Is This Hell?

Originally posted by Malakai
this being a supposed hell, how come there are beautiful creations such as breath taking oceans, mountains, landscapes, intricate designs on plants, animals and love here on this planet in general.

The obvious answer is that we are not supposed to realize this hell. I say obvious not to be curt, but put your self in the shoes of our dark brothers. Each of us gets our spiritual spark from the creator, which means that we are capable of tapping into the mind of God. If this world was all horrors, then everyone would know it was hell. But the goal is to trick us into believing we're safe. Trick you into believing this is home. Trick us into giving up our light, to evil.

On this planet the rich, and powerful are considered gods. Everyone else works for them. In our true home, there is no money. And non more powerful then our Father/Mother God.

In the beautiful ocean there are great whites. The summits of great mountains are graveyards for men who sought the challenge of climbing them. The majestic landscapes of every continent are soaked with the blood of men/women. There are plants in the beautiful rainforrest that just brushing against them, releases tiny needle like fibres that enter you blood stream causing internal bleeding, and animals that will kill you. And the Christ Jesus was murdered on this planet for speaking about love.

And the kicker is, you can only remember this life. You can't remember your true home, or your Father/Mother God who loves you, and wants you to continue exploring the depths of His ever expanding mind. What if tomorrow you couldn't remember your mother or father here on earth, or if your children forgot that you are their father/mother, and rejected you, for some other person whispering sweet words into their ears?

Originally posted by Malakai
i've done certain things in my past i am greatly ashamed of, and would not muster up the strength to admit such terrible acts. i feel like i am enveloped in guilt due to my past actions. do i simply forgive myself, move on and allow that light within me to burn as bright as possible?

Only you know the depths of these acts. Some things carry over, that's just a fact. Forgiveness is one thing, but if you have wronged someone, or an innocent creature, you have created a debt that must be paid. But there are some acts that can only be committed after giving up our light to darkness. Put youself on the scales. No one needs to tell you, which way the scales are tilted. You know.

You say that you are basically a good person. Based on what? Your idea of what is good, or God's? Compare your life and your giving to the giving of the Christ Teresa. We all fall way short of her example. She gave ALL of herself to those who needed Love, because she saw Jesus' face, in the faces of everyone she helped.

Another reason this is hell, because the world is repulsed by the kind of life she led. It was no mere coinsident she and Diana's physical deaths were close together. Which one do you imagine every mother wishes her daughter could grow up to be? A princess, or a little woman with 1 change of clothes, and 2 pairs of shoes?

And her joy, was the joy of serving God, through serving those the world considered as being the least among us. If you're doing things for others because it makes you feel good, then it has nothing to do with the love of God. Jesus didn't endure the beatings, and crusifixtion because it felt good.

But when you looked at either Jesus or Teresa, then you were looking at God, in the sense that each was the perfect son and daughter reflexting the light of our Father/Mother God in this world.

As far as the dream is concerned. Look, when we're sleep we're at our weakest. We are always surrounded by spirits. If your energy is aligned with evil, then evil will follow you. Might explain the scratches, and the dream, considering your former penchant for terrible acts.

Peace

Originally posted by Astyanax
One Hell of A Thread
Apart from your 'inner knowledge', which you say was vouchsafed to you at a moment of extreme stress, can you suggest any other ways of substantiating the following assertions?

1/ This is Hell

2/ God exists

3/ God is good

You have argued all three points very eloquently in the thread, but your arguments seems to be based largely on circumstantial evidence, or on personal experiences that others may not be able to share. I'd love to see something a bit more solid -- God's fingerprints, if you will...

Is this solid enough for ya? The Holy Spirit was just on the planet recently, in the form of a little woman we know as Mother Teresa. In fact, she is the Christ Teresa, because she was in every way, a reflection of the Christ Jesus, or more succintly, the manifestation of the Love of God, on earth.

The works she performed proved that she was perfectly aligned with God, and proved that God exists, as did the works of the Christ Jesus. Her presence in this world also demonstrated that God is good, because she dedicated her entire life in service to the Love of God, through the Love of neighbor as self. Which by the way, is also a Commandment of God.

There are litterally thousands of stories, of people, who just before they left this physical plane, racked with pain and suffering, suddenly relaxing, and then smiling, calling out to God, seeing His face, simply because the Christ Teresa was there to lead them to Him.

People who were not Christians BTW.

And there are very few on the planet, except Baptist, and Born Again Christians who failed to see the God in her.

Now, she also showed us that this place is hell, because she perfectly demonstrated exactly how there could be peace on this earth, if we all put our own greed and desires aside in the persuit of Loving God with ALL our hearts, ALL our souls, ALL our minds, and loving each other as we would ourselves.

The fact that we refuse to do this, to follow the example of the Christ once again, proves that this place is not interested in peace, but rather in murder, (16,000 murdered in the U.S. last year) and violence, and war and the exploitation of human beings, and resourses to the extent that we will use them up without considering the needs of future generations.

God, through Teresa told people to get rid of the weapons of mass destruction, but the governments decided that they still needed the option of destroying us all, so they patted her on her little head and sent her away, snickering, "Get rid of our nuclear weapons...? What, is she out of her mind?" or something like that.

