"Zionist Conspiracy Theory" = Black Propaganda

Originally posted by Goathief

Here's some sound reasoning for you, Jews brought freemasonry to America:

I didnt know that. Since Freemasonry is all about Tolerance and Benevolence, that puts Jews in a good light, doesnt it...

reply to post by mybigunit


Let me guess...you havent actually read the Talmud but picked this off some "jew-watch" site.

Pick up a copy someday and get some actual knowledge...in context and without the mis-translations.

Originally posted by mybigunit

Ill just say this if they were forged and according to most media sources they were there sure are a hell of a lot of predictions or "coincidences" that were predicted when they were written in the 1800s or whenever they were written. There are a lot of things in there that apply to what is going on today. Probably just a strange coincidence though....

The Protocols accurately describe Machiavellian Manipulation. That was never up for discussion in this thread. Whats up for discussion is that previous versions existed that had other groups pulling the strings.

[edit on 16-3-2009 by Skyfloating]

reply to post by Skyfloating


Yup....more than likely one of those sites the poster has characterized as "illegitimate".

Yay for the Internet....providing the means to cull the "sound bites" needed to construct any fanciful musings.

On Freemasonry:

Some governments, mostly authoritarian, and virtually all totalitarian, regimes have treated Freemasonry as a potential source of opposition due to its secret nature and international connections. It has been alleged by Masonic scholars that the language used by the totalitarian regimes is similar to that used by some modern critics of Freemasonry.[1]

1


Freemasons promote tolerance, education, liberation...things that oppressive regimes, tyrants and bigots cannot stand.

Freemasonry was persecuted in all the communist countries

Freemasonry is illegal in most of the Islamic world. It is prohibited in all Arab countries except Lebanon and Morocco

In 1933 Hermann Goering, the Reichstag President and one of the key figures in the process of Gleichschaltung ("synchronization"), states "..in National Socialist Germany, there is no place for Freemasonry." [13]

it is estimated that between 80,000 and 200,000 Freemasons were murdered under the Nazi regime.[20]

How many people did freemasonry kill compared to that?

[edit on 16-3-2009 by Skyfloating]

I don't think the Talmud has a monopoly on violence, cruelty, misogyny, etc....

Exodus 35:2 Six days work shall be done, but on the seventh day you shall have a Sabbath of solemn rest, holy to the Lord. Whoever does any work on it shall be put to death.


Deuteronomy 7:1-2 When the Lord your God brings you into the land that you are entering to take possession of it, and clears away many nations before you, the Hittites, the Girga#es, the Amorites, the Canaanites, the Perizzites, the Hivites, and the Jebusites, seven nations more numerous and mightier than yourselves, and when the Lord your God gives them over to you, and you defeat them, then you must devote them to complete destruction. You shall make no covenant with them and show no mercy to them.


Deuteronomy 20:10-17 But in the cities of these peoples that the Lord your God is giving you for an inheritance, you shall save alive nothing that breathes, but you shall devote them to complete destruction, the Hittites and the Amorites, the Canaanites and the Perizzites, the Hivites and the Jebusites, as the Lord your God has commanded.


Ezekiel 20:25-26 Moreover, I gave them statutes that were not good and rules by which they could not have life, and I defiled them through their very gifts in their offering up all their firstborn, that I might devastate them. I did it that they might know that I am the Lord.


Leviticus 25:44-45
As for your male and female slaves whom you may have: you may buy male and female slaves from among the nations that are around you. You may also buy from among the strangers who sojourn with you and their clans that are with you, who have been born in your land, and they may be your property.

Matthew 6:1 “Beware of practicing your righteousness before other people in order to be seen by them, for then you will have no reward from your Father who is in heaven.”

Matthew 10:34 “Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace, but a sword.”

This is fun....I'm going to go build me a "conspiracy" out of whole cloth....film at 11:00.

Originally posted by Skyfloating
I didnt know that. Since Freemasonry is all about Tolerance and Benevolence, that puts Jews in a good light, doesnt it...

