conclude our interchange here. You fail to grasp even the simplest and most obvious of conspiracy theory when spoonfed to you. I honestly don't think the problem is me, it's you. You believe the 9 o'clock news and, taken this into consideration, we will never reach agreement on conspiracy theory.

If you ever take the blinders off then maybe we can talk about these issues, but while you're just in denial it's pointless. I've spoken to many people in all social circles and all of them accept elitist manipulation in principle, only the dumbest, most ignorant and perhaps a few biased people do not. Go learn some history, as you clearly have no idea what civilization is and where it came from.

We're done.

Just how much of the worlds land surface is desert and mountains? is there any food produced from deserts and mountains? how many people live in deserts and on mountains? anyone factored in that? just a thought.

reply to post by mmiichael


You need to do some research because you are not grasping technology that well.

What I'm saying about technology is NOT a "maybe" or an "if", it's been done and it's growing exponentially.

Now if you don't think space travel to planets VERY far away is already made possible, then that's your problem. I've talked with people who work for NASA, so I'm in the know, and yes we do have bases on the moon.

As for people like you well then I guess you can watch sci-fi and think it's all fiction, while people like me sit there and laugh because we know the "fiction" is preparing people for the real when it's announced within a few years time.

reply to post by bobbylove321

Why don't you look up how much arable land it takes to provide grain for a family of four for one year.

and the fact that the population is growing exponentially.

reply to post by hexagramfifty


SOLUTIONS

NOT PROBLEMS

www.verticalfarm.com...

Don't even try to tell me either... that we an pump all the OIL we need down a pipe from Alaska or Siberia but doing so for Water to fuel these things will pose a technological problem...

last i checked, the North pole could keep us drinking for a few dozen billion more people

There Is no problem

Let's go take over Area51!!!
www.abovetopsecret.com...

[edit on 2-6-2009 by donutviper]

I think a few people made comments about Texas and world population. I have some info to add that should clarify their comments.

I had read that if you put the entire world's population inside of Texas, it would have the same population density as New York City. I didn't believe it myself until I calcuated it....and found it to be even less. Here are the numbers:

NYC population density = 27,147/ sq mi (via wikipedia)
Texas area = 268,820 sq mi
World population = 6,783,906,631 (U.S. Census Bureau World Population Clock)

World population density if in Texas = 25,236 / sq mi

I have no solid opinion formed as to if the world is currently overpopulated or not. I am concerned however, as to the population growth rate since 1750 vs. the beginning of man to 1750. There will be a big problem sometime in the next 50 - 200 yrs (infinitesimally short in geological time).

Originally posted by bobbylove321
reply to post by mmiichael

 

[..]

As for people like you well then I guess you can watch sci-fi and think it's all fiction, while people like me sit there and laugh because we know the "fiction" is preparing people for the real when it's announced within a few years time.

Which in turn makes me laugh because I know people have been saying this since the first ever space travel movie was created - The Woman in the Moon (1929) (aka By Rocket to the Moon). This was further stimulated by Things to Come (1936) which 'tells' us about the coming of the space age.

Understand that 20-year old chaps who saw that movie might've imagined the exact same thing - but most of them are dead and buried now. No space-flights for them.

It didn't happen within a few years time.

At the root, the idea of overpopulation is simply totalitarian. P.J. O'Rourke says it best, "Overpopulation: Too much of you, not enough of me."

What are the proposed solutions to this? None of them are ever humanitarian. It's not a real issue, either. I'm no proponent of genetically altered foods, but that is much better than no food, in any case. The real issue is the governments that undertake the "mission" to fix this--like in Somalia, as mentioned, or China.

Originally posted by bobbylove321
You need to do some research because you are not grasping technology that well.

What I'm saying about technology is NOT a "maybe" or an "if", it's been done and it's growing exponentially.

Now if you don't think space travel to planets VERY far away is already made possible, then that's your problem. I've talked with people who work for NASA, so I'm in the know, and yes we do have bases on the moon.

As for people like you well then I guess you can watch sci-fi and think it's all fiction, while people like me sit there and laugh because we know the "fiction" is preparing people for the real when it's announced within a few years time.

I guess I must have my head in the sand because I think "Star Wars" "Star Trek" "Terminator" are genre Science Fiction.

I doubt you friend's uncle at NASA who says there has been an established colony on the Moon for 25 years. Lots of people observe and record the Moon for activity.

I very much doubt space travel to planets very far away is possible now or for the foreseeable future. Unless they quietly developed "Star Trek" Warp Factor, the nearest ascertained stars at approaching light speed would take like hundreds or even thousands of years to reach. And the trip might end up being to a toxic gaseous planet that can't even be landed on.