She also talked against the killing of millions upon millions of babies while they sleep helplessly in the womb, and the people responded, "What, that's the best time to kill them. Before they get out of there and cost us money, or headaches," and again sent her on her way.

You see, when God comes to this planet, we have a tendancy to ignor Him/Her or want to kill Him. Because, like our false evil fathers, we have learned to hate Him/Her for various reasons.

Hmmm, let's see, hell is supposed to be run by evil right? I'd say it's pretty evil to want to kill God. Even if one didn't believe in God persay, wanting to kill even the concept of God, is really evil. In fact, I would imagine that of all the evil there is in all of creation, the desire to kill God, has to be right up there with the most evil acts imaginable.

My point is, if you didn't see God in the person of the Christ Teresa, and the thousands of sick, destitute, and dying she helped, then I'm guessing there wouldn't be any way to substantiate the existance of God to you, if He/She was standing right beside you.

Those she helped certainly saw the goodness of God in her and needed no other substantiation.

Wanna see a miracle? If you were open to the Love of God, through the service of others, you will actually meet God - in your heart.

[edit on 11-6-2007 by SatansQue]

I have a follow up to what Malakai asked, do you think there are better places on this planet and worse, what i mean by that is say for example you always here that the midwest/south of the united states has more hospitable people willing to greet you with a smile, does that make that place any better?


Also you're right in what you said i do have a lot to contemplate alot of stuff seems to make sence even things that seem to contridict each other, i feel like if someone did put me through what i went through for a evil purpose i wanna get em back but is going to there level really the right thing to do, i'm not sure, it seemed to me like i saw both good and evil so who really knows.


Another thing since this happened my energy has been real low, now before i had a ton of it (probably too much) but now it's on the lower side.

Is that all?

Originally posted by SatansQue

Originally posted by Astyanax
You have argued... very eloquently in the thread, but your arguments seems to be based largely on circumstantial evidence, or on personal experiences... I'd love to see something a bit more solid.

Is this solid enough for ya? The Holy Spirit was just on the planet recently, in the form of a little woman we know as Mother Teresa.

No, it most certainly is not.

What grounds have you for this assertion?

Did you ever meet Mother Teresa?

Many who did came away with a personal evaluation of the woman that was greatly at odds with yours. Perhaps some research into her management style and the manner in which she treated her fellow-religious are in order before you proclaim her divinity so unreservedly.

But even if Mother Teresa were truly a saint on earth, it has no bearing whatever on my question, which is how do you know what you so confidently assert? 'You either know or you don't' just doesn't cut it, I'm afraid.

I must confess I find your answer quite disappointing.

Originally posted by Astyanax
I must confess I find your answer quite disappointing.

Here's the problem Astyanax,

Honestly, the minute I read your glowing, flowery praise, followed by your questions, I knew what you were about. You actually believed that you were setting a trap for me. Because you know that it is impossible to prove the existance of God, His Goodness, and the fact that this is Hell, to those who are aligned with evil, or darkness.

Because this earth is a step away from death, what you have here on this planet are the spirits who will cease to exist when time is done. The fact that we are here, means that we have spent the last several hundred thousand years, passing from one existance to another in the birth and death cycle.

Spirit knows spirit. What, you think this little planet is too big to feel the energy of God's Holy Spirit in this world? Please!

When God comes into this world, it is understood that only a very small percentage of the beings on this planet, after so many ages here, will be able to recognize Him/Her. Why? Because our dark brothers controll this material universe, and really, God has nothing to do with this place other than sending emissaries here to rescue those who have not given over their lights to evil.

All you have done, is shown to those who have not given up their light to our dark brothers - that you have! And you have further proved the intent of this thesis that this is hell. Only those with the light of God in their hearts, can see God, in what ever form God comes into this world. It's just that simple. That the Christ was manifested in Teresa, there really isn't anything to debate. It is fact. A fact you will learn in the not too distant future for yourself.

I'm not here trying to save you, because you have already made your choice. Pretty much everyone on this planet right now has. So convincing you, is not my goal. And that's not a cop-out either.

You see, the false religion, Christianity, which is not based upon the words of the Christ, has people believing that the goal of true believers is to convert sinners. This is not, and was not the goal of the Christ. The Christ came for His own, for those who could hear his voice, and connect with his spirit.

So the purpose for God's incursions is not to prove anything to the prisoners who are happy and content in this world. Why would God disturb your moment of happiness, or take from you that which is most important to you, your ignorance of God? And I'm not saying this to be mean, or curt.

There are people who worked side-by-side with the Christ Teresa, who failed to see the Divinity in her. Just as there were those who saw Jesus face to face, spoke to Him, were healed by him, and failed to see the Divine nature within. The story of Thomas, doubting the resurrection of the Christ was real.

My purpose for being in this world, right now, is to be the witness of the Christ Teresa in this world. Of course, I thought that I would be revealing this in another setting, as apposed to here, dressed up as Satan. LOL!! But I chose this persone' because I recognize my own faults, deficiencies, and the times during my existance when ignorance was my daily bread. But I never gave up my light to evil. And now I mock fear, and the persone of evil, to speak the truth, just as fear and evil have mocked God.