You left out usuary and favortism, ritualistic witchcraft and libation... tolerance in freemasonry? Why is anyone who isn't in on the scam considered profane and why do they have guides on how to recognise curly hair follicles and make black people join Prince Hall Freemasonry rather than just letting them in regular lodges? Albert Pike was a KKK guru, and a masonic icon.
Benevolence? Yeah to their fellow brethern, the charities are for charitable status and tax breaks, it's called giving back to the community which of course inplies that they took something in the first place. That holier than thou art masonic ego they pump members full of is truly revolting. When you peel off the shiny aprons and banners, it's nothing but a good ole boy club with a quasi-kabbalist root in the zionist cause.

reply to post by MrPenny


I think strong arguments can be made that most if not all of the earth’s religions are fundamentally flawed in many of their concepts.

As someone of no faith whatsoever beyond my landlord is going to insist on the rent at the first of every month, I bristle whenever I hear people in the United States purport that ours is a Christian Nation.

While the Talmudic Laws absolutely take the prize for some of the most blatantly uncharitable thoughts towards interpersonal relationships, and have some uniquely disturbing philosophies towards business, political and sexual practices they are by no means alone in trying to establish a rule of law based on ethnology and philosophy ultimately guised and couched in a purported spirituality.

Ethnology and institutionalized spiritual philosophies are clearly what binds together nations with drawn borders and binds their citizenry together under a rule of law that employs both the former to ensure the nation’s cohesive order.

Of course no one who belongs on the red team wants to think whoever belongs on the blue team is as individually and uniquely talented as they personally are, and that the combined team they are competing against is as talented or better in any quality that would justify in the team’s mind surrendering in loss to them.

Validating one’s own ethnology and philosophy as being uniquely superior and more correct is an intrinsic part of each human’s psychological makeup and sense of security and propriety.

The ultimate validation and security of course comes in persuading those beyond the tribe’s border’s of differing ethnology and philosophical background that your tribe or sect’s fundamental beliefs and Rule of Law that binds your tribe together is superior and more correct and should be adopted by them as well. This practice of self validation often does become offensive in nature and employs any means necessary at times.

The defensive posture is always, well our book or our leader, or our belief is certainly no worse than yours as that defending entity points to the offensive and offending one to once again validate their belief system, ethnology and rule of law. This is often used as the justification in defending the sometimes very amoral, self serving and unyielding notions that comprise the embodiment of the rule of law that become threatening to other tribal regions, the ethnology and philosophy of them and their rule of law.

The offensive posture is ours is superior and we our superior and when ever there are two or more differing opinions regarding ethnology, philosophy and spirituality and the rule of law a tribe incorporates these things into is that only one of the competing notions can be correct.

Ultimately it leads to a sense of lack of security and fear of inferiority that has always caused humans to seek safety in numbers through tribal and communal defensive and offensive security.

I do not think that there are but a handful of zealots, even in the priestly class let alone the laity who practice faiths and governance by laws regarding their individual sects spiritual believes and interpretation of it’s deities divine laws that believe wholeheartedly in every last one or even a majority of the assertions that grant a divine right to utilize amoral and unjust, self serving perspectives of the divine to incorporate the amoral and unjust and uncharitable into the laws that give the sect and ultimately the tribe it’s identity and cohesiveness and security under the rule of law.

Yet, when it comes time to ensure the tribes borders or to expand them, ensure the ethnic desire to retain its unique blood lines and heritage that grants it a visible difference superficially that the human inclination is to judge as being superior to those that do not share it, and the spiritual philosophies that bind the tribe into a cohesive group governed by a Rule a Law that ensures it’s function and integrity they will and do invoke then the premise that they have a divinely inherent right to expand offensively through a pretext that it is merely defensive in nature and the practice of employing an amoral, unjust and uncharitable approach towards other tribes, ethnic and spiritual practices is not untoward or wrong because of that shared notion that absolves their conscious for inhumane acts towards others in the process that the divinity of the deity grants them through the notion of a superiority and correctness the deity proclaims as being right and just.

No singular human being could neither justify the obscene barbarity, violence and destruction then employed as being moral in such a way to grant the tribes absolution of conscience through such acts and practices. The only way these behaviors have been perpetuated and validated and justified is through the rigidly indoctrinated and enforced notion that it is a super human divine force that wishes it’s will to be done that it is correct to indulge and serve in this manner for the tribe and sect’s security and longevity.