We would all be very surprised to find NASA is spending billions maybe even trillions on projects that might not see tangible benefits for hundreds or thousands of years.

Any guarantee there will be a NASA or even a United States that far in the future?


Mike



[edit on 2-6-2009 by mmiichael]

I would expect this thread was started by a younger person,say mid 30's at the latest......

You must look more closely at what it is you are observing,the numbers are there to make you feel better,don't rely on the numbers......

I am from the mid-west,wisconsin specifically,farmers chose good firtile land to grow crops on,land that was not prone to flooding,as few rocks to remove as possible....etc....

Housing developers like the same type of land for the same reasons,and they have been messing up prime farmland for years,because one 100 acre sale of this land allows the farmer to retire,and a bunch of useless suburbanites to move away from the city and build their "suburbia"..there is nothing wrong with living in the city,the land is already ruined anyway,why not try to not be so selfish.....

Think!!!!...

I do have my opinions on some things I might add...

The more people you have ANYWHERE,the more waste and pollution is generated,so you lose some more potential there for landfills and such,contaminated run-off going to the watershed from their leaky cars,and ALL cars leak,and then you have true green chemlawn in their endless quest to have a more beautiful lawn than "joe next door"....

You may be correct in that overpopulation is not a problem though.

More like stupidity is the problem.....

I'm not even going to start on how much corporations ruin the environment.

You may want to look into this yourself much more closely.

We are ruining our world out of greed,thoughtlessness and stupidity.

We accuse animals of eating where they #,of eating their young..that is what makes them different than us,but we aren't so much different really.

Worse actually,we destroy their environment too.

One more thing,why is it such an unthinkable thing to try to preserve the place we come from,instead of taking HOPIUM and expecting to colonise other planets?.

The majority of us will be left here to die anyway,just think about how much it would cost to go to a colony on another planet.....the majority of us are not so outstanding in any way to get a ticket,even if we have the money to pay for it.

I kinda like hanging out in the ocean,sitting in the sun,enjoying the contrast between earth and sky,day and night,the stars,the wind....critters skittering around,doing whatever it is they do.......

I like it here,I think I'll stay even if they give me a ticket to an imaginary colony as a way of disposing of me,because I am probably considered useless by those who have the "authority' to deem me so...

We need more of the old fashioned type of farmers,who did it because they realised it made them more free and independent,who cared about the land,like the Indians did....need more of those in high places too,by the way,incorruptible ones.

Dream on....

[edit on 2-6-2009 by chiponbothshoulders]

[edit on 2-6-2009 by chiponbothshoulders]

[edit on 2-6-2009 by chiponbothshoulders]

reply to post by Insubordinate Soul


LOL the Pumps. Classic !!

Bobbylove, car manufacturers have had the technology for high mileage care for over 100 years.
As to the electric cars: do you have any idea of what goes into producing that electricity?

I’m not a 75 year old man. Don’t you think we should wait until the first explorers come back with a report on habitable planets before we allow population to keep doubling?

One of your uncle’s friends…..yeah, right.

Does it mean anything to you that life in the Ocean is disappearing? There are bans on taking certain fish because they have been fished out. It is illegal to take fish that are very small and also that are very big. The little ones need to grow and the big ones are needed to produce more big ones, else the fish will get smaller and smaller. Pollution in the oceans are killing the coral reefs.

Tell me exactly why we need billions more of uneducated primitive and economically poor semi-primitive people. Have you thought that if a pandemic breaks out in that population dense center that you are proposing, that the toll will be much worse than if there were fewer people spread out on the land area, as they are now?

When is your magical technology going to appear?
There are billions of have-nots in the world right now. Are the Elites doing anything to help them improve their lot?
What makes you think that when there are twice as many of them that they will care?

Why exactly should we continue to reproduce?
How will this make your life better?
Why should we sacrifice our living habits and our food preferences for you or anyone else?
What advantage is there to having so many people?

You have failed to address the above questions.

Mopusvindictus, a lot of people are having great life right now. You have plenty of water - good for you. Do you have your own well? That is really the only good fresh water. Are you aware that there are plans to put meters on private wells? They want to charge you for using your own water. And next I suspect they will only allow you to use a certain amount before charging you even more. Gotta share it with all the newcomers you know.

I live on a treed acre. I enjoy looking out and seeing lawn, trees and flowering bushes. And not a house next door. I’m having a great life too. I also like to enjoy the fruits of my labor. I do not think I or anyone else should have to sacrifice just because some people in some other part of the world have eaten themselves out of house and home.
Some of your posts cause me to doubt your Mensa status.