Yeah, as unbelievable as it might sound to you, this is why I have traversed the ages. I have traversed the ages for that one in a million who will hear, the "Christ Teresa", and say, "Wow! God IS great, and has not forgotten us in Hell"

So of course my answer is dissappointing to you, as I knew it would be. And I am thoroughly happy to dissappoint you my friend, and for your giving me the opportunity to do my "thing."

God is not a science experiment, that you can dissect in a laboratory, or hold debates over to prove His/Her exisitance. You either know the Love of God or you don't.

[edit on 12-6-2007 by SatansQue]

>DISCLAIMER>END DISCLAIMER

And then?

Originally posted by SatansQue
Honestly, the minute I read your glowing, flowery praise, followed by your questions, I knew what you were about. You actually believed that you were setting a trap for me.

I should have expected nothing less from someone possessed of esoteric sources of knowledge.

Because you know that it is impossible to prove the existance of God, His Goodness, and the fact that this is Hell, to those who are aligned with evil, or darkness.

However, you seem to be misinformed about my intent. I have no time to waste on foolish arguments about whether or not God exists. I wish merely to understand how you came by your knowledge, and how you are so sure that what you 'know' is true.

As for the rest of your response...

Because this earth is a step away from death...

...You either know the Love of God or you don't.

It makes an impressive sermon, but it doesn't answer my questions.

Still disappointed, I'm afraid.

The wrong horse

Originally posted by yeahright
Mother Teresa's House of Illusions is an interesting article.

Indeed.

Mother Teresa's oft-repeated and unyielding opposition to abortion and contraception also tend to diminish her credentials as one dedicated to reducing human misery.

For those with a taste for the subtleties of torment in this quotidian hell of ours, here is an absolutely riveting exposé of Mother Teresa and her obsessions by that darkest of brothers, Christopher Hitchens, who also wrote this:

MT was not a friend of the poor. She was a friend of poverty. She said that suffering was a gift from God. She spent her life opposing the only known cure for poverty, which is the empowerment of women and the emancipation of them from a livestock version of compulsory reproduction. And she was a friend to the worst of the rich, taking misappropriated money from the atrocious Duvalier family in Haiti (whose rule she praised in return) and from Charles Keating of the Lincoln Savings and Loan. Where did that money, and all the other donations, go? The primitive hospice in Calcutta was as run down when she died as it always had been—she preferred California clinics when she got sick herself—and her order always refused to publish any audit. But we have her own claim that she opened 500 convents in more than a hundred countries, all bearing the name of her own order. Excuse me, but this is modesty and humility?

SatansQue old chap, I think you've backed the wrong horse.

Originally posted by yeahright

Personally, I don't believe I can "know" much of anything with 100% certainty. There are varying degrees of certainty with which I know anything, some approaching, but not reaching 100%.

What's happening Yeahright,

Because we've spoken in the past, I know one thing you're certain of, and that's your damn Colts went through my Baltimore Ravens to win the Super friggin' BOWL! LOL!!! And all my lifetimes, and past experiences didn't prepare me for that either!

Originally posted by yeahright
SQ you've referred Christ Teresa multiple times, and I believe I understand what you mean with her self sacrificing for the poor and downtrodden being the embodiment of what Christ taught. And I believe you mean the significance of her presence in the world was even beyond that.

Look, there are two different views here. One is what the world thinks, and the other, God's point of view. Anyone who has read my post in other threads knows how vehemitly I am against the false, evil, murderous Catholic Church. And a Pope who would allow himself to be called Holy Father, in direct contridiction to the teachings of the Christ Jesus.

So for me, to be here in this world professing a Catholic as the Christ, completely goes against everything I believe is Holy. I hear what you say about not knowing something 100%, but this one is a no-brainer, because it in no way comes from me. This is revealed, through the Holy Spirit of God.

I know, I know! It's sorta like taking the ball and going home, and completely unprovable by most standards.

But what do I gain by saying this? How does this improve my position in the world? What praise do I get? Satansque, for gods sake? To say something that goes completely against what most people in this world believe, just to be different? To piss people off? Please! I could do that in so many different ways, as Satan, and have a whole lot more fun screwing with people.

But this is how God comes to this world created by evil - In the body of a servant. And it really pisses folks off. People want earth trembling, angels flying around, voices shouting from the sky, and God's big ol' face in the middle of the sky. They want conclussive proof beyond the shaddow of a doubt - in this world, then they'll believe.

But God isn't trying to save this world created by evil. God isn't trying to convince the world. Why? Because this world is created by evil, and it will not last. On the other hand the spiritual realm is without time constraints. The idea is to get those loyal to God, off this planet before time runs out.

And just as Jesus, the ordinary man, and the Christ became one in purpose, to the will of God, to complete a task, Teresa, a normal person, did the same, and she got thousands of spirits off this planet, and beyond the astral plane back to their true home with God. This is why God chose her.

