Palin owes the American people an apology!

reply to post by LLoyd45


I have worked in social work fields, namely mental health as well as a handful of community service volunteer work, but do not now work in a community mental health agency...what is it with you republicans attacking and trying to discredit the messenger. The only reason I brought it up was to point out how crucial to our civilization the work is and that people who do this stuff do not need to be ridiculed, then I get you folks out of the wood work attacking me for it; what the hell gives? On top of that you claim to have a graduate degree for which I asked you to provide some info regarding your research and career in that academic path and all I hear is crickets, but this is so typical of many folks who get on here and rather directly talk about what the thread is about you distract us with these stupid side tracks.

The beloved Christian right goddess Palin is the one who insulted folks doing some pretty damn important and noble work and not just once but several times and Giuliani damn near had a wet dream over it and literally over the bodies of millions who continue to live in slums with substandard educations, no healthcare, skyrocketing unemployment figures, soaring crime rates, child hunger, struggling single mothers, epidemic substance abuse rates, While the Republican politicians joke about folks who put their hard work into the area of helping these Americans improve their lives and make our country stronger, and your on here trying to snag me up on my own background with community building. What is wrong with some people? Can't they see how transparent these folks are? These GOP'ers (Gas, Oil and Petrolium party) don't represent you or me, or the middle and working class, and definately not the poor...besides not caring, they don't have a clue what goes on in the inner cities or how millions of Americans really struggle just to survive...they represent big corporate interests and big oil. The very fact that they make jabs at community organizers is the proof positive that first, they don't give a damn about "the people", that they are out of touch, and that they think that those who will likely buy that crap are to dumb to notice...I've tried my hardest to point this out on here for you folks, but you'd rather fight about non relevant materials than get past your own cognitive disonance. Denial ain't just some river in Egypt!

This sums it up:
GOP 2008, Organizing Communities Against Community Organizing! That's today's Republican party! This is the new reality folks, and the proof is in the pudding!


It's just like Barack Obama states, we can't keep playing the same politics. The issues that effect the American people, at stake are far to important (I didn't hear any Republicans talk about this). All we saw with the GOP speakers was more of the same. On all of the issues (what little bit of time was even dedicated to them) was about old policies that have got us in the mess we are in now...they are not reform or change...what a joke. And McCain's allowing the GOP bosses to hand pick Palin was not putting "Country First", nor does it make him a maverick or someone willing to buck the party...what a bunch of nonsense!



[edit on 5-9-2008 by skyshow]

Originally posted by skyshow
reply to post by LLoyd45

 

I have worked in social work fields, namely mental health, but do not now...what is it with you republicans attacking and trying to discredit the messenger. Palin is the one who insulted folks doing some pretty damn important and noble work, and your on here trying to snag me up on my own background with community building.

GOP 2008, Organizing Communities Against Community Organizing! That's today's Republican!

As I said before she insulted no one but Obama and his lame assertions regarding his experience.

Originally posted by Artista
reply to post by Swampfox46_1999

 

I am pro-choice. Because I am a former rape victim, I can tell you quite honestly that had I became pregant due to the rape, I would have had an abortion. I want that to remain my choice - I want that to be a choice for ALL women.

i agree, rape victims should be allowed to abort as the blood will be on the hands of the rapist. this is something i believe sarah should change about her position. the next problem would be created however, and that's proving rape. there are already an inordinate amount of men in jail for rape who haven't actually done the crime. many have, but many haven't as well. what's happened is they've responded in the legal system, to the extreme opposite, which is really not a good thing. i realize someone thinks that type of thing is karmic, but i think it's just abuse.

anyway, it would be impossible to prove it was rape before the baby was born, so obviously, the only real solution is to ask the potential rape victim. if they lie, the blood is on their hands and not the government's hands or the hands of the people who legallized the process. if they tell the truth and it really did happen, the blood is on the hands of the rapist.

the rape case would have to wait. that's the problem with tying it to abortion. how many would use that as an excuse and having the man put in prison just because they didn't want to have a baby? if they said they were raped to get an abortion and the case was taken to court... the person found guilty (which would be either the mother of the child or the rapist) would be guilty of murder in some degree. that would curtail the use of abortion as a form of frequent birth control, anyway.

egads, the whole thing is just bad.




[edit on 5-9-2008 by undo]

reply to post by LLoyd45

As I said before she insulted no one but Obama and his lame assertions regarding his experience.

And by doing that she insults all of us. She shows herself as someone incapable of representing all of the people at the Presidential level. You can't put community building down and at the same time tell eveyone you work for "the people".

