The "Anonymous" Scientology Protest is an NSA/FBI Fishing Expedition

reply to post by Gazrok


How about an vast underground labyrinth of super-computers capable of doing the things you highlight, perhaps in a place like Area 51 or similar?

Don't forget those cunning little scientists will be working on computerised communication as well as aircraft.

edit; this is one of those posts where i simply highlight the 'unknown' factor, so you don't really need to take it seriously.

[edit on 25-2-2008 by Throbber]

[Mod Edit: In order to foster as free a discussion as possible ATS remains neutral on matters. In order that this should be seen as such potential advertising/recruitment in the manner here is not accepted. Please see Terms and Conditions of Use 1e and 4. Thank you - Jak]

[edit on 25/2/08 by JAK]

Is everybody taking note of how upset and in denial these supposed "Anonymous" folks are? Each one of the myriad of screen names has assured us repeatedly that they're not with the government. Many of them have said it's impossible that they're being controled by FBI/NSA. Notice how they are completely closed off from the possibility (the reality) that it IS government controled. You can't know that this movement isn't being controled regardless of how Anonymous and independent you think membership is. The fact that you give a rats ass about Scientology is already promoting it as being something way bigger than it actually is.

People as "revolutionarily" minded as you Anonymous folks should be questioning how this movement started. Who was the first Anonymous guy? Why did he start a faceless movement? How has it been able to receive so much hype? And why does Anonymous clearly focus on "Scientology" not "criminals" or "corrupt corporations" or other individual rights abuses... instead of actually making the difference you claim to be making, you are creating a straw man that the government will use to knock down the 1st ammendment.



[edit on 25-2-2008 by freight tomsen]

reply to post by another anon


I actually find that is usually the case, which is why i like to look at the more critical possibilities when i can.

There is one thing though - i 'know' for a fact that everything we're talking about is linked in with something bigger than a simple anti-scientology movement.

I could try and explain this by highlighting the same event that was forclosed in this thread - i.e; the Youtube issue.

Not only would someone need to have known when and how Anon was going to post those vids, but they'd also need to know who they would be able to talk to on the technical staff who would be willing to accept a bribe.

Unless of course one of Youtube's Techies is infact a planted agent, but n/m that for now.

I reckon, and this isn't even something i think that anyone 'Anon' would even dare consider, that the Anon movement stands a good chance of exposing these people for who they are.

I'm going to shut up NOW before i say something that has me labelled 'high-risk'.

Originally posted by Throbber

1: More Details, please.

This is something that can be used against scientology from the outside of the Anon movement, just incase anyone is listening who feels it nessecary to lend a hand.

2: Same country?

3: It isn't supposed to be fun.

1)

the two big ones I recall off hand is someone filming the owner of enturbulation, and someone stalking one of the people involved in the Austin raids.

2) not sure what you mean, there are reports coming in from all over (that thread only has some of them)

3) it is, we are fighting a ruthless international crime syndicate that has killed untold numbers of people in it's bid for power, and yet it is powerless to do anything about us, because we are documenting everything and because there are so many of us if anything happens to one of us the rest will utterly swarm. we are just waiting for them to pull something overt so we can use it against them, it's only a matter of time before they try something stupid. and that's when the real fun will begin, useing there own crimes against them.




[Mod Edit: In order to foster as free a discussion as possible ATS remains neutral on matters. In order that this should be seen as such potential advertising/recruitment in the manner here is not accepted. Please see Terms and Conditions of Use 1e and 4. Thank you - Jak]

[edit on 25/2/08 by JAK]

Originally posted by another anon
it's only a matter of time before they try something stupid. and that's when the real fun will begin, useing there own crimes against them.

Do you understand what i mean by the "Carrot-on-the-stick" analogy i made yet, or do you want me to compare Anon to an over-confident wolf moving in on what appears to be a lame bear cub?

In clarity; Move in on Scientology, the lame bear cub, and the big mommy Justice System Bear will jump into the scene, wailing at ya'll with a baseball bat and having false information force-fed down it's throat.

edit; You could say i think it's a tad dangerous to underestimate the true purpose of Scientology.

For example - Why has it not been condemned publicly as a cult by the establishment?

Answer: The Establishment understands that Scientology is a target.

[edit on 25-2-2008 by Throbber]

Originally posted by anon too
reply to post by Skyfloating

 

A little moar history to add about Scientologie, not Scientology...
forums.enturbulation.org...

