If aliens exist they are of no consequence to you!

Maybe we are here as a resource for the aliens, or as a resource collector. Anyone play any RTS games? How do you collect resources? You have a resource collector of some kind. You place that collector on near the resources, and let it do its job of bringing you resources.

If I were an advanced being with knowledge of DNA and complete freedom of traveling the galaxies, what would I do to collect resources? I would plant resource collectors on planets full of resources. Why not use robots, one may ask? Because they require maintenance. Too costly and too much supervision.

Maybe just mix up some DNA to create a being that can survive on said planet and give it the drive to collect the needed resource. What is the resource? I don't know, but we collect huge masses of metals, then we crush these items up after use and put them in stockpiles. They could easily find massive amounts of metals in scrapyards, these aliens. Or maybe it is gold, or CO2 emmissions.

I don't actually believe my theory, I'm just throwing it out there as my train of thought. We could merely be slaves to an alien race, collecting their resources for them. They will be back one day to get what they need. Then probably zap us back into the dark ages, to only start again and thousands of years later, no one will no any better.

this is a good point but we have to look at the probabilities of an alien race that is at a stage of NEEDING mass resources that hasn't already found easily renewable resources for traversing deep space.

most alien races are going to fall into the mediocre category of existence. they will be moderately intelligent and live on planets circling moderate sized stars. if an alien race even acheived space travel it would be VERY likely that they are similar to us. capable of space travel but more concerned with war and the economy to do such a thing. otherwise their home planet could easily be stuck in a cycle of period destruction such as our own is and is not capable of ahceiving self sustaining deep space travel. statistically speaking the chances of an alien race that is stuck in a moderate phase of space travel would be very unlikely to be near earth.

secondly, even if that scenario were true it would be unlikely that they would sustain human life for thousands of years. surely they could get the resources they need quicker than that and then move on. hence, they won't matter to you in any practical sense. if they're still around it could affect us but at our stage in evolution it would be just as beneficial as harmful.

reply to post by Mozzy


Absurd.
Would humans have a 'home base' in an ant hill?

Possibly aliens simply aren't very interested in us yet, as we are not even a type 1 civilization yet. Also, evolution would most likely cause them to be more protective of their lives, as the goal of evolution is to sustain life. Given this, their brains are probably so fearful of giving us any advantage. They would be more likely to keep our chances of killing them at 0% rather than even letting it escalate to 0.0001% by showing themselves.

reply to post by TruthParadox


what does the anthill have to do with anything i don't get it?

secondly, you're probably the same type of person that believes in crop circles and flashing lights in the sky. would those be the same aliens tha twouldn't want us to know they're here?

Originally posted by Mozzy
what does the anthill have to do with anything i don't get it?

We have the ability to conquer ants, but we wouldn't establish a home base in an ant hill. If they're as powerful as people say, then they wouldn't have to establish anything or plot for thousands of years at all. Perhaps they're only after knowledge.

Originally posted by Mozzy
secondly, you're probably the same type of person that believes in crop circles and flashing lights in the sky. would those be the same aliens tha twouldn't want us to know they're here?

I don't believe in that. It's not that they wouldn't want us to know that they're here, it's that they wouldn't show their face unless they have the advantage. I'm sure you have no problem if a bear knows that humans exist, but you probably won't go into a bear cave. A species that's evolved longer than us would have an even greater fear of the unknown. They would seek knowledge to gain the advantage.

well that's a reasonable assumption but it's just as reasonable to assume that they're very capable defensivley and have no need to fear us. or a myriad other answers to that question.

but more over, my point was that if these aliens orginated from earth we surely would see some type of hard evidence, we don't.

if they came from elsewhere then the chances that they are near us on the evolutionary ladder is very very very very rare. hence no need to hide.

Just visiting this site...

Anyhow, my opinion is that if aliens indeed are coming to Earth, they're non-hostile. Why? If you have the technology for interstellar travel, it's going to be a trivial matter to push a large rock from the asteroid belt into the Earth's orbit and finish things for humanity with the least amount of effort. Since they haven't already done so, then they're not all that hostile.

So what would account for their being here? I like to think of it as a scientific survey and a biological assessment of flora and fauna on life bearing worlds. That is, they come here for the same reason that people go on safari jaunts or whale watching. It's just an innate curiosity by living things in regards to other living things.