This argument isn't a new one, because the same objections were made against Jesus being the Christ - still today. Yes, the RCC is an enormously powerful organization, on earth! But they haven't helped a single spirit get off this planet and back home. They mean nothing to God.

Yes, and the most vociferous voices are those who would call themselves Christians, because Teresa wasn't a missionary helping the poor, while shoving "The word of God" down their throats.

She set the bar pretty damn high, and was rejected, like Jesus, because he didn't come in the manor folks expected. So they conspired to mudered him. And pretty much immediately after he left the planet, the perversion began.

Now, Teresa never asserted that she was Christ, or anything special for that matter. But in God's eyes, She lived a perfect life, in service to those who God sent her to love.

And God would love it if we all did the same.

Why me? Lord, I keep asking that question everyday. But this is something I am 100% sure of, because it's not my idea.

Originally posted by Astyanax
Mother Teresa's oft-repeated and unyielding opposition to abortion and contraception also tend to diminish her credentials as one dedicated to reducing human misery.

So, are you saying that God approves of murdering children in their mother's wombs?

As I said before Astyanax, I'm satansque, I know where you're coming from. I've said all I wish to say to you.

Peace)

The thing is anytime you have people working for you/with you there's always going to be some one who is discontented it's just human nature.


I don't think mother Teresa was the christ like Jesus was but she followed his teachings and words better then most people and did what you're supposed to do, and yes the world would be a much better place if more people were like her, i think it's just a fact.


Also SQ try being a Buffalo Bills fan four Super Bowl loses in row at least you guys got one back in 2000.

[edit on 12-6-2007 by WhatIsWhat]

[edit on 12-6-2007 by WhatIsWhat]

[edit on 12-6-2007 by WhatIsWhat]

You know this could be hell. We dont really know for sure.
Maybe we are a advanced elsewhere and earth is our punishment.

However I personally dont believe this. If you go to Alaska, Florida, Australia just to name a few and observe nature at its finest moments by yourself when its peaceful, its heaven.

How can Hell be so beautiful?
Doesnt Jive.

Bearer of Light or Father of Lies?

* * *

Gnosticism is about to become the 21st century world religion.

-- Gilles Quispel

* * *

Originally posted by SatansQue
As I said before Astyanax, I'm satansque, I know where you're coming from. I've said all I wish to say to you.

Getting a little nervous, are we? I’m not surprised. Six thread pages and nobody’s yet called your bluff; you must be biting those Satanic nails of yours, wondering how much longer you’ve got.

Wonder no more.

Originally posted by SatansQue
These are my ideas.

They are not. They are ideas that have been around for a very long time. They are Gnostic ideas.

God did not create this material existance...

This is a fundamental doctrine of Gnosticism.

In the Gnostic view, there is a true, ultimate and transcendent God, who is beyond all created universes and who never created anything...

So is this:

...it was an imposed upon a sector of the spiritual realm by spirits who were not equal to God, who were in error about a few things, but refused to correct themselves.

You mean the Demiurge...

Several systems of Gnostic thought present the Demiurge as antagonistic to the will of the Supreme Being: his act of creation occurs in unconscious imitation of the divine model, and thus is fundamentally flawed, or else is formed with the malevolent intention of entrapping aspects of the divine in materiality.

...and his archons.

some variants of Gnosticism used the term Archon to refer to several servants of the Demiurge, the "creator god", that stood between the human race and a transcendent God.

The Demiurge is often identified with the God of the Bible, which is pretty much what you've been saying throughout this thread:

Your god aint God.

Your unacknowledged 'borrowings' from Gnostic thought don’t end there. In fact, if you take Gnosticism out of ‘your ideas’, there’s precious little left.

This world... was created by evil, and all we can hope for is to get off of it, and out of the cycle of birth and death.

The world-spirit in exile must go through the Inferno of matter and the Purgatory of morals to arrive at the spiritual Paradise.

-- Gilles Quispel

Our own dark brothers, spiritual being, with the spark of the light of God in them, used the power of that light, to create an alternative reality to our spiritual home, because they assumed that just because they could, that they were somehow greater than our creator.

The error of the ego is... also is the error of the Demiurge in the story of Sophia. The demiurge forgets his Mother Sophia who engendered him, when he arrogantly proclaims, “There are no gods before me.”

-- A Homily for The Assumption of Sophia, by Steven Marshall

So this material universe, which consists of 12 eliptical universes overlapping each other, was designed, and manifested as sort of a light catcher, if you will.

You speak of the creation of twelve authorites by the Demiurge, and their appointment to the various realms...

And [Yaltabaoth] was stupefied in his Madness, the one who dwells within him, and he begat some authorities for himself.

The name of the first is Athoth... The second is Harmas... The twelfth is Belias...

And he set up [these twelve over his created realms] that they might rule.

And he divided his fire among them... but when the darkness mixed with the light, it darkened the light.

-- The Apocryphon of John (Nag Hammadi Codexes II, 1 & IV, 1)

You then purloin the Gnostic idea of the spark divinity or 'light' in humanity for yourself:

God is in our hearts... The Jesus I saw as a child, was a beautiful, loving human being...

This Sunday-School truism is in fact another tenet of Gnostic belief.