She's too inexperienced, to inept, and unable to serve. McCain obviously did not pick her and it shows him as being impetent. The polls are starting to reflect it as well. This whole thing has been nothing but a disaster and all because they were so desperate to try and get that Christian fundamentalist vote, and then they have the nerve to say "country first". We all see the proof that the country does not come first, winning for them and the money is what comes first, and thus we have this dumb speech by that awful woman from Alaska who doesn't give a damn about you or me period.

Sorry fool, but "Community Activist" is not preparation to become the President of the United States.

Besides, his largest achievement was a housing development built by his al Tony Resko, which is now shuttered because of poor and unsafe construction. Obama knows that his good buddy went to jail because of this project.

He took money from this man, who negotiated the purchase of Obama's house, and co-purchased the lot next door. Obama got a $300,00 pay off, and ended up with a multi-million dollar piece of property.

He has been an Illinois State Senator, and a U.S Senator, and in those 8 years has become a multi-millionaire. Strange, because none of those jobs pay at that level.

But of course we are supposed to trust this guy, right?

He's nothing but a cleaned up hood from the hood.

reply to post by skyshow


Hey OP you owe us an apology for posting crap like this. If you want to help get Obama elected go work for him or his staff passing out flyers. Keep the BS off here. Your the only one that was insulted,,,,hmm,,,maybe your a community builder but I highly doubt it. Community builders wouldnt be trying to tear down the ATS community by posting this crap. Like I said you owe us an apology

[edit on 5-9-2008 by alienj]

[edit on 5-9-2008 by alienj]

Why are you guys even talking about non-issues like this? Wake up, this is just political crap and has nothing to do with the issues.

If you let this kind of stuff determine your vote then you are part of the problem.

If you push this kind of stuff as reasons why you shouldn't vote for someone, then you are part of the problem.

I mean seriously, how can you argue about this stuff? There are so many valid reasons why both McCain and Obama aren't worth voting for, and over and over this is the kind of crap people argue over.

Wake up!

Originally posted by skyshow
reply to post by LLoyd45

 

I have worked in social work fields, namely mental health as well as a handful of community service volunteer work, but do not now work in a community mental health agency...what is it with you republicans attacking and trying to discredit the messenger. The only reason I brought it up was to point out how crucial to our civilization the work is and that people who do this stuff do not need to be ridiculed, then I get you folks out of the wood work attacking me for it; what the hell gives?

Nobody's attacking you, but first you said you were a social worker, then you said you weren't. Which is it?

On top of that you claim to have a graduate degree for which I asked you to provide some info regarding your research and career in that academic path and all I hear is crickets, but this is so typical you guys get on here and rather directly talk about what the thread is about you distract us with these stupid side tracks.

I'm afraid real social workers aren't required to do their own research studies unless they happen to be non-practicing academics. Social workers may read a lot of research papers and articles, but they don't actually conduct their own studies or submit articles and papers.

This gap in your knowledge is yet another reason to doubt you ever worked as a social worker. I have a BS and an MS in counseling, with a minor in social work. What areas are your BS and MS in?

The beloved Christian right goddess Palin is the one who insulted folks doing some pretty damn important and noble work and not just once but several times and Giuliani damn near had a wet dream over it and literally over the bodies of millions who continue to live in slums with substandard educations, no healthcare, skyrocketing unemployment figures, soaring crime rates, child hunger, struggling single mothers, epidemic substance abuse rates, While the Republican politicians joke about folks who put their hard work into the area of helping these Americans improve their lives and make our country stronger, and your on here trying to snag me up on my own background with community building. What is wrong with you people?

Nobody is calling Palin a Goddess but you, and she never insulted anyone, aside Barack Obama, and that was only as a result of his idiotic claims. Community organizers definitely serve a purpose, but not a vastly important one in the grand scheme of things. Aldermen and ombudsmen play a far more significant role.

GOP 2008, Organizing Communities Against Community Organizing! That's today's Republican! This is the new reality folks, and the proof is in the pudding!


[edit on 5-9-2008 by skyshow]

Yeah, if you say so..

[edit on 5-9-2008 by LLoyd45]

Originally posted by skyshow
reply to post by LLoyd45

 

As I said before she insulted no one but Obama and his lame assertions regarding his experience.

And by doing that she insults all of us. She shows herself as someone incapable of representing all of the people at the Presidential level. You can't put community building down and at the same time tell eveyone you work for "the people".

She's too inexperienced, to inept, and unable to serve. McCain obviously did not pick her and it shows him as being impetent. The polls are starting to reflect it as well. This whole thing has been nothing but a disaster and all because they were so desperate to try and get that Christian fundamentalist vote, and then they have the nerve to say "country first". We all see the proof that the country does not come first, winning for them and the money is what comes first, and thus we have this dumb speech by that awful woman from Alaska who doesn't give a damn about you or me period.

