Healthy eating only for the rich?

Originally posted by Loki
reply to post by scientist

 

Anyway, soy is great. I actually love curried Tofu. However it's not what you'd call economical. It's pretty expensive, honestly. I'm reading the China study now.

Soy is not all what it's cracked up to be and I would highly recommend avoiding it. Soy contains high amounts of estrogen and has been linked to everything from infertility, breast cancer, developmental issues, premature puberty in girls, and slowed masculine development in males.

Link to interesting article

More than 70 years of human, animal, and laboratory studies show that soybeans put the thyroid at risk. The chief culprits are the plant hormones in soy known as phytoestrogens or isoflavones.57-59 The United Kingdom's Committee on Toxicology has identified several populations at special risk: infants on soy formula, vegans who use soy as their principal meat and dairy replacements, and men and women who self-medicate with soy foods and/or isoflavone supplements in an attempt to prevent or reverse menopausal symptoms, cancer, or heart disease.60

A crucial time for the programming of the human reproduction system is right after birth-the very time when bottles of soy formula are given to many non-breastfed babies. Normally during this period, the body surges with natural estrogens, testosterones, and other hormones that are meant to program the baby's reproductive development from infancy through puberty and into adulthood. For infants on soy formula, this programming may be interrupted.68-70

Originally posted by Wildbob77

We don't need more poor people on this planet. So stop having kids you cna't afford.

[edit on 21-11-2007 by Wildbob77]

I was on the way to agree with you until i see your last sentence.
I mean ok i understand your view why have a child when you can't even get food for you, but this... what that mean? we can't have childs if we are poor? do you think we always have the choice? the sate aren't here to support us on this case? Does that mean a child born in a poor family will be always poor? how old are you? are you kidding? is this really you? do you ever been poor in your life? do you know you can be rich one day and the next day living in the streets? what to do in this case,say " ok son/daughter i'm not rich anymore then you have to leave coz poor people can't have child, you have to go in a rich family".

If only one day poor can be rich and rich become poor, i'd like to see the rich's face.

Originally posted by annestacey
Another thing that is going on with the food industry is that they add chemicals to the food to make them taste better (and some of these chemicals actually cause addiction to the food) and this is all done to sell more of their products.

Yes, and the reason they are added is because the processing and preservatives added virtually remove the taste of the food. So they remove the taste, then re-add chemicals to supplement the tastes they remove. It's crazy.
Same thing happens with dairy... the pasteurization process removes essential vitamins/minerals which is why you always see "Enriched with XYZ". Same with breads. Bread is essentially void of nutrition unless you are eating whole grain bread. Not wheat, but whole grain.
Virtually every product sold in a "big box" grocery store contains MSG and as stated on the MSG website, increases appetite.

I suggest everyone read the book Fast Food Nation.

Originally posted by Loki
reply to post by scientist

 

Here is a study that illustrates the principle of what I'm saying (in rats)

These are rats dude, not humans, thats why i don't understand animal testing, we don't have the same organism so why compare us to them or other animal?
I'm vegan for soon 3 years and was vegetarian 5 year before being vegan and i'm really healty, i'm never sick and eat some so yummy dishes.
But does this article speak about the danger of eating meat? no? this is strange........
Do you know what is the effect of animal fat on our organism? do you know that our body is alergic to cow milk and this is why lot of people can't digest it?
The only real """""problem""""" in being vegan it's the vitamine b12, but you can find it mushrooms and pickles and certainly in other vegetables/cereals, also our body product it naturaly but some ingredients that we eat stop this production, and do not use soya as the only proteins source, proteins is everywhere.

GO VEGetariAN

[edit on 21-11-2007 by ufopunx]

reply to post by ufopunx




After 20 years of personal experimentation in diet, and plenty of reading too, I came to the conclusion that one man's poison is another man's miracle food.

I did vegetarian and I also did raw, then I read some Arjonus Vonderplanitz (yeah well, his name was originally Dick!) who cured himself from 7 life threatening cancers etc using a diet of 90% animal fat. Tried that too, the only radical diet I actually felt satisfied on until I moved on from it

I spent at least a decade ramming dietary lifestyles down the throats of loved ones - oops.

If you found a great diet that makes you feel and look healthy, then fantastic. However, you need to understand that others have found ways that probably contradict yours, and they also feel and look great.

If you're obese though, then you got it seriously wrong, sorry. No sympathy, no excuses, just get a grip and get into action, unless of course you enjoy being grossly overweight with a shortened life, then go for it


Mod Note: Trim Those Quotes - Please Review this link

[edit on 23-11-2007 by DontTreadOnMe]

Originally posted by ufopunx
Do you know what is the effect of animal fat on our organism? do you know that our body is alergic to cow milk and this is why lot of people can't digest it?