I think your notion of life span in times past is a bit skewed. A life of only 26 years would not give people time to raise a family to maturity. Apparently they lived long enough to produce lots of children. There were a lot of reasons for people to die young, however the survivors sure made up for their loss.

population growth slows when you have resources available. the US isn't overpopulated and the growth rate is quite low because most people have a good comfortable life, they depend on technology to do most of their work and have good healthcare that assures them 2 children is enough to continue their bloodline.

if you look at poor regions of the world like Africa - no healthcare, no technology, no easily available resources. so they have lots of kids because most will die and also the work there is mostly back breaking, not machine assisted so they need someone to work the field.

bring poor regions of the world to a comfort close to that of the west and they will stop having 20 kids! food will be plenty then and population will stabilize. the sooner we do this the lower the stable population will be!

let's not forget we can also build floating cities (see The Millennial Project) nothing is impossible for humans if we really put our minds to it!

those who think depopulation is a good thing should probably start by stepping up and ending their existence for the greater good

Originally posted by Spooky Fox Mulder

Originally posted by bobbylove321
Overpopulation...get out of here..

Oh, and you think that some let's say 30 billions more people who will abuse this planet, abuse nature and each other -- will be great?

Who said anything about that? You missed the point with that assumption.

Do yourself a favor and get your bottom off the ATS and unplug yourself from the computer and travel to India.

And to Africa.

And see for yourself.

See all those people who live under conditions that you won't even offer to a dog.

Not enough food.

Not enough water.

Not enough medicine.

Human life is being p*ssed on.

Children are being p*ssed on.

So, then if you will still consider that -- yaay! -- bringing some 30 billions more people will be great...


...well, no my dear friend.

That won't be great at all.

You my friend, have to first understand why those places are the way they are. And I'll tell you, over-population has nothing to do with it. Those problems arise from greed, corruption and a thirst for power.

So all of you people here who shout OVERPOPULATION IS GREAT AND THERE IS ENOUGH PLACE FOR EVERYONE!!!!!! - please get your bottoms off the Net, unplug yourselves from the computers and travel to 3rd world countries.

See for yourselves.

Trinidad is considered a 3rd world country...and I live in Trinidad. Its by no means as bad as some parts of Africa, India, Haiti or other places in the world...but, I can tell you, if you think over population is the reason for those problems, you are seriously misinformed and thumbs down to anyone who gives you a star for such a silly and ignorant post.

And when you come back from your research, let me hear if you still think that overpopulation is so great as you claim it to be.

This is my final note on this subject.


Peace,
Mulder

Take your own advice. Get out there, and do some very extensive research. You need it more than you think.

reply to post by scraze


well neither did the new world, it's not like we will colonize the stars over night, there was about 100 years from Columbus to anything viable ... and that was just across an ocean


Sit back and address the 9 Trillion Dollars the WAR in Iraq cost, then apply that to colonization of MARS or the MOON

I'm not even saying 9 Trillion would be enough to finish the job... but if America alone can blow that on one war imagine what can be done...

The Mars rover cost what 300 Million?

I would guesstimate...20 manned missions, a few hundred rovers, hundreds of satellites and a permanent base from that total...

and as we all know, the more you manufacture the cheeper it gets...

so if anything i'm grossly underestimating

SPACE?

Nasa gets 15 Billion a year, from one country lol

WAR 2 Trillion

Can space be colonized... sure if LIFE not DEATH is our priority

reply to post by mmiichael


Lets be clear...

We have NOT yet encountered a point in space where there is no matter.

The ASSUMPTION that we need a warp drive is false

beyond Pluto we have found the Kupier Belt, many planetoids... Tons of water, tons of materials, tons of area to build colonies and bases within those orbiting planetoids... water + Hydrogen and Oxygen, a planetoid surface = raw materials

We have to work on the assumption that Centauri, the entire tri system has similar objects because from what we have seen the whole galaxy at least follows the same principals

so the gap isn't 4 light years

it's more like only 3

then... it is estimated the number of FAILED stars could be 10x the number of stars...

we also have direct evidence of a gravitational; pull beyond our system...

what i'm saying is, there could very well be, although not proven as many as 2-10 Neptune - Jupiter sized masses floating loose between the 2 stars

as we know, those types of planets might have 30-40 moons



So IS there ANY real reason to believe we can't on conventional technology simply HOP all the way out even if light speed travel is never possible

answer is no

There is absolutely no reason to conclude that space is empty... just from our perspective, just like the Ocean seemed endless once...

When we encounter a definitive void as we reach further into space... PLEASE, let me know

Until then, we claim we are running out of resources when ... a single asteroid can be worth 17 Trillion in Platinum RIGHT NOW

BE BRAVE, there is a Universe available

and no PROOF any one is there to claim it but us to date