Soldier doubts ( Obama's) eligibility, defies president's orders

Originally posted by ConMi27
If they gave legitimate proof of his birth in Hawaii, there is no possible way anybody can continue on to say that he's an illegal. Simple as that.

You know that is not true.

He did give legitimate proof of his birth, and they refused to accept it. They refuse to accept the Hawaii State Health Director confirming Obama was born in Hawaii; they refuse to accept World Net Daily saying the short-form is not forgery. They refuse to accept that the Short-Form is by State Department standard enough to prove citizenship. They refuse to accept Fact Check's evidence showing conclusively that it is not a forgery. If they refuse to accept all of that, they will never accept any document that Obama produces. Those who say otherwise are liar, even if it themselves they are lying to.

Obama producing his long-form birth-certificate will not end this, and the liars know it. They will just move the goal-posts. Some of them already argue that the birth-certificate doesn't prove he was born in Hawaii.

Originally posted by Injustice for All
Truthfully , the only way this will be stopped is through blood shed, the government does not take the public serious.

You are a moron. And a dangerous one at that.

reply to post by converge


Converge Well said and comprehensively so.
And thanks to DimensionalDetective for providing us with a great topic

As you pointed out earlier, this thread is really going around in circles, with certain individuals refusing to accept their President's credentials.

Whether anti-Obama's like it or not, there's a guy sitting in the oval office right now, with a sign on his desk that says "President".

Quit flogging a dead horse.

[edit on 25-2-2009 by mckyle]

Now wouldn't it be weird if the USA had a coup.
Just a random thought.

Originally posted by SaviorComplex

Originally posted by Injustice for All
Truthfully , the only way this will be stopped is through blood shed, the government does not take the public serious.

You are a moron. And a dangerous one at that.

Totally agree.

This thread has really identified some worrisome individuals who, irrespective of their ideology, possess some very perverted logic.

Originally posted by mckyle
This thread has really identified some worrisome individuals who, irrespective of their ideology, possess some very perverted logic.

He says the government is not listening to the people because someone he does not like is president, refusing to acknowledge the majority of the voting public voted for that same man.

And there are not a few individuals on ATS who crave the opportunity to kill their fellow Americans; either because they are immature and have no idea what war really looks like or because they are just simple sociopaths.

Originally posted by 5thElement

Originally posted by sezsue
The only PROOF the Social Security Department would accept was a Certificate of Live Birth, which is what shows child's date and time of birth, sex of child, address and names of parents, occupation of parents, race, Hospital name, the Doctor's name, and address of business, and signatures of both parents attesting to parenthood of child.

Not true. That is not the only proof...

I'm naturalized citizen of USA and I have no birth certificate

I'm just telling you what they required of me in my situation. My fiancee and I weren't married at the time of the birth, and they had to see the copy of the actual piece of paper that we both signed attesting to the fact that her father was claiming fatherhood.

Without that piece of paper, I would not have been able to claim SS benefits for her upon his death, because a mother can name any person as the father of the child. By signing the paper he agreed he was the father.

I was using that situation as an example of an ordinary American being forced to give absolute proof of something using the original Certificate of Live Birth, with all the applicable information.

Since I am just an average American who will never affect large groups of people (possibly the world!!) with my actions, how much more important should it be to hold the owner of the highest office in the world to the same standard?

I'm glad you were able to do whatever you needed to do without that piece of paper. In my case, if I wouldn't have had or been able to get what they asked me for, I would've been out of luck!

Originally posted by WishForWings
Now wouldn't it be weird if the USA had a coup.
Just a random thought.

Hi WishForWings - nice to see someone from Oz

A coup may not be on the horizon, but what does concern me, is the deep-seated venom evident in some of the posts. We've already had someone make a thread about the timing of Obama's assassination. That's really scary stuff.

