Est. 300,000+ Innocent Iraqi's Killed

Assume a couple hundred thousand Iraqi civilians have been brutally killed (like that's something new as of 2003) anyway, assume in the past 3 or 4 years 500,000 Iraqi's have been killed. The GIANT irrational illogical leap that many make is that those deaths were at the hands of United States soldiers....Now, this simply IS NOT TRUE.

I see very few images posted showing U.S. and/or coalition forces killing Iraqi civilians....hmmmmmmmmm....now there's a clue for ya!

Methinks whoever flew them planes into the USA and particularly into the Pentagon made a tactical error and HUGE MILTARY BLUNDER. Matter of fact, those crazy 'mericans ain't calmed down yet.

Originally posted by Connected



We Americans are not extremists, we will not kill people because they are on our land.

What about the 187 abortion clinics that have been attacked (bombing\shooting) in the past 15 years in America by religious extremists? Or only muslims that kill considered "extremists"

Methinks whoever flew them planes into the USA and particularly into the Pentagon made a tactical error and HUGE MILTARY BLUNDER. Matter of fact, those crazy 'mericans ain't calmed down yet.

I assume you are saying the terrorists flew the planes into the building? If so, the person behind that would be OBL. Did he really make such a big blunder? Is he in prison, has he been killed?

It is really hard to beleive that people still connect Iraq to 9/11; they had nothing to do with each other.


As for Americans being suicide bombers, if it came to that it would happen. If we were overmatched with no way to win a heads up fight you know some Americans would do it. Nobody will admit to it personally because there is a chance the FBI may pay them a visit.

The Alamo was basically a suicide mission. There was no way a victory was possible; they knew they would die but they took as many out with them as they could.




[edit on 23-2-2007 by manimal]

Originally posted by manimal
[
The Alamo was basically a suicide mission. There was no way a victory was possible; they knew they would die but they took as many out with them as they could.


[edit on 23-2-2007 by manimal]

You know, you bring up a damn good point here. I never thought of it this way. These are tactics used when you are overwhelmingly out gunned. We are making it out to be some religious thing. I am so sick of the rhetoric by some in this country - people only see in black and white (or in this case american and terrorist).

I assume you are saying the terrorists flew the planes into the building? If so, the person behind that would be OBL. Did he really make such a big blunder? Is he in prison, has he been killed?

It is really hard to beleive that people still connect Iraq to 9/11; they had nothing to do with each other.




dude ain't nowhere I mentioned a relation between Iraq and 9/11. You think the war being fought is between nations no problem, I say it ain't. If the US was at war with Iraq it'd been over a long time ago. Try to separate the countries out of this mess, cuz it aint a war between the US and Iraq, or Afghanistan, or the Phillipines, or Indonesia....... get it?

Originally posted by LogansRun

Considering we have never been invaded, you pretty much are talking out of your backside here.

Dude, I was answering to a FICTIONAL story. Of course I'm going to have a fictional answer. WTF do you think?

Originally posted by LogansRun
If we were invaded by a foreign force and I was fighting that foreign occupation, I would most definately fire upon Americans giving aid to the enemy - much as what is happening in Iraq.

Get the hell out of America then! Go home! You answered all my questions right now, you have a biased opinion, and any further replies from you are now going to be ignored. Yeah go ahead, give aid to the enemy, you are a yellow, backstabber. I can have you arrested for your comment. Believe it.

Originally posted by LogansRun
It isn't a matter of right and wrong, it simply is. Your above post is incredibly ignorant: "Iraqi's are not afraid of death, that is why they are dying so much" - that is the stupidest thing I have ever heard.

Then you sir have no place to talk, you are ill-informed. It is a fact that extremist Muslims are not afraid of death, especially when they are "protecting their people", because then they become a "martyr" after death.

Originally posted by Connected
What the hell does that even mean? There are many Americans that have extremist views -

Extremist views... yes.

Extremist actions... not so much.

Originally posted by Connected
I can GUARANTEE that if a foreign power invaded us for ANY reason, we would most definately be fighting them and we would most definately have a reason.

ANY reason?!? Are you sure about that? Even to HELP US??!

