House Dems turn out the lights, but GOP keeps talking

Originally posted by centurion1211
OK, please enlighten the rest of us on the "real" reason oil prices have recently dropped.

Remember how supply and demand works?

I can't speak for Animal, but I remember. Do you? (insert redundant eyerolls here)

As you said, it's supply and demand.

Americans drove 1.4 billion fewer highway miles in April than they did in April 2007.

Americans drove 9.6 billion fewer miles in May compared with a year earlier

That's a 8.2 billion mile drop off in one month's time. Demand has been falling very rapidly so naturally the price has been falling as well.

That makes sense following basic supply and demand. However, if that's the reason, it's one hell of a coincidence that it started immediately after Bush gave his speech.

I've enjoyed reading this thread. Comical doesn't even cover it! The GOP is throwing a temper tantrum because they don't have control and can't deal with it like adults.

They have known for some time that the first of August was the time they take their 5 week vacation. There was a vote to adjourn and it passed. Go home and drive your kids around in your Hummer and stop acting like you give a crap...

Grandstanding and theatrics is all this is. It's funny, though.

There's been a lot of crying and whining from the GOP lately. :shk:

Originally posted by redmage
That's a 8.2 billion mile drop off in one month's time. Demand has been falling very rapidly so naturally the price has been falling as well.

That might have played a small part if any but IMO prices started falling since Bush removed the whitehouse ban on domestic drilling. So of course if congress would remove the ban the price of oil would drop even further. Look, once the speculators and other relevant parties realize the U.S. is serious and that being energy independent is the goal, the price of oil will drop like a rock even before one barrel of oil get pumped.

You know this freakin' media we have in the U.S. is so blatantly in tthe tank for the dems it makes me want to projectile vomit!

I generally bounce between three web sites for news during the day.

1. www.drudgereport.com...

2. www.cnn.com...

3.abcnews.go.com...

Look now as this story is unfolding.

Drudge has it and the other two have front page stories on Brittany's new bikini body (not bad by the way!) ABC & CNN reporting a manufacturing plant wants to ditch labor day for a Muslim holiday.

I'm now checking Quantas flights because Australia is looking pretty frickin' good right now.

Becker

Originally posted by redmage
As you said, it's supply and demand.

Americans drove 1.4 billion fewer highway miles in April than they did in April 2007.

Americans drove 9.6 billion fewer miles in May compared with a year earlier

That's a 8.2 billion mile drop off in one month's time. Demand has been falling very rapidly so naturally the price has been falling as well.

I'll admit that the supply demand curve might allow some change due to that. But are you really advocating the global demand for oil was heavily influenced by a less than 4% drop in miles driven in the US?

Originally posted by jackinthebox


Do you really believe they would have been able to get anything through this week, that would have actually had any impact whatsoever on gas prices? No way.

If legislation were to be put forward that effective immediately all foriegn aid is suspended and will instead be spent on research and development of alternative energy sources. That the US will make do only with domestically produced oil in five years by reducing imports by 20% per year until such goal. And that all new cars sold in the US must run on something other than gasoline as the primary energy source effective Jan 1, 2010....then yeah, I will bet wheelbarrows of money that the price of oil would go down real fast.

The system is far too cumbersome to be managed in such a way. Waiting a few months isn't going to make any difference when the effects of energy policy aren't felt for years.

When the gun is put to your head (or fire to your feet if you don't like that saying) things can be done quite quickly and efficiently. Nothing clears up redtape like the thought of 300 million people coming to DC to turn you over their knee for a good old fashioned spanking...now if W. wnated to be a prick he could take a little stroll over to the capitol building and ask congress to present some legislation on his desk monday morning. Failure to do so would result in him envoking consitutionally provided power to suspend Congress.

Of course if he did that, people would be crying that he replaced Hail to the Chief with the Imperial March or something like that, but it would send a very clear message to the people that Congress taking vaction while the country is in need of leadership and responibility is not acceptable.

Yes the Republicans that stayed grandstanded as much as the Democrats that left have. Point is, with all the hoopla this has gained so far an orgainised group (foreign or domestic) could have a field day right now. Like passing legislation that alolows the direct taxation of income without apportionment...wait that happened on a Christmas Break nearly a hundred years ago, we are more honorable than that today, right?

I agree if the repubs cared this vote would be on allocating money to natural energy that is NOT oil.

There have been SOOOO many breakthroughs in solar/wind power that we could drop oil use atleast 50% over the next few years.

Destroying Alaska is not the answer. The ONLY way i would support this is if The Alaskan people got FULL control over the oil and project and 75% of the jobs were offered to Alaskans first. . Its there oil and their state . They have to live there..

Who's first in line for the no bid contract? I bet those repubs were pulling this show for a seat on the board of directors.
"Whoever makes the dems look bad gets the seat"



[edit on 1-8-2008 by d11_m_na_c05]

reply to post by _Del_


Well, lets see...

Department of Transportation said Americans drove 30 billion fewer miles between November 2007 and April 2008

Tack on another 11 billion fewer, from April and May alone, and we see a dramatically falling demand curve. That's without the June and July numbers.

You may say "less than 4%"; however, that translates to vast sums of money, and you can't argue with the fact that the U.S. is the primary consumer when it comes to oil so our purchasing habits absolutely have an effect on the PPB globally.

Heck, even though Exxon broke quarterly profit records (yet again), they still missed their quarterly goal and shareholders were not pleased.

Add the fact that the price per barrel was/is being artificially inflated, largely due to speculation investment, and a dip was inevitable.