Humankind contains a perishable physical and psychic component, as well as a spiritual component which is a fragment of the divine essence. This latter part is often symbolically referred to as the “divine spark”... Humans are generally ignorant of the divine spark resident within them.

You got this bit right, too:

All of the negative emotions associated with being human, actually generate extra, even more powerful energy. But the main goal of our dark brothers has been to convince as many as they can, to actually give up their light.

Our dark brothers designed the material realm to trap our light. And this light, because it comes directly from the creator, is powerful, and helps sustain the illusion of this material universe.

These statements of yours paraphrase another central Gnostic idea:

Humans are generally ignorant of the divine spark resident within them. This ignorance is fostered in human nature by the influence of the false creator and his Archons, who together are intent upon keeping men and women ignorant of their true nature and destiny. Anything that causes us to remain attached to earthly things serves to keep us in enslavement to these lower cosmic rulers.

Here's a grab-bag of some other Satanesque 'revelations':

The Source is Absolute - perfect: One of the definitions of absolute is, being self-sufficient, and free of external references. Each manifested life, has that spark of Light, when that spark inhabits a body in the material world, it tends to forget. So the flesh is the source of contention, since it is the opposite of spirit.

The spark, which is the piece of Light from the Creator, is seated in the heart, but expands out into every cell of our bodies.

This material word is like a containment shell for our light.

As is clearly evident from the sources I have quoted from, every word of these ideas you claim as yours are filched from Gnostic tradition without any acknowledgement.

Your only 'original' contribution (perhaps) is to suggest that the God of the Bible is a human fiction and not are real being (the Demiurge). Instead, you put the blame on the archons. But I expect a real Gnostic initiate could point us straight at a text that says precisely the same as you do.

None of this would have mattered if you had given credit where credit was due. You were given two opportunities to do so: one by WyrdeOne, one by me. You chose not to take those chances. Instead, you made a great boast of your religious learning...

I read the Bible at least 15 times... the interpreters Bible (30+ volums)... the Philocalia of Origen... the lives of the saints... the lost books of the bible, as much of the dead sea scrolls as possible... the Shastra... bhagavad-gita... 200+ publications from the Varnashram Dharma... lived in an ashram... studied Judaism... the Qur'am, Bhudism, Zen bhudism... Litterally 40 years of constant theological study.

...without once mentioning the word Gnosticism. This reluctance clearly indicates that the mystical and spiritual experiences you lay claim to are fictional, based on what you’ve read about Gnosticism.

Well, the Demiorgos doesn’t acknowledge his Source either, so your behaviour sort of fits.

Vade retro, Satanas.

Originally posted by SatansQue

Originally posted by wigit
I agree with you in part however, I don't have a bible. I'm interested to know who YOUR God is. Maybe he's my God too, or is he just yours? Methinks, maybe you don't even know who you're preaching to.

Wigit,

Perhaps it sounds like preaching, but preaching denotes that I'm trying to change your opinion or teach you something. This ATS thing is a cool forum for putting ideas out into the ethers.

These are my ideas. If you don't agree, I don't care, really. And I'm not saying that with an attitude or anything, I'm being sincere. I love putting an idea out, and then defending it. I'm not someone who just spouts off at the mouth, and then folds when people start picking my ideas apart - you kidding? I love to debate. Call me an a-hole, I don't care. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. Been shown to be wrong many, many times, and changed my point of view, with a thank you, and have a nice day.

Of course I don't know who I'm speaking to. I'm looking at a computer screen. The only way I know who I'm speaking to is by what a person says - language - flow of thought.

My God, is the God of the Christ Jesus. I have had a personal relationship with this God, long before I ever read a single page of the Bible. In fact, whether you believe it or not, (I don't care) this God, and spirits of my God, have been with me since I came home from the hospital in my mother's arms, because I remember that day, as clear as if it was yesterday, in the car, with my mom, (No carseats back then) in the front seat, in her arms.

So the Holy Spirit of God is very real to me. Doesn't make me any more special than any one else. In fact, I've been a jabonie most of my life. So I guess God realised that I was such a basket case coming into the world, that I needed to get started as soon as I got here. Perhaps within the last 6 months, I've felt less like a jabonie than I have my entire life.

But during my jabonie years, I read the Bible cover to cover at least 15 times. Plus read the interpreters Bible (30+ volums) through a couple of times, plus the Philocalia of Origen, studied the lives of the saints, studied the lost books of the bible, as much of the dead sea scrolls as possible, learned to read and speak sanskrit so I could study the Shastra, bhagavad-gita, and 200+ publications from the Varnashram Dharma and social system, then lived in an ashram two years, studied Judaism, the Qur'am, Bhudism, Zen bhudism - listen, I could go on and on. Litterally 40 years of constant theological study, with some paranormal studies, a little physics, etc., even produced several nationally syndicated TV shows for about 7 years, flying through that business as a diversion.

I'm a writer, sculptor, baker, father and a bunch of other things, and I have been on the brink of certain death at least 7 times. In fact, I have a heart condition which could litterally take me out of this world while I'm sitting here writing this letter to you.