"Invaded" is a powerful word. You are not using it correctly. If a country came to America specifically to kill all Americans, YES there would be people fighting back. That is not what is happening in Iraq.

But if a country came to America to free us from a evil dictator, and to capture all of the extremists that want to kill the enemy just because of their life style, then no, the only people fighting will be the extremists.

Why do you people think we just want to kill everyone in Iraq??!? Why do you think our soldiers want to be there?? Why do you think this is a religious war? Why do you think we are there giving gifts an trying to win hearts???

We are there to kill the extremists that want to kill us. Nobody else.... In the future, we want a common American to be able to travel to Iraq for vacation, and sight seeing, without worrying about getting shot by some extremist that doesn't like Americans. We want to coexist. We aren't there to frikken murder everyone.. so STFU ABOUT THAT.

Originally posted by Connected
You dont thing Iraqi's have a reason to fight?

No I don't. All we want is for all of Iraq to have PEACE. If that means going in and killing all the lawless and unpeaceful people, then SO BE IT.

Originally posted by Connected
Well, that seems simple enough, except that they dont want us there!

THAT IS WERE YOU ARE CONFUSED! There are MANY that want us there. MANY!!! More so than not.

Originally posted by Connected
Whos law are we referring to? We are an invading force in another persons country.

"Another persons country". Who's? Who owns Iraq? Please tell me. Nobody. They live there, but this is Earth, EVERYONES EARTH. Americans just want peace. Thats all. "Peace in the middle east" that is the oldest saying in the world, and it may soon happen.

Originally posted by smokenmirrors

dude ain't nowhere I mentioned a relation between Iraq and 9/11. You think the war being fought is between nations no problem, I say it ain't. If the US was at war with Iraq it'd been over a long time ago. Try to separate the countries out of this mess, cuz it aint a war between the US and Iraq, or Afghanistan, or the Phillipines, or Indonesia....... get it?

Then why bring up 9/11 in an Iraq War thread?

Aside from that, this may be an ideological war, but why did we invade a country that seems not to have terrorist ties and despose of their leader?
link

And I know that Saddam was not a good ethical/moral leader and killed his citizens in some instances, but that would be an issue for the UN not USA.

Originally posted by smokenmirrors

You think the war being fought is between nations no problem, I say it ain't. If the US was at war with Iraq it'd been over a long time ago. Try to separate the countries out of this mess, cuz it aint a war between the US and Iraq, or Afghanistan, or the Phillipines, or Indonesia....... get it?

EXACTLY.

Some odd reason these people think it is USA vs IRAQ. If that was the case, YES, Iraq would have been vaporized long ago.

This is a war of USA vs lawless extremists that want to kill Americans for fun. We want to sift through the people of Iraq, and capture anyone that wants to harm America.

Heck, if we went to Iraq and NOBODY from Iraq did anything. No shots fired, no IED's exploded, then we would have left Iraq loonnnnng ago.

Unfortunately, they continue to try to kill us. That makes us think there are enemies still living there. We want them... so we are going to hunt them for as long as it takes.

Originally posted by pstiffy
What about the 187 abortion clinics that have been attacked (bombing\shooting) in the past 15 years in America by religious extremists?

Killing little babies is not justified, period, but our law's allow abortion.

That is a totaly different senario. That doesn't have anything to do with what I was talking about.

Oh whatever. Innocent,,,, bah
Who knows which one of the cowards over there is an insurgent and who isn't? Perhaps if they'd have the balls to come out and fight like men instead of hiding in peoples homes and cars and such.
What about the US men and women who die everyday over there who are just following orders and fighting for freedom?
What about the thousands who are murdered and raped right here in our own country?
I apologize by the our country thing. I realize that a lot of people on here may not be American.

Originally posted by Connected

Originally posted by LogansRun
If we were invaded by a foreign force and I was fighting that foreign occupation, I would most definately fire upon Americans giving aid to the enemy - much as what is happening in Iraq.

Get the hell out of America then! Go home! You answered all my questions right now, you have a biased opinion, and any further replies from you are now going to be ignored. Yeah go ahead, give aid to the enemy, you are a yellow, backstabber. I can have you arrested for your comment. Believe it.

The Union soldiers killed confederates, how is that any different? Were they yellow backstabbers?

Then you sir have no place to talk, you are ill-informed. It is a fact that extremist Muslims are not afraid of death, especially when they are "protecting their people", because then they become a "martyr" after death.

Why dont you provide a link to that "fact"? Perhaps they are afraid of death but they are willing to sacrifice their life for a cause they strongly believe in regarless of if it is right or wrong.

Originally posted by Connected
What the hell does that even mean? There are many Americans that have extremist views -

Extremist views... yes.

Extremist actions... not so much.

state by state bombings
American Terrorists

Originally posted by Connected
You dont thing Iraqi's have a reason to fight?

No I don't. All we want is for all of Iraq to have PEACE. If that means going in and killing all the lawless and unpeaceful people, then SO BE IT.

We sure have a strange way of bringing peace to a country.

Originally posted by Connected
Well, that seems simple enough, except that they dont want us there!

THAT IS WERE YOU ARE CONFUSED! There are MANY that want us there. MANY!!! More so than not.

nearly three-quarters of residents polled said they would feel safer if U.S. and other foreign forces left IraqWho is confused?

Originally posted by Connected
Whos law are we referring to? We are an invading force in another persons country.

"Another persons country". Who's? Who owns Iraq? Please tell me. Nobody. They live there, but this is Earth, EVERYONES EARTH. Americans just want peace. Thats all. "Peace in the middle east" that is the oldest saying in the world, and it may soon happen.

Iraq was/is a sovereign country; they had political control over a certain geographic area. We violated that sovereignty.

You are right this is everyones earth. However, an analogy to the stuation is if an illegal immigrant moved into your house and occupied it for an indefinate period of time, after all, this is his earth as much as yours.

We both know that is wrong because you have occupied that house for who knows how long and you are recognized as the owner. The Iraqis(you) have occupied there area(your house) for a long time and that area is recognized as being "theirs". If you were to unjustly punish someone in your household(like saddam has done before), do you belive a neighbor should come dispose of you or the police(UN) should come dispose of you.

Of course you may say we are the world's police.

How dare some of you sit there and say these people did this to themselves. I've read your postings of soldiers passing out toys/candy to these kids (of course this is American media saying this). I saw one poster say

The GIANT irrational illogical leap that many make is that those deaths were at the hands of United States soldiers....Now, this simply IS NOT TRUE.

Apparently you must not have heard about the Haditha Killings, or how about the Iraqi kidnapping, or the Iraqi gang rape incident, or the Hamdaniya Killing, or the 3 soldiers with premeditated murder, or this frightening article. Maybe you chose not to see this. Let me hand out these quotes from the last article for those of you that chose to remain blind.

"The first time I shot someone, it was the most exhilarating thing I'd ever felt."

"We talk about killing all the time," he says. "I never used to talk this way. I'm not proud of it, but it's like I can't stop. I'm worried what I will be like when I get home."

"Kill, kill, kill, kill, kill," Hall says. "It's like it pounds at my brain. I'll figure out how to deal with it when I get home."

"I enjoy killing Iraqis," says Staff Sgt. William Deaton, 30.

American Soldiers Torturing Iraqi's to Death?

"Throw some candy in the schoolyard, watch the children gather round, lock a belt in your M-16, mow them little bastards down." Marine Training Chant as told by Chris White

We are monsters in this foreign land to those of you can't see this. We are every bit as responsible for these deaths as the suicide bombers there. OPEN YOUR EYES PEOPLE. You are thinking just the way they want you to, being that nothing is wrong, America is right.

Originally posted by Connected

Originally posted by pstiffy
What about the 187 abortion clinics that have been attacked (bombing\shooting) in the past 15 years in America by religious extremists?

Killing little babies is not justified, period, but our law's allow abortion.

That is a totaly different senario. That doesn't have anything to do with what I was talking about.

He was merely pointing out that extremist do in fact exist in America. Do you not consider these people extremist? What about the unibomber was he extremist? KKK?

Thing is the Iraqis asked us for help.
True, we have been there for far too long, but I believe we helped a bit.

Originally posted by Connected

Get the hell out of America then! Go home! You answered all my questions right now, you have a biased opinion, and any further replies from you are now going to be ignored. Yeah go ahead, give aid to the enemy, you are a yellow, backstabber. I can have you arrested for your comment. Believe it.

My god, what is your IQ. READ WHAT I POSTED! I said that I would fire upon Americans giving aid to the enemy, meaning the AMERICANS WHO GAVE AID TO THE ENEMY. Go back to school and learn something before you come in here and think you know it all.

[edit on 23-2-2007 by LogansRun]

In the future, we want a common American to be able to travel to Iraq for vacation, and sight seeing, without worrying about getting shot by some extremist that doesn't like Americans.

Are you implying America is doing this for vacation purposes!?

Originally posted by Connected

I can have you arrested for your comment. Believe it.

Since I am on "ignore" by this genius, can someone please tell him to go sit and spin?

Who the hell do you think you are?

Actually, if you are a US citizen, and you made that comment in public, you probably could be arressted.
Freedom of speech ends when it enfringes on someone elses right. Sorry, not trying to start anything, but as an American, we need to support our country.

I say one thing to these people who think this war is somehow good...GO FIGHT IT! Then youll see.

Like the top general at Guantanamo bay, quit in discust, he was like "this is ridiculous, these are not even the Tailban or Al Queda, its all just a show". Yea there is a real man right there. "No, im not gonna torture these children, most of them are like 12!"

Its like Alberto Gonzalas, releasing that report about how torture is good, and neccesary, and he even said how "we could rape peoples kids in front of them to get answers". Thats sick folks! And you're government advocates it!

But yea its to stop Al Queda, so its okay. My god, you people have been dillusioned to a point where it would be funny if it wasnt so sad.

These people are psychopaths, and they are dead set on war. It is so obvious, how blatant does it have to be?

Maybe if you all got out of there, and kept your nose out of their business, they would stop shooting at you? Maybe if you stopped dropping bombs on their schools hospitals and apartment buildings, they would stop resisting? Maybe if you actually learned the Truth, you would actually stand up and fight the evil!

How many more bodies? How much more blood? How much more innocent lives must be snuffed out for you ignorant pathetic fools realize that WAR IS NOT THE ANSWER!! IT NEVER WORKED, ITS NOT WORKING, AND IT NEVER WILL WORK!

This is getting sick folks. The numbers are staggering, and all you see is these morons up here disputing the numbers "oh it cant be 600,000!" look if you kill ONE INNOCENT PERSON OVER THERE THAT IS TOO MUCH!!!

You think its Al Queda fighting the invasion, no, its ordinary iraqi men fighting for their freedom. If some country that was giving you problems for years suddenly invaded you, playing the good guy claiming to give you freedom, yet gives you DEATH, wouldnt you fight back?

Even CNN has reported that the death squads that run around Baghdad killing people are protected and actually shepherded by the Iraqi Police that the Americans set up! Even CNN admits now that Iraqi soldiers, trained by the Americans, are out raping women. Lets not get started about all the stories of atrocities the Americans are responsible for. Even CNN now admits, that top "terrorists" are in positions of power in the Iraqi government, a government that was set up by...the Americans.

All they did was swap one oppressive regime for an even worse regime! With the police organizing deathsquads to run around the cities, Saddam never did that!

It is sick, discusting, get out of there now you Americans before you cause more damage. Stop this madness, because your government is out of control. They are bloodthirsty, they dont give a damn about the will of the American people, they made that very clear when they said in basic terms "we dont care what the people say, well do whatever we want." egotistical, corrupt maniacs are in power, and they are completely ignoring the constitution and the democratic process. WAKE UP AND TAKE BACK YOUR COUNTRY!

Originally posted by deesw
Actually, if you are a US citizen, and you made that comment in public, you probably could be arressted.
Freedom of speech ends when it enfringes on someone elses right. Sorry, not trying to start anything, but as an American, we need to support our country.

Well then you can re read my post. What I was saying, was that if we were invaded by a foreign force, and that foreign force was receiving aid from Americans (i.e. the Americans would be betraying their own country in aiding the enemy) then I would fight those Americans (the ones aiding the enemy and betraying our country). Do you get it now????? I am talking about defending America against other Americans giving aid to an invading force!!! Still think I could get arrested for making comments about defending my own country? Does everyone understand this now??????