"Zionist Conspiracy Theory" = Black Propaganda

reply to post by dalan.


The Universe and everything in it belongs to G-D. The banks do not own my land nor the house I live in. I'm not going to let any anti-semites like you drive me out of it!

Originally posted by cpdaman
would it be TOO panful to unbiasedly ask yourself could talmudic Zionists wielding tons of poltical power and financial infuence actually have been screwing over ordinary jews for the last century financial emotionally and intellectually.

Rational.....

It's a pointless question. You made it pointless with the inclusion of "could". Go back and replace "talmudic Zionists" with "white Protestants" and "jews" with "Americans"....same thing.....it's simply a rhetorical question. Make it rational and concrete.....Has talmudic Zionists....yadda, yadda, yadda,....emotionally and intellectually. And if they did, where are the emotionally and intellectually screwed over Jews? I ain't seeing them.

One can ask "could haves" all day....and get no where.

The only "painful" part of this is the embarrassing lack of a macro view. The complete and total denial of the history of nationalism and nation building......the bizarre, weird focus on "Zionism".

Rational...why is Zionism different from any other nationalistic movement and/or nation building?

Originally posted by mybigunit
Israel only survives because our government robs the people of America and gives it to Israel to the tune of hundreds of billions in both money and weapons.

That's the only reason Israel survives?

Rational.....you'll need to support that. Otherwise, it's a wild ass guess.

Rational.....now you need to bitch and moan about all of the other countries that receive any form of US aid or financial assistance. Because rationally, they are robbing us and giving it to a lot of different people....not just Israel. Explain why the aid to Israel is somehow different than any other foreign aid.

Originally posted by MrPenny

Rational...why is Zionism different from any other nationalistic movement and/or nation building?

SO I guess we should of let Hitler win eh? According to you taking over the world isnt a bad thing if you can get away with it isnt that what you're saying? Whats the difference between Hitler and his new world order and Zionism and their new world order? Zionism isnt just a national movement its an international movement. To control the world because the world is to be ruled by the Jews according to the imperialists because they are the chosen ones. What am I missing here? The sad thing is this movement isnt even being paid by the people who want to take over the world its being paid on the backs of taxpayers all around the world through the corrupt debt base banking system.

Originally posted by MrPenny

That's the only reason Israel survives?

Rational.....you'll need to support that. Otherwise, it's a wild ass guess.

Rational.....now you need to bitch and moan about all of the other countries that receive any form of US aid or financial assistance. Because rationally, they are robbing us and giving it to a lot of different people....not just Israel. Explain why the aid to Israel is somehow different than any other foreign aid.

Nope I agree with you actually. I dont think we need to be handing money out to anyone. First off we are broke we dont have the money to be handing out to everyone and second there is always a backlash because if you help one side you must help the other otherwise there is hell to pay. I think we need to get our own backyard in order before we can worry about others backyard.

Originally posted by mybigunit
Zionism isnt just a national movement its an international movement. To control the world because the world is to be ruled by the Jews according to the imperialists because they are the chosen ones.

I asked a straight up question and you can't answer it.

Now, support your assertion that Zionism is a movement to control the world. What is your scholarly/authoritative source for that claim? Simply shouting more rhetoric does nothing.

Your post is a perfect example of what I'm ranting about.....it's empty rhetoric.

Originally posted by daeoeste

I have a feeling that when the person read the "protocols" it made sense for him to change some names around, because it fit in an uncanny way. This person may have used the documents because he could not have put it better himself, and it works to instill a sense of danger and urgency that fan the flames and spread awareness and anger more rapidly.

This leads to my retort to the second point. There is a whole host of news that SHOULD make people TREMBLE with righteous anger. "IF YOU ARE NOT PISSED , YOU ARE NOT PAYING ATTENTION." Ever heard that quote before? I do not know who coined it, but it's sure as hell true. Some of the fruits enjoyed due to people taking action with a sense of righteous anger are the liberties we have today. And while these may be being eroded, it will take a renewed sense of righteous anger to retain them.

History shows that temporary anger can wake us up from hopeless slumber. But it also shows that prolonged anger can and will turn into destructive action. So maybe "being pissed", as you put it, is not as effective as many think it is.

Originally posted by StrangeBrew


As far as the "Protocols of the Elders of Zion" go, I do think there is definitely black propaganda in play. However, I think it's in the complete opposite way Skyfloatting suggests.

More accurately you'd have to call it, black-white-black propaganda or whatever. Here's how - the first part is the bait and switch. Instead of the enemy writing the "black propaganda", they write it against themselves. Then, when the "Protocols or documents" are exposed, the enemy is vilified by your own doing (in this case, future referenceable/semi-resembling zionist-like conspiracy to that of the forgery).

