Why do women break up with nice guys?

reply to post by riley

Again. I have not been attacking him so there is nothing to "weasel" out of.

Really?

Let's see about that, shall we?

We have already established that it is indeed whining.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

That seems like a pretty underhanded insult to me, actually.

Oh, and THIS...

I believe the problem is you are finnally starting to realize just how creepy you sound.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

That was a Keeper.

But anyways... on with the Show.

I have been answering his arguments which heA put forth and I have been sticking to the actual TOPIC despite BOTH OF YOU trying to derail it back to women bashing.

Ah, misdirection....

Here is ANOUTHER example of what "Nice Guys" have to put up with. People using strawman arguments to attempt to twist their words and paint them as the Bad Guy.

All because they want to stay in power.

Please, Show me where I was bashing women... and for the Love of Posterity, Try not to Quote me out of Context, would ya?

"Nice guys" have to deal with this kind of stuff all of the time, The constant ridicule, and THEN their Attackers paint themselves out to be the Victims.

IT is quite Transparent, their plans, I mean.

So... in this idiom, I release Truth to foil their plans, and bring the world back to the balance that Everyone RIGHTLY deserves... without Those in positions of Faux authority belittling and attacking for their own jollies.

A reminder. The topic is about why "nice guys" get dumped:

I know... I have been trying to explain that for several dozen pages now.. and you are helping me out a GREAT DEAL.

So, Much Thanks!

I'm wondering what is it you will not allow Edrick?
How exactly are you going to enforce this ruling of yours..?

Oh, a Magician never reveals his secrets... don' t you know that?

LOL!

Thanks for Caring enough to respond to my posts...!

I wish you a blessed moment of Enlightenment that I predict will be yours very soon!

God Bless!

[snip]

-Edrick

How mods is my post off topic when I'm just saying that I'm not coming back? Its really trivial.

So I'l say it again. I'm not coming back. To this thread. If you delete THIS as being off topic I just won't say it again.

reply to post by Edrick


You quoted my post as being part of an attempt to gang up on TQS, thereby insinuating I was one of the culprits and he was one of the "nice guys" I was raving on about...that's how you identified him, as one of the "nice guys", and as long as you think I'm part of TPTB there is really no point in trying to reason with you, is there?

You said I'm susceptible to TPTB and am not consciously aware of it...I guess that would be the equivalent of me saying you are delusional about the world being against you and don't realise it because you're delusional...

In any case, I think that's straying away from the original topic.

I agree with you though that there are many people out there willing to take advantage of kindness, because I have met them, and in cases where the male/female relationship has nothing to do with it. There's more than one way to deal with that sort of thing though, without taking the whole world at ransom. Do you see justice when you hear a story about a bullied kid shooting up half the school, taking with him not only his tormentors but those innocent to his personal suffering? How about "nice guys" being bitter at the world after getting rejected by a few people?

If you really do feel the world is set against you, not sure what I or anyone else can do to help you? Any point of view that diverges from yours will have no doubt been influenced by TPTB.

It seems namine wasn't targetting me. so we can just leave it at that.

so I have to leave this thread. I know why some who post regularly on this thread are here for, and I cannot be bothered to reason with them or even explain myself. They have their agendas as far as I can see.

and Edrick, it's alright man don't bother yourself trying to defend me, though I appreciate it. These people will just never get it.

and also, we are just arguing over trivial things it seems. It's not like much can be much done about these issues but to be our own person.

Perhaps we are just different, and that's why it's been hard to find someone like us who can understand. Anyone who's deep into the 'alternative thought' paradigms would most definitely find it harder to find someone in a society steeped in ignorance. It is just discouraging though sometimes. Just a bit disheartening. Especially when you're caught up in the thick of the bad part of it. Pain is pain, we have our reactions to suffering just like the body feels pain when we are struck by something.

reply to post by namine

You quoted my post as being part of an attempt to gang up on TQS, thereby insinuating I was one of the culprits and he was one of the "nice guys" I was raving on about...

No, I did not insinuate that TQS was a nice guy, however, you are correct otherwise.