[edit on 21-11-2007 by ufopunx]

Studies have shown that properly raised red meat (grass fed, free range, no drugs) is just fine for you. Also studies of old societies have shown that people living on a very high saturated fat diet of meat and raw dairy have no heart issues, are very healthy, and have very little dental issues.

The human body is not allergic to cow milk and that is not why people have digestion problems with milk. The reason lies in the pasteurization process, the homogenization process, and the process of converting the milk to low-fat, 2%, or non-fat milk. Many people, myself included, who have dairy allergies (i break out very badly in hives) can drink raw milk just fine. I buy my milk directly from an organic dairy down the street from me.... it's $8 a galon, but worth it.

This site has a lot of great articles and information on Raw Milk.

reply to post by Enrikez


I've only had my high paying job for a few years. prior to that, I was on £12,000 year (before tax) for several years. That would be a take home of around £800 a month. Not that much when you consider rent took up more than half of that and council tax another £100 month.

Never put on weight, managed to eat right and stayed fit and healthy. I've been 10-11 stone throughout.

No high horse here chap, been there, done that, got the t-shirt. Just because I am "rich" now, does not mean that was always the case.

It is a little more complicated than this.
It would be nice to simplify things.
It has to do with lifestyles somewhat. The constant consumerism. People would rather spend money on cable, cars, and clothes then spend it on healthy food. To afford a house, new cars, the big screen tv, tivo, and everything else, both parents work. Sticking their kids in daycare. The parents are too busy to cook healthy, so they buy conveinvance food.
There is a stigma against spending money on food there. We want the most bang for our buck. RAther spend money on bulk mac n cheese then buy salads. And the macncheese you can throw in a microwave.
And here organic food is more expensive. It is not mainstream and everyone can't afford it. though it is shifting.
But it conditioned from the beginning. Even infant formula contains corn syrup. And you don't ahve any other choice if you can't breastfeed.
There are very few healthy items in schools. This is a serious problem that is not being addressed. It is hamburgers, pizza, fries, and mashed potatoes. So if kids are being raised on this? what are they going to eat as adults?
I was on a low fat diet in high school. And during break the lowest fat item I could find to snack on was a rice crispy treat. I met a teacher from my school recently and apparently it hasn't changed.

I'd say being a college student is difficult to live a healthy lifestyle, personally at my college the closest grocery store near campus is a 5-8 minute drive away.

Unfortunately, not everyone has the luxury of a car, plus my college doesn't provide a kitchen for kids living in dorm/housing, so most kids resort to the dining hall or the food court, and I can say food there is HORRIBLE. Even the healthy one has low quality, high fat cut slab of meat.

We have a boars head, but when your a growing kid, paying 5-6 dollars for JUST a sandwich about 4x4 doesn't really do you any good.

Most of the time I'm usually in the school library, and always grab a bit at the quickest food chain, granted it it not be mcdonald or tacobell....urg...

Luckily I live in an apartment, but the mean of transportation to a grocery store is my biggest problem, I guess along with the fact that I can't don't know any recipes for a healthy meal (ps. if you guys have any, U2U it to me, or just reply on the board.)

reply to post by canuck7500


Cargill supplies all of the meat patties to McDonalds restaurants in Ontario. Approx. 500 restaurants.

This I know for a fact.

reply to post by skyblueff0


Transportation would be an issue to be solved.

But I eat pretty well and I don't have any fancy recipes. Eggs, turkey bacon, hash browns, whole grain cereal, wheat toast, oranges, quality lunch meats and cheeses, peanuts, apples, lettuce, grilled chicken breast, baked beans, baked potato, steamed rice, grass-fed steak, various soups... mix and match and you've got the usual meals for my typical day.

Basically just try to stay in the perimeter of the grocery store. All the processed crap is in the aisles.

Originally posted by RogerT

I did vegetarian and I also did raw, then I read some Arjonus Vonderplanitz (yeah well, his name was originally Dick!) who cured himself from 7 life threatening cancers etc using a diet of 90% animal fat. Tried that too, the only radical diet I actually felt satisfied on until I moved on from it

Thanx for the info i did some search about him [ it's Aajonus not arjonus... ], but does raw meat isn't a good way to get a tapeworm? at least he cured his cancer, it's a good thing.
i have a friend who tried to be crudivore, not for a long time..., the idea is good, the food is more healty and don't need to use gas or electricity but personally i couldn't always eat raw.