From the standpoint of being a vet of the U.S. Army and IMHO, this guy and anyone like him needs a court martial, because if he wants to use that logic on the Commander In Chief then he needs to start applying it to anyone in his chain of command first, and not just because they look or talk like born in the good old U.S.A. assume they are legitimately an American citizen, for every superior he needs to get proof from each and every one of them including their official birth certificate, and he would also need it authenticated, then have any of their original enlistment or commission paperwork examined, then after that proceed with any order given, what a load of bull*hit, who do these people think they are? get his a*s out of the military, when executing orders you don't have time to analyze beyond whether the order is lawful or not, once elected, enlisted or commissioned, your ability to question your superiors qualifications is pretty much not going to be valid, plus he would more than likely be breaching the oath of service he took and also become susceptible to all kinds of UCMJ actions.



[edit on 25-2-2009 by phinubian]

The officer corps better wake up in mass. If Obama is not who he says he is, U.S. Officers may be held accountable, by opposing forces, for following unlawful orders and may be summarily executed without the violation of International laws. Our enemies will deem our officer corps as perpetrators carrying out illegal war acts. They may be hunted around the world at any time w/out an expiration date. Similar to the Israelis hunting WW2 Nazis all over the planet. Find and kill. Sadly, the history of our military proves that peacetime officers are not the brightest lot of our society. The head honchos are usually political appointees. These have been given supreme commands, not for the ability to destroy things, but for the sensitivity they provide to a corrupt purse holding congress. So, lets together predict the future: If Obama remains in office and he is not legally qualified by our laws to be the Commander in Chief, envision a retired Army officer w/his wife on vacation 10 years from now. He sits with her on the beach at Trenton, New Jersey, enjoying the sun. An Iraqi Mosad Styled assassin, blows their f'n heads off, returns to his country, and is decorated for valour for his service. It may happen if they do nothing w/the messiah. Perhaps they can get the Kenyan a believable birth certificate. Gee, the CIA and FBI must have more time on their hands since the addition of the new, Soviet named, Homeland Security. Give them the job. Aren't they good at producing fake IDs?

Originally posted by SaviorComplex

Originally posted by mckyle
This thread has really identified some worrisome individuals who, irrespective of their ideology, possess some very perverted logic.

And there are not a few individuals on ATS who crave the opportunity to kill their fellow Americans; either because they are immature and have no idea what war really looks like or because they are just simple sociopaths.

Couldn't have said it better SaviorComplex

phinubian: I agree. The guy needs to be court martialled. Pure and simple. He chose to join, he took the vow, he swore allegiance. No one asked him to become a constitutional lawyer and adjudicate on whether or not the President is fit to serve.

[edit on 25-2-2009 by mckyle]

[edit on 25-2-2009 by mckyle]

This topic is clearly very provocative, please make sure all comments are relevant to the discussion and within the T&C. Thanks.

Originally posted by mckyle

I didn't care for Bush's tactics either. I don't think he won the election fairly but his opponent conceded rather than fight it.

So, by your analogy, if McCain had not challeneged Obama's birthright, then you wouldn't be on the redneck rampage about this issue yourself. Well stone the crows and hog-tie me to a moonshine sthil!
Congratulations, you've just just shot down your own argument for a legitimate pretense. McCain didn't dispute Obama's legitimacy!!!

I should probably stay out of your fight (sorry mckyle, I didn't read your apology yet )but I just wanted to address the above statement by you.

The reason why McCain probably didn't dispute Obama's legitimacy goes back to several posters statements through this thread that American politics these days are nothing but a dog and pony show to make Americans think they have a choice in the Presidential elections.

Zbigniew Brzezinski is big with Obama both in his campaign and now is his foreign policy advisor. See the Wiki article on Zbigniew Brzezinski below for an extremely interesting read, long but worth it.
It gives a good idea what we are in for with Zbig being Obama's foreign policy advisor. He has had his hand in every marginal foreign policy pie going back for decades.

Zbigniew Brzezinski here

When John McCain ran for president in 2000, guess who his foreign policy advisor was? If you guessed Zbgneiw Brzezinski, you get a gold star.