I saw you as attacking.

that's how you identified him, as one of the "nice guys"

No, I identified him as someone whose was under attack because of his perspective.

and as long as you think I'm part of TPTB there is really no point in trying to reason with you, is there?

Like I said before, You may be just doing it Subconciously.

They are VERY sneaky in their Mass media manipulations.

I have seen people Attack others for no other reason than they saw something similar on television.

And this is one of the problems.

People seem to emulate the behavior that the mass media GIVES them, and it ends up turning us against each-other.

I am merely trying to counter this plan in my own particular idiom.

You said I'm susceptible to TPTB and am not consciously aware of it...

Oh, come now... You have been on Above top Secret for long enough......

Wait... You have only been here about a month or two...

Haven't you ever come face to face with one of the LIES of the mass media?

Honestly? No, seriously, I would like your answer to this question.

Do you trust the mass media about everything? (Not likley) or have you seen through the manipulations?

This is what I am talking about... the mass media is COMPLETELY full of lies, in ALL ASPECTS and on ALL LEVELS.

Some levels and aspects are just a little harder to uncover because they are linked to Core Instincts, as opposed to the normal Cultural and political Flotsam.

In any case, I think that's straying away from the original topic.

I'm just trying to express my perspective on why "Nice Guys" have such a hard time in the Dating sphere, and how that connects to the larger Scheme of TPTB.

Honestly, I don't see what the big deal is in me expressing what I know.

I mean, Disagree with me... that's fine... Don't label me, shove me in a box, stamp me, process me, and judge me.

Just listen, form an opinion, respond, whatever.


I am actually VERY CIVIL, and Respectable to others... so long as they are not being MEAN.

I loath when the HAVES gang up on the HAVE NOT's, be that in Financial, Political, or Sexual spheres.


I mean, Look... We don't insult the poor as being "Losers", we don't Label the Politically Underprivileged as "Whiners" because they complain about not being represented...

and yet... Those who lack relationship experience are automatically shoved into the "Loser" box, and sent packing into the cold wasteland of "Not Good Enough"

And frankly, I will not stand for it.

I agree with you though that there are many people out there willing to take advantage of kindness, because I have met them, and in cases where the male/female relationship has nothing to do with it.

Yes, there are...

But there are ALSO those who are willing to take advantage of kindness where the male/female relatiohship is concerned.

As it seems in this thread, most would choose to believe that this is never the case.

IT is a form of entitlement.

There's more than one way to deal with that sort of thing though, without taking the whole world at ransom.

Yeah... there is.

But it is so much more fun and challenging to take on the Whole world at once... I just can't be bothered to oppose anything less.

Do you see justice when you hear a story about a bullied kid shooting up half the school, taking with him not only his tormentors but those innocent to his personal suffering?

Justice?

No... Vengeance is more like it.

Some people seem to think that their Cruel and inhuman actions have no consequences... and they would be wrong.

And some people, get SO down, So angry, SO FRUSTRATED, and SO ALONE, that they think the only way out is to lock and Load, and take down as many of their tormentors as possible.

Now, I don't condone that sort of thing.

But I *DO* understand it.

And honestly, it is not their fault... they were forced into a situation not of their own making, Detrimental to their Mental health, and emotional Well being..

No-one deserves that.

No-one deserves to be SHOT for bullying on that scale... I will agree... but there is no Justice in these situations, and there never WAS.

They are taking the only way out that they can see.... their minds and wills broken beyond repair, all for the want of a little human kindness, that they are systematically denied, because others want *ALL* of the warmth, and do not know when to stop the pressure, and attacks.

How about "nice guys" being bitter at the world after getting rejected by a few people?

Watch this Video... It might help you to understand My Perspective.... try to keep an open mind, because THIS TOPIC (about "Nice Guys") explains MORE about the problems in this world than you know:

If you really do feel the world is set against you, not sure what I or anyone else can do to help you?

Protect the Weak from the Predations of the Strong.

That is All.

Any point of view that diverges from yours will have no doubt been influenced by TPTB.

No, that is not true at all.

KilgoreTrout expressed a VERY interesting point of view a few pages back (about playboy being a tool of mass psychological programming) that I didn't already include in my perspective.