This type of complex conspiracy-behind-the-conspiracy thinking, while possible, is more of a "lets distort and convolute facts until the Jews are the culprit.

This is similar to another poster earlier saying that the genocide on the Jews was ultimately carried out by the Jews or that the freedom of the Internet is actually a cover-up for removed-freedoms to come.

There is no need to make stuff extremely complex in order to fit the belief-system "jews are evil".

The competitiveness of that game is an illusion.

From a puppet-masters point of view the competition would be an Illusion.

Originally posted by MrPenny

I asked a straight up question and you can't answer it.

Now, support your assertion that Zionism is a movement to control the world. What is your scholarly/authoritative source for that claim? Simply shouting more rhetoric does nothing.

Your post is a perfect example of what I'm ranting about.....it's empty rhetoric.

I dont need a "legitimate" text to tell me its an international plan. I use what most people dont use I use my eyes. But if you want legitimate just read the Talmud. It spells it out pretty clearly that there is to be a Jewish Utopia where there are two people Jews and Non Jews or Gentiles. Now to give credit where it is due all religions talk about how they are to rule the world but it seems to me the Zionists have a pretty big lead in the take over the world business. Now why do I say this? Once again look at what they control. The control the banking, media, and entertainment industry. If I was going to take over the world taking over those three industries would be top on my list to start with. But all of this will go in one ear and our the other because its just empty rhetoric from a bigot.

Edit to add: Having the ability to control money can bring nations to their knees as we have just seen. When the banks pull the money supply it has real effects. These banks literally print money and can use this money to buy assets of real value. They dont work for the money there is no production there in fact the value to these fiat dollars is directly because of the productive people. Its the biggest scam on earth but it is in genius. Take over the world by the control of money.

[edit on 13-3-2009 by mybigunit]

Originally posted by kosmicjack
I don't think anyone's mind is going to be changed based on this thread or my opinion.

Some people, who have been reading about the "zionist world conspiracy" here on a daily basis and have started to buy into it will be dissuaded from the idea when given the facts on the theories origins. And for that there will be a little less stupidity in the world.

As such, I humbly suggest that you consider more deeply whether it is quite possible that a Zionist Agenda exists,

Im not necessarily referring to the Israel-Lobby in the U.S. or to the current Israeli situation. Im referring more to the "Zionist World Conspiracy Theory" that holds almost all governments, media and banks are in the control of Jews and even goes as far as to label Harry Potter, Leonardo DiCaprio and me as part of this vast conspiracy.

Having read the respective anti-jewish books and websites I've already considered this more deepl. This type of super-paranoia is crippling to sincere conspiracy-research and fuels fear and strife. Nothing more.

As for American-Israeli favouritism, lobbyism, bullish behavior towards Palestinians...not arguing that at all. There`s a difference between genuine anti-semitism and anti-Israeli positions.

Originally posted by Justice69
A FORGERY USED TO MANIPULATE THE MASSES TO HATE JEWS.

Wow, that sounds like quite a conspiracy. A bigger conspiracy than many of the facts being denied here.

Originally posted by Skyfloating

Originally posted by StrangeBrew


As far as the "Protocols of the Elders of Zion" go, I do think there is definitely black propaganda in play. However, I think it's in the complete opposite way Skyfloatting suggests.

More accurately you'd have to call it, black-white-black propaganda or whatever. Here's how - the first part is the bait and switch. Instead of the enemy writing the "black propaganda", they write it against themselves. Then, when the "Protocols or documents" are exposed, the enemy is vilified by your own doing (in this case, future referenceable/semi-resembling zionist-like conspiracy to that of the forgery).

This type of complex conspiracy-behind-the-conspiracy thinking, while possible, is more of a "lets distort and convolute facts until the Jews are the culprit.

This is similar to another poster earlier saying that the genocide on the Jews was ultimately carried out by the Jews or that the freedom of the Internet is actually a cover-up for removed-freedoms to come.

There is no need to make stuff extremely complex in order to fit the belief-system "jews are evil".

The competitiveness of that game is an illusion.

From a puppet-masters point of view the competition would be an Illusion.

There's nothing complex about my example of a classic bait and switch. As I said, this is as simple as a "bait and switch" gets.

There is no need to make stuff extremely complex in order to fit the belief-system "jews are evil"

Whoa. Now this may be a winner. Winner for you because you scared me out of the thread. In no way did I utter "evil jew" or anything of the sort. I don't have time to teach the entire history of a one world order and how it relates to zionism.

Spend a few months (or years) reading Eustace Mullins. Mr Penny, you'd benefit from his research greatly.

This is my final post in this thread.

Peace

How come Zionism is not real, yet all the things that are mentioned in the Protocols of Zion are becoming true? the demoralization of people, the race mixing, the massive debts...

