The SUSPENSION of illicit drugs/mind altering substance topics on ATS (The experiment failed)

And as far as "go post on some other site"... Well, why? I find most sites filled with trolls and spam bots. Not something I find here. I find these forums well modded and lots of thoughtfull posts made. If you ever spent an hour on the yahooka forums you would know what I mean.

There is a strict critera here for posting. I have had many posts deleted over the years. Lots moved to BTS. All of them aggravated me. I always thought the people that run this site are a bit preachy for my liking, but I dealt with it. It was quality.

The solution here is simple. It gets its own folder and subject matter needs to be clearly defined. Whats allowed and whats not. Then assign a mod or two (I'll do it!! I love banhammers!!). And keep it within the T&Cs. The folder could be "Conspricy on the Drug War" or something similar.

Just remember--- over 40% of Americans favor some sort of repeal of the prohibition on it. The numbers are growing..

Skeptic---> pimpin IS easy...
-runnin ATS isn't.

Originally posted by Uniceft17
The motto is to DENY IGNORANCE.

And you are wallowing in it.

You have chosen to ignore why exactly this policy came down and have been too obtuse to understand what problems it could create.

Originally posted by Uniceft17
You obviously are missing the conspiracy side of the drug topic, you are embracing ignorance by advocating the banning this topic because of a few members.

I know what the conspiracy side of it is. And we should be allowed to discuss this things. I have been explicit in stating that. But you have been too obtuse to notice.

Originally posted by Uniceft17
Wouldn't you like to know what our government is doing with illegal drugs?

That is not the issue.

Originally posted by Uniceft17
I call BS.

Did you just make that up off the top of your head?

No. Read my posts... it's all there.

Please... what value is there in "9/11 Truth" topics?

Implicit in your sarcasm is the notion that there is not much value in "9/11 Truth" topics.

So using the reasoning you have repeatedly given for banning drug discussions, shouldn't "9/11 Truth" discussions be banned as well?

Originally posted by Cutwolf
Implicit in your sarcasm is the notion that there is not much value in "9/11 Truth" topics.

The context was in regards to the value to advertisers.

reply to post by SkepticOverlord

Please... what value is there in "9/11 Truth" topics?

What value is there in believing what you're told?

If you're likely to believe the government's story you're more likely to believe all of their lies. Both parties lie.

The government lies.

We should be able to discuss the issue of drugs. People can act according to their agenda if they have one if they wish to. There should be a separate forum to discuss drugs IMO. We need to talk about the drug war.

Oh well. I can always go to the Lou Dobb's forum and discuss drugs there and then use this for other topics.

I typically hang around ATS in the aliens & UFOs and government intelligence areas. I’ve been doing research on a topic and preparing to launch a thread that I think would be of great interest to ATS members and correlate perfectly with the general interest level.

Namely, this topic concerns the cultivation, worldwide distribution, and, most importantly, the covert financial aspects and government involvement in the opium trade in Afghanistan. Significantly, though details are very hard to ascertain for obvious reasons, there is at least some empirical evidence that the opium trade in Afghanistan has not only flourished, but is increasing dramatically and that there is much more to the government’s presence and involvement there than the cover of few undesirables lurking in a cave here and there. Think laundered money, covert operations, worldwide funding of military-industrial projects, “asset protection”, etc...

The premise of this topic fits, I had originally thought, with the ideal ATS thread -and I can think of no better place to discuss this with intelligent, equally inquisitive, resourceful arm-chair researchers. The topic is, in my view, “Made for ATS”.

Now – my question is this: Is such a potential thread now OFF LIMITS???

(If affirmative - then that is unfortunate indeed. As I understand it, we can't discuss such a topic because there just may be a potential poster who may have used the substance or something?)

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

Originally posted by Cutwolf
Implicit in your sarcasm is the notion that there is not much value in "9/11 Truth" topics.

The context was in regards to the value to advertisers.

Fair enough.

The underlying point still remains: there are quite a few topics discussed here that are not "real" issues - why not ban those, as well?

As I said before and I will repeat: The topic of illicit drugs is one of the few topics here that is empirically grounded in reality and has an impact on society.

Oh man, i can't keep up. There are so many people against this. I left for five minutes, came back, and another 10 posts on this subject. I can see why many are angered, but i did not expect this much response.