Yes, some of it is stolen from there. And there are also many, many almost verbatim copies of crowleys work.

Originally posted by Throbber

Originally posted by ArtfulD
There are as-yet unconfirmed reports of people being targeted offline. Three protesters were assaulted on the 10th. It's no fun to launch a movement that's just going to be met with indifference.

1: More Details, please.

This is something that can be used against scientology from the outside of the Anon movement, just incase anyone is listening who feels it nessecary to lend a hand.

2: Same country?

3: It isn't supposed to be fun.

1. forums.enturbulation.org...

There ya go.

I think it was 2 in the US and one in Australia? Noone was hurt, but still.

And 3? Well, that's just the wrong damn attitude to take IMO. Down that road lies tinfoil wankery.

reply to post by mister.old.school


You lie:
Statement Six: The group, "Anonymous", is a target of the NSA and FBI
Regardless of the more realistic likelihood that this group is nothing more than bored 15-year olds, both of these agencies have labeled the group "cyber terrorists" and have placed a high priority on infiltration and prosecution.

In fact:
The Church of Scientology called Anonymous "cyber-terrorists." Also CoS said their Bibles were "Mein Kampf and Communist Manifesto." This is because the Church's "fair Game" policy to handle "suppressive persons." In that policy, they are ordered to "always attack, never defend." Also, SPs may be "tricked, lied to, or destroyed."

reply to post by freight tomsen

You are endlessly entertaining with the never ending rants about government control. I haven't been here long, but Imma willin' to bet my lazars that you always find a way to turn any topic of conversation towards government control and secret stuff (that anon can't talk about because we would have to invoke rule 34) .

"Who was the first Anonymous guy? Why did he start a faceless movement?"
You truly have no clue about any of this.


Believe what you will, anon will just laugh or politely not pay attention.




[edit on 25-2-2008 by anon too]

reply to post by ArtfulD


I'll take tinfoil wankery over leading myself down the rabbit hole to my own destruction, pal.

You're a' dancin to the tune of the piper', and you're too charmed by what you hearin' to realise it.

edit; Yes, i suppose the pied piper is probably a better analogy.

The point is - are the mice being lead by the piper, or the music?

[edit on 25-2-2008 by Throbber]

reply to post by freight tomsen


Firstly.

www.whyaretheydead.net...

This is the kind of abuse you support.

Secondly, I'm now of the opinion this man is an OSA plant.

1. Scientologist 'handlers' are taught to always attack, never defend.

2. They claim any critic is perpetrating religious bigotry and prejudice.

3. They "black pr" anyone critical of scientology whether or not it is truth.

Look through the thread for yourselves people, I ask you, who has been the more hostile/agressive?

As to his points.

Originally posted by freight tomsen
Is everybody taking note of how upset and in denial these supposed "Anonymous" folks are? Each one of the myriad of screen names has assured us repeatedly that they're not with the government. Many of them have said it's impossible that they're being controled by FBI/NSA.

Something about which you've done nothing other than scream lies, no evidence, no tangible theory that doesn't have two sides to it. Paranoia is fine, theory is fine, but you're the one proclaiming it as fact, not us.

I actually went as far as to say that it's possible, but unlikely, that this was started by third parties in the goverment.

Originally posted by freight tomsenThe fact that you give a rats ass about Scientology is already promoting it as being something way bigger than it actually is.

A scientologist on the Operation Clambake forums also said that critical PR is still positive PR.

Besides which, it's abuses are sizeable, and thus being promoted as such.

How exactly is that surprising?

Originally posted by freight tomsenPeople as "revolutionarily" minded as you Anonymous folks should be questioning how this movement started. Who was the first Anonymous guy? Why did he start a faceless movement? How has it been able to receive so much hype?

I dealt with this, and the why they're focused on scientology earlier, something you conveniently ignored.

Try harder.

reply to post by Throbber


Actually, Scientology sought their tax exemption using their usual illegal methods. Part of operation snow white was to send an army of PIs after individuals that would be involved with determining their tax status. The dug up dirt on all these people and used it to compromise many. They also infiltrated the US government to compromise it from the inside. Anonymous is very aware how dangerous the cult is, and that's exactly why they are having success where others failed: anonymity protects them.

