Why do non 33 degree masonic members rant about what all the symbolism & secrets mean

watch the video
The Doomsday Clock - Astronomical Precession and 2012 (David Flynn) (2005)
(search for it on google )

flynn brings up some interesting points that you might find worthwhile, including some about freemasonary's symbolism and what it really means, not the same thing as the masons say it means at all...

i agree, only those in the upper eschelons really know what's going on because most people just assume a pentagram is either evil or a symbol of protection, but it's really a mathematical symbol as flynn shows in this video
check it out, your eyes will be opened

Thanks Wondernut for that link.

no problem,


on a totally irrelevent side note i just noticed my word limit just got bumped to 6500 characters instead of 4000

expect to see some lenghty replies, comebacks, rebuttals, and whatever else happens to come up in the future!

that is, assuming mods dont read this and knock it back down, that'd make me cry, please dont...

Originally posted by solidgear
Don't think we can all be fulled into some scense of accepting your so called inocence as a society.

We return once again to the beginning.

What are the charges? Where is the evidence (apart from a "bad feeling" or general suspicion as a response to closed doors)?

There is no evidence whatsoever of Freemasonry's guilt as an organisation of anything dishonourable. Disagree? Find it! Present it. Do it now. Stop referring to it with vague insinuations and present SOMETHING.

This is what blows me away about anti-Masons. Some of them are actually reasonably intelligent (as the world measures intelligence), but they STILL believe in things like the "upper echelons" of Freemasonry and conspiracies which have no foundation in reality.

Bah. Believe what you will. It's your loss. You are what you eat.

& you are enslaved by what is hidden by your closed mindedness.

How can one know what is not enlightened to him? Christians who trully rely on the holy spirit too confirm good & evil, know that secrets are not Godly, & that one must have no trust in man, rather God alone. So your so called fraternity does not fall under the law of God & is therefore evil. Sorry this is what we believe & we don't hide that, it's open honest truth.

You however hide behind secrets, which your levels allow privy too will depend. How can you tell me there are no dark secrets? are you privy too all so called wisdom which masonry claims to hold?

Because you do not trust solely in the Lord God for your life & it's challanges, rather in a fraternity which you swore an oath too, we will continue to lock horns.

[edit on 13-8-2006 by solidgear]

Hello solidgear

I've enjoyed reading through this thread immensely, it's a little bit of 'back to the old days' mason-bashing which (quite frankly) I rather miss.

Just one thing though - you have stated on a number of occasions that you believe freemasonry to be a secret society. Just wondered what you meant by that, as from my perspective it doesn't seem to be very secret at all.

Originally posted by solidgear
& you are enslaved by what is hidden by your closed mindedness.

How can one know what is not enlightened to him? Christians who trully rely on the holy spirit too confirm good & evil, know that secrets are not Godly, & that one must have no trust in man, rather God alone. So your so called fraternity does not fall under the law of God & is therefore evil. Sorry this is what we believe & we don't hide that, it's open honest truth.

You however hide behind secrets, which your levels allow privy too will depend. How can you tell me there are no dark secrets? are you privy too all so called wisdom which masonry claims to hold?

Because you do not trust solely in the Lord God for your life & it's challanges, rather in a fraternity which you swore an oath too, we will continue to lock horns.

SG, ya seem like a nice guy so let ya in on a little secret
the masons have no "powers"
all their "secrets" are freely available across the internet
the *true* meanings of these "secrets" are as lost on them as the power of soron's ring was lost on gollum

pentagrams, degrees, the number 33, the phoenix, the half lion half man faces, snakes, and even the all mysterious circle square and triangle all have to do with math, the earth,the eliptic, and out galaxy

watch the movie i recommended earlier for an explanation on how that all ties together as i don't have an hour to to explain it nor do i feel like it when it's all presented in that video

please understand, what we know as masons today are little more than overgrown boyscouts
yes, back hundreds of years ago there may have been power there, but had they been influencing our path of advancement through the ages then we would be much farther along than we are now.
if they were truely as powerful as they claimed to be then why was the church able to defeat them throughout the dark ages?

simple, they don't really exist in the way we have all imagined they do and their "secrecy" only bolsters the fear (secrecy in quotes because many of them will freely talk about things if you ask them)

remember, it is not your place to judge people, but god's
if something offends god do you really think he is powerless against it?
my belief is that god is much more able to defend himself than i ever will be

consider the story of Elijah and the prophets of Baal
you need only have faith and stand firm in god and he will take care of things.

1 Kings Chapter 18
www.nccbuscc.org...

hey, I just watched that movie, Must say some of it was interesting, however the guy jumps from here to thier coming up with his own equations, which quite frankly, any good mathamatician could do.

I have to disagree guys, If the secrets are so openly widespread accross the internet, then why would people join, if it's as openly made as you say then what is it's point?

Originally posted by solidgear
hey, I just watched that movie, Must say some of it was interesting, however the guy jumps from here to thier coming up with his own equations, which quite frankly, any good mathamatician could do.

i agree about his math work, but the exact pinpointing of roswell and the mountain top where, according to an ancient text, the fallen angels of heaven came down to earth was rather interesting though as it was all based off of math
the basic system we used for centuries to navagate is what was used to pinpoint these locations, (33,33) pinpointed the mountain top when using the "rose line" aka "paris line", which was the former prime meridian before they moved it to greenwich
think it was 33 & 1/3*pi to get one of the numbers for roswell

if aliens were going to make contact they would do it at a place that made mathematical sense as math is the *only* universal language
oddly enough roswell and a tibetian plateu are the only places on earth that would work as they encorporate pi on the ancient navagation system utilizing compass roses well, that and of the 4 coords given in this equation the other 2 places are under water

it's all a bit of a stretch, but it lends credence to why secret societies exist, to preserve these all important numbersand formulas and their signifigance
even if the societie lost all meaning of what the numbers are for and what their symbols really mean, the symbols will still continue to exist do to the obsesison with rituals, ensuring one day someone would put it all together and figue out what was going on

the tie in with the mayan calendar ending in 2012's wintersolstice was also rather intreguing

I have to disagree guys, If the secrets are so openly widespread accross the internet, then why would people join, if it's as openly made as you say then what is it's point?

the point is essencially the same as why kids join boyscouts, it's a fun social club to be involved in
instead of making birdhouses they read books, drink coffiee, and socialize
essencially there is no point, like most of the fun things in life...

I can never get over how many of these nutbars out there that will willingly and knowingly lie through their teeth trying put on this rubbish about The Freemasons being just a harmless charity and other nonsense.
All these dropkick Master Masons pretending that they are a 33rd degree mason make me laugh really - the 33rd degree is an executive degree that grants you access to a Supreme Council, it is strictly number limited and only bestowed to a very elite few.
It's Walter Mitty "Lite" really, not even an interesting fantasy - just an aspiration to mediocrity.

Every spineless bootlick gazing up dreaming of the day he will be the boss for a while then after realising what a hopeless situation he has got himself into, living the rest of his life in denial and shame.

Serves 'em right really.

Originally posted by MrNECROS
I can never get over how many of these nutbars out there that will willingly and knowingly lie through their teeth trying put on this rubbish about The Freemasons being just a harmless charity and other nonsense.
All these dropkick Master Masons pretending that they are a 33rd degree mason make me laugh really - the 33rd degree is an executive degree that grants you access to a Supreme Council, it is strictly number limited and only bestowed to a very elite few.
It's Walter Mitty "Lite" really, not even an interesting fantasy - just an aspiration to mediocrity.

Every spineless bootlick gazing up dreaming of the day he will be the boss for a while then after realising what a hopeless situation he has got himself into, living the rest of his life in denial and shame.

Serves 'em right really.

Ah, the somewhat infamous MrNecros. I've read a lot of your posts (for some reason) You, too, love ad hominem attacks (and have received your fair share I see) I love that term "nutbar" and "spineless bootlick" isn't bad either.

I'm not sure how much you know about the 33rd Degree but at any given time there are several THOUSAND of 'em in the Southern Jurisdiction USA alone. Here's a list of the men who received it in 2001 (along with those who received another Scottish Rite honor, the Knight Commander of the Court of Honor).


www.srmason-sj.org...

Quite a list, huh?

Thirty-Third's "ain't" so rare really. Go to a Scottish Rite initiation (called a "Reunion") and the place will be just lousy with 'em. They're awfully handy for bringing meals to the new initiates, picking up the soiled dishes, mopping up spills, et cetera. Then during the ceremony they're particularly useful for sitting up in the nose-bleed section with their arms crossed saying "Hrmmmpphh! That's not how we used to do it!"



[edit on 14-8-2006 by Appak]

Ah Appak, beat me to it again!

I was going to point out the obvious lack of knowledge shown in MrNecros thread. I better not now tho - if we masons stick up for each other they will cry Masonic Conspiracy

What are the charges? Where is the evidence (apart from a "bad feeling" or general suspicion as a response to closed doors)?

Britain's worst ever mass murderer Harold Shipman, Child murderer Thomas Hamilton Serial Rapist Paul Bernardo and James Lloyd the Shoe Rapist....

All freemasons... The bad apples argument doesn't work for a society supposedly with the highest moral values. Clearly things are not quite as they seem.

Consider also that in these cases the corrupt mason police were found either to be blocking investigation or impeding it.

And that's just in the past ten years or so... AND they're the ones who were found out.

Chilling.



[edit on 14-8-2006 by Edelweiss Pirate]

Originally posted by Edelweiss Pirate

What are the charges? Where is the evidence (apart from a "bad feeling" or general suspicion as a response to closed doors)?

Britain's worst ever mass murderer Harold Shipman, Child murderer Thomas Hamilton Serial Rapist Paul Bernardo and James Lloyd the Shoe Rapist....

All freemasons... The bad apples argument doesn't work for a society supposedly with the highest moral values. Clearly things are not quite as they seem.

Consider also that in these cases the corrupt mason police were found either to be blocking investigation or impeding it.

And that's just in the past ten years or so... AND they're the ones who were found out.

Chilling.



[edit on 14-8-2006 by Edelweiss Pirate]

You choose to post the names of four criminals whose vile acts are in direct contradiction to the tenets and ideals of Freemasonry, and you expect everyone to take it as a conclusive indictment of the organisation? Weak, dude…

Truly, these men were scum, by any standard, but I’m afraid you’ve completely failed to answer my challenge concerning the honour/dishonour of Freemasonry.

Your passion and zeal for what you see as “right” are admirable, but your prejudice, and compulsion to make tenuous connections, have blinded you to the truth of the matter.

I won’t even bother responding to Necros or the guy who thinks Freemasonry is a bake sale / knot tying club. Those guys seem beyond learning.

Adios.

This thread has gone off topic long enough.