EU urges Texas to end executions

Originally posted by jsobecky
reply to post by nickh

 

Recently Iran executed many people, among them a 16 year old girl. Her offense? Having a sharp tongue.

So tell me, did the EU intervene and try to save this young girl's life?

Well put jsobecky!I'd also like to add the next time europe's about to be over-run by who ever the next invaders are to let them defend themselves for a change!They are anti-american until they need us to defend them.Enough!

Originally posted by infinite
ashame it does,
heck, we even say the same to your homeland of Cuba.

The EU still has an embargo on Cuba.

Humm...why change this now to Cuba?

Anyways, actually here is the latest on the position of the EU on Cuba.

The European Union cannot accept that unilateral measures imposed by the United States on specific countries limit the Union's economic and commercial relations with third countries, in this case Cuba. Therefore, in November 1996, the Council of Ministers of the European Union adopted a regulation and a joint action to protect the interest of natural or legal persons resident in the European Union against the extraterritorial effects of the Helms-Burton legislation, which prohibits compliance with that legislation.

www.europa-eu-un.org...

As a matter of fact many of the businesses in Cuba are from Europeans, and many of the people who enjoy the "cheap services" in Cuba while Cubans keep suffering are......Europeans...... Well at least "rich Europeans".... Although many other rich people from other countries are also involved.

Originally posted by infinite
Because it was Prime Minister Brown and President Sarzoky who put it to the UN

I actually gave several links with excerpts which say differently.....

Originally posted by infinite
I'm sorry, did I make you cry again?

Actually I wasn't referring to you specifically, even though i find it strange that you went out of your way to change the facts and to leave out the U.S. involvement in the Darfur/Sudan resolution, and you were completely wrong about the EU wanting to keep the arms embargo to China.

But since you want to be smug about it.... We do not cry over such trivial matters.... After all we are "gun toting cowboys/cowgirls" right?....

[edit on 22-8-2007 by Muaddib]

reply to post by Muaddib


With regards,
In all honesty, you are one of the contributors who I genuinely believe to be well intentioned, reasoned as well as honerst and forthright and I respect that.
However, some of the comments displayed nothing but contempt and disrespect for Europeans daring to comment and discuss US domestic topics.
I have found this to be quite common on ats and found it annoying that a perfectly legitimate OP resulted in such blatant anti-european sentiment.

Yes, some of the "pro european" responses were anti-US but were merely in response to the anti-european posts.

I was merely pointing out that, as a generalisation, americans seem to think that they have some divine right to comment on anything and everything but no-one has a right to question or discuss US domestic topics. This my friend is hypocritical.

Obviously, US citizens have every right to question what goes on in their country and to express their own opinions, no-one has suggested anything other.


"Originally posted by Freeborn
"Keep out of our business because we are bigger and harder than you"
That's the biggest crock of you know what.
Get the biggest gun and shoot from the hip.



No one even suggested anything like that, but your remark only shows your own disdain for Americans and the U.S."

I think if you re-read all the posts you will see several examples of that mindset being displayed.

I repeat, I am in no way anti-US, far from it.
Whilst I disagree with a lot of the US governments foreign policies I feel that the world would be a much unsafer place without US involvement in world affairs.

Why, when stating US european heritage is it necessary to resort to petty name calling. We are no more barbarians than you. That is a fact.
Yes, you have developed your own individual culture but is still predominantly european, whether you like it or not that is still a fact.

There is no need for petty quarrelling and mud slinging; I respect your rights and your culture, please pay me and my fellow europeans the same respect.
If you don't then don't be suprised when anti-US sentiment is then expressed.
It's not hard.

As a Texan, I would like to invite the EU to shut the hell up...

I guess we could do something humane like load them on a plane and drop them off there...COD of course.

Victims of violent crime don't get mercy from their killers...when killers are sentenced after a fair trial, it is called justice. The families of the victims need to feel that justice is done. A life is a precious thing, but if you waste some poor soul while you're trying to get some cash to buy some dope...you will forfiet yours...that's fair don't you think?

Originally posted by Freeborn
.............
Why, when stating US european heritage is it necessary to resort to petty name calling. We are no more barbarians than you. That is a fact.
Yes, you have developed your own individual culture but is still predominantly european, whether you like it or not that is still a fact.
..............

I have to go so will only have time to anwser this.