The censorship begins...Just this one topic in the beginning, but hey it's only one.

Right?

Heard it all before, seen it all before and it ain't pretty.

Hey I think all of you should check SO's last post in his update thread.

It made me feel a whole lot better.

LONG LIVE FREE SPEECH ON ATS.

I wanted to interject a point while I was able to....
I've learned that disagreeing with Springer will only lead to a response that will force me away for months.... However...

I agree that the discussion of using illegal substances should be against the T & C, just as I wouldn't expect underage drinking, torture of small animals, or driving under-the-influence to be topics that are discussed here.

But what about discussions of drug cartels/wars that are occuring in Mexico?
And what about the illegal drug trade, as it has to do with terrorism?

More importantly;

I am now on the radio, and I have an interview coming up that I was going to download to this site, ( I know you didn't want me for your radio Springer, but you didn't think that my abilities would go un-championed, did you?)

This interview is about Industrialized Hemp, and will include two state senators from the Dakota's. The whole interview is about how plastic companies used the war on drugs to eliminate a product that has NOTHING to do with drugs, in order to increase their profit.

So assuming you are an educated person Springer, can you explain to me why you would blacklist such a discussion, one which would help or solve many of the very problems that are discussed daily here on this site? Are YOU sponsored by Dupont and Dow?

I know you hate usurption, buit can you answer the question about hemp, as I AM SURE THAT THERE ARE MANY THAT FEEL LIKE I DO, without making a reference to marijuana, a plant that only shares a background with it?

I await your timely response, thank you in advance, Jason

Why not ban people talking about Reptiles? They are often childish and immature, EricktheRed once told me i should be 'exterminated' because i was obviously a lizard-demon hybrid! I bet they're hard to mod and many people get very offended at being called a cold blooded lizard person.

What really gets me is the amount of threads about hiding guns, making gangs and attacking the government with the aim of overthrowing them - this is HIGHLY illigal (conspiracy to treason) but the mods never say anything despite it being clearly violation of T&C. If the van's ever come for the servers it will be because some nut threated to overthrow the government or mentions the thing you can't do to obama, it won't be because someone said that government are talking about legalizing.

Alcohol has been legal in a lot of places for a long time, and it's not nearly as controversial as illicit substances (unless you're talking about lowering the drinking age).

You all need to remember that there are tons of these immature, inappropriate drug-related posts that have been removed by mods before we could even see them. If people wanted to actually debate the laws, provided decent evidence (which many did), and everyone acted responsibly then this would never have been such an intense issue.

It's clearly not about the money, or the ads. It's about the fact that a bunch of users with IP addresses that can recognize them as living in a country where say, marijuana, is illegal or link them to being 14 years old and doing heavy drugs, or could link any IP address to talking about selling, buying, or distributing illegal drugs could get both YOU and the website in serious trouble. Because ATS is an intermediary and it wouldn't be fair to the owners of this site who have worked so hard to build ATS from the ground up to have to deal with legal trouble for "enabling the communication linking to selling or buying illegal drugs." It wouldn't be fair to those of us who don't do drugs, if the website had to be shut down because of illegal discussion like that. It's okay to debate it seriously, but you know there are a lot of jokes (or just stupid seriousness) made about "getting so high" or whatever. The mods are basically cleaning up a lot of garbage from this topic, so it's good that it's being removed to keep the boards serious.

It would be just as illegal to talk about distributing alcohol to minors, or people talking about drinking alcohol at school or work, or purchasing it underage. Those threads would be closed if they were not a mature debate over the drinking age, and if people posted basically off-topic comments about their own personal use.

Salvia is clearly not okay. If marijuana is not okay, salvia is not okay to discuss either. Alcohol is, because the government taxes it here in America and regulates companies that sell it, unlike salvia. Same goes for pharmaceutical medications used to treat depression or other mental disorders, as long as they are prescribed legally by a psychiatrist or MD, and not being misused. I mean, I could say that everyone who takes more Advil than recommended for their body weight is abusing the drug, really (even though it probably wouldn't do anything).