So, what would account for so called cases of abduction phenomena? Think about it in regards to what our biologists do to higher order animals when monitoring them and their role in the environment. I'm sure anyone who's watched a wildlife show has seen one tag and release program or another being instituted. This is done to monitor the health of a given animal population in comparison to its role in an environment. Now imagine how traumatic it probably is for the animals on the recieving end that don't know what the heck is going on. Do you think human actions in such cases would be regarded as aggressive and hostile? I'm sure it does look that way to the animals. (None of them seem to enjoy it much.) So from my perspective, an account of alien abduction phenomena by another human would be exactly like being on the recieving end of a tag and release program. (Tissue samples taken, vital signs measured, a quick assement of reproductive and general health, and some tag or marking placed on a person in a tamper-proof manner for use in future surveys.)

So I would regard them as mostly harmless... For now. But once humanity finally figures out how to foray into space in a significant way, then our interactions with aliens will take on more significance and be of a more serious nature. (And this is simply because we would then have the potential to seriously affect their environment. And I'm sure we'd do no less, provided the roles are reversed.)

Originally posted by Mozzy
well that's a reasonable assumption but it's just as reasonable to assume that they're very capable defensivley and have no need to fear us. or a myriad other answers to that question.

That's logical, isn't it. But it would also be logical that humans have no fear of spiders, yet many do. We should have no fear of angry dogs, but many do. We should have no fear of non poisonous snakes, but many do.
I believe that if aliens do exist (which they probably do), then they may know that it's illogical to fear us, yet they would still not wish to show their faces. We fear what we do not know which is why humans fear the dark. They probably would have overcome this problem through evolution, and it's likely that they can see in the light and dark. But they still do not have complete knowledge, which would explain abductions.

Originally posted by Mozzy
but more over, my point was that if these aliens orginated from earth we surely would see some type of hard evidence, we don't.

Which is why they didn't originate from earth .

Originally posted by Mozzy
if they came from elsewhere then the chances that they are near us on the evolutionary ladder is very very very very rare. hence no need to hide.

We are no where near spiders, yet how many people fear spiders? And even that is a poor comparison, because the part of our brain that breeds fear would have evolved in aliens. In otherwords, we may be ok with subjecting ourselves to something that has a 0.01% chance of killing us (such as sky diving, for example, though I'm not sure of the odds), yet aliens wouldn't even be willing to subject themselves to something that had a 0.000001% chance of killing them. It is also doubtful that they would seek our land or to rule over us. Would we wish to take over an ant hill and command them? However they do seek knowledge of the universe and to understand it and thus lessen their fears - and we are a part of that universe.

your argument doesn't work because there are lots of people that do show themselves to spiders and dogs. and there are lots of people that got over their fear of spiders and dogs and now show themselves to them.

your argument is trying to base the whole idea on whether or not aliens would show themselves to us. i'm backing up further than that and saying that it's extremely unlikely that any extraterrestrial has ever been here and if they have been here then they have mastered interstellar flight.

i don't think it matters whether or not they would show themselves to us.

Originally posted by Mozzy
your argument doesn't work because there are lots of people that do show themselves to spiders and dogs. and there are lots of people that got over their fear of spiders and dogs and now show themselves to them.

Because we learn to overcome that part of our brain which tells us there is a slight danger. Aliens would have evolved far past our stage, and their fear of the unknown could be many times more powerful than ours. You aren't listening to what I'm saying. Even so, the argument isn't that aliens don't show themselves, because there are reports of people saying they do, the argument is that they would not show themselves unless they have the complete advantage. For example, comming down on an entire city of people is a less controlled environment, and there's no way such a being would do this. However, going to a remote area of the world with a sparse population and picking out one house with one person in that house would be much more controlled. This is how they would choose to learn about us, and this is what we see. I do believe that many abductions can be explained away by SP, but not all of them.

Originally posted by Mozzy
your argument is trying to base the whole idea on whether or not aliens would show themselves to us. i'm backing up further than that and saying that it's extremely unlikely that any extraterrestrial has ever been here and if they have been here then they have mastered interstellar flight.

They could have mastered everything, but they still are not omniscient. They seek knowledge.

Originally posted by Mozzy
i don't think it matters whether or not they would show themselves to us.

I think it does, because one of the main arguments against aliens is the fact that they don't directly show themselves to large groups of humans. I think that though this could be seen as suspicious, it also just happens to go in line with how their psychology would most likely be.

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
...Anyhow, my opinion is that if aliens indeed are coming to Earth, they're non-hostile. Why? If you have the technology for interstellar travel, it's going to be a trivial matter to push a large rock from the asteroid belt into the Earth's orbit and finish things for humanity with the least amount of effort. Since they haven't already done so, then they're not all that hostile...