If you found a great diet that makes you feel and look healthy, then fantastic. However, you need to understand that others have found ways that probably contradict yours, and they also feel and look great.

I understand the other's choice, i like to speak about that, as i said in my first post (bottom of page 6), it's all about choice!!!!!
Personally i feel better like that, physically and mentaly, when i was vegetarian i always had a bad fellings when eating eggs, i imagined the foetus and wanted to puke, so i started to be vegan and now i'm fine.
I did it more for the animal than for my health.

If you're obese though, then you got it seriously wrong, sorry. No sympathy, no excuses, just get a grip and get into action, unless of course you enjoy being grossly overweight with a shortened life, then go for it

I'm 5.5 feet tall and weight 119 pounds, then i don't think i'm obese

Originally posted by urbal

Studies have shown that properly raised red meat (grass fed, free range, no drugs) is just fine for you. Also studies of old societies have shown that people living on a very high saturated fat diet of meat and raw dairy have no heart issues, are very healthy, and have very little dental issues.

I always heard that high satured animal fat diet was the cause of heart problem and also block the artery, maybe not in the old socities..
So why all people who have cardiac problem and stuff are recommended to do not eat red meat/high satured animal fat?

The human body is not allergic to cow milk and that is not why people have digestion problems with milk. The reason lies in the pasteurization process, the homogenization process, and the process of converting the milk to low-fat, 2%, or non-fat milk. Many people, myself included, who have dairy allergies (i break out very badly in hives) can drink raw milk just fine. I buy my milk directly from an organic dairy down the street from me.... it's $8 a galon, but worth it.

This site has a lot of great articles and information on Raw Milk.

Didn't know that, at my knowledge the body was allergic to the whole kind of milk.
Do you never tried soy milk? A friend who didn't digest the cow milk tried to soya milk and digest it very well, I know that the natural taste is not that great but those with chocolate or vanilla etc... are pretty good, the taste is really near from the cow milk, i also tried the rice milk with almond taste, very good too!!!

Originally posted by ufopunx


I'm 5.5 feet tall and weight 119 pounds, then i don't think i'm obese

Wasn't referring to you bro'

That was to the dude who said he's obese, and also suggests that 4 people need 3 whole lettuces for a side salad. Bit of a clue there

Originally posted by ufopunx
Do you never tried soy milk? A friend who didn't digest the cow milk tried to soya milk and digest it very well, I know that the natural taste is not that great but those with chocolate or vanilla etc... are pretty good, the taste is really near from the cow milk

oh, i beg to differ! The main reason i switched to soy, was because I preferred the taste. I get the unsweetened kind too (dont even get me started on the sugar conspiracy). It's much smoother than cow's milk, tastier, and doesn't leave a film in your mouth, or excess mucus! I became more aware of the health benefits much after i had already been drinking soy instead of dairy for a while.

[edit on 21-11-2007 by scientist]

[edit on 21-11-2007 by scientist]

Originally posted by ufopunx

So why all people who have cardiac problem and stuff are recommended to do not eat red meat/high satured animal fat?

Do you never tried soy milk? A friend who didn't digest the cow milk tried to soya milk and digest it very well, I know that the natural taste is not that great but those with chocolate or vanilla etc... are pretty good, the taste is really near from the cow milk, i also tried the rice milk with almond taste, very good too!!!

To your first question: My only response would be, what has Western Medicine really gotten "right" in the grand scheme of things? Not much, IMO.

Re: Soy... se my post at the top of page 7 in this thread about Soy. I used to drink soy milk and I must admit the chocolate soy is delicious, it's like drinking a desert! I do drink rice milk, unsweetened.... and raw milk.

Soy in the West has been a product of the industrial revolution-an opportunity for technologists to develop cheap meat substitutes, to find clever new ways to hide soy in familiar food products, to formulate soy-based pharmaceuticals, and to develop a renewable, plant-based resource that could replace petroleum-based plastics and fuels.

For years, the soy protein left over from soy-oil extraction went to animals and poultry. Now that food scientists have discovered inexpensive ways to improve or disguise the color, flavor, "bite characteristics," and "mouth feel" of soy protein-based products, soy is being aggressively marketed as a "people feed." Although the newer refining techniques yield blander, purer soy proteins than the "beany," hard-to-cover-up flavors of the past, the main reason that soy foods now taste and look better is the lavish use of unhealthy additives such as sugar and other sweeteners, salt, artificial flavorings, colors, and monosodium glutamate (MSG).

Soy now lurks in nearly 60 percent of the foods sold in supermarkets and natural food stores. Much of this is "hidden" in products where it wouldn't ordinarily be expected, such as fast-food burgers and Bumblebee canned tuna. Soy is also a key ingredient in ersatz products with names like Soysage, Not Dogs, Fakin Bakin, Sham Ham, and TofuRella, which have been named after and made to look like the familiar meat and diary products they are intended to replace.

There's nothing natural about these modern soy protein products. Textured soy protein, for example, is made by forcing defatted soy flour through a machine called an extruder under conditions of such extreme heat and pressure that the very structure of the soy protein is changed. Production differs little from the extrusion technology used to produce starch-based packing materials, fiber-based industrial products, and plastic toy parts, bowls, and plates.16

The process of making soy protein isolate (SPI) begins with defatted soybean meal, which is mixed with a caustic alkaline solution to remove the fiber, then washed in an acid solution to precipitate out the protein. The protein curds are then dipped into another alkaline solution and spray-dried at extremely high temperatures. SPI is then often spun into protein fibers using technology borrowed from the textile industry. These refining processes remove "off flavors," "beany" tastes, and some of the worst flatulence-producing components. They improve digestibility, but vitamin, mineral, and protein quality are sacrificed, and levels of carcinogens such as nitrosamines are increased.17-22 SPIs appear in so many products that consumers would never guess that the Federation of American Societies for Experimental Biology (FASEB) decreed in 1979 that the only safe use for SPIs was for sealers for cardboard packages.23

[edit on 21-11-2007 by urbal]

[edit on 21-11-2007 by urbal]

yup, processed soy can be just as bad as processed anything else. That's the main thing to look at. The soy bean itself is not so harmful. Soymilk is a byproduct of tofu, and many brands do not add nasty chemicals to the mix. It's important to look into the brands you are buying.

I have six children. Four girls and two boys. The oldest is 11 years young and not a single one of them are fat. It's anyone's choice to become fat and lazy and eat fast food restaurants. Me and my spouse eat good and work hard night and day to provide good foods to eat. Our children don't eat fruity pebbles or fruit loop cereal because we've never givin it to them.
Candy is a reward for good behavior and grades, not a snack that's gobbled down weekly. We bake alot of our foods just to stay away from greasy fried fat foods. We are definetly in the poor range when it comes to having extra money. ( I actually don't know what the meaning of " extra money is".)
I remember back when I was very young. Most families I knew had gardens with food in them. Now days I don't see very many gardens of food, just gardens of flowers and plants. Believe me, growing your own food will save lots of money at the grocery store.
I've even seen rich people that are way out of shape because they eat bad foods and pay everyone to do it for them. Being poor doesn't mean you have to eat crap. You just have to want to be healthy and make healthy choices for you and your children.

yep, this is disturbing indeed.....so does anyone have a solution to this?
Educating people about this isn't targeted towards the poor-the minds are
asleep and the consciousness is being tapped to stay dormant by putting other crap in food that is affecting people on all levels, not just on being obese, or mal nourished. The effects of these ingredients, additives. drugs and other wierd stuff is actually manipulating the brain cells/waves so that people will be less cognizant of the new world order taking place, and also more likely to fall into the controlled state....its mind blowing to say the least to read up on some of this info...There is very good info on this agenda regarding Food Safety and the government/FDA/new world order on Coast to Coast am Radio...just enter FOOD in the search box to view the various informative guests and get websites etc...

~SyN

Originally posted by Flyer
Not really, lots of people rent and arent allowed to grow things in the garden and lots of people live in flats or apartments without any garden access at all.

Also, lots of people live in a climate where its impossible, I take it youve never tried to grow any vegetables under 6 feet of snow?

You do not have to own land to tend land. I have several hundred trees planted on land that I have no financial intrest in. The previous generation has left fruit and nut trees on vacant lots across the city... go pick. There are drainage ditches and overgrown weed filled lots... turn it over. Plant a seed.

Whether or not there is six feet of snow on the ground (and I have lived in places like that), brown rice is still "99c/pound" and dried beans the same. Greenhouses. Potted veggies that can be brought in at night.

sprout your beans... add some...

google image search: winter snow cabbage

with or without vegatbles; you will be doing as good as anyone in the

google search: winter diet ukraine

No excuse.

Nobody lives in "a flat" or "an apartment" or "rents and cannot grow anything in the garden."

We all live here. On earth. Outside. Eden. One place. One people.

You create the boxes around your mind. You create the boxes around your circle of influence.

Plant a seed. Share.

Sri Oracle