It then becomes a tragically flawed circular logic and enslaving trap in it’s own right because it becomes beyond the privilege and power of any single human or group of humans to deny, defy or alter what is purported to be correct as declared by a divine non human entity whose inherent power is promoted as being so much more greater and wiser that no human could or should challenge it.

That these divine entities whose tribal elders and leaders and priestly class see that scriptures are written and maintained to detail the deities wishes and objectives and laws have no ability to communicate directly with a verifiable and scientifically provable divine force of this nature is an absurd and manipulative form of contrived and flawed governance that ensures the barbarity and perpetual retardation of the human race that the logical process of human thought is then blocked from creating just solutions for all humans based on human needs and not some capricious uninvolved divine entities is something so ludicrous and self defeating the only way it could be perpetuated is to place it above human hands.

That is why all religions are so dangerous.

Science and logic dictates that 2 plus 2 is always 4.

Religion can and will argue when it suits the tribe and it’s philosophy and ethnology that 2 plus 2 is 3, while others will counter that 2 plus 2 is five and all will justify their faulty conclusion on well G-d said so and G-d is always right, and one does not argue with G-d.

One can’t argue with G-d because G-d is not around to argue with.

That my friend’s is the Zionist conspiracy because all of these dominating scriptures are simply differing interpretations of the Hebrew/Jewish divinity that one competing scripture says 2 plus 2 is 5, and another says is 3, while yet another says is 6.

The conspiracy is the ongoing justification of utilizing this nonhuman purportedly divine factor to arrive at a quotient uniquely beneficial to one tribe versus the other to the detriment more often than not of the other tribes and their philosophy.

It’s a house of cards that stands on the Hebrew/Jewish divinity that the sand it was built on becomes impenetrable rock above all because of the absolution it grants for a human to be in humane in perpetuating and ensuring it’s survival as a political system of governance and conquest.

Continued

reply to post by MrPenny


Continued from above...

The simple truth of this repugnant system that visits so much death and destruction and suffering upon the world is that it is all based on the notion of a Hebrew/Jewish divinity being divine and that at the root of the system no single human can ever deny the false truth of 2 plus 2 equals 3.

Ultimately the only way this system could survive forever is by the total conquest of the world.

It is imperative to Jews/Hebrews and Christians, and Muslims especially as at it’s base is the corrupt politics that allows for an obscene version of laws that is as glaringly evident in the Talmud as it is in our own nation’s and every nations laws that incorporate elements of divine right and privilege to ensure the wealth and power of a commerce and political systems that continues to this day to be uniquely beneficial to a rarified privileged few and detrimental to the vast sea of the majority of humanity that suffers it’s indignities.

The real Zionist conspiracy is deluding us through this human introduced and maintained system that it is divine and beyond our control and we are wrong to change it.

In reality you can’t debunk that it’s not a Hebrew/Zionist conspiracy.

Only your Deity can and you can’t produce your Deity, you can only perpetuate a system that instills a fear that the Deity is real.
Produce your G-d or understand that ultimately if human kind is ever going to be run to the benefit of human kind, exclusively aimed towards the benefit of ALL of human kind, human kind has no choice but to be anti-Semitic to topple the house of cards that it has been jailed in.

What you wish people to believe is that anti-Semitism which is really just humans being pro-logic and science, and humanity is wrong.

That’s the conspiracy, how you ensure its continuation and the only way you can ensure its continuation is to absorb every last tribe and human into it is called logistics.

This thread is about arguing over the logistics of the conspiracy in yet another perverted and self serving attempt to deny the existence of the conspiracy by invalidating one logistical element of it.

My real question to the paranoid worshipping these imaginary deities and condoning and engaging in inhuman acts in the deity’s name, why the heck don’t you want to be human?

What do you have against us that you would so contrive for so long to deny us and pervert ours?

Have any of you not involved in it but for the sheer power and wealth the system grants you ever thought through what your vain desire to validate your ethnology and philosophy as superior is in fact doing to your fellow humans and this planet.

You are all inherently good people, but until you do that, and stop doing the inhuman and trying to justify it by hiding behind some divine excuse and notion of superiority you do have great cause to be paranoid.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Yeah, thanks. Did it ever occur to you that you may be addressing an atheist? I don't care about any of that. And I certainly don't need Philosophy 101, thank you.

