Whats going on at yellowstone?

reply to post by westcoast


Actually, didn't we establish that the "double tap" were p-wave and s-waves from other quakes or mine blasts?

reply to post by kennylee


Well, I could speculate and try to answer your question, but it would be totally un-scientific and only opinion based. SO I will defer to someone who has more knowledge than myself.

As far as the question of the double-tap being debunked as the different waves.....unless I missed something (which is very possible), I think that you might be thinking of when I posted a graph from a Mount St. Helens mini erruption as a comparison. It was explained by Shirakawa, I think, that the example I gave was in fact the two waves due to the location of the seismo in relation to the mountain. I did not take that to mean the same was true with the Yellowstone situation, since it appears to be actually two seperate micro quakes occuring. I could be wrong though...it is known to happen.

reply to post by westcoast


I just think someone's incorrectly labeling something as a mini-swarm and also grasping at straws because nothing's really going on at Yellowstone. Nothing out of the ordinary, anyway.

Has anyone else noticed that Shirakawa has not been about for a while?

As much as I value every single persons input I love to hear Shirakawa's opinion. What with the increase of earthquakes in general and how it may/may not be effecting Yellowstone would be something that Shirakawa could research like only Shirakawa can!

Anyway, carry on as before people and keep up the great work - thank you to everyone for their contributions.



Note To Self: Must remember that people are allowed a life outside of ATS!

reply to post by jvz123


Wow...do you make it a point to just jump into something and start implying things out of the blue?

I never said I thought it was another mini-swarm. Only that this was something I hadn't seen for awhile SINCE the last swarm. Could it be a pre-curser? I don't know, maybe, probably not.

If you are going to continue to insult people, maybe you need to jump onto a thread with better material?

To get back on track....I had noticed Shirakawas absence also. They are one I most definately defer the scientifc questions to. I am sure that if there is anything of significance happening, they will be back!

reply to post by westcoast


First of all, you should chill out. I was speaking generally, but more indirectly to Engtech than to you.

Anything he's posted lately was something about his self-proclaimed "mini-swarm."

Not attacking or insulting anyone, actually.

reply to post by jvz123


You are right, I think I owe you an apology. After going back and re-reading your post, I over reacted. I think because of previous posts.

I will chill......

Edit to add: as we speak, GEE is getting VERY active. Some continuos micro quakes, seems to be closest to 207. I wish I knew how to do a screen shot on it...i

[edit on 1-3-2010 by westcoast]

Originally posted by kennylee
reply to post by Roald

 

From what I gather from your post, along with westcoasts post, is that the Chile quake should have some effect on the west coast of US. And, since we haven't seen that yet, then it could mean that if we do, then it will be a major release? I am honestly curious and trying to learn and I thank you in advance for your reply.

Forgive me, but allow me to first just say that i believe that seismic waves, radiating from the earthquake rupture as deep and strong as M8.8, may trigger an eruption in an volcano by stirring or shaking the molten rock beneath the volcano. The disturbances that result from this lead to eruption but, because of the time it takes for pressure to build up inside a volcano and for magma to move towards the surface, an eruption may not occur until some months after the earthquake

As an example, the great Chilean earthquakes in 1906 and 1960 (the largest earthquake ever recorded) were each followed by activity at six or seven volcanoes – a significant increase on the average eruption rate of about 1 per year.

Until recently, scientists did not think major earthquakes could set off smaller tremors at distant locations. Then, in 1992, they found that California’s magnitude-7.3 Landers earthquake set off small jolts as far away as Yellowstone National Park.


Now, to your first question.
Every so often, one large earthquake can trigger another. That happen because the first quake shifts stresses around in the Earth’s crust, triggering other temblor.

Earthquakes aren’t random events -- they occur when stresses build up, so what i think happened in Chile was that the first quake occurred just like any major thrusting earthquake, with the subducting plate lurching forward under the other plate. All those other quakes that still are shaking that area is a direct result of this sudden movement.

I do believe that the passage of this seismic waves may change the water flow in a fault, possibly increasing the number of conduits that water can flow through which could cause the fault to slip again, further "up". Surface waves might also increase the strain on a fault, or loosen a fault so that it prematurely breaks or slides.

Generally a rupture will reduce the stress in the fault that's ruptured, but will increase it in other places, and all other things being equal, we'll get more seismic quake activity in those places.

I also believe that the orientation of a fault—say, north-south or east-west—can affect how a fault responds to seismic stresses. Depending on the orientation of a fault, it may be that the increase in stress produced by a past earthquake will move that fault closer to failure.
However, in a fault at another orientation, the change in stress could actually lengthen the time to the next earthquake or have no effect at all.

What I'm trying to say is that the activity outside Chile have released build-up stress in the trench/fault and that this release are still ongoing. And that this release might increase the stress further up the Nazca Plate, which means that I expect to see a domino effect. Quakes moving towards US.

So, would it result in a major release on the west coast of US?
I do not think so since we then have to pass the Cocos Plate.

The interaction between the Nazca Plate and the South American Plate, where the quakes now are rumbling, is what we call compressional, while the boundary between the Nazca Plate and the Cocos Plate are extensional, meaning: they move away from each other.

Hope I did not make a fool of myself now. It's quite late here now. Almost 4am. Past my bedtime.

To my untrained eye it looks to me like something is happening!
www.quake.utah.edu...
www.iris.edu...

reply to post by westcoast


Shirakawa stated the following to the double taps:

Yes, mine blasting is occurring.
You can recognize it because it's most visible on webicorders on the eastern area of the park. Also the time between the P and the S waves is usually clearly around 45-50 seconds.

That is definitely the same blasting activity we've been seeing in the past weeks. Those signals all (except a few ones) have about the same intensity and a recognizable interval of 50-55 seconds between their P and S waves. Mining activity on a specific site can last for decades until there's nothing left to harvest, so I wouldn't find surprising that this was already happening in 2003.


My only problem with the above is that the number and strengh of double taps "caused by mine blasting" is that the mine blasting seemed to diminish after the Jan./Feb. swarm

reply to post by Anmarie96


Thank you for the info, but I still don't think we are talking about the same thing.

The mine blasting is very distinct, constant 'noise', starting strongest in the NE corner of the park, spreading across. These 'double-taps' are distinct, individual quakes that have not been around since the swarm.

Look at YMR right now: HERE

we just got another series of them...strongest at that station, not the NE corner. When you watch GEE, you can see the individual quakes.

Yes the mine blasts which are very visible on YPK
www.iris.edu...
are just barely visible on B207
www.iris.edu...

reply to post by westcoast


I am not sure - just getting back after several days without power and much to do here to fully reseach - check Page 571, mid way down. We discussed alot of different goings on around that page to these different signals.

It does appear something new is going on.

[edit on 1-3-2010 by Anmarie96]

reply to post by EngTech36


Right. Thank you for that very clear example. The micro quakes are very distinct.

I am not trying to claim the swarm is starting again, only that I see a similarity or pattern emerging. It will be very interesting to see if this continues or drops off.

reply to post by Roald


with other words the 7.0 in japan some earlier could have chili set off.........

reply to post by ressiv
Yes, maybe. Maybe because I do not know, but as I posted in my reply to kennylee , scientists did not think major earthquakes could set off smaller tremors at distant locations until 1992 when they saw that California’s magnitude-7.3 Landers earthquake set off small jolts as far away as Yellowstone National Park.

To investigate further, scientists analyzed 15 earthquakes of magnitude 7 or greater that occurred since 1990. These included the 2004 Indian Ocean earthquake, as well as the 1999 Izmit earthquake in Turkey that killed at least 15,000 and left a half-million homeless.

By studying rumbles in the ground five hours before and five hours after these earthquakes — data gathered from more than 500 research stations worldwide — the researchers found that 12 of these large earthquakes generated surface waves that set off quakes around the planet. For instance, the 2004 Indian Ocean earthquake triggered small earthquakes as far away as Alaska, California and Ecuador.

So Yes, maybe the 7.0 in japan some earlier could have set off the incident in Chile.

[edit on 1/3/2010 by Roald]

reply to post by Roald

I am curious. Why do we worry if the quakes do not move North? I got the impression from Mike and others that we should worry if they do. I am confused.

I see no sign of them moving north yet, but I am keeping a very close watch on that area and Chaiten.

reply to post by Roald

The Yellowstone Volcano Observatory's GPS network has revealed a spreading rate at the park that's even faster.

For it to be 'spreading' faster than the rest of the main body would this not imply lift or tilt? If not then how do you account for this. Do you have any map or other reference you could post (a link to) so we can see what this entails?

[edit on 1/3/2010 by PuterMan]

Roald, I have to agree with you and there is evidence that our atmosphere has thinned and cool making it more dense and contracted. This however would make tide less energetic as the cool atmosphere pushes down.

I almost doubted my own prediction and here we are again. The moon is waning and this is letting the plumbing of Yellowstone to return to a "more normal state". The strong moon cycle is over and the next new moon will be insignificant. I know this seems all ass-backward from my rants about the new moon, but it's part of a cylce, like the stokes with a pump. The first is a primer. Over the last two years, during the perihelion, Yellowstone's crust has been heaving and settleing as the gravitional pull of the moon was at it's maxium. This last full moon is the last of this periodic phenomenon. What scares me is the transiton as the aquifer, and even the chamber settles down. I believe there will be an active resettlement phase and lots of fluid migration. The whole caldera has the odd pop or two.

What do I know? As if I could see what's happening under miles of rock. Jackass. Hell nothing might happen for the next while and things will be quiet like the were for almost a year after the lake swarm. But I don't think so. The moon's been pushing on Yellowstone crust like an paramedic trying to get a man's heart started. It's when you stop you will then see if there's moving internally.

Even a old-school crazy fool like me can see on YMR that there is activity in the area of the most recent swarm, the second largest swarm ever recorded. But the geologists told us this could go on for months. Puterman if you can't make a map just tell me, I'm too obsessive to wait patiently for things. I have tried though. I don't even want to write here. I'm not that adverse to crankiness, I mean I have to live with myself. But I won't have much to say after the moon moves away- the next cycle won't be until the end of 2017.
Shirakawa must be stranded on an island because he would have been all over the Chile quakes and I didn't see him writing there.

Yellowstone is anything but quiet at the moment.

Wanna hear my old coot personae? Gard darn miners blastin' whole mountains. Damn fools. Shakes the whold state! That old mutt of mine jumps up lookin' this way and that way everytime. She's old and miserable after they wake her and won't settle down for a spell. They're blasting away whole mountains and burning em up as fast as they can. They're gonna keep shaking the ground til sumtin wakes up. Kinda like that Beowolf movie I seen. They kept thumping on those tables until they woke up the deformed giant baby. God, it looked like an unborn baby. Unfit to look at really. Ya, those damn mountain rapers are going to blow up the whole state and set off that volcano. Mark my words. They're going wake up that deformed thing livin' under the park. Damn fools. You keep throwing rocks at a hornet's nest and nature's gonna bite you back. Keep blowin' up mountains you damn fools, HEY! You kids get off my lawn.

reply to post by Robin Marks


I really do have to agree with you re the mining.

If an earthquake far away can trigger things, why not a more local mining blast.

Can you point me at a source for the moon cycles? I want to try and compare to the quake record. I have downloaded Yellowstone since the ANSS records begin so I have a good spread.


[edit on 1/3/2010 by PuterMan]

okay i'm living in holland and we have a full moon now in the souith... think its opposite of yellowstone now.. perhaps gives that some disturbance on YMR?