How did the terrorists know where to fly?

reply to post by JanusFIN


Honestly I wouldn’t have a problem with Indian Intel towing a shadowy line for a Global 911 cover-up. That said, 99% of the people in most organizations are going to do the best they can if allowed. Meaning I suppose that the Indian Intel leak to a news service could be legit?? Was that link corroborated by other sources outside of this statement - (like the SEC) I believe it was (and available online?)

So, if you are suggesting a massive cover-up with numerous false information sources all supportively connecting across conspiring global governments through their intel services , my hat is off to your open mindedness and big thinking.

The Queen may indeed still be that good. I however naively choose to believe that while indeed there was a 9/11 conspiracy, while well placed, there are still people presently in a position to call it what it is and was.

Originally posted by Boone 870
reply to post by scrapple

 

How can you possibly know that no air traffic controllers gave out the altimeter settings to other aircraft?

Just saying this is what you are relying on to set the specific number that day. Is it impossible no, but from the article the ground stop was some minutes after WTC second strike. The time between it and the Pentagon strike was more than 30 minutes. So they had a lot of time to hold traffic and get inbounds down while the plane in question is handed off to another ATC altogether.

Maybe somebody was whistling the new Reagan field data. Maybe WeedWacker can confirm if Reagan was broadcasting it around the time the flight went around Stinger Missile Batteries.

Didn't they hijack the plane at the very last minute? like they boarded the planes as normal using fake passports etc and chose the specific planes for the flight path needed to make the terrorist attack possible, then hijacked the plane at the very last minute before the attack?

Originally posted by weedwhacker
reply to post by scrapple

 

scrapple, fair question....

the B757 has three altimeters...one for the Capt, one for the FO, and the Standby...

Here's the question, and I am just a user of the equipment, I didn't design it....but I will use my experience and judgement to assume that the DFDR looked at the Capt's altimeter....

But, is this the only discrepancy? What about the rest of the readings from the FDR? I'd like to know.....

There a millions of finer flying points of question in this case - which as a non pilot i can only hang on to but not really control.

However for something more basic, What about the long right handed turn decent from the left seat. That’s a directional question and to the point of this thread. If you had to choose, was out one pilot a noob, or a true jockey in sheep’s clothing - based just on the turn , throttles and ultimate line-up.

-scrap

Awesome OP!! S/F for sure!

Well, if you never see the inside of a cockpit of an airliner and then compare it to a Piper-Colt NOT equipped with instruments which will allow it to fly in bad weather or night. I suggest you take a good hard look and think about this.....

How many actually FLIGHT hours it takes to JUST understand the instrument panel in the

airliner--> www.aeronautics.ru...

and then compare the panel of a

Piper Colt-->www.youtube.com...

How much experience would you think you would need? (Airline or private pilots PLEASE post your knowledge of the amount of school hours, man house, actually flight hours will take to fly a fully instrumented airliner.)

From what I remember, the 'experience' that one of the attackers had, came from a private pilot school NOT a FULLY accredited university/college/school.....and he flew it directly into the building with JUST that training?? Riiiight!!

2nd. Aren't hijacked airliners eq'd with silent alarms?? I'm pretty sure they are.

the Numbers to me just don't add up.






.

Has everybody forgot the fact that the terrorist went to FLIGHT SCHOOL for multi engine aircraft before the attack?

Also you can download the manuals for these planes, or at least you could.

Also GPS is the simplest thing in the world to us.

Not to mention that flying a plane and simple nav is the easiest thing in the world. Take off is harder and landing is the hardest. A simple thing to nav a plane toward NYC. All you need is a map and then fly a general direction until you see a large city, then you aim for the big building.

Originally posted by gtirlad2
Didn't they hijack the plane at the very last minute? like they boarded the planes as normal using fake passports etc and chose the specific planes for the flight path needed to make the terrorist attack possible, then hijacked the plane at the very last minute before the attack?

For the Pentagon flight, the offical story has the take-over at a very early stage right after take-off. Interesting to me - this happens with very little flight control reaction shown iby the FDR simulation, that is for getting two pilots out of the their seats - durring this supposed time period.

reply to post by scrapple


scrapple, no need to be insulting, is there?

Really, I have said already, even before you used my USER name in vain, that I have no idea about the discrepancies in the AA77 DFDR. I ahven't studied it enough, I just say what I know about how we fly airplanes.

I have been directed to something, by someone else, and I just printed it up, and will read it.

I don't want people to get all tight in the panties over this issue, I hope we can discuss openly, and logically.

Believe me when I say, if I get convinced that the 'official' storyis an outright lie, then I will say so. I'm just being Switzerland here, for now.

sidebar...I've spent a lot of money on a cruise, this Summer, in the Baltic. I REALLY want to go on this cruise, since I've also booked Biz Class on BA for the trip....I'm gonna get miles, of course....but if the World blows up again, while we're out of country....well, my cat died already, so I'll pack everything I need, and drain my bank accounts before I go, just in case...............

reply to post by scrapple


scrapple, I'm not sure AA77 was taken over as quickly as your last post would seem to indicate....but, I will read the data ai jsut printed, as I mentioned earlier...