My intentions were not to name call. You were trying to link Americans with Europeans, and i was trying to show you that we are as different from Europeans as you are from the barbarian descendants of the past.

It was not name calling. I was making an analogy.

Americans come from a myriad of many other cultures, not all of them European, but we are distinct from Europeans, we developed our own culture, just as you and other Europeans are distinct from the ancient barbarians and developed overtime your own cultures and beliefs etc..



[edit on 22-8-2007 by Muaddib]

seems like we have lotsa bloodthirsty people round here.
specially you big, bad texans....

to the couple people talking about not wanting to pay for a murderer to spend life in jail, how much does it cost to execute them?
have you any idea?

www.deathpenaltyinfo.org...

At the trial level, death penalty cases are estimated to generate roughly $470,000 inadditional costs to the prosecution and defense over the cost of trying the same case as an aggravated murder without the death penalty and costs of $47,000 to $70,000 for court personnel.

On direct appeal, the cost of appellate defense averages $100,000 more in death penalty cases, than in non-death penalty murder cases.

Personal restraint petitions filed in death penalty cases on average cost an additional$137,000 in public defense costs.
-----------^^^washington

A New Jersey Policy Perspectives report concluded that the state's death penalty has cost taxpayers $253 million since 1983, a figure that is over and above the costs that would have been incurred had the state utilized a sentence of life without parole instead of death

----------------

tennessee----Death penalty trials cost an average of 48% more than the average cost of trials in which prosecutors seek life imprisonment.

kansas----In its review of death penalty expenses, the State of Kansas concluded that capital cases are 70% more expensive than comparable non-death penalty cases. The study counted death penalty case costs through to execution and found that the median death penalty case costs $1.26 million. Non-death penalty cases were counted through to the end of incarceration and were found to have a median cost of $740,000.
--------------------------------

you get the idea....support what you want but don't use money as a cop out k? thanks

The average American is far less informed and educated than most Europeans, and most of us Americans have no idea about human rights campaigns . We execute the innocent and imprrison the mentally ill. There have been over 200 INNOCENT people released from prisons and DEATH ROWS across this nation because DNA proved their innocence.

Those cowboy redneck kill 'em all morons make the USA look like a backwater of ignorance and depravity. Sure people do bad things to each other, and they always will. Criminals do NOT stop and think about the penalties before they committ a crime, especially murder, they assume they will get away. The death penalty has NEVER been shown to reduce crime or murder at all.

Unless you have a PERFECT justice system, the death penalty is a sham and a way to kill the innocent along with the guilty. So many trials are slanted and unfair, with prosecutorial misconduct a common thing, that there is no way to assure that the really guilty party is the one on trial. It is a guessing game, and to guess with someones life is not right. The falsely arrested and charged, set up by crooked cops and such, are always the ones that get the most severe penalties; minorities, poor people and the weak are all victimized by the system.

Execute a man today and then tomorrow find out that he was really inocent. What do you say theen? Ooooppppps!! Sorry, we killed you by mistake. No good. Better to make life in prison the norm and then if a man is found out later to be innocent, then at least the poor sucker stil has his life even tho he may have missed a few decades while the courts find out what really happened.

Europe is more humane, more intelligent and kore educated per capita than the USA, in all areas.MOST Europeans KNOW that 9-11 was an inside job; the average American, dumbed down by Fox news and a diet of government lies, swallows it whole every time. Most Americans have no clue what is going on and rely on corrupt politicians for their laws and protections and controlled media for their education as to current events.

Hell, most Americans do not even know what year the 9-11 inside job happened in!! No idea!! Most Americans trust the government, against all proof that it is a bad idea. ost Europeans will get out and march and demonstrate if they do not like a policy..here we just turn the TV to American Idol and the sports channel and ignore all of the ' disturbing ' news that is going on all around us. We do not riot and demand and insist, we beg and whine ands then whimper and cry when the crooks ignore us.

We are the laughing stock of the world; we think we are high and mighty and all we really have is a lot more guns and ammo than anyone else, that makes us what? Good guys? No way, we are the monsters gobbling up the world with our despicable leaders like Bush and Cheney, total traitors and scum, while the rest of the world watches us and wonders what happened to the old America..it is gone, swept away by the crooks that are supposed to be representing us and the corporate masters that run the show.

