Discrimination against white males will soon be encouraged

Correct, but while "white" (includes North Africans, Egyptians etc) Americans form 60% of the U.S. population, "African-Americans" form 13% of the U.S. population blacks commit 46.9% of crime, while "whites" (I'm assuming this - as with most Bureau of Justice Statistics - defines hispanics as white too) commit 50.9% of homicidal crimes.

And why is it, exactly, that people who love to bring up black crime statistics never acknowledge the fact that blacks are also far more likely percentage-wise to be victims of crime as well?

In fact violent crime correlates far better with economic circumstance than with race, across the board.

Why are bulletin boards full of white people crying about OJ getting away with murdering his wife, while we never hear a peep about Robert Blake getting away with murdering his wife?

Oops, your agenda is showing!

reply to post by poet1b


The white man was the first to drop a nuke on other human beings, and that's pretty low. Plus I'm still not convinced that the white man invented everything. For all I know white men could've of been the first to stumble across lost technologies from the ancient past and claim it as their own.

reply to post by TheInformer



Great post.

reply to post by Teeky


ah, it wasn't the U.S. who dropped the nuke, it was the white man. When it comes to sharing the blame, I guess we are not all Americans. AFter the rape of Nanking, it pretty much levels out. The decision was a great deal more complicated than you seem to be able to understand.

I never said the white man invented everything, we just succeeded in being at the top at the right time technology wise in world history. I think the social institutions were probably the most important part. If you look into the history of western Europe you will see that they were always primarily a equalaterian society. Often times, until the Catholics came along with the devine rights of kings, People of Western Europe only had someone designated as the King during times of war.

reply to post by xmotex


Interesting take on history, but sounds like another wacky theory to me. The signing of the Magna Carta, the translation of the bible into German, invention of the movable press, and something rarely talked about, the development of sailing technology didn't have anything to do with it?

Are you sure that more farmers (serfs) weren't wiped out than skilled tradesmen? I would say that the revolt against the Catholic Church had far more to do with it, that and superior sailing skills of the British and the need of a certain King for a male child.

Western Europe escaped fuedalism, and that was the big key. The Chinese, Japanese, Indians, and Muslims were hopeless trapped by the hierarchial societies they developed. Europeans had not been feudalistic by nature, that was something the catholics had successfully established for several centuries.

You also forgot to mention that Europeans also changed in response to dealing with centuries of Muslim hostility and aggression.

Originally posted by xmotex
And why is it, exactly, that people who love to bring up black crime statistics never acknowledge the fact that blacks are also far more likely percentage-wise to be victims of crime as well?

In fact violent crime correlates far better with economic circumstance than with race, across the board.

Why are bulletin boards full of white people crying about OJ getting away with murdering his wife, while we never hear a peep about Robert Blake getting away with murdering his wife?

Oops, your agenda is showing!

First I never personally said anything; however, I going to spell this out for you just in case you don't quite understand.

60% of the population involved in 50.9% would equate into below normal

13% of the population involved in 46.9% would equate into very abnormal.

Now let's address the rest of the first thing I said. If 50.9% is committed by 60% of the population, whom do you suppose committed the other 49.1%? The 13%?

More crypto-Nazi talking points

Look, what's so hard to wrap your head around?

Crime problems in black communities tend to be more serious because black communities tend to have more poverty - more poverty == more crime, be the community black, white, or whatever.

Blacks are more likely to be perpetrators of crime, they are also more likely to be victims of crime, because they are more likely to be poor.

Most crimes committed by blacks are also committed against blacks - feel free to look it up.

It's very simple, but some folks with a not-so-hidden agenda want us to see only half the picture.

I wonder why?

reply to post by poet1b

Western Europe escaped fuedalism, and that was the big key.

Yes - and only after the Plague wiped out half the population.

Until that, European society was the epitome of feudalism...

Wow...sometimes one wonders if their own perception of the world is colored by prejudice.

And sometimes the evidence is overwhelming. Like here, now. The tension is increasing. No doubt about it.

reply to post by xmotex


So basically what your telling me is that because they are poor, they do not understand the difference between right and wrong? Or is it that because they are poor they lack ethics? I am having a hard time understanding this, perhaps you could elaborate some and explain how being poor causes you to not understand right from wrong or how it affects your ethics? Sounds to me like more excuses being made to try to explain poor choices and decisions. I could be completely wrong; however, I always believed that if you keep making excuses for anyone with a problem; drugs, alcohol, criminals...etc, that you were in fact doing them a disservice by condoning and insinuating that they are somehow not responsible for the decisions they make in life. Can you please explain to me how excusing their behavior with poverty is going to help them, their victims, or anyone else for that matter?