Originally posted by freight tomsen
Is everybody taking note of how upset and in denial these supposed "Anonymous" folks are? Each one of the myriad of screen names has assured us repeatedly that they're not with the government. Many of them have said it's impossible that they're being controled by FBI/NSA. Notice how they are completely closed off from the possibility (the reality) that it IS government controled. You can't know that this movement isn't being controled regardless of how Anonymous and independent you think membership is. The fact that you give a rats ass about Scientology is already promoting it as being something way bigger than it actually is.

People as "revolutionarily" minded as you Anonymous folks should be questioning how this movement started. Who was the first Anonymous guy? Why did he start a faceless movement? How has it been able to receive so much hype? And why does Anonymous clearly focus on "Scientology" not "criminals" or "corrupt corporations" or other individual rights abuses... instead of actually making the difference you claim to be making, you are creating a straw man that the government will use to knock down the 1st ammendment.
[edit on 25-2-2008 by freight tomsen]

ah, and here we have it. having lost the argument on our motives and methods he starts back anew, right back were he started, laities and gentlemen I accept his surrender. thank you for playing have a nice day.

Originally posted by another anon
we are fighting a ruthless international crime syndicate that has killed untold numbers of people in it's bid for power, and yet it is powerless to do anything about us, because we are documenting everything and because there are so many of us if anything happens to one of us the rest will utterly swarm. we are just waiting for them to pull something overt so we can use it against them, it's only a matter of time before they try something stupid. and that's when the real fun will begin, useing there own crimes against them.

Notice the spelling in Anon too's threads. He can spell "ruthless international crime syndicate" but spells "using" wrong. Look at his threads, he is eloquent and a good speller generally, but there are grammar/spelling mistakes thrown in randomly to make him seem of normal intelligence level. He is cointel pro trying to convince you he's not and that Anonymous could not possibly be a government op.

He says, "its only a matter of time before they try something stupid." But earlier he was saying that they have already done so many things stupid... why does he here focus on some future "stupid" thing that Scientology will do? If Anon too and the Anonymous movement really wanted to bring these people to justice, they would go after the individuals, not their organization. You can't get convictions for "being involved in Scientology" or anything of the sort, so what do you think your movement is doing towards bringing them to justice? All you're doing is creating a frenzy of dislike/hate towards a minority. Haven't we moved past hate crime?

reply to post by freight tomsen


I appreciate your conspiracy-theory but I dont think we dont need to attack other ATS-members prematurely. This would only enturbulate the thread.

Máybe it was only a typo

reply to post by GoblinBlix


You forget that people are afraid of the unknown, and that is exactly what Anonymity is.

The single point i'm making in this post is that Anonymity is both your blessing AND your curse - and that because of this that Scientology will hold the higher ground.

And why?

Because people think they know more about scientology than they do about Anon.

This is actually a psychological theory on how people recognise others as friends or enemies - a face you can see similarities with your own in is more likely to be an ally than a face which has NO similarities*.

Anon has essentially become the Establishment's next "Al Qaeda", except no one knows how to look at you other than as faceless cyber-terrorists.

At least, that would be my paranoid belief as of this moment.




*Scientology is a religion, and therefore religious people could see this as positive, because those who follow scientology believe in something extra-ordinary.

[edit on 25-2-2008 by Throbber]

reply to post by freight tomsen


1. Personal attacks.

2. Accusations of prejudice, despite claims otherwise that you have not adressed or taken notice of.

3. Accusations of perpetration of ahte crimes.

Kindly show me proof of the second and third, that isn't in contradiction with what has been stated as the actual aims and standpoint of Anonymous.

Kindly leave the first out as it is utterly uncessary in a civil discussion.

As a sidenote, if you have any sincere questions to ask, rather than baseless hatred to preach for us, I would be more than happy to give you my two cents on the topic as a member of Anonymous and a long time lurker.

EDIT: That last part goes to anyone here, I'm more than happy to answer questions, although I do have some errands to run in about ten minutes, and they may take up to an hour or two, but I'll rea through and catch up on my responses when I return.

[edit on 25-2-2008 by KosherKrackers]

[edit on 25-2-2008 by KosherKrackers]

As this topic is one which arouses passions I'd just like to post a little reminder to all:

Terms and Conditions of Use

A Word About Politeness.

Courtesy Is Mandatory

Sorry to interrupt, please continue. Fascinating thread.

Jak

As a side-note; The first step in the Implementation of the Ultimate Strategy has EVERYTHING to do with the internet, btw.