Your prose is interesting, but.....maybe you could work on the brevity a bit? You seem like a really bright person and I can't figure out why I take your input in such a condescending tone......even considering the overbearing tone I take on myself.

Originally posted by twitchy
You left out usuary, ritualistic witchcraft and libation... tolerance in freemasonry?

I know freemasonry inside-out and bottom-to-top and none of this happens in it. Consider that you may be gravely mistaken.

Albert Pike was a KKK guru, and a masonic icon.

Really bizzare how anti-masons keep quoting a single member that died long ago. It matters not what a single member thinks Freemasonry is. It matters what Freemasonry does and presents in its ritual and instruction books...which continually harp on tolerance and benevolence.

That holier than thou art masonic ego they pump members full of is truly revolting. When you peel off the shiny aprons and banners, it's nothing but a good ole boy club with a quasi-kabbalist root in the zionist cause.

I could think of a lot of worse belief-systems than the kabbala. Whats wrong with Kabbala?

Its OUTRAGEOUS what you guys believe about Jews, Freemasons etc.

Originally posted by Skyfloating

Originally posted by twitchy
You left out usuary, ritualistic witchcraft and libation... tolerance in freemasonry?

I see you took favoritism out of the quote... LOL
Looks like a real noble instituion, right to the very end...

reply to post by MrPenny


Hey you wont hear any arguments from me partner on Christianity. I told you earlier in this thread all religions are screwed hence is why I dont do the religion thing. I just said before in that same quote as Ill say again is that the imperialist Jews are leading the way in the take over the world department. Christianity once lead the way and lead us to such great times like the Dark Ages and the several inquisitions. I dont want any religion running the place which is why I am the way I am. It may seem like Im coming down hard on Jews and my rant truly is not against all Jews for I know not all Jews drink the imperialistic kool aid but the ones that do however use the innocents as tools as they hide behind the guise of Judaism. These people really do believe in the old century talmudic laws just like the hardcore neo cons evangelicals believe in the rule the world screw everyone else parts of the bible. Anymore what scares me even more is the alliance between these two factions of Christians and Jews which seems to be what is happening.

Originally posted by MrPenny
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

Yeah, thanks. Did it ever occur to you that you may be addressing an atheist? I don't care about any of that. And I certainly don't need Philosophy 101, thank you.

Your prose is interesting, but.....maybe you could work on the brevity a bit?

You seem like a really bright person and I can't figure out why I take your input in such a condescending tone......even considering the overbearing tone I take on myself.

I certainly apologize if my posts come across condescending. I sure don't meant them to sound that way.

As far as brevity is concerned, the reality is my posts as tedious and rudimentary as they seem, ultimately have to bring into question what is volumes and volumes and reams and reams of religious doctrine, philosophy, law and history.

It's like trying to give an elephant pause to stop in it's rampaging tracks by shooting a slingshot at it. In theory you have a shot if you hit the Elephant in the right spot but it's got to still be a sizable rock.

I don't know if there is a good way out of the circular logic of the religious trap that convinces people out of fear of not truly understanding their purpose or place or future in the world and universe that the safest and surest best to ensure one is through adherence to the scriptures that purport to authoritatively determine what it is, that does but only does ensure them an eternally desirable place in the universe through their adherence to and allegiance to them.

I try to make the stone big enough to at least give the Elephant something to think about if they take notice at all that simply might make it question.

Ultimately we all have to decide for ourselves.

When the process of that decision requires looking at the fundamental notions involved that create tribal, ethnic, and spiritual unity and identity the nature of the overall system is just to assume and react with the premise that another equally flawed or more severely flawed tribe, ethnic or spiritual movement is simply trying to gain supremacy to their detriment.

They make it about then an us versus them type of reasoning that causes them to avoid any notion of introspection and examination of the flaws inherent in their own system to rally them together behind the system without ever truly stopping to think if at a core level is the system they are rallying behind is in fact in their own core benefit.

This notion that intelligent and reasoned humans can't speak to the elements that are destructive to those in and outside of the system that is being critiqued without having committed both some terrible infraction against it and the supposed deity that oversees and ultimately rules over it is one that people just don't want to let go of.

