Putin says:" I'll Point My Missiles at Europe"

I have been reading posts in this forum for a long time, but just now i decided to join in order to reply to this subject.
This ain't no joke as some wrote above, this is for real and it should concerne everyone no matter his origins.
And it's not just for defence as your officials say.Just think about it: how many times did they lied to you ? What makes it different now?

I for one am from Romania, a country that Putin specifically thought of in his speech.
Along with Bulgaria and Poland if i remember corectlly.
Putin speech was disturbing for me, i mean c'mon, it was a clear threat, not a threat to US , but a threat to some small ,by economical and world politics points of view, countries.
It just incresead my hate towards politicians and towards those that by a raised hand change out lifes.
At the moment in my country it's a political chaos, we've just had a referendum ,to vote for or against our president that was suspended by the parlament, and it's getting worse day by day.
Even tho we joined the UE looks like we are still the puppets of your government(USA).
In every war or conflict that USA had we send troops , there are known established US bases on our country territory and so on.
The sad part is that those that come to our country , appear to have more rights then us and the what's worst is the fact that they are well aware of that and try to make the best of it.
What's in it for us? For the average citizen? Nothing.Not even a thing
Not even the visas for US were removed.

When Putin said Europe he didn't meant Germany or France or Spain, he meant the eastern countries.
All the stress of living in a threatened country for nothing

Im sorry man, if anything happens you can bring your family over to my place in america. Its not that big a place and we dont have much but, if my government causes that much hell for yah ill help out.

Originally posted by themaster1
First of all i don't think it's a joke
Secondly, i support that because i'm so tired about US foreign policy

Let the Ruskies live their life DO NOT threat them

Communism is not a Threat aight, American Imperialism is

And clean the mess before it's too late Miss Colaleeza R.

First of all perhaps it would do you good to actually read what has been going on over there. The Polish and Czech Republic governments want to get a missile defense shield and asked for help from the United States for doing this.... The Russian government is the one who is threatening with reprisals if the U.S. helps these countries get a missile defense shield.... The Russian govenrmentis the bad guy because they have been blackmailing and threatening former Communist countries and countries in Europe in general.

But i guess some people will never change their mantra "the U.S. is evil", no matter the context of the topic because they hate everything that has to do with the United States...

Sad really.

Not like this matters anyway, even if we believe the public story in a nuclear war the missiles would be launched at whatever targets are deemed critical on short notice. It does not take much to load the target coordinates into the on board computer.

Bingo.

It's a political saber to rattle only... Still, it's a pretty bold statement...but I'm really wondering just how reliable those old nukes really are in this day and age... After all, it isn't like they've been puttin' out the dough to keep them at a constant state of readiness... Still, it's a valid threat though... but we've got far more dangerous snakes to tangle with...including the one in the White House...

Originally posted by the_sentinal
I'm sure the European's are lovin this....They weren't to thrilled with the last volly of threats Putin threw at them over this shield but I still say that all this flame throwing over a purely defensive missile system does not make sense, I'll say it again...There must be more to this than were being told.

Russia wants to have control over European countries, and more so over former Communist countries.

For what other reason would Russia make such threats over a defense missile shield?

The Russian government itself has 100 interceptors missiles in the defense system around Moscow, but of course, the Russian govenrment doesn't want any European countries having any missile defense system...

www.globalsecurity.org...

[edit on 4-6-2007 by Muaddib]

Originally posted by Muaddib
For what other reason would Russia make such threats over a defense missile shield?

Jumping on the "US is evil" bus makes for easy consumption...nothing more.

It’s a bit bigger than just simply placing a few US defensive systems inside a few countries in place…Imo, Moscow’s concerns may be pinned on future losses in the form of balance and inability to counter….using the typical “evil US” rhetoric.

The discussion about deployment of US systems in the region sparked a flurry of NATO interests in shielding all of Europe.

Immediately following the above recent meetings in which the possible deployments were mentioned, the Russian’s later met via NATO-Russian Council…Moscow’s statements followed. I can only imagine how the discussions went over….