So, you're a volunteer community worker.. That's a far cry from being a social worker, but not as far as a community organizer is from the President of the United States.

reply to post by LLoyd45


Lloyd
What's the matter bro why did you leave social work?
Did you burn out on big city problems??

Lloyd tell the truth. Not enough money for you? Not enough respect??

What did you DO as a social worker??

What is exactly your beef with community organizers??

They didn't solve all those problems fast enough for you?

Tell me Lloyd.

Here is exactly why this is an issue...

I found a great article that lays it out on the line. But first let me say that you should know better when you say that they were only attacking Obama on is being a community organizer. They purposely used a generalization that community organizers don't have an influential role in society.

As the article I will post lays out even Rudy Gulliani once praised these people for the work they do. Apparently, Rudy Gulliani was FOR community organizing before he was AGAINST it.

Now here's the kicker, community organizer are responsible for helping parents hockey and soccer leagues (HELLO!!! Hockey mom anyone?) and help them get access to fields to use for the games.

And...what the do you think the PTA is? It's a community organization where parents get together to "get their way" with the school system. Ummm...wasn't Sarah Palin in the PTA??

Giuliani agreed to provide a large swath of vacant public land in a neglected part of Brooklyn. At the groundbreaking ceremony for the Nehemiah homes [depicted in the documentary film, The Democratic Promise Giuliani, surrounded by hundreds of EBC activists, lavished praise on the group. "Most of the political establishment in this city opposed them [and] tried to undercut them," he said. Then he lauded EBC because "they do not pay homage to political figures...They require you to answer their questions. They remind you that you are a public servant."

Giuliani has since forgotten those words of praise, but he was correct. Community organizers make democracy work by mobilizing people to inject long-ignored issues onto the public agenda and hold politicians accountable. They help give people the confidence they need to use the tools of democracy. In a society where wealth and income is concentrated in a few hands, grassroots organizations make it possible for ordinary Americans to find their civic voice and exercise influence in politics.

Our democracy works best when people come together to solve problems, not simply by voting every few years, but also by participating in a wide array of voluntary organizations--the "civil society" that serves as a mediator between the power of business and money and the authority of government. Politicians need to listen to people's problems, help them forge solutions, and give voice to their hopes, rather than stoke people's fears and prejudices.

The article sums the ISSUE up perfectly...

Republicans thought they were being smart mocking community organizing. But what they didn't understand is that their smug comments weren't simply an attack on Barack Obama, but on the entire grassroots chain of change that has, for over 200 years, made America a more democratic and humane country.

How do you think women and blacks got the right to vote? How do you think blacks were finally allowed to sit at the FRONT of the bus? Or be allowed into restaurants and stores that didn't want them there? It's because of community organizers.

How do you think that entire neighborhoods were saved from being wiped out because the city government decided it would have a better use as a parking garage?

Why do you think that the city finally did something about that river that was full of trash and toxic waste?

You better thank you lucky stars for community orgainizers.

Apparently, according to the speakers at the RNC you're service to the community only matters if it's for political gain, power, and money.

Originally posted by Leo Strauss
Lloyd
What's the matter bro why did you leave social work?
Did you burn out on big city problems??

Lloyd tell the truth. Not enough money for you? Not enough respect??

What did you DO as a social worker??

What is exactly your beef with community organizers??

They didn't solve all those problems fast enough for you?

Tell me Lloyd.

I quit because I got tired of paving yellow brick roads for people who were too stupid to follow them. You could plan out every single detail, and they'd still manage to screw up.

There are just some people who simply don't want to be helped, they'd rather piss and moan about how unfair life is, and blame others for their mistakes. I was a tough love kind of guy, and I didn't tolerate BS very well. If someone wanted help, I'd help them, but if they just wanted to waste my time, I'd tell them to come back when they were ready to do some work.

I worked with all the various populations at one time or another, crazies, addicts, mentally challenged, elderly, parolees, etc.

I have no personal beef with community organizers, I just don't feel they're quite as important as they seem to think they are. In reality they do very little aside from empowering others to do for themselves. That involves no real labor of work on their part, just a lot of talking. Talk is cheap in my opinion, and most people seem to like the sound of their own voices too much.

[edit on 5-9-2008 by LLoyd45]

Originally posted by LLoyd45

Originally posted by Leo Strauss

I quit because I got tired of paving yellow brick roads for people who were too stupid to follow them. You could plan out every single detail, and they'd still manage to screw up.