Not trying to be a dick, or a braggert, or gain any sympathy what-so-ever, which I'm sure I'll be accused of, it's just that research, and the search for my True God have been my life's persuit, 24/7 for my entire life. While most people were working at jobs, I was in the library 7 hours per-day, most of my life.

And you know what? The most liberating moment of my life, is when I threw my torn and tattered bible into the garbage 3 months ago. Why? because I finally saw if for exactly what it is, and I stopped fearing what God would do to me if I didn't believe in it, because I didn't want Him to be dissappointed in me for thinking He had anything to do with it. A book filled with half truths, outright lies, and slanders against my God, is antiChrist.

So if you still want to talk, I'm willing. If you want to call me an jerk and be on your way, that's fine too.

It's your world.

[edit on 25-5-2007 by SatansQue]

I find it hard to believe you have any relationship with Jesus or God based on your name and that offensive picture.

Ive known a few like yourself, they were all satanists. Although they didnt call themselves that. There were other new age names to hide what they really were.

It would be like a jewish person having the name Hitlerque and a picture of Hitler next to it claiming to be jewish and loving israel.

Originally posted by SatansQue
I read the Bible at least 15 times... the interpreters Bible (30+ volums)... the Philocalia of Origen... the lives of the saints... the lost books of the bible, as much of the dead sea scrolls as possible... the Shastra... bhagavad-gita... 200+ publications from the Varnashram Dharma... lived in an ashram... studied Judaism... the Qur'am, Bhudism, Zen bhudism... Litterally 40 years of constant theological study.

Originally posted by Astyanax
...without once mentioning the word Gnosticism. This reluctance clearly indicates that the mystical and spiritual experiences you lay claim to are fictional, based on what you’ve read about Gnosticism.

Astyanax,

You've done a real fine job with your post. I love it, and I thank you for proving what I said about myself, and how I came to understand the things I do through study and the rememberance of many life time experiences in the service of God.

Becasue I've listed pretty much the main areas of focus concerning my earthly studies of religious beliefs. And you're right, I'm embarrassed to say, I didn't mention Gnosticism, because I've actually never studied it.

I have laid bare a lot of information about myself here on ATS. More than most. So one thing you can't call me is a liar. Well, I guess you can, but your opinion doesn't matter to me.

I originally ran across Gnostic teaching back in the late... I'd say 70s, via the nag Hamadi Library. It was the first time I heard the word Gnostic. At the time, quite frankly, I was afraid of it, because bits and peices of external writings from folks like Origen, (who I respected) and Thomas Aquinus, and a few other so-called Fathers of the Church warned us to avoid it, and said negative things about it. The little I read, I didn't understand. Sophia, acorns? I was like, "What the hell?" So I put it aside, and never went back to it.

But based upon the quotes you've listed here, I guess I should have really gotten into it more, because it's not as scary as everyone made it out to be. And you're right, I do see a lot of simularities. So what? If you're trying to say that I based all my thinking on it because of the simularities, and just changed the words, then you're wrong. You understand it a lot better than I.

In fact, if you really wanted to do a "gotcha" on me, go read anything by Amitakh Stanford. She is someone I discovered as a kindred spirit, within the last few years. In fact, it's down right scary how our views are very simular. The main difference being, I'm not as clued in on all of the alien influence, which is why I don't quote her directly because, I really don't want to get caught up in all the "aliens spawned the human race" discussions, which would pretty much take this thread, or any other off the main Point. But I respect her greatly, and have been influenced by her tremendously in this life, and in previous lives.

Originally posted by Astyanax
None of this would have mattered if you had given credit where credit was due. You were given two opportunities to do so: one by WyrdeOne, one by me. You chose not to take those chances.

All you had to do was ask me, "Satansque, did you get most of your ideas from studying gnosticism?" and I would have answered you. But here's the thing about you: I'm only playing at being the devil, but you are the real thing. Because your whole approach to this discussion from your very first words, have been deception, and trickery.

You don't actually care about the underlying quest for truth, all you really cared about was trying to discredit me, as someone who claims to know the truth. I have no problem with that, but like most COWARDS, instead of approaching me like a man, and asking me straight up, then dealing with the answer, you try and sneak up from behind.

So let me ask you. Since you seem to be an expert at gnosticism: What part of Gnosticism calls Teresa, the Christ?



[edit on 13-6-2007 by SatansQue]

Originally posted by admriker444
I find it hard to believe you have any relationship with Jesus or God based on your name and that offensive picture.

Ive known a few like yourself, they were all satanists. Although they didnt call themselves that. There were other new age names to hide what they really were.

It would be like a jewish person having the name Hitlerque and a picture of Hitler next to it claiming to be jewish and loving israel.

You're right. I find my name and dress just as offensive. As offensive as what men have done to the teachings of the Christ Jesus in this world. As offensive as the slander against God, calling him vengful, angry, jealous, choosing favorites among men, and leading HIS children on murderous rampages stealing other people's land. Oh, yeah, I find my name and dress as offensive as that so-called "Word of God" written by men, referred to as the Holy Bible, or the Torah, or the Qur'an, or the bhagavad Gita.