Bush mocked and mimicked Carla Faye Tucker, a woman that was about to be executed. He actually mocked a condemned woman headed for her death. No matter the crime, the sight of a president mocking a woman about to die was a sickening example of a soul less and cruel man who cares only about image and politics. Bush presided over more executions than anyone, ever. The blood lust is a hard thing to deny when it is so plain and clear. Sick.

Sure, there are bad people that probably deserve to die, but until we can ASSURE that the innocent will not be executed, the death penalty is a bad thing. our system stinks and is set up for the rich to get away and the poor to be convicted; we see it all the time. Putting people to deatn siomply reinforces in the minds of the bad guys that they might as well go for broke if they are playing the game..might as well kill 10 witnesses to avoid the death penalty; it takes away any reason to limit damage. The death penalty is a throw back to a dark and brutal time in history and we should get rid of all death penalties totally. Make life mean life and never let them go.

Europe is way ahead of us in most every way; they have been civilized and cultured since before we ever had a foot set on this continent. We are the young bucks playing fast and loose with peoples lives and maybe someday we will grow up and see that we have a lot to learn from our Euro friends about what is best LONG TERM. We are short term thinkers here and we need to be long term..simple.

Originally posted by Muaddib
As a matter of fact many of the businesses in Cuba are from Europeans, and many of the people who enjoy the "cheap services" in Cuba while Cubans keep suffering are......Europeans...... Well at least "rich Europeans".... Although many other rich people from other countries are also involved.

There is a embargo now, after more human rights abuse in Cuba. Our embargo is very different from the United States, it's not that strict.

I actually gave several links with excerpts which say differently.....

I know, some where out of date

and you were completely wrong about the EU wanting to keep the arms embargo to China.

I didn't say the EU wanted to keep it. But it's still in place.

But since you want to be smug about it.... We do not cry over such trivial matters.... After all we are "gun toting cowboys/cowgirls" right?....

I had a little giggle over that

[edit on 22-8-2007 by infinite]

Originally posted by Muaddib
just as you and other Europeans are distinct from the ancient barbarians and developed overtime your own cultures and beliefs etc..

Well..I have to disagree.
One example, the Welsh

[edit on 22-8-2007 by infinite]

It is pretty simple - and it is true.



I think penalty of 100 years in prison is enough for every criminal to start thinking about his evil deeds he did in the past and in the end - he will eventually die in prison and never ever taste freedom again. Isn't that already a maximum penalty?

It costs 1.2 million dollars a year to keep an inmate alive in the Texas Department of Criminal Justice prisons. It costs 2 thousand dollars for an inmate to be executed. WEIGH THE PRICE and tell the EU to stay out of my state

Originally posted by eyewitness86
We execute the innocent and imprrison the mentally ill. There have been over 200 INNOCENT people released from prisons and DEATH ROWS across this nation because DNA proved their innocence.

^^^^facts that are usully glossed over........

Those cowboy redneck kill 'em all morons make the USA look like a backwater of ignorance and depravity.

^^^^totally agreed. a long time ago i was a supporter of the death penalty. as i got older, i realized how screwed up our system is and basically, we shouldn't go around killing people......maybe i don't get it cause i am not from texas....no gun rack in my car you know......

Unless you have a PERFECT justice system, the death penalty is a sham and a way to kill the innocent along with the guilty.

^^^^^^again, totally agreed. i would say our system is about the polar opposite of perfect so executing people should be the last thing we do.



.here we just turn the TV to American Idol and the sports channel and ignore all of the ' disturbing ' news that is going on all around us.

^^^^so true...my wife and i were talking about her friend at work..we watch a lot of news but this particular bubblehead never watches it or reads the paper cause she 'don't want to know what is going on', but you can bet she has an opinion on all the issues...


we are the monsters gobbling up the world with our despicable leaders like Bush and Cheney, total traitors and scum, while the rest of the world watches us and wonders what happened to the old America..

^^^agreed again. i love my guns and all that but i agree that 'we'(the gov) are in fact monsters....

Bush presided over more executions than anyone, ever. The blood lust is a hard thing to deny when it is so plain and clear. Sick.


^^^^HEY...he is 'the decider'....don't forget..hahahah

Putting people to deatn siomply reinforces in the minds of the bad guys that they might as well go for broke if they are playing the game..might as well kill 10 witnesses to avoid the death penalty; it takes away any reason to limit damage.