[edit on 8/1/08 by redmage]

I'm just glad that the other party finaly seems to have grown a pair and are thumbing they're noses at Pelosi. If the Reps had adjorned and turned off the lights the MSM would be going ballistic. It would be 24/7 how terrible and unfeeling the party is and blah blah blah!!!!

Zindo

www.politico.com...


Politico is updating their coverage.

Democratic aides were furious at the GOP stunt, and reporters were kicked out of the Speaker's Lobby, the space next to the House floor where they normally interview lawmakers.

"You're not covering this, are you?" complained one senior Democratic aide. Another called the Republicans "morons" for staying on the floor.

Update: The Capitol Police are now trying to kick reporters out of the press gallery above the floor, meaning we can't watch the Republicans anymore. But Minority Whip Roy Blunt (R-Mo.) is now in the gallery talking to reporters, so the cops have held off for a minute. Clearly, Democrats don't want Republicans getting any press for this episode. GOP leaders are trying to find other Republicans to rotate in for Blunt so reporters aren't kicked out.

Originally posted by ZindoDoone
I'm just glad that the other party finaly seems to have grown a pair and are thumbing they're noses at Pelosi. If the Reps had adjorned and turned off the lights the MSM would be going ballistic. It would be 24/7 how terrible and unfeeling the party is and blah blah blah!!!!

Zindo

I had to give you a star because you are so correct.

If the Rep's had walked out on the Dem's to go on vacation and turned off the lights and microphone, the MSM and the Dem's would be going ballistic! They would be crying about how the Rep's don't care about the people and this proves they are not compassionate about the suffering of the people.

This double standard is so obvious, it's disgusting.

Originally posted by redmage
You may say "less than 4%"; however, that translates to vast sums of money lost, and you can't argue that the U.S. is the primary global consumer when it comes to oil.

You're still saying that speculation has nothing to do with the price drop? The price drop is due to less than 4% drop in less than 25% of world demand? Let's assume that all the oil consumption in the US goes to mileage/transportation (which is ridiculous the number is closer to 70%), that's a 0.00925 drop in world demand! Less than 1%. A little more than half a percent if we use the more accurate figure for transportation. The number becomes even smaller when we realize that the vehicles that aren't effected by this drop in mileage (trucking, etc) use more than an equal share of gas for their percentage of mileage.
It sounds good to say that we're reducing our mileage driven by x-billion miles, but the truth is it is spit in the ocean compared to world consumption. I'm all for reducing our energy use, and agree the reduction may help oil prices (though India and China are increasing consumption by more than 6% annually by most estimates). The global market isn't going to be set by people not driving that extra trip to the grocery store, though.
To then dismiss the speculative nature of the market on top of that is pretty misleading.

Originally posted by _Del_
To then dismiss the speculative nature of the market on top of that is pretty misleading.

I'm not dismissing speculation at all.

When demand falls so do prices, and speculators bail in turn (which drops the prices further).

[edit on 8/1/08 by redmage]

reply to post by d11_m_na_c05

Originally posted by d11_m_na_c05
I agree if the repubs cared this vote would be on allocating money to natural energy that is NOT oil.

There have been SOOOO many breakthroughs in solar/wind power that we could drop oil use atleast 50% over the next few years.

Destroying Alaska is not the answer. The ONLY way i would support this is if The Alaskan people got FULL control over the oil and project and 75% of the jobs were offered to Alaskans first. . Its there oil and their state . They have to live there..
[edit on 1-8-2008 by d11_m_na_c05]

Please, stop with the disnfo and hysteria. First of all the numbers you give for solar and wind are sheer insanity. There is no way even the most wild-eyed enviro-terrorist believes those numbers.

Next, "Destroying Alaska"? Do you know how much land we're talking about? About the size of a postage stamp on a football field. Look at these pictures:








blog.heritage.org...

Check out the other pics on that site. There are some beautiful shots of previously developed oil fields.

reply to post by redmage



Global demand fell roughly half a percentage point (assuming no other markets had no growth, which we know is not true) and speculators bailed to the tune of $20 a barrel? Just happens to coincide with Bush lifting drilling restrictions? Don't hurt your back with that stretch there



[edit on 1-8-2008 by _Del_]

reply to post by _Del_


Likewise, don't hurt your back building your strawman.

I've never claimed speculation has no effect, I'm merely pointing out the falling demand from the number one oil consumer in the world.

Just checked both C-spans and nuttin'!!!! Got some BS meetings about foreign aid and something else. Typical!!!


Zindo

Did global demand really fall appreciably, or did new supply become available? I don't know how you can argue that a global fall of half a percentage point (again assuming the rest of the market was static) was the "real" cause of the $20 a barrel drop, and not the potential opening of new supply that just happens to coincide with the drop. Give the devil his due.

More on topic:

C-SPAN has just issued this statement: "A number of media organizations have incorrectly referred to 'C-SPAN cameras' being turned off and not providing televised coverage of the GOP House members' post-adjournment protest on energy policy being held on the House floor on Friday afternoon. Please note that cameras in the House chamber are under the control of the Speaker of the House and that all media organizations, including C-SPAN, wishing to cover events in the chamber must use the official House TV feed. No private media cameras are permitted in the House (or Senate) chambers."

www.politico.com...

Its hard for me to belive people are still falling for the dog and pony show.
WAKE UP PEOPLE!!! Its all about keeping the people devided. There are no Democrats or Republicans.



The only wise response in the thread!


Folks, Both sides point fingerss at each other, the media eats it up, and
the shady work is done behind the scenes.
IT's all BS. One Party moving in one direction.....NAU...........simple.