Fast forward to 2008 presidential election.

Marxist Zbigniew Brzezinski's sons are both advisors to both McCain and Obama
Posted October 29th, 2008 by hopefulfilled

YOUR NEW PRESIDENT, ZBIG BROTHER

"In the 2000 campaign, Zbigniew Brzezinski, lifelong Marxist, was foreign policy adviser to Senator John McCain, who said this: “I am honored that Zbigniew Brzezinski will join my foreign policy team. As a former national security adviser and a highly respected foreign policy expert, his broad experience makes him an invaluable asset to my team.” So Zbig went from Democrat Jimmy to Republican John. Remember that at the top – above the candidates – you have one party with two branches. What about this year? This year, Zbig is back, running foreign policy for Hussein. Indeed, remember Mark, son of Zbig? Mark was one of the sons to whom Zbig dedicated Between Two Ages in 1970. Mark is all grown up now and shaving. Can you imagine? Mark is foreign policy adviser to Senator Hussein. So who is foreign policy adviser to Senator McCain this year? The envelope please! El Senador Juan McCain’s foreign policy adviser this year is Ian Brzezinski, the other Zbigniew son." To read the whole article: www.newswithviews.......

article here

See, I did my research before voting........

Well there is strength in numbers. If he is an imposter, then he should be booted out. If we deny the constitution, then it is a meaningless document. These records should be public info. Everyone's info is public. Why should he be any different. When the soldiers numbers start to grow, (those who dont believe obama), and they all dont recognize him as president, there will be a security risk to our country. They cannot jail all of them and then the info will be made public.

I support our military in this matter. I do not trust the so called messiah.

Originally posted by sezsue
The reason why McCain probably didn't dispute Obama's legitimacy goes back to several posters statements through this thread that American politics these days are nothing but a dog and pony show to make Americans think they have a choice in the Presidential elections.

Since we're making assumptions here, I got one: maybe McCain didn't dispute Obama's citizenship status because McCain himself probably doesn't qualify as a natural born citizen?

reply to post by nj2day


Obama's Already addressed this, with proof! Supreme court has thrown out a lawsuit challenging his citizenship. The media has picked over every candidate's secrets for TWO FREEKIN' YEARS NOW. If you Republicans can't believe he's a US citizen in the face of the PROOF then move/stfu/commit suicide but it's time to stop your denial & admit you lost the election!!!!
PS; I want a recount from the 2000 & 2004 elections, but it ain't gonna happen.

reply to post by 5thElement


Since when would the moral fiber of a man wishing to be President not produce the desire to reassure ALL people he serves by merely presenting the document (vaulted) that could solve the debate?

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
If he is an imposter, then he should be booted out. If we deny the constitution, then it is a meaningless document. These records should be public info. Everyone's info is public.

The vital records are not public information. The reason why they are kept in a vault, only handled by authorized people of the Department of Health is because it is sensitive and private information.

Obama has presented a Certification of Live Birth. It is issued with the information that the Department of Health has in its records.

State officials have confirmed that they have, and have checked Obama's original (vital) records. They also said the certificate Obama has presented is valid.

If people don't believe what's in the certificate, then they won't believe what's in the vital records either, because the information has to match.

People can't just ask to put whatever they'd like on a certificate! That's why the certificates are stamped and signed by employees of the Department of State, certifying that it contains accurate information.

Obama's certificate is stamped and signed by Alvin T. Onaka. According to this, Alvin Onaka is:

Alvin T. Onaka, Ph.D. State Registrar and Chief of the Office of Health Status Monitoring of the Hawaii Department of Health

I like how someone compared this to what one would have to go through to get a job.

Lets say hypothetically I go get a management job.... Is it then the right of the employee's beneath me to demand my proof of citizenship before they do what I say? Flawed logic if you ask me.

reply to post by ExistenceUnknown


You don't have to be an American citizen to be a manager...you DO have to be an American citizen to be the president.

(Not saying Obama isn't, just making a point)