^^^agreed. go for broke...thats what happens

.

i basically think this country(as we currently know it) is doomed...all these issues piling up and it's gonna crack...
i just can not get behind the death penalty when the system is so screwed and i almost have to literally laugh when i see people all proud like to be from texas where so many get put to death...they make jokes like having a party...
i think it is pretty warped but hey, it's texas

Originally posted by wings_of_an_eagle
It costs 1.2 million dollars a year to keep an inmate alive in the Texas Department of Criminal Justice prisons. It costs 2 thousand dollars for an inmate to be executed. WEIGH THE PRICE and tell the EU to stay out of my state

please link that source....2 grand to execute someone huh?
i really don't think so..

i sourced some numbers a couple posts above yours...i have NEVER heard the 2 grand number....NEVER

Originally posted by Souljah
I think penalty of 100 years in prison is enough for every criminal to start thinking about his evil deeds he did in the past and in the end - he will eventually die in prison and never ever taste freedom again. Isn't that already a maximum penalty?

And does the State want to become like the criminal? do we want to lower ourselves to their world by taking life?

They've over stepped the mark, crossed the line and we do not support their actions.

An innocent man in prison can be freed, if he is not guilty, if you are executed then you can't.

That's the problem with the death penalty.

[edit on 22-8-2007 by infinite]

reply to post by wings_of_an_eagle


Well I think I know where your problem is - and you kind of nailed it. There are far TOO MANY prisoners in United States today! And there are nearly 2 Million "Blacks" imprisoned worldwide with over 1 Million of them being African Americans incarcerated here in the USA. Believe it or not the United States of America has more prisoners than do all of Europe (including Russia!), India, Australia, New Zealand, & Brazil combined an area that has a total population of over 2 Billion people which is almost 25% of the Worlds population contrast that to the USA which only has between 4-5% of the Worlds population yet it has 25% of the worlds prisoners.

So no wonder death penalty is to stay in the U.S.A. - have to get rid of all those prisoners one way or anther. It costs the country way too much money. But have you ever wondered why are there so many criminals?

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
I still have not seen one single solitary anti- death penalty proponent come up with a viable solution. It always reverts back to law abiding tax payers paying for murderers to live in our prison system. What sense does that make? Absolutely none

How about cutting thier spinal cord and have them stare at a blank wall for the rest of their life, I would go with that...

Sometimes death is the easy way out. If someone raped any of my kids I would find the family of the biggest bad gay inmate and pay them money to have thier love one rape this guy daily.

Originally posted by Xtrozero

How about cutting thier spinal cord and have them stare at a blank wall for the rest of their life, I would go with that...

Sometimes death is the easy way out. If someone raped any of my kids I would find the family of the biggest bad gay inmate and pay them money to have thier love one rape this guy daily.

are all people from texas as bad ass as you?
just curious

what if one of your kids were given the death penalty for something they didn't do?
who's bootay would you be stomping then?

As I'm from Texas, I will chime in on this little topic.

I have over the last few years changed my feelings on the death penalty. This change is primarily due to my own religious beliefs. In addition, I'm not so sure it is really working to deter crime.

However....whatever the State of Texas does is up to the State of Texas and its citizens; NOT the EU.

Here is my 'Texan' showing: The EU can mind its own damn business.

Originally posted by Txhunter67

However....whatever the State of Texas does is up to the State of Texas and its citizens; NOT the EU.

i agree with you...nothing to do with the EU...i just get all tingly when i read peoples posts about how pro death they are and al the fantastic things they would do to someone....
pretty amusing....

My opinion, for what it's worth being a barbaric european

I think it's hypocritical to say "it's wrong to kill someone so because you have killed someone we are going to kill you".

Also, with 400 people being executed i'm not quite sure it works as a deterrent. What are murder rates like in states with capital punishment compared to states without capital punishment?

However, I don't see what's wrong with lifetime imprisonment, bread and water, straw mattress and bucket to be slopped out daily for scumbags who have committed acts of pre-meditated murder, paedophiles, rapists etc.
And, the chain gang for all those unsavoury jobs that even the illegal immigrants don't want to do nowadays.
Surely that would be cost effective.

The purpose of sentencing these evil people must be to punish, not rehabilitate. They forgoe their right to be a member of society when they commit the crime.