I am a white woman that grew up in a hispanic neighborhood, I was teased about the color of my skin for many years. I thought that there was something wrong with me. It wasn't until I moved out of that area and grew up to realize there was nothing wrong with me or the color of my skin. This is a prime example of reverse racism. When you are just a little kid and people make you feel different or that you are bad for who you are there is no difference where the racism comes from. This has made me a more sympathetic person for people of color because I have experienced racism...I decided not to allow it to shadow my outlook but to understand how it can affect people.

Originally posted by DarrylGalasso Can you please explain to me how excusing their behavior with poverty is going to help them, their victims, or anyone else for that matter?

But let us realize, it is not all about "poverty". I dare ANYONE to point out a middle class neighborhood comprised of a certain ethnicity that does NOT have a much higher than average crime rate.

Oh wait...so when the "poverty" excuse doesn't fit, then we move on the "cultural remains of racism" effect.

Because it is always the same, and it never ends. But the excuses never end either. Trends come and go, but the racism excuse lasts forever!

reply to post by DarrylGalasso


Apparently, you've never been poor

Poverty increases desperation, and desperation increases one's likelihood of seeing crime as a way to make some money.

Factor in other poverty-related social pathologies like alcoholism and drug addiction, as well as the moneymaking opportunities offered by drug prohibition, and you've got a recipe for lots of crime, regardless of race.

I am having trouble pinpointing your argument - is it that blacks are somehow inherently less moral than whites? Less intelligent and capable?

Stop tip-toeing through the tulips and just come out and say it already

Why do you think crime rates are higher among blacks, since you seem so concerned about it?


[edit on 12/15/08 by xmotex]

Originally posted by xmotex
reply to post by DarrylGalasso

 

Apparently, you've never been poor

Poverty increases desperation, and desperation increases one's likelihood of seeing crime as a way to make some money.

Factor in other poverty-related social pathologies like alcoholism and drug addiction, as well as the moneymaking opportunities offered by drug prohibition, and you've got a recipe for lots of crime, regardless of race.

I am having trouble pinpointing your argument - is it that blacks are somehow inherently less moral than whites? Less intelligent and capable?

Stop tip-toeing through the tulips and just come out and say it already

Why do you think crime rates are higher among blacks, since you seem so concerned about it?


[edit on 12/15/08 by xmotex]

Surely you are a fool to even insinuate that was what I was thinking when you yourself was the one who used poverty as the excuse, I did not stipulate any color with poverty as it is an equal opportunity condition; however, you seem to imply that I am racist because of responding to YOUR statements. Well first allow me to inform you that I am not white, nor black and if you think the Italian community did not live in impoverished neighborhoods during the great immigration period, then you are not very bright at all. I was raised by two immigrant parents and I assure you I know exactly what it is like to want for stuff. Fortunately for me, my parents did not set the example that poverty was an acceptable accuse for one's behaviors. I was held accountable for everything I did growing up and in turn this taught me to hold myself accountable as an adult.

All I asked you for was to explain your statements so they made some logical sense, obviously that was too difficult of a request.

As for your last question, I explain it very simply, lack of accountability, plain and simple. Lack of accountability by their families, communities and ESPECIALLY the liberal folks that tried to make excuses for their behavior thus telling them it was alright to continue to behave in this manner. You can take that as racist, honest, stupid, or which ever way you choose to receive it.

As far as your statements go about alcohol, drugs...etc. If you knew what I did for a living, you would certainly understand that I have these people sent to me EVERY SINGLE DAY by the courts to be helped, and if there is one thing I can assure you it is this, when there is no admittance of the problem and one has no motivation for change, change cannot occur. I can not tell you how many times I have contacted a Judge to inform them that I cannot help an individual because they refuse help and do not acknowledge they have a problem. I am not a miracle worker and I would much rather spend my time and efforts helping people that truly want to be helped, the time I waste with people who do not want help is time that could actually be spent to benefit society.

I am not anti-anybody other than anti-predators.