Following high-level consultations, NATO member countries agreed that the territory of all member countries must be protected from missile threats, calling for “indivisible security”
---[snip]---
During the meeting, experts exchanged views on whether existing NATO missile defence projects – being developed in NATO to protect troops on operations - could be “bolted on” the US system to ensure that all of Europe is covered.

”The unanimous view was that the principle of the indivisibility of security should apply,” NATO Secretary General Jaap de Hoop Scheffer told reporters, “There is a shared desire that any US system should be complementary to any NATO missile defence system.”
NATO

If the US, Europe and/or NATO member nations begin on this project, Russia may not be able to maintain a sense of her own balance while slipping farther down the scales of influence.


mg

and do tell us is it bad for "all of Europe to be covered by a ballistic defense missile?...

Russia has already 100 of them, and they are trying to stop anyone from having any.

Things need to calm down, we are almost close to war with Iran, we don't need another situation building with the RUSS..besides whats the point on building this shield in Europe.. isn't russia a """democratic""" republic already?? almost 20 years now...

Originally posted by pleyades

isn't russia a """democratic""" republic already??

I believe they call it "dermokrati", which is a different kind of democracy...

I thought these missiles were already pointing at Europe. Where else would they be pointing at? The moon?

[edit on 2007/6/4 by Hellmutt]

Originally posted by Hellmutt
I thought these missiles were already pointing at Europe. Where else would they be pointing at? The moon?

They are, they are not, maybe. All it takes is an electronic command to retask the missiles and that does not take very long even after they go through all the codes etc.

Its a tempest in a tea pot trying to garner public opinion when in reality it means very very little.

Originally posted by pleyades
Things need to calm down, we are almost close to war with Iran, we don't need another situation building with the RUSS..besides whats the point on building this shield in Europe.. isn't russia a """democratic""" republic already?? almost 20 years now...

If you actually read why the Czech Republic and the Polish government are asking for help from the United States to build these defense missile system, then perhaps you might realise that Russia is not so democratic.

The Russian government has been blackmailing, and threatening these two former Communist countries and others as well. It was only time for at least some of these countries to stand up and say "enough is enough".

But of course, for some reason some people want to overlook what the Russian government has been doing, and keeps doing over there and instead want to claim "it is all the U.S. fault"...

[edit on 4-6-2007 by Muaddib]

Neither Russia or the US are good guys in this scenario. What we've actually been misled to believe is that the cold war actually ended. Since the collapse of the Soviet Union the US has seized the opportunity to roll out its "Pax Americana".

The ultimate piece in this jigsaw is attaining the position of nuclear primacy where the US can launch a first attack without fear of reprisal. This changes the stakes from the old stance of Mutually Assured Destruction and if you pinpoint the location of the missile defence systems, you'll see they encircle Russia as they know their biggest threat still comes from Moscow with its own energy supplies and thousands of nuclear missiles.

Putin is not stupid, he knows what the end game is and the innocence being portrayed by NATO and the western media is laughable and reinforces the negative opinion most ATS'ers have of the MSM.

Peace is not achieved by starting an arms race and it's not nice to admit but our side (the west), started it.

More about Russia and US nuclear primacy

[edit on 4-6-2007 by uknumpty]

Originally posted by uknumpty
.....................
Putin is not stupid, he knows what the end game is and the innocence being portrayed by NATO and the western media is laughable and reinforces the negative opinion most ATS'ers have of the MSM.

Peace is not achieved by starting an arms race and it's not nice to admit but our side (the west), started it.

Excuse me.... What exactly do European countries who don't want to be in the hands of Russia have anything to do with your claim that this will help the U.S. with it's "Global Domination" you apparently think is behind the U.S. agreement to help Poland and the Czech Republic?...

The only thing the U.S. is going to get out of this is money and good relations with these two European countries.