Originally posted by MrPenny

This will not end well Skyfloating.....all you've done is thrown down the soapbox.....and now the shouting commences.

It will end just fine. No harm done in questioning the status-quo of conspiracy-theory.

I see you do it all the time

Originally posted by vcwxvwligen
I'm sure you are aware that several of the most popular US presidents were Freemasons.

Yes and so what?

It's very difficult to succeed in many professions, such as law, without becoming a Freemason.

This is untrue. Its based on misguided conspiracy-theories. Was it true 100 years ago? Maybe, maybe not. But its not true today.

Originally posted by StrangeBrew
Spend a few months (or years) reading Eustace Mullins.

I've read Eustace Mullins. It was not a good read because it lacked any sort of open-mindedness.

I too can single out a bunch of jewish names in power while ignoring millions of non-jewish names who have been influental in history and secret-history.

Originally posted by masterp
How come Zionism is not real, yet all the things that are mentioned in the Protocols of Zion are becoming true? the demoralization of people, the race mixing, the massive debts...

1. What is the greatest change in the last 20 years? Probably the Internet. The currently largest source of media information. And all of it created by you.

2. The Protocols of the Elders of Zion show how Machiavellian Power-Politics work. The problem begins when claiming any one specific group is behind it all. That creates a witchhunt.

Originally posted by MrPenny


Yeah, damned straight!!! Victims of slavery, spousal abuse, child abuse, child laborers, the suffering of indigenous people (Native Americans, Australian aborigines, etc...)....[/sarcasm]

Great, then let's build a homeland for everyone, because everyone experiences suffering.

Why does the social currency cashed in by a multitude of abused and wronged segments of society and cultures have more legitimacy than what the Jewish people claim as their social currency?

Whoa ... so the suffering of Jews bears equal weight to the combined suffereing of everyone else? Let's not forget that 0.2% of the world's population practices Judaism.

"Taking rational arguments out of the equation"....that's hilarious, in the context of this thread and Skyfloating's opening post. The irrational attempts at rebuttal, and the massive ignorance exposed....

Hmm, yeah, hilarious. So funny I forgot to laugh

How's this for rationality....the creation of the State of Israel is for the most part, exactly what has been occurring for the whole of humanity's history, in one form or another. Tribes, nation states, cities, empires, clans, alliances.....all formed based on some real or imagined shared traits that made the members feel safe and protected.

Why should someone who's never been to the Middle East have a right to kick someone else out of their home?

It is very revealing to me that not a single poster in this thread bothered to see the irony in the description of "Manifest Destiny".....not one.

Then please, take it upon yourself to do us the honor.

Originally posted by mybigunit
I dont need a "legitimate" text to tell me its an international plan.

Do you know how revealing that sentence is. How it lacks a rational base?

read the Talmud. It spells it out pretty clearly that there is to be a Jewish Utopia where there are two people Jews and Non Jews or Gentiles.

Big deal....the New Testament ends in much the same way.

The control the banking, media, and entertainment industry.

So they're good at business. This, and an ancient religious text is the foundation for all of this? Really? And you think that's rational.

Having the ability to control money can bring nations to their knees as we have just seen. When the banks pull the money supply it has real effects. These banks literally print money and can use this money to buy assets of real value.

I haven't time to give a lesson in economics or financial matters right now...but the current banking crisis is a result of the lack of control. It may very well have as a root cause something as simple as a mathematical formula (written by a gentleman of Chinese descent) no one understood, yet trusted with our money. Incidentally, Iceland, with very few Jews running its banks, totally collapsed.

[edit on 13-3-2009 by MrPenny]

Skyfloating, thank you for politely challenging what you sincerely believe to be the status-quo of a certain conspiracy, and your case is good and well-presented. And there is such a thing as Jew-hate, and there is such a thing as Anti-Semitism. And this piece of disinformation you speak of is a black-propaganda tool for the most part, and I personally won't attempt to deny this.

But there are certain facts, and there are certain connections, that strongly imply a conspiracy of some sort being real, concerning Zionism.

For example, here you have Joe Biden, and this is him speaking in an interview not long before his election as Vice-President of the United States;



And I'll quote him; "I am a Zionist, you don't have to be a Jew to be a Zionist", and he later also goes on to speak about the war in Iraq. This interview was on 'Shalom TV'.. am I correct in assuming that that is an Israeli channel?.. now why would he be discussing the war in Iraq on an Israeli channel?.. and note the banner behind Biden's shoulder, it says "Biden for President".

Now my personal opinion, is that Biden isn't much of a Zionist in reality, but this was an attempt by him to garner political support, and this is pretty evident. Look at Joe Biden now not-long after, he is now the Vice-President of the U.S. There is a conspiracy here surely.