But, you justify the actions of criminals anyway you choose, you are not hurting me in any way shape or fashion, my life is relatively comfortable, I earned my degree and pulled myself out of poverty, without hurting anyone in the process. The only people you are hurting are those you are trying to protect by excusing devious behavior, so please continue the good fight. You can keep the very people you would appear to care about underprivileged for another 50 or so years, as I said, I do not care. You want to help someone you tell them the truth, it may hurt them, but living in the lie will only increase and prolong their suffering.

If you need an example of this, you need to look no further than the present state of economics in this country and how it was told to you for the last 15 months that it was not a recession and everything would be just fine, eventually, the lie can be concealed no longer, and at that point the damage has already been exaggerated tenfold.

Open your eyes man, I am not trying to hurt you, I am trying to help you. One cannot address any problem so long as they believe it does not exist.

White males are getting a bad rap because they have been (mostly) in charge of this country/corporations - and we now have a "mess". It's who the masses see in the wall street pics - running the auto/oil industry - in political office. The old boy network.
People want to see this "group" evolve out of greed.

Fortunately there are many evolved, conscious, loving, intelligent white men out there. White men that the masses are not privy to.
They are healers and amazing fathers - and quiet white giants
(and these "kinds" of men and women come in all colors) .

The planet is looking for the opposite of what we have/see at the moment.
We have to make someone the bad guy.
We do it with everything.
We are a culture that prides itself on competition and separation.
Someday we will learn that this does not work.

reply to post by Sonya610


You may be right, I honestly do not know, nor do I concern myself much with those type of issues. I do not hate any race of people, I believe that every segment of society has a potential contribution to make to the society as a whole. If they are underachieving or devious behavior is common in one group or another, I believe it to be the fault of those of influence in their lives for not taking the appropriate responsibility to correct devious behavior and teach them the appropriate social skills to fit into society. I have seen many folks of many backgrounds with the same problem.

I do however have a problem with someone using excuses to relieve those people of their responsibility for their own actions.

reply to post by spinkyboo


That was a very well written post. And you are in fact quite correct about everything and especially the competition aspect of society. Social Darwinism although vehemently denied in our culture, is in fact the driving force behind our culture and can only end in one scenario, hate, distrust, and social unrest. Not only is Social Darwinism prevalent, it is integrated in it's purest form, simple competition. If you asked a professor to define Social Darwinism, they would probably relate it to something like Hitler's idea for the survival of the fittest race, when in fact, it is completely about competition. Darwin used this to explain how evolution worked and what drove evolution which he believed to in fact be competition between everything right down to the cellular level and that was what drove the genetic mutations that fueled evolution.

Great post and a star for you.

reply to post by DarrylGalasso


You seem to be confusing the concepts "explanation" and "excuse".

They're two different things

And BTW, have no doubt the crime rates among poor Italian, Irish and other immigrant groups were far higher than among middle-class whites a hundred years ago.

In fact the story back then was WASPS complaining about these "dirty immigrants" coming to the US and causing lots of crime

Some things never change...

BTW, I'm more than 50% Irish by descent, so don't take that as some kind of insult

As far as responsibility and accountability go, these apply to individuals, not races or ethnicities - or are all Italian Americans somehow "responsible" for the crimes of the Gambino family, etc?

As far as "liberal" goes, I don't subscribe to any variety of ideological snake oil. "Liberalism" and "conservatism" are both equally idiotic distortions of reality IMO.

I'm interesting in facing reality, not subscribing to some politician's line of nonsensical BS...



[edit on 12/15/08 by xmotex]

reply to post by ofhumandescent


I just had to say, great post.

Star for you.

reply to post by xmotex


Honestly, I believe the crimes of the families are in fact the responsibility of the entire community where they were raised. Let me define that a little better, the neighborhood where they were raised. Because of the entire neighborhood turning their heads and doing nothing allowed those criminals to flourish.

And I took no exception to your comment, in fact I agree that my background had a troubled past (note the word past here). Somewhere along the line, there has to come a realization to the problem and the appropriate corrections made. I am sure you realize the problems with the Irish communities back in the same time frame as the Italians you mentioned, do you think they overcame this through denial of a problem, or blaming that problem on the white majority in this country? Perhaps one day all groups will realize that they have problems and take the steps necessary to help their own people out of a life of depression, but until one faces the truth as I said before, change can not come about.

And also as I said before, I am not here to try to hurt you or fight with you, only to help. The problem simply cannot be addressed until it is realized and confronted.


[edit on 12/15/2008 by DarrylGalasso]