A missile defense system is no threat for Russia, much less when Russia has 100 missile interceptors, and i am pretty sure that neither Poland nor the Czech Republic have an economy capable of buying an arsenal that will scare the Russians...

BTW, I do find it strangely ironic, that when the Russians approached recently the Cuban government telling them "that they could buy anything they want in military equipment from Russia once again" barely anyone said a peep about it...


[edit on 4-6-2007 by Muaddib]

As an historian I think this all happened before in 1964 before most of you dear little babies were born.
Back then USA took the whole thing very very seriously but there is still so much conflicting material in what was written then and has been written recently to know if the world did actually go to the brink of nuclear war...but i tend to go with my instincts and as... yes we did go to brink.

This time around USA is quite a different place and i do not expect that you will take President Putin seriously or hear beneath the retoric the clear message that as a world leader he is giving.

Therefore to conclude I am of the opinion that substantial parts of and populations with USA will be destroyed when the long awaited 1964 event takes place (Come on Bob sing it from your wheel chair "Its a hard its a hard rain thats gonna fall."... and you too Barry get out on your walking stick and sing for us Eve of Destruction one more time maybe they haven't heard it yet)

In the history of the human race EVERY arms race has resulted in war. Anyone who thinks that current humans are any more civilised/rational than Romans/Carthaginians or England/Spain are seriously delusional. There WILL be war - are you prepared?


A war scenario was played out in semi-secret by the US a few years ago. They took recently retired civilian and military strategists and had them play a war game in real time using Europe as the battleground. It only took the participants 72 hours to launch nuclear weapons because the US could not sustain the conventional conflict.

When Gobachev unilaterally pulled back Russia's nuclear capability, the US had the perfect opportunity to respond in kind and demonstrate that it was not the insane, capitalist-controlled, imperialist, war-mongering thug that the rest of the world thought it was. The US proved us right by increasing its capability, becoming more xenophobic and aggressive and using its sole super-power status to send even more of the world's vulnerable into poverty and degredation. And don't think that the peoples of world are unaware of the real USA. Why do you think that much of the world is arming itself and developing military strategies independent of the US? To defend against the US when it finally decides to forcibly install the fourth reich. The only people unaware of the reality of the USA is the US people themselves. The next war won't be USA Vs Russia, it will be USA Vs the rest of the world. USA will lose, the planet will lose, humanity will lose.

Originally posted by intrepid

Originally posted by semperfoo


Theres a big distinct difference between the two. The US is not planting nukes near russian territory as the russians did 200 miles off the US mainland back in the 60s. And we are not forcing this shield onto Poland and the Czech republic. this is there choice. So lets stop blaming the evil ugly imperialist american scum for everything that happens.

What big difference? Just checked out Google maps. The Polish border is only about 450 miles from MOSCOW!!!

But... WE'RE NOT PUTTING NUKES ON POLISH SOIL!!

Originally posted by intrepid

Originally posted by semperfoo

not surprising really. the dems are cowards when it comes to national security.

And the Rep's might be crusading on to annihliation?

both partys are just as corrupt in my opinion. but i like how republicans are all about going after these scoundrels versus the democrats approach which is one of "lets just sit back and wait and see". Fighting them over there is better then waiting for them to draw first blood again. Which is why we must stay on the offensive. Meanwhile the dems want to pull out and concede defeat to the terrorist. What kind of message is that sending to the terrorist who actually want a democratic president for the US? What does that say in itself? They caught us with our pants down and we struck back with vengeance. They didnt expect this from the US. Why because they thought we had gone soft much like the rest of the world who had just sit on there hands while condemning such terroristic acts that had happened in years past. We finally stand up and do somthing and now the dems want to go on the defensive? This war can only be fought one way.. and thats to be on the offensive. The dems dont do that..thats not who they are.


[edit on 083030p://2606pm by semperfoo]

Originally posted by charlie_the_loafer
I have been reading posts in this forum for a long time, but just now i decided to join in order to reply to this subject.
This ain't no joke as some wrote above, this is for real and it should concerne everyone no matter his origins.
And it's not just for defence as your officials say.Just think about it: how many times did they lied to you ? What makes it different now?