She expressed her perspective on the matter, it "Clicked" with mine, and so I added it to my own perspective, because it logically fit with what I See of the world.


As I said, I USED to be a Nice guy... I never went after the women, so the whole point of the matter of relationships never really applied to me... but the UNJUST ATTACKS against those who are kind DOES make me VERY ANGRY, because it reminds me of what happened to ME for the very same reason.

This is a HUGE problem in the western world, and America in particular... and it is something that I cannot abide.

No-One should be Singled out for Attack just because they are Nice or Kind.

And calling them "Self-Centered" or the like is just going WAY to far over the line.

Honestly... I shouldn't even have to say this.


Do you feel me now?

-Edrick

reply to post by The Quiet Storm

and Edrick, it's alright man don't bother yourself trying to defend me, though I appreciate it.

You are welcome.

But honestly, this is about a Damaged Perspective that must be Repaired.

These people will just never get it.

I have only one Reply:




-Edrick

reply to post by Edrick


I was not attacking TQS. My gripe was with the self-centered “nice guys” who think they’re better than what they call the “average sheeple” and think that the world, or particularly women in this case, owes them something. If people can see those traits within themselves, then that’s on them, if not, then well they’d have no reason to be offended. It has to be said TQS wasn’t exactly respectful throughout his posts, particularly the older ones, and any criticism he received was probably in return for the criticism he dished out. For what it’s worth I think TQS is genuinely a nice guy, albeit frustrated, which is understandable, but still no excuse to demonize all women and men who happen to be successful with women.

To answer your question, no, I don’t wholly trust the mass media, but then I tend to be skeptical about everything, even every day people, which is probably how I landed up at a site like this hehe. I joined recently but in truth I’ve been stalking ATS on and off for at least a year, and even as a member I don’t post often. It’s funny because when I started visiting this place I was very easily convinced by the theories presented, then I watched as mysteries were explained away, videos were debunked, hoaxers were ousted etc etc in short, over time, this community where I came to do research on conspiracies and such topics you can’t openly discuss “out there” has made me more of a skeptic than a believer. The irony, ay? I do find some conspiracies entertaining to say the least, but I don’t let them infiltrate my world view any more, not without good reason…wouldn't want to lose touch with reality.

I do get your point about the HAVES derailing the HAVE NOTs, hey both population have messed up people, some HAVES are mean to HAVE NOTs for the heck of it, but some HAVE NOTs like to have a go at HAVES, too, whether or not they’re deserving of it, it seems. Yeah, most people won’t take that lying down. I am civil and respectable as well. I’d like to think most people are only mean when given a reason to be. Not saying you don’t get your Out-And-Out Jerks, you certainly do! I was bullied quite often as a kid, too, you know. I know how it feels.

I humored you and saw the video, not the first time I seen a video on the subject matter either. Well…it’s interesting. It does leave me with questions. I’m not convinced though, I can tell you why if you really want to know, but that would be deviating from the topic of this thread. U2U me or something.

Thinking you're special from everyone else, so special in fact that the most powerful organization in the world goes out of their way just to prevent you from reproducing, seems like a hell of stretch to me, and a self-centered way of looking at the world. If they are all that powerful and wanted to stop you, they could easily have you assassinated (kinda like ‘jackals’ from the vid) , and what’s to stop them from keeping it covered up? You’re hardly an “important” person like their usual targets. These perpetrators seem to be able to get away with anything anyway.

If you're really a nice guy, I'm rooting for you.

I expected more from a Moderator.

Oh, and By the Way... isn't your Avatar that REALLY EVIL, and Deceptive character who worships death and power, and is sort of a "Racial Purist" from the Harry Potter Series?

Yes, so either I'm a racist and evil, or I could simply be a fan of the films, anticipating the next installment...., and you are using a cartoon bunny...I fail to see the relevance.

As for pornography, it's a rather subjective subject. What is porn to one, is not necessarily porn to another...so you can't rely on a dictionary to define that which is subjective.

reply to post by namine

I was not attacking TQS. My gripe was with the self-centered “nice guys” who think they’re better than what they call the “average sheeple” and think that the world, or particularly women in this case, owes them something.