You are an anti-Semite, you are a fascist or a radical Islamic fundamental, as you are immediately categorized as one of the known and already identified enemies of the system in a rallying cry to treat this imagined threat with the same defensive and offensive vigor of previously identified and known enemies and in the process conjuring forth all the passions attached to those events and perspectives.

I am just trying to get people to think, and even in most humans as individual a mention of their flaws in constructively critical ways that you perceive are limiting as well damaging to them and others, typically only results in a counterattack pointing out the others. It's typically what everyone except the wisest and most inquisitive do when critiqued or chastised. They justify their own imperfections not by acknowledging them or thinking about them or correcting them, but rather focusing on attacking flaws in the other person.

In my case it would seem that is coming off sounding condescending. I can only hope that alone isn't the cause for anyone not to at least ponder and think on the words and ideas.

No one can make things better simply by trying to make sure no one else makes things worse!

A person has to want to first be better themselves and make things better themselves and they really can't do that when the whole process of education and growth is bound by an outdated and ineffective set of ideals that excuses them from having to consider doing so, and absolves them of it at the same time.

People are dying and starving and suffering each day because of these flawed beliefs. It is a 2,000 year old stalemate no one can break that the people who imagine they can and will win in imposing it on everyone with absolute total hegemony can't possibly do so.

All they can do in the process is hurt humanity and retard its true potential while making those who want and truly believe something much better can be achieved are petty and bigoted and evil and dangerous for wanting to do so.

Anti-Semite is a word for you are an enemy and wrong and foolish for even trying.

Justifying one flawed system as being excusable by pointing at the flaws of another system is just a smoke screen to be responsible in the need for a civilization that addresses and celebrates human diversity and growth as opposed to seeing it as a threat to one that is so inherently flawed and destructive that the only way it can be justified at all is to chalk it up to the wisdom of something above human wisdom and human's ability to understand.

I at least will keep working on trying to not sound and seem condescending, what though is everyone else's excuse for not working on their own obvious flaws?

This whole circular system of the best defense is a good offense born out of humans trying to interpret and impose that which they imagine is divine and to profit off the falsehoods of it is what makes the world a place that spirals towards an ever more destructive and inhuman decay instead of towards a more progressive and productive and prosperous future. Not for the ruling elite and their trusted minions of one tribe, philosophy or ethnic group, but for everyone.

I think it's worth time investing in talking about, writing and seeing if others are tired looking to the heavens for answers that never look back with answers and start accepting that everyone has to make some compromises to find some answers here on earth, where just humans, decide what is actually fair and safe and just for all humans.

I guess I am just a dreamer. A bit of an optimist too, I think it can be done, if people ever get to the point they are willing to truly give up something that really doesn't work in order to achieve something that might and could.

Thanks.

reply to post by twitchy


You go ahead and rest in your belief that masons and jooos are evil world controllers. There's nothing whatsoever I could say that could change it.

Good Luck

[edit on 16-3-2009 by Skyfloating]

I find it appalling that a 'moderator' (how ironic) is allowed to start a topic like this on a website supposedly dedicated to finding the truth regarding world conspiracies. Your first post here contains a little disclaimer, but of course that is meaningless. You DO speak for ATS and its owners when you post on your moderator account. Why couldn't you have done what the owners do - create an alternate persona to push your agenda? Their transparency is laughable to me, yet most regular members, as far as I can tell, take no notice. See how easy it is?

You seem to be relatively intelligent and well-read, Mr. Floating, so I have a hard time dismissing your ideas as simple products of harmless ignorance. You MUST be aware that Zionism, at least in the current era, has nothing to do with Judaism or Freemasonry. In my research - which is and always will be on-going, thereby keeping my opinions in a fluid state - I have found more links to Zionism with the occult Nazis and the hard-line, Armageddon-hungry Christians than with Jews and Masons.

I almost fell into the "quote-refute-repeat" game so many internet debaters participate in, but I simply don't have the time or energy to play along, at least not on this forum, where the motto is, of course, Deny Ignorance. Keep on Denyin'!