In my opinion, anything that you wouldn't discuss with your boss or a police officer isn't okay here on ATS. Because the internet is being monitored (so people know if, say, a serial shooting is being planned or something). It's a risk to you and it's a risk to everyone related to the site. If something happened, like, worst case scenario with this is that people would start talking about what they use and how they get it. They decide to trade or sell to each other either over the site, or via communication that they were given through the site. It could lead to a drug bust and the people involved would get in trouble, and so would the website for being a tool used to facilitate.

It's also completely immature and inappropriate to brag about how much you're messing up who you naturally are as a person. (Chemicals naturally made by your brain should continue to be made by your brain in the same proportions). If you are prescribed any of these by a psychiatrist or doctor, then of course it's alright. If you're prescribed marijuana by a doctor, legally, then of course it's okay. And yes it's good to make it known whether or not it actually helps you. They were trying to give us a chance to prove that we could deal with a mature discussion of the topic, and we failed, because people felt like they needed to be immature and brag about it, or insult people who disagreed with them in a tremendous amount.

If you've said "okay that's it, I'm off of ATS because of this." I really think you're missing out, or had your sights set on a few relatively unimportant topics. Very few of the members here are only interested in one type of topic. So I do suggest you see what else we have to offer besides drug discussions. There are tons of websites out there for that, and you can have an account there and on ATS, but really just don't mix up the two.

Why not go ahead and introduce a 'Drug War' forum right now, as a previous member said, with a clearly defined set of rules as to what is and what is not acceptable?

I fail to understand this notion that 'the dust needs to settle' before that can happen. Mods can and do delete posts/threads that go against the TnS. I don't believe for one second that there are so many posters here hell-bent on turning ATS into Cannabis Culture that the mods can't deal with it.

And I'm sure SaviourComplex is waiting in the wings to call me 'obtuse' and perhaps a 'mental midget' for my failure to understand your reasoning.

Originally posted by SaviorComplex

And you are wallowing in it.

And tell me how exactly that is, i'm not the one agreeing with a complete blanket ban on drug talk, doing that is keeping the sheeple in ignorance when their are many things to learn about what our governments are doing behind our back, but you seem to agree with the fact that that part can't even be discussed anymore.

You have chosen to ignore why exactly this policy came down and have been too obtuse to understand what problems it could create.

This policy was implemented because of a few bad apples, why not just throw out the bad apples and keep the good ones, it seems like common sense to me.

I know what the conspiracy side of it is. And we should be allowed to discuss this things. I have been explicit in stating that. But you have been too obtuse to notice.

That is not the issue.

You say we should be allowed to discuss the conspiracy side? But at the same time agree with a complete ban on drug topics?

From what i get your logic is hey theirs a few people talking about illegaly using drugs, so lets just ban the whole topic alltogether.

Now can you tell me how that is logical? Because you are saying one thing, and then saying someting completely different.

This problem were bound to happen as ATS gets more attention and attracts a more pedestrian audiance that just can't figure out why they can't say whatever comes into their very average minds...

This wont be the first or the last topical area that suffers in this way but i for one don't believe growth can or will be maintained ( or that growth of this variety is worth the pain) unless moderation increases in line with the type of member being drawn from elsewhere on the internet.

Thanks ( and best of luck),

Stellar

So here's my beef. I was engaged in a discussion with another member about whether or not conservative magazines miss the point that while pressing for less government, they don't seem to mind government interferance in sex, illegal drugs, and gambling. Apparently that now violates the T's and C's.

Hell, if I read your conditions correctly, this thread is now illegal since it discusses illicit drugs.

Frankly, you're making the dough off of this site, you ought to put the effort forth to moderate such topics. Use a heavy hand, by all means, but when censorship becaome a response to laziness...that, my friends, sux.

reply to post by ravenshadow13

In my opinion, anything that you wouldn't discuss with your boss or a police officer isn't okay here on ATS.

LOL what? Alright then, lets just take half the threads off of ATS then



[edit on 25-2-2009 by darcon]

reply to post by jasonjnelson


That'sa very very good point, the cartels civil war in mexico is a really big event at the moment but no one is talking about it in the MSM, now ATS won't here about it either... maybe all the nonsence people are meant to talk about on ATS are just to stop us seeing whats really happening...

ATS A DISINFO SITE? More likely than you'ld think.