And what would you believe makes "Nice" guys, Self Centered? (I was talking about this perspective before)

Isn't that a contradiction in terms?

Here, let me spell this out.

Women "Reject" nice guys, because they are NOT self-obsessed, lying psychopaths.

Bad boys, it seems, really do get all the girls. Women might claim they want caring, thoughtful types but scientists have discovered what they really want – self-obsessed, lying psychopaths.

A study has found that men with the "dark triad" of traits – narcissism, thrill- seeking and deceitfulness – are likely to have a larger number of sexual affairs.

www.independent.co.uk...

So, that means that these "Nice guys", lack the traits of self-obsession, deceitfulness, and psychopathy.

And yet, women attempt to JUSTIFY their attraction to these "Users and Abusers", by painting "Nice Guys" *AS* the bad guys.... when they are anything BUT.

This is the problem I am having.

What we have here, is an attempt to Turn the definition of words on their heads, to satisfy the EGO of spoiled princesses (No offense), and Psychopathic Deceivers. (Much offense)

If people can see those traits within themselves, then that’s on them, if not, then well they’d have no reason to be offended.

Once again, You do not get to DEFINE what "Nice Guy" means... Nice means Nice, it doesn't mean Psychopathic, Deceptive, or Narcissistic.

Nice means Nice, it always HAS, and it ALWAYS WILL.

But women live for the opinions of others, they NEED people to think of them as a "Good Girl" who only goes after "Nice Guys", while they go after Psychopaths.... so, they attempt to Turn the world UPSIDE DOWN, making Evil into Good, Making Nice into Mean.

These are not what the words mean..... and If you are going after the "Bad Boys", then you are *NOT* a Good Girl.

And that is just how REALITY works.

It has to be said TQS wasn’t exactly respectful throughout his posts, particularly the older ones, and any criticism he received was probably in return for the criticism he dished out.

In the past 2 sentences, you have slandered men who are NICE, in an attempt to get the world to agree with YOUR definition of "Nice", instead of the one that is TRUE.

Calling someone what they are not, is slander... didn't you know that?

Once again, you are trying to deflect all criticism away from these Psychopaths.

For what it’s worth I think TQS is genuinely a nice guy, albeit frustrated, which is understandable, but still no excuse to demonize all women and men who happen to be successful with women.

Excuse me.... the past dozen or so pages has been an attempt TO DEMONIZE NICE GUYS.

To answer your question, no, I don’t wholly trust the mass media

Good... because THIS THREAD is another instance where the mass media is lying to you.

"Nice guys" are *NICE*

"Bad Boys" are *BAD*

Words mean, what they MEAN; not what makes people feel good about themselves.

I do get your point about the HAVES derailing the HAVE NOTs, hey both population have messed up people, some HAVES are mean to HAVE NOTs for the heck of it, but some HAVE NOTs like to have a go at HAVES, too, whether or not they’re deserving of it, it seems.

You are defending Tyrants.

Yeah, most people won’t take that lying down. I am civil and respectable as well.

Except when people Refute made up definitions of words that the populous wraps themselves in like cozy blankets.

I humored you and saw the video, not the first time I seen a video on the subject matter either. Well…it’s interesting. It does leave me with questions. I’m not convinced though, I can tell you why if you really want to know, but that would be deviating from the topic of this thread. U2U me or something.

Ok.

Thinking you're special from everyone else, so special in fact that the most powerful organization in the world goes out of their way just to prevent you from reproducing, seems like a hell of stretch to me, and a self-centered way of looking at the world.

Explain why Bad boys, and girls attack Nice guys then.

If they are all that powerful and wanted to stop you, they could easily have you assassinated (kinda like ‘jackals’ from the vid) , and what’s to stop them from keeping it covered up? You’re hardly an “important” person like their usual targets.

Are we making this about ME?

Because it's not about me. It is about TRUTH.

These perpetrators seem to be able to get away with anything anyway.

Well, they *ARE* Deceptive, Narcissistic, Psychopaths.

With the full backing of the Women of the West, it seems.

If you're really a nice guy, I'm rooting for you.

Well, thank you... but I am not Nice.

I'm on a Mission.