I for one am from Romania, a country that Putin specifically thought of in his speech.
Along with Bulgaria and Poland if i remember corectlly.
Putin speech was disturbing for me, i mean c'mon, it was a clear threat, not a threat to US , but a threat to some small ,by economical and world politics points of view, countries.
It just incresead my hate towards politicians and towards those that by a raised hand change out lifes.
At the moment in my country it's a political chaos, we've just had a referendum ,to vote for or against our president that was suspended by the parlament, and it's getting worse day by day.
Even tho we joined the UE looks like we are still the puppets of your government(USA).
In every war or conflict that USA had we send troops , there are known established US bases on our country territory and so on.
The sad part is that those that come to our country , appear to have more rights then us and the what's worst is the fact that they are well aware of that and try to make the best of it.
What's in it for us? For the average citizen? Nothing.Not even a thing
Not even the visas for US were removed.

When Putin said Europe he didn't meant Germany or France or Spain, he meant the eastern countries.
All the stress of living in a threatened country for nothing

i understand your concerns. Let me just say that those US bases are there for your protection. You prolly dont like this. and thats totally understandable. I wouldnt like some other sovereign nation building bases all over my country. however, you should be blaming your government and the rest of the EU for not doing more to build an army that acts as one. If they did this then they wouldnt need the US to build bases all over your land. As much as you may hate to hear this the US is there for your protection. I think our history with europe speaks for itself. WWI and II throughout all the years of the coldwar we have been there standing by your side and there for your defense. I read an article a while back that talked alot about the differences of power between the EU and the US. It was a pretty good read though pretty long. It basically said that the US is there for the EUs protection..that the EU lives in a Utopia that wouldnt exist if not for the US military presence...

And another thing.. This is up to poland and the czechs.. The US isnt trying to force this on them. We're just letting them know that the keys to the gun safe are under the rug.

[edit on 083030p://5206pm by semperfoo]

Update: Bush Flies Into Missile Storm!

As President Bush tours Europe and the proposed missile sites a spokesperson for NATO stated this concerning Putins comments.....

a Nato spokesman, James Appathurai, said: "These kind of comments are unhelpful and unwelcome."

I also found this scarry bit of hype concerning a possible ploy by Putin to stay in office.

Other US concerns include the crackdown by Mr Putin on pro-democracy activists in Russia, increasing centralisation and the possibility that he will not stand down, as required by the constitution, at the end of his term. There are fears that Mr Putin could exploit the showdown with the US as an excuse to extend his stay.

Tha same could be said of Bush, and has been said of Bush, at any rate many seem to believe war is likely to achieve this end. Heck, if war broke out in the next few weeks for some unforseen reason, perhaps Tony Blair could stay in office too.

[edit on 4-6-2007 by the_sentinal]

[edit on 4-6-2007 by the_sentinal]

Can you see what is happening here

This is not an American forum; the people who are serious and are not calling Putin an idiot..... are from nations outside of USA.

I remember the first time time I saw Putin- he had just got the job of top man in Russia and flew in for a meeting in our nation; came down the gangway and stepped off the red carpet and went over to talk to the journalists who were calling out to him.
I was impressed- not for a minute caught up with the pomp and ceromony but right away into the politics of getting a message out and using the journalists to do it.
I have no doubt that what Puttin is saying is political manourvering but it is backed up by real missiles and a real change in world opinion and real battles being (fought out in the streets of Germany as i write this) real battles being fought for who has a part to play in leading Europe in this new century.
Nuclear weapons have always been- just an option but when the politics stops then I am certian that they will be used (so we have created a South Pacific Nuclear Free Zone and will not accept US warships into our waters because USA has yet to respect our seriousness on this matter)

So do consider "the majority" that is those of us who live outside of USA and have taken these matter very seriously for a long time.....