This is assuming that we have nothing of value on this planet. If they are in need of something of value on our planet, why would they destroy the whole thing? Maybe they see our planet fit for life for them. Maybe they are after our water. If they destroy the planet by way of a huge rock, then they lose everything.

anonymous is right, if capable of deep space travel there would be no need to suck the resources from our planet. asteriods alone would suffice for all the gold diamond water you'd ever need.

and yes they could easily wipe us out as you mentioned. that totally agrees with what i'm saying.

reply to post by Mozzy


If aliens exist certainly this is a concern of ours. Its a BIG TIME concern.

Lets think about the following example:

We have the ancient territory of Germany on the map, and we have the ancient territory of Russia in the same map. Today we know how happy would the Germans be if Russia was far far away, Russians could feel the same way. This is only an example!

Lets take the ancient Germany and project the earth map on the night sky. The territory is covering many different star systems probably. Lets take just the systems which are only inside an imaginary sphere with a radius of only 50 light years with the earth as the center of this sphere.
Ever tried to count how many star systems are inside the distance of only 50 light years from our Sun?
Lets say that Earth is an ancient Germanic village, very close to the borders with what would be the Russian territory in some hundred years.

What I paralleled above is from a part of our own human history. I took only a couple of countries from the hundreds we currently have to show this.

If we exist, also others do exist.
If we deal with politics, so do others.
If we are in the same ocean of space, someday, somehow, they will or we will find them.

Maybe that has already happened.

Humans are still here, strong, still eager to produce, still strong to fight, still curious about what lays beyond their sight, still very decisive and about to push forward.

If we think aliens are not of our concern, certainly aliens could feel differently, we could be of concern to THEM.

Apparently we are still stuck in the same situation.

When you are an island in an ocean and you share it with other islands, sooner or later thinks happen. They have to happen.

[edit on 4-12-2008 by spacebot]

reply to post by AHostileMe


Then they could release chemicals over our planet which would kill us and leave everything else intact. I don't see why they would find anything valuable on this planet except for knowledge of a Universe which we share.

reply to post by spacebot


everything you are saying coudl be true. but why would that matter to us? what would we do about such a war between galactic enemies? nothing.

For starters we know nothing. Or we chose to not learn.
Maybe we are the enemy. Maybe we are a weapon to the hands of another enemy. Maybe we are the saviors in some situations against an enemy.

Ignorance in such a situation could mean, inactivity. Inactivity could mean lost chances, lost time. Our global economy, is failing.A global peace was never achieved. A global religion, was never possible. Only thing that lays ahead is enslavement but not if we find a way to escape from our planet. All problems can be solved, or just disappear. We have to know what lays out there before we make choices. Maybe whoever has decided that our only way to survive is through enslavement DOES NOT WANT US TO KNOW whats out there, simply because they DO NOT WANT US there, since they wouldn't be able to control us there.

[edit on 4-12-2008 by spacebot]

i've heard the "humans are POWs" theory before and there's just not even an inkling of a reason why anyone should believe that. if we are involved with aliens are role has been defined for us.

There is not only one country on this planet. There is not even one kind of faction.
Why should be different elsewhere where even the authoritative force of nature could demand different needs for each race, different ways of thinking and of achieving goals.
Where there is diversity there exists the realm of opportunity, but also exists the realm of struggle.
You must use proxies as a means to an end if a goal you want to achieve is greater than your combined abilities. Means to an end could be other races that posses abilities you don't have and even at the same time the same races do not posses other much needed abilities but the situation about your levels of progress contrary to theirs would make a direct cooperation impossible.

yet there's plenty of evidence of said countries and factions. there isn't one shred of evidence about any galactic council or our need to join it.

however, even if there is. how is it consequential to us? they obviously face the same problems we do "if indeed they exist" so it would pretty much be the situation.

I do not like think with preconceived models of a supposed order out there delivered to us by "channelers". Yes there is no shred of evidence there, at least of what I and you wish to discuss here. On the other hand evidence would not be readily available anywhere unless we took great pains to find it. There would be good reasons why evidence could be hidden. Everything changes, what could be considered a good time for something to happen at one instance could be a bad time for the same thing to happen later on, when the opportunity is missed by certain circumstances.

Let me dig something out for you. There are clues everywhere, clues that lead to evidence. The very alphabet we use right now could be a clue by itself. Let me dig something out for you. At least this will help me decide if you are the kind of person that just asks for prepared food and have no willingness to cook for your own.

Part of it is in my signature, the first link.
Take some time to read it.

[edit on 4-12-2008 by spacebot]