-Edrick

reply to post by Gazrok

Yes, so either I'm a racist and evil, or I could simply be a fan of the films, anticipating the next installment...., and you are using a cartoon bunny...I fail to see the relevance.

I didn't call you a Racist, Or evil... I was commenting on your Avatar (or, what WAS your avatar, at least)

I didn't mean any offense, and perhaps I should not have added that comment at the end.

If you took it personally, I am sorry.

I just really hate that guy..... That Deceptive, Narcissistic, Psychopath.

Snape is MUCH cooler.

As for pornography, it's a rather subjective subject. What is porn to one, is not necessarily porn to another...so you can't rely on a dictionary to define that which is subjective.

This is True... but Me and KilgoreTrout were referring to the Skin magazines that are directed towards men.

And the context of our conversation reflects this.

-Edrick

reply to post by Edrick


I wasn't defending tyrants. I’m sure you know who I’m talking about when I say “nice guys”. The “nice guys” are not really nice guys, hence the quotation marks. You tend to use the two interchangeably which will throw my words out of context. “Nice guys” ARE deceptive, narcissistic, psychopaths, although they go about it a different way. They like to think they’re nicer than they really are. If you are that hung up about the idiom “nice guys”, feel free to substitute it with another term. I thought it was obvious what I meant. Looking at your last post, a lot of it hinges on this confusion.

reply to post by namine

I’m sure you know who I’m talking about when I say “nice guys”

No, I don't, please explain.

The “nice guys” are not really nice guys, hence the quotation marks.

Then why Call them Nice Guys?

“Nice guys” ARE deceptive, narcissistic, psychopaths, although they go about it a different way.

Explain please.

They like to think they’re nicer than they really are.

Explain please.

If you are that hung up about the idiom “nice guys”, feel free to substitute it with another term. I thought it was obvious what I meant. Looking at your last post, a lot of it hinges on this confusion.

Indeed.... please clarify so that we can avoid any future confusion on the subject.

When I say "Nice Guys", I am referring to the two words:

Nice: pleasant or pleasing or agreeable in nature or appearance
decent: socially or conventionally correct; refined or virtuous

Guy: an informal term for a youth or man

So... when YOU say "Nice Guy", what do *YOU* mean?


Please to explain?

-Edrick

Because women are not 'full', I mean they originate in Eve and Eve was created form Adam's rib. Lilith was/is the real woman. That's why women can never achieve full equality with men. Every man internally wants a complete woman like Lilith but since it's not possible, he marries a daughter of Eve.

Everybody wants something from the opposite sex:
Generally men want sex/company to and women want money/kids/attachment.
Case 'Gender wars' closed.

reply to post by troyj88

Because women are not 'full', I mean they originate in Eve and Eve was created form Adam's rib. Lilith was/is the real woman. That's why women can never achieve full equality with men. Every man internally wants a complete woman like Lilith but since it's not possible, he marries a daughter of Eve.

Lilith (Hebrew: לילית‎) is a character in Jewish mythology, found earliest in the Babylonian Talmud, which is generally thought to be related to a class of female demons Līlīṯu in Mesopotamian texts. However, Lowell K. Handy (1997) notes that "Very little information has been found relating to the Akkadian and Babylonian view of these demons. Two sources of information previously used to define Lilith are both suspect."

In Jewish folklore, from the 8th-10th Century Alphabet of Ben Sira onwards Lilith becomes Adam's first wife, who was created at the same time and from the same earth as Adam. This legend was greatly developed during the Middle Ages, in the tradition of Aggadic midrashim, the Zohar and Jewish mysticism.[3] In the 13th Century writings of Rabbi Isaac ben Jacob ha-Kohen, for example, Lilith left Adam after she refused to become subservient to him and then would not return to the Garden of Eden after she mated with archangel Samael.[4] The resulting Lilith legend is still commonly used as source material in modern Western culture, literature, occultism, fantasy and horror.

en.wikipedia.org...

Yeah... Lilith...

First Wife of Adam... From the 8th-10th Century Onward.......

........... I'm not really into Pokemon.

-Edrick

Edrick, I'm sorry but Wikipedia proves 'wrong' everything that's being posted here on ATS, so I don't think it's really a credible source.

reply to post by troyj88

Edrick, I'm sorry but Wikipedia proves 'wrong' everything that's being posted here on ATS, so I don't think it's really a credible source.

I'm not sure where you saw that Wikipedia *PROVES* lilith to be wrong...

Could you highlight that part for me?

I'm new at this Game.

-Edrick

I don't think it's a turn off when guys are nice, but sometimes when a guy's only quality that makes me want to be around them is that they're nice, it just gets boring. I mean, like others have said, I would rather be with someone who is funny and jokes with me, and isn't always too preoccupied with being nice to even joke around or tease me, really. Sometimes it just gets boring being with someone who can't even be themselves because they are so worried about being nice or inoffensive. Really, you shouldn't even have to try to be nice if you are with a person you actually like/genuinely get along with, you should just be able to be yourself, because if you are with someone that you belong with, you will just be nice because you act the way you want around that person, and obviously, if you really cared about them, you would be nice just because you appreciate who they are you know? So I'd say stop 'trying' to be nice or labeling yourself that way, and just be yourself, and find someone that works with, and stop trying to be some macho guy who has tons of girls hanging off of them just because they make themselves unavailable and rude because they have some bitterness towards women who didn't like them. If you could even consider acting like that to a girl who likes you, you were never a nice guy in the first place.

reply to post by idontlikepunk

I don't think it's a turn off when guys are nice, but sometimes when a guy's only quality that makes me want to be around them is that they're nice, it just gets boring.

Oh, are you speaking about someone in particular?

I mean, like others have said, I would rather be with someone who is funny and jokes with me, and isn't always too preoccupied with being nice to even joke around or tease me, really.

That's a Neg, darling... The jokes are directed *AT* you, instead of WITH you.

It is an attempt to lower your own sense of self worth, and raise your perception of theirs.

This causes you to be "Attracted" to their "Higher Social Status".

But all they are really doing is trying to Crush your ego to get into your pants.

Sometimes it just gets boring being with someone who can't even be themselves because they are so worried about being nice or inoffensive.

We aren't talking about the same things, obviously.

NICE is a descriptor for an individual, not their entire personality.

What they have DONE, is convince you that anyone who is NICE, must be a complete loser.

And, since they hang around you ALL THE TIME, and tell you EVERYTHING about these Nice Guys... your perspective is naturally molded by the Psychopathic, Deceptive, Narcissistic, Morons....

This is Basic Psychology.

Really, you shouldn't even have to try to be nice if you are with a person you actually like/genuinely get along with, you should just be able to be yourself, because if you are with someone that you belong with, you will just be nice because you act the way you want around that person, and obviously, if you really cared about them, you would be nice just because you appreciate who they are you know?

So, the guys you hang out with... you see them being nice to YOU.

But do you see them Slighting other people behind their backs? (I.E. the Nice guys are Losers Schpeel)

Once again... its basic Psychology.

and... Deceptive Manipulation.

Don't get caught in that trap... you will just hate yourself for it later.

So I'd say stop 'trying' to be nice or labeling yourself that way, and just be yourself

You see, here you go.

The presumption that someone who is NICE, is just ACTING that way, as opposed to actually BEING a nice person.

Meanwhile, you got the guys who ACT nice around your Vagina.... and then slander any possible opposition to their conquest of your body.

This is "Game"... it is based upon the Nash Postulate, A.K.A. *GAME THEORY* that was developed by John Nash during the Cold war, and further refined by the Rand Corporation think tank.
en.wikipedia.org...

IT is basically, a presumption that humans are soulless monsters.

and find someone that works with, and stop trying to be some macho guy who has tons of girls hanging off of them just because they make themselves unavailable and rude because they have some bitterness towards women who didn't like them.

Wow, you went from Nice Guy to Macho Guy pretty fast...

Care to explain that leap of Logic?

If you could even consider acting like that to a girl who likes you, you were never a nice guy in the first place.

Well, I would have to agree with you.... I am Generally Civil to people in all circumstances, unless they break the *Cardinal Rules* of "Etiquette", that is.... You know... Like Trespassing or whatever.

-Edrick (Defender of Free Will)