WW

reply to post by dismanrc


Do you have a link to that... cuz in my mind.. i'm thinking .. 2 engine private NOT airliner..

Originally posted by weedwhacker
reply to post by scrapple

 

scrapple, I'm not sure AA77 was taken over as quickly as your last post would seem to indicate....but, I will read the data ai jsut printed, as I mentioned earlier...

WW

I think you may find that the captain tells DC 'good day' at the hand-off. The cabin attack is theorized to have happened shortly after. I naively call that early in the travel loop. Could we say end of the first 1/4 or 1/3?

BTW, I only take the Lord's name in vain.
-but true sympathies for your cat.

Night,
Scrapple

reply to post by scrapple


Well, scrapp....I can only guess about the right-hand turn....

Here's something to consider, just to point out the visibility from the cockpits....we used to have to be trained in something called a 'circling' [sp?] approach....we did this in the simulator....

This is a procedure where you let down, following the VOR or other non-precision guidance, to an altitude, the minimum altitude for the procedure, where you are (hopefully) below the clouds, and once have the airport in sight, you 'circle' visually to the assigned runway.

Well, my airline stopped training for this, since it is antiquated, and we had GPS on every airplane, plus we had auto-land capability as well....no point in wsting Sim time on procedures that won't be used....

But, back to your question...a B757 has pretty good visibility out of the cockpit windows, from either seat. Perhaps the actual person flying was sitting in the right seat? Could be...although we teach beginners in the left seat, I know I started there...I learned to fly from the right seat when I had only about 500 hours....it is weird at first, but only takes a few minutes, one flight, to get accustomed....

What if these guys had THOUSANDS of dollars to spend on Simulator time, the Ultimate video game?!?!?

If I were wealthy, I would invite most of you from ATS to enjoy a few hours flying a Sim....not only would it be fun, but it would be educational!!!

Best, WW

wow i didnt expect for so many people to read this or leave their comments. its all good. I guess i have to have post more hot topics.

What do you guys think hit the Pentagon because that hole is too small for a plane??

reply to post by pro420


pro420...I live in the area, I saw the Pentagon damage...drove by it, saw it, the damage was huge.

My house actually shook, as the floors collapsed....this, at about 1000...maybe 1010...I was upstairs, looking East out my window when I felt the tremor.

My House was just a few miles from the Pentagon....

See, I actually know a little about the DC area...I LIVE here!

I know the terrain, I know people who saw AA77 as it passed by their balconies....you see, we know these things...the road 'Columbia Pike'...look it up on Google, you will see how it was a direct path to the Pentagon....

Keep trying, though....WW

Originally posted by Komodo
reply to post by dismanrc

 

Do you have a link to that... cuz in my mind.. i'm thinking .. 2 engine private NOT airliner..

If you learn to fly any multi engine jet, you could fly an airliner. The only difference is the location of the controls. Modern jets almost fly themselves.

reply to post by dismanrc


dismanrc you are getting it!!

question...to you fly R/C?

WW

reply to post by weedwhacker


Im sorry but i really dont think that the 757 crashed into the pentagon. It was something else. on video cameras you dont see the plane. theres something there but not a 757.

reply to post by pro420


I would never underestimate a terrorist, if they can figure out how to get explosives past security in shampoo bottles than they can definately use a GPS. Field dressing an AK-47 is much harder than plugging in some coordiantes on a GPS. And the GPS could easily have been pre-set.

reply to post by pro420


pro420, which video camera are you referring to?

The one that only took a pic every two seconds?

The one aimed at the parking lot, and was designed to look for intruders, people who would not be flying in at 500mph????

OK, then, under those criteria, guess you got me!!!

WW

Let me tell you a little story...I was a crewchief on a Blackhawk helicopter. One night we went out on a training mission our goal was to fly from Savannah Ga. and end up in a place near Jacksonville Fl.. It was a night flight and we were using both a doppler and omega. We were doing pretty well hitting our way points but at sometime along the flight we lost our way. We ended up at a runway near the coast of Ga. The funny thing was we had no idea where we were and we got lucky because there was also a customs Blackhawk there doing training too and they told us where we were. Why would I admit this little FUBAR well it is an example of how hard it can be to fly even with instumentation.

For a person to fly that big plane (Which I have flown in a simulator, and I crashed everytime) they would have to be very good pilots. A couple of scenerios might be:

1. They forced the pilots to fly them back to NYC and possibly made them fly right up to the very last minute.

2. That they were very expierenced pilots and had knowledge of their flight plan.

3. They used the onboard flight computer to get them close enough for the pilot to take over.

One other thing...just a thought...Building 7 was destoyed on purpose I believe no can deny this fact. So maybe it was control center where the planes were vectored to. Now I`m trying to start anything but we know that there was a reinforced bunk inside the building...just an X files idea.

See ya..