As offensive as a man dressed in $50,000 garments, who leads followers to worship statues, and lets people kiss his rings and calls him the Holy Father.

As offensive as the Baptist minister and his wife who spend their parishoners money to buy mink coats, and diamond rings, and Mercedes benzes to go out to fine restaurants to dine.

As offensive as the murder of millions of spirit/humans by those who would call themselves God's soldiers.

As offensive as a "One nation Under God" that would drop Atomic bombs on Hiroshima and nagasaki. As offensive as the same nation under God, who's entire ecconomy thrives on war.

As offensive as those who would kill innocent animals upon an alter and call it a sacrifice to God. As offensive as human beings who would ignor the spirit of the earth, and destroy the resorces of this planet, the water, the air, and kill all the honey bees.

Yeah, you're damn right my look, and my name are offensive to those who would hide their offenses behind the cloak of a concept called Satan. At least Hitler was a real man, who led other real men to do horrible things. I happen to have known anton levey personally, through my work as a television producer. (Another evil institution) And In our discussions, we did not see eye to eye. So A satanist, I'm not, or if you want to insist that I am, you have to admit that I'm not a very good one, based upon my own words written all over this ATS thing.

Yes, it's a little extreme, but I'm trying to make a point. God comes to this world and says the most important thing of all is the Love we have for each other, and the world refuses to listen. In this world, the real satan is usually staring back at you in a mirror. So as long as men will play the devil with each other, then I'll play the devil who knows the truth.

Originally posted by SatansQue
This is revealed, through the Holy Spirit of God.

I know, I know! It's sorta like taking the ball and going home, and completely unprovable by most standards.

But that's okay, at least for me. There's a big difference between relating info based upon experience for sharing purposes, and getting all sideways because people don't believe you. Which (IMO) you haven't done. Doesn't mean I agree, but I can't be hostile about it. Experiences are individual for the most part, and even when a multitude of people have the same experience, individual interpretation will put unique spin on it.

So there you go. I think you're an interesting, intelligent, well-spoken, good guy. But not an authority (for me).

Yes, and the most vociferous voices are those who would call themselves Christians, because Teresa wasn't a missionary helping the poor, while shoving "The word of God" down their throats.

See this is where it gets tricky. You previously mentioned "why would I do this?" And that's exactly where I see the Christopher Hitchens' work and the link I posted above from the lady who worked with Mother Teresa for 10 years. Why would they prevaricate? Mother Teresa is a world famous symbol of charity and goodness. Not much can be gained from willfully and maliciously slamming her falsely. You might as well go on TV and stomp on a pile of live baby ducks. Sure, some sickos will cheer you on, but it's not exactly the path to glory. Yes, Hitchens is a hardcore atheist, but he's a respected journalist and not a nut job. I wouldn't consider him an authority on spiritual matters, but as a finder of fact in reporting, he's legitimate (IMO).

Now, Teresa never asserted that she was Christ, or anything special for that matter. But in God's eyes, She lived a perfect life, in service to those who God sent her to love.

I believe she believed she was doing what she was commanded to do. And I can't very well dispute that, but I have no reason (authority?) to believe it, either. I do believe (based on reason and authority) that her popularity and fame allowed her to be used to jack cash out of a whole lot of people who had it to give. And none of it (or the potential benefits of it) made it to the people she was helping.

Of course, if her mission was to "help spirits get off this planet" then that's all completely irrelevant and the real deal is so far over my head that I can't fathom it. So maybe you're right. I'm just not prepared to say so.

And God would love it if we all did the same.

Absolutely. We know what the message is. We may get there in different ways, but the message is the message, regardless. If we could somehow focus on the message rather than some of the petty trivial "who said what why how" stuff that bogs us down, what a wonderful world this would be. (Cue Ray Charles, somebody).

Why me? Lord, I keep asking that question everyday. But this is something I am 100% sure of, because it's not my idea.

Good luck with that. Seriously. Better you than me. I'm sorely lacking in the whole love category. There's maybe a handful of people I truly love. A couple of dozen or so I really care about. Maybe that many I completely dislike. The other nearly seven billion or so, I'm pretty much indifferent about. Bear no malice, but you know... it's a capacity thing and situational at best.

Off-topic, but as much as I respect McNair, Ravens need Troy Smith to step up fast. I can't believe he fell as far as he did in the draft. He's a player.

Originally posted by yeahright
See this is where it gets tricky. You previously mentioned "why would I do this?" And that's exactly where I see the Christopher Hitchens' work and the link I posted above from the lady who worked with Mother Teresa for 10 years. Why would they prevaricate?

Why would Judas, a disciple, betray Jesus? Forget that she or he was Christ for a moment. Even in the material world, you get promoted on your job - what goes on in the minds of those who wanted the job? Loyalty, or do they work to get you fired? Humans are petty. Every mistake is blown out of proportion. Some work harder than they did before you got promoted, just to make you look bad.

yeahright,

I understand exactly what you mean. But there's an old saying, "No good deed goes unpunished". If you believed as I do, (not saying you do) that this world is created by evil, then it makes perfect sence. Then who is Christopher Hitchens really working for? We can't say he's taking Teresa to task because he cares about the Love of God.