There are just some people who simply don't want to be helped, they'd rather piss and moan about how unfair life is, and blame others for their mistakes. I was a tough love kind of guy, and I didn't tolerate BS very well. If someone wanted help, I'd help them, but if they just wanted to waste my time, I'd tell them to come back when they were ready to do some work.

I worked with all the various populations at one time or another, crazies, addicts, mentally challenged, elderly, parolees, etc.

I have no personal beef with community organizers, I just don't feel they're quite as important as they seem to think they are. In reality they do very little aside from empowering others to do for themselves. That involves no real labor of work on their part, just a lot of talking. Talk is cheap in my opinion, and most people seem to like the sound of their own voices too much.

[edit on 5-9-2008 by LLoyd45]

Lloyd thanks for your service. These are not easy problems. I think neighborhood folks respond better to community organizers because they don't feel like they are being patronized by self serving do gooders.

Helping yourself always feels better than getting hand outs. But it is not that easy no it's not. What are you doing now?

[edit on 5-9-2008 by Leo Strauss]

reply to post by OldMedic

Sorry fool, but "Community Activist" is not preparation to become the President of the United States.

You act like his volunteer service is all he ever did? Where have you been? have you ever bothered to google Obama Legislation? Howabout his multiple terms in the Illinois state house, or as a United States Senator? Huh? What about working as a Constitutional Lawyer? What about Getting into Harvard Grad. school and graduating at the upper levels of his class?

If all you do is get your information from Fox news talking heads, or Limbaugh or any number of party hacks or from the GOP.com daily talking points email you aren't fully informed.

The very fact that he can stand on all of his community service and related work for the poor and destraught and needy is the very reason we need him to be President of the United States. When he says he works "for the people" he has the resume' to back it up!

Originally posted by Shazam The Unbowed
A "community organiser" is nothing but a low level cog in a political machine. Nothing more, nothing less. Its not some sanctified secular preisthood, or some great and noble profession. A community organiser gets people together to demand free crap from the government, or bitch about crap they dont like. Why am I not surprised however that liberals find this profession to be the epitomy and apotheosis of public service and nobility.

[edit on 9/4/2008 by Shazam The Unbowed]

A typical characteristic of mayors, of big towns or small towns, is their skill at creating division among the people their towns. They have to because towns, big towns or small towns, are made up of special interests. For a politician it is a matter picking sides in order to gain votes and retain political power. Giuliani represented a big town and Palin represents a small town, both are adepts at using divisive tactics in order to gain political influence. However, a good mayor will balance special interests towards the benefit of the public at large, rather than just for the groups who represent those interests.

We know the history of Giuliani.

Palin's speech at the RNC rests on the basic foundation of "name calling". It was lower than high school. It was kindergarten trash talking. The difference in level of responsibility between the office of mayor to community organizer is not something that she should have had to point out. A mayor of a town should have larger and perhaps more important responsibilities than a community organizer. One being able to handle those responsibilities should be a qualification of the office of mayor. The fact that she chose to highlight the difference in the way that she did is in actuality an elitist thing to do. And there are not more ways to look at it than that. The root is the root.

On the other hand community organizers are generally faced with the difficult task of bringing people together irrespective of their racial, ethnic, social, and economic backgrounds for the purpose of opening lines of communication, and keeping them open, so that all who live in a town might understand one another in order to create a situation where most, if not all, benefit from the best that the town has to offer. Community organizers are the real peace officers and peace keepers of any town; it certainly is not the police. And it damn sure ain't the mayor. Community organizers create situations where all of a town's citizens have the opportunity to socialize with one another and discuss important changes that a town might have to undergo. Community organizers are the ones who are out in the field making sure that citizens are kept informed, and that citizens use their voices and votes for rightful causes. Community organizers are motivators of the citizenry; second only to the citizens who organize and motivate themselves. Mayors, on the other hand, excel at keeping citizens in the dark on just about any matter that will conflicts with the town's and state's special interest groups. However, a good mayor will use community organizers to the benefit of the mayor, the town's citizens, and the special interest groups. A good mayor would also praise the efforts of community organizers. Especially since most of what a community organizer does is at the community organizer's expense and not the expense of the city or the state.

Palin did was what she was expected to do. She appealed to the Republican party through a speech with language it knows and appreciates. And if it hadn't been written specifically for her, old GWB could have delivered it to the same effect. It was the same old, same old delivered by someone younger whose qualifications for the office of Vice President are just as dubious as GWB's were for the office of President.

Here's another thing she can apologise for: You remember that jet she said she sold on ebay? Well, it turns out that was a lie too. She didn't sell it on ebay, but instead privately sold it at a loss to one of her campaign contributors who got a pretty good deal on a jet at the expense of the taxpayers...Someone needs to start a thread compiling in order all of the blatently false information she fed the viewers the other night. This is unbelievable. Even worse is how she is refusing to talk to the press or go on any of the talk shows and account for all that she said.

You know if I said the things she did, I think I would run and hide too....actually, I would issue a press release apology, and bow out of the race, but then I don't make my living the way she does and never would either.



[edit on 5-9-2008 by skyshow]

Another thing that needs to be mentioned is that Palin's comparison of the Office of Mayor to community organizer seems to speak of a fear that she has of community organizers. It is true that community organizers have often organized the citizenry of a town against the aims and directives of the town's mayor. Martin Luther King, Jr. was a community organizer.

Bottom line: If Palin had any respect for community organizer's she wouldn't have made the speech that she made at the RNC. She obviously hold's contempt for those who would work for free towards the betterment of their communities. At worse, she holds a general fear of people who would organize themselves without her say-so.

Originally posted by Areal51


Palin's speech at the RNC rests on the basic foundation of "name calling". It was lower than high school..

Then this comment will fit right in. They statrted it. Politics, for both parties, involves attacking the oppoisition. Thats the grown up world, deal with it.

The difference in level of responsibility between the office of mayor to community organizer is not something that she should have had to point out.

and yet Major democratic politicans have suggested that being mayor of a small town of "only" 6000 people, is somwhow LESS than being a community organiser.

On the other hand community organizers are generally faced with the difficult task of bringing people together irrespective of their racial, ethnic, social, and economic backgrounds for the purpose of opening lines of communication, and keeping them open, so that all who live in a town might understand one another in order to create a situation where most, if not all, benefit from the best that the town has to offer.

Yeah, Im calling *SNIP*.
"Community organisers" get paid. Which means soemone has a reason to pay them. WHich means political money, whcih means partisanship. Period. Especially in chicago the first two questions a "community organiser" asks are
1) Are you a democrat?
and
2) Are you part of the machine.

Community organiser are paid by political groups, 527's, charities seeking more federal dollars and other political organisations to provide them with bodies and signatures.

Community organizers are the real peace officers and peace keepers of any town; it certainly is not the police.

Whatever you are smoking pass it please. The best way for a community organiser to get results is tos tir up partisan passions. Especially on the south side of chicago.



Look I get it, you think Community organisers are one step below (maybe) Jesus. I aint buying it, and I doubt many others are dumb enough to either.

Oh and BTW MLK was NOT a Community Organiser, and every time you say so you just show your ignorance. He was a Baptist Minister and as such a community leader.
Back before liebralism took hold, communties didnt need organisers, back then communites had leaders.


Mod Edit: Profanity/Circumvention Of Censors – Please Review This Link.


[edit on 9/5/2008 by Shazam The Unbowed]

[edit on 9/5/2008 by maria_stardust]

Originally posted by skyshow
... This is unbelievable. Even worse is how she is refusing to talk to the press or go on any of the talk shows and account for all that she said.

She is not refusing. Her republican handlers (turdblossom Rove) have determined it would not be in the interest of the republican party if Sarah Palin were to speak extemporaneously.

She needs the teleprompter and speechwriters. You see the secret Karl Rove does not want us to know is that she is a bug eyed extremist!!!

Originally posted by schrodingers dog
reply to post by cognoscente

 

You know, the whole republican crew here are giddy in their forums tonight. They heard exactly what they wanted to hear, the hateful crap they spew on ATS everyday. They truly in their hearts believe that tonight nothing can stop them.

I suspect that when the cold reality of the morning rolls in, they will realize that most of the country feels like the OP. This was nothing more that a frat party with suits and prostates. The tone, the bitterness, the childishness, the high school putdowns. That is not good. It's like they used their inside voice on the outside. And not talking about any issue is beyond belief.

They're going to be very confused at the people's reaction tomorrow. Then they'll tell them why they're wrong.

Many many people will be put off by this.

Please....this site is one of the most unfriendly sight on the net toward republicans. Are you sure you talking about ATS??? Palin delivered a brilliant speech. One thing I notice is people who do not see the humor or irony in the barbs, see the truth. Its the ones that see the truth in the barb that take the biggest offense. Face it...Palin knocked the demo-socialist party on their rears. I am not saying she sealed anything, I still want to see how she fares against Biden in that debate. I bet he was as surprised as anyone as to how well she did.

Should be interesting. USA>>>USA>>>USA>>>

Drill Drill Drill!!!!!!!!!