Originally posted by Hiddenglyph
I find it appalling that a 'moderator' (how ironic) is allowed to start a topic like this on a website supposedly dedicated to finding the truth regarding world conspiracies.

Its indeed rare that a thread shows up questioning the motives behind some of these "conspiracy" theories. That, in my opinion, is helpful.

Your first post here contains a little disclaimer, but of course that is meaningless. You DO speak for ATS and its owners when you post on your moderator account.

Moderating and Membership are entirely separate things. Im a member first and as a member I enjoy expressing an opinion now and then.

Why couldn't you have done what the owners do - create an alternate persona to push your agenda?

Do they? I see this is your very first post on ATS - welcome btw - how would you know what they do?

You MUST be aware that Zionism, at least in the current era, has nothing to do with Judaism or Freemasonry.

Of course. I've been saying that Zionism has nothing to do with the "Zionist World Conspiracy Theory".

Originally posted by Hiddenglyph
I find it appalling that a 'moderator' (how ironic) is allowed to start a topic like this on a website supposedly dedicated to finding the truth regarding world conspiracies. Your first post here contains a little disclaimer, but of course that is meaningless. You DO speak for ATS and its owners when you post on your moderator account. Why couldn't you have done what the owners do - create an alternate persona to push your agenda? Their transparency is laughable to me, yet most regular members, as far as I can tell, take no notice. See how easy it is?

You seem to be relatively intelligent and well-read, Mr. Floating, so I have a hard time dismissing your ideas as simple products of harmless ignorance. You MUST be aware that Zionism, at least in the current era, has nothing to do with Judaism or Freemasonry. In my research - which is and always will be on-going, thereby keeping my opinions in a fluid state - I have found more links to Zionism with the occult Nazis and the hard-line, Armageddon-hungry Christians than with Jews and Masons.

I almost fell into the "quote-refute-repeat" game so many internet debaters participate in, but I simply don't have the time or energy to play along, at least not on this forum, where the motto is, of course, Deny Ignorance. Keep on Denyin'!

I would like to say that SkyFloating has certainly been an exceptional poster as well as Moderator on this thread.

The fairness shown in allowing everyone to voice opinion and put forth arguments and a broad range of facts from the poorly substantiated to the very well substantiated as well as allowing people to put forth theories almost entirely based on speculation is commendatory.

The overall civility of this thread has been at such a well maintained and elevated level for an exchange on a topic as heated as this as to deserve special compliments.

My compliments SkyFloating you have been as gracious and civil in allowing everyone to share their varying positions and styles as anyone could hope for.

Thank you very much for giving us all the opportunity to share.

As far as SkyFloating's opinions and beliefs, everyone is entitled to them and share theirs in a forum that allows for free speech.

Even if you entirely disagree with SkyFloating's position and opinions that individual thought and initiative was put into creating a thread that people of all opinions and positions could voice in on is commendable in and of itself.

Nobody with a differing opinion including me has been treated poorly or run off.

Thank you again SkyFloating for the original post to give us all cause to think and share, and the exceptional decorum you have maintained throughout.

It's been a real pleasure and honor to participate on such a well maintained and open thread.

Originally posted by Skyfloating
I know freemasonry inside-out and bottom-to-top and none of this happens in it. Consider that you may be gravely mistaken.

Umm...

Originally posted by Skyfloating

Originally posted by Goathief
Jews brought freemasonry to America

I didnt know that.

Perhaps you should rethink your claims of "knowing freemasonry inside and out" and consider that in fact you may be gravely mistaken.

There are so many splinter-groups, offshoots and subdivisions within 'freemasonry' it is quite possible that even if you are a Freemason yourself your brethren may hold views and practices entirely different to your own. Hence why 'illuminati' is the preferable term when discussing NWO and secret societies because they were the first documented group of Freemasons who tried to change the world. To the best of my knowledge they are now defunct and the real Zionist conspirators/NWO will be named something else, even the illuminati went under the guise of a library/reading group at one point. In the same manner we differentiate between Jews and Zionists, so should we do with Freemasons and Illuminati.

None of this changes the fact that they do exist and many are too blind to see it. We are just arguing over names.

reply to post by Goathief


Im not claiming to know everything...like some of these conspiracy-theorists are.