Besides folks like Teresa, and Jesus are friggin' spiritual geeks, who come to this world with a sincere desire to bring home those who God sent them to rescue, and are more interested in doing their jobs, then watching their backs. All sorts attach themselves to them, for the express purpose of fomenting discord, to discredit them, etc. So they basically become sitting ducks for the powers that controll every aspect of human existance on this earth. Especially when they are effective in just doing their jobs.

Originally posted by yeahright
We're all gonna "know" different stuff. Three ways to "know" something-
1) Reason 2) Authority 3) Experience

I need to add one, Divine inspiration, which is separete from human authority, because in this world, authority is considered that which can be proved by, or is given to men. I said earlier, it is impossible to prove the existance, or goodness of God in a world that has nothing to do with God. Not when you have to work, pay bills, raise a family, fight wars, in a country where 16,000 people were murdered last year. Or in a place like Dufar, the congo, North Korea, Russia, etc.

I'm not trying to be anyone's authority. The act of putting ideas in a public forum for debate, presses me to defend those ideas, based upon my understanding of them, and in doing so, I'm sure the tenor can takie on the impression that I am preaching, rather than just debating, because I can't help but speak with conviction. But I'm not demanding to be taken as the final word, even though I might get a little testy.

It's one of the reasons why I decided to share whatever information I have about myself, even though I still have the luxury of being annoymous. If you really knew me, you would surely see me as even less of an authority than you do now. LOL!!

Originally posted by yeahright
Of course, if her mission was to "help spirits get off this planet" then that's all completely irrelevant and the real deal is so far over my head that I can't fathom it. So maybe you're right. I'm just not prepared to say so.

This was her only purpose. I have mentioned the rescue mission numerous times.When God sends someone like a Teresa to manifest the Christ, it isn't to win friends and influence enemies, especially those among the non-believers - it is specifically designed to bring X number of spirits back home. You could say, these spirits were consigned to be with Teresa, at the times of their earthly transit, long before this world ever knew of a mother Teresa.

Originally posted by yeahright
There's maybe a handful of people I truly love.

And what would you do for the handful you truly Love? Some come to love thousands, some just a handful. To God, your handful are just as important. Love, in this world made by evil, is a miracle in-and-of-itself.

Off topic: As far as Troy Smith starting is concerned, I can only dream. But believe it or not, I would love to see Boller get one more shot. And I know, this too opens up a whole can of worms.

Originally posted by earth2
However I personally dont believe this. If you go to Alaska, Florida, Australia just to name a few and observe nature at its finest moments by yourself when its peaceful, its heaven. How can Hell be so beautiful? Doesnt Jive.

Who told you that hell was supposed to be ugly? To an insect, the Venus Flytrap, is beautiful, and smells really sweet. How many people have had their hearts broken in pieces by the most beautiful man/woman They've ever seen? North Korea is a breath-takingly beautiful country, but do you really want to live there?

And then there are seemingly beautiful words like these...

Originally posted by Astyanax
Greetings, SatanQue. You have chosen a wonderfully provocative thread topic, presented it beautifully and done an exemplary job of keeping the thread going. ATS rarely produces discussion of such quality. I salute you.

...which are really just a trap designed to suck in the fool who believes them. The man who looks around this world, and only sees the temporary beauty created by evil as a trap to relieve you of your light - is destinted to get lost in the dark.

Originally posted by WhatIsWhat
I don't think mother Teresa was the christ like Jesus was but she followed his teachings and words better then most people and did what you're supposed to do, and yes the world would be a much better place if more people were like her, i think it's just a fact.

WhatIsWhat,

Blessed are you my friend, because what you have just said, inspires a rare Bible quote from me. So in your honor, and for the glory of the Love of God who comes into this world, here goes:

John 14:11 "Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father is in Me; otherwise believe because of the works themselves."

Peace


[edit on 13-6-2007 by SatansQue]

Good post. Thanks for the participation. One thing-

Originally posted by SatansQue
I need to add one, Divine inspiration, which is separete from human authority, because in this world, authority is considered that which can be proved by, or is given to men.

I'd classify "Divine Inspiration" as experience. At least, I certainly envision it as being one.

Off topic- Boller may be just good enough, if the Ravens can maintain their defensive superiority (which I think Lewis can do just through sheer will). If the Bears can do it with Grossman...

I like the McGahee pickup.

I know this is off topic but i love football, i think at this point the Ravens sink or swim with Mcnair i mean they went 13 and 3 they were a legit contender, they just caught a Colts team who by the way wasn't even there best Colts team (the Edgerrin James years they were better) whos defense just stepped it up at the right time.

I said before i'm a Bills fan and were on the upswing except for one thing and at some point this will come back to haunt all three of our teams in one way or the other for the 2007 season and that is the Patriots play in the National Football League.

Thanks for the shout at SQ, on a separate note i'v had a few dealings with someone who i think believes in that Gnostic religion i didn't really get into it with him but got a strange vibe one which i'm not sure was positive or negative.

[edit on 13-6